Why do you use 3rd person?

[Heiduk 265]

I do exploit 3rd person in situations to get an advantage

Beans for the last honest man in Chernarus.

Given the opportunity all of us will cheat. I hate that it is easier to spot players in the forest by looking away from them and using the peripheral dots then it is to look toward them, but that doesn't mean I don't do it. I hate that I can instantly tell if players are in a town by looking at the zombie distribution, but that doesn't mean I don't do it.

Sometimes in order to make a game better options have to be taken away from the player.

[Max Planck 7174]

Sometimes in order to make a game better options have to be taken away from the player.

Well said.

[Wazza 274]

If your that fully sic pro at 1st person than dont use 3rd person.. If you dont need or want to use it because you're a fully sic pro Dayz Gam3r than dont.. It is a game. Play it the way you want but remember its only a game.

[dayzisthebest 4]

I am using 3rd person because its better for viewing my character,I can better empathize to be in game.I really liked 3RDPERSON !!!

If they removed 3rd,it wont be DAYZ anymore,and i will stop playing it!!!

And you have still choice to use 1person or 3 rd!!!

[fathairybeast 246]

I prefer first person but I don't use it in firefights because the opponent will have an advantage if they're using 3rd person (which they more than likely are). Should have added that option in the poll.

[Droidlife 11]

For this game, players should be anchored down and tied into the body of their toon, FPS style, (all "claustrofobic and restricted" whaa whaa) and that's pretty much the end of it. All donkey kong country style whiners ("wouldnt be Dayz any more!", wtf?) should just be crushed and squashed under the weight of the mighty 1st person perspective boot.

Sure, Rocket and the team might miss out on some revenue but things would be put right. It's a critical decision. Do we want tense, immersive, realistic style zombie survival or do we want some gamey run of the mill bullshit that's a dime a dozen in the market place? Weeee I wanna jack cars and kill hookers! Piew piew I can seeee you, tihi! Pwnd!

Edited February 1, 2013 by Droidlife

[Droidlife 11]

First off, CoD and Battlefield are for casual gamers. I think the people that get dizzy in CoD and BF are called "facebook gamers" or something worse.

There are enough first person shooters on the market and even if the view was why they were popular, which is not the case in my opinion, it wouldn't matter because the scale of this game is much larger than the garden variety pew pew arena respawn deathmatch garbage found cluttering the market. And it's kind of late in the game to chance one of the most recognizable features of dayz, in my opinion.

I guess Third Person is the new whipping boy now that a lot of the hacking has been reduced thanks to whitelisted servers. So now everyone wants to blame their deaths on the "exploitation" of the third person camera and not on their poor tactics or their poor choice of routes into locations.

TP takes some getting used to and since there really isn't a campaign for DayZ, I strongly recommend everyone fire up Arma2 and play some missions or even the campaign until third person becomes second nature. Once you learn to use it effectively you can imagine how others are using it. It's more than just peaking around corners or going prone on top of some sniper nest in Cherno. You have to anticipate where players are likely to hide to get the best view of wherever you're trying to move to. Then you have to find a route to your destination while minimizing your exposure. That's harder than strafing side to side in first person or sprinting past a doorway with ALT held down until you think the coast is clear.

I honestly don't see why you guys think the game is any easier when an opponent can spot you from just about anywhere. It's easier for them to spot you if you run around without thinking but not easier for them to approach you. If you're taking your time and not just running through Elektro trying to gear up as fast as you can then you'll likely have plenty of opportunities to spot any player trying to get the drop on you, short of sniper hill. Knowing other players are using third person also adds more tension as you never do know if you're being watched.

Yes. Adapt. Forcing everyone into first person will make the game easier for the third person haters, and they know it.

Reasons why FP view is awful:

Framerates - if you're pushing 20 fps, cities and forests look like ass in FP. Third Person mitigates the noticeable stuttering and the game becomes playable. Arma/DayZ eats computers for lunch so only the best rigs, or random freaks of nature, are pulling smooth framerates in the cities and forests.

Field of View - it's boinked. Sure, this could be improved quite a bit but I don't think the devs are too focused on this though.

The design of some interiors - It's hard enough to squeeze through some doors in TP and I've been playing for months. I can't imagine there was a lot of reason to run around inside some of the buildings in Arma as much as we do in DayZ. They don't seem to be designed for the kind of use they're seeing.

It won't solve the "cheap" deaths people experience - It'll make it worse as more people will find its easier to doorway camp.

Vehicles - Some do not appear to be designed with FP view in mind. Try driving that V3S in FP or ride in the back of any of the cars. Not being able to see out the window I'm sitting next to is immersion breaking for me.

Climbing ladders - This made me want to puke at 50 fps

Reasons why FP view is awesome:

Immersion - Despite it's flaws, it really does beef up the immersion and makes looting and navigating harder.

Driving - It's fun to be the driver, even if you can't see.

Zombies become a threat again (this one could easily be overcome with experience)

Plays differently across the board.

Dude. Stop peaking around corners, alright?

[Mad Z 51]

I use third person whenever I'm not aiming/firing my weapon. Why? First person in this game severely limits even the reasonable field of view, and make me feel sick after any extended amount of time.

[hatfieldcw 184]

Also the weapon mechanics are off, I don't know about you ladies and gets, but I can run and keep my weapon up. In this game you have to be perfectly still to shoot.

I'm going to deviate from the topic a bit to call your bluff on this one. You can move and shoot in Arma2, and it feels annoyingly like trying to move and shoot in real life. The bouncing sight picture, the tunnel vision, it all feels about right. Try it out some time, aim down the sights of any pistol or long gun (or just use your finger if no gun-like object is handy) and see how fast you get going before it gets hard to keep it where you want it to be. Master Chief is a space cyborg, so he can obviously do it very well, but I know I struggle with it, and I always prefer to move and fire at different times, at least when my goal is to hit something specific.

The things that eat my lunch are stopping to sling a rifle or throw a flare. I'd like to be able to drop a smoke grenade on the ground as I run, or draw my pistol while moving. There are a lot of interface hiccups like that in the engine, maybe some will be ironed out in the standalone game.

[AfterShave 140]

First person is fucking horrible

[landfish 62]

@Dallas

First of all, I would like to say, you brought up a lot of valid points I agreed on. It is up to you, if you can turn a deserted server into a fun party.

However, this thread wasn't intended to state weather I like 1st person more than 3rd person. This isn't a personal preference thread, I don't like 3rd person removed just because I can play better without it.

How about 1st person players stop joining 3rd person severs, because they are full and start joining empty 1st person servers?You know how you fill up a server? You join it and then you wait for other people to join it! This is not easy and it can take time to build up a reputation for a sever, but if you're not willing to put in the effort, you're always going to have this problem. Stop joining 3rd person servers, because you filter for players and only join the high-pop servers at the top of the serverlist!

You know, not everybody have the attention span to wait for a low population server to fill up, and the problem lies here, people with short attention span greatly outnumbers those patient enough to wait for a low pop server to fill up, hence the lack of 1st person server with more than 5 people. Yes you have to put in effort, but how about we make things less dependent on server owners and more dependent on the game itself? Why should I have to put in so much effort simply to play a great server in 1st person? Why should people who enjoy 3rd person be privileged with great number of servers with high population? Why should you cast out 1st person players who bitch about 3rd person servers when they're the one who see that they need to work harder than everyone else?

You say people prefer 3rd person, but how about those who prefer 1st person? Just throw them in the back burner because they are the minority and we don't need to see their complains deeper? The pros of 1st person greatly outweighs those of 3rd person. Say something about 3rd person being better than 1st person, and I guarantee you, it will be countered quickly, and lastly, the game feels really different from one point of view to another, is it really DayZ's goal to separate people with different preferences?

Whether you like it or not, look at the stats and the stats indicate if you want DayZ to continue to succeed, you have to approach 3rd person with extreme caution. Take a look at 1st person population levels and popularity, before you decide to turn all servers into 1st person servers. Are you really sure you want to pull out a key component, a determining factor for whether a server is a party or a desert?

Is it not stated that DayZ is supposed to be an anti-game? are the devs supposed to be looking at the level of popularity of servers instead of the underlying issues that 1st person players are talking about? are they supposed to be scared by the majority of people who would go ape-shit if they take out something that the majority so loved? What made DayZ so successful is its open field of decisions you have to make in game but I feel like server side options that affects the gameplay(not graphics) mechanics of an entire server and its players are taking it too far.

Why fix it, if it isn't broken?

3rd person is a broken mechanic weather you see it or not. I'm talking out of experience here when I say that I find it way way way easier to play DayZ with 3rd person and a feature that will make the game easier than if you use another feature(1st person) is quite contradictory and broken in my book.

Why tamper with ArmA's golden rule about difficulty enforced by the server?

Because DayZ will become its own game very soon, why should it follow ArmA's "gloden rules"? Isn't it allowed for DayZ to break from it previous engine and explore different areas of possibilities? Why should the difficulty depend on the player and not on the game itself? In my opinion, it sounds to me as if you don't want DayZ to have its own rules and its own mechanics.

DayZ is a grind, DayZ a chore and you have to put in hours worth of gametime to progress and get around, 3rd person is less intense, less taxing, that's why people are playing longer sessions and thereby filling up servers. If you remove or radically change 3rd person, you're tampering with a key component that guarantees the population levels and the very player interactions DayZ so heavily rely on.

You contradicted yourself a lot in there. Yes you need to put in lots of hours of gametime to progress but if 3rd person is less intense and taxing as you said, what will make players stop from abusing it to progress faster than those who are using 1st person? You also said that radically changing 3rd person is a huge risk, I don't think so, I think keeping the elevation as it is in the mod, giving 3rd person players the edge over 1st person players like in the mod and overall giving the 3rd person view the huge advantage as it did in the mod is a bigger risk than radically changing it.

[Xeqtor (DayZ) 0]

I love first person for Immersion. Hell I would love to play on 1st person servers but there are never any players there :(.

On 3rd person servers I feel like I have to use 3rd P. because everyone else is. Not using it would give the others a huge advantage over me.

Hell I never understand popularity ... zombies, 3rd person view, unrealistic games like COD and so on....... .

I guess 1st person must suck because of ppl like me who want realism :(.

[Sula 1205]

I can't think of a polite response to this thread so I shall say no more.

[monsterrrkill@hotmail.co.uk 21]

I use a mixture of third and first person. I tend to explore in third person but use first inside buildings and when engaging in combat. I tend to get a little motion sick in ARMA II first person for some reason even though I have head bob all the way down haha. I honestly just like to look at my character and have that little bit of distance. Not exactly a detailed response but I've voted.

[dallas 5195]

You know, not everybody have the attention span to wait for a low population server to fill up, and the problem lies here, people with short attention span greatly outnumbers those patient enough to wait for a low pop server to fill up, hence the lack of 1st person server with more than 5 people. Yes you have to put in effort, but how about we make things less dependent on server owners and more dependent on the game itself? Why should I have to put in so much effort simply to play a great server in 1st person? Why should people who enjoy 3rd person be privileged with great number of servers with high population? Why should you cast out 1st person players who bitch about 3rd person servers when they're the one who see that they need to work harder than everyone else?

You say people prefer 3rd person, but how about those who prefer 1st person? Just throw them in the back burner because they are the minority and we don't need to see their complains deeper? The pros of 1st person greatly outweighs those of 3rd person. Say something about 3rd person being better than 1st person, and I guarantee you, it will be countered quickly, and lastly, the game feels really different from one point of view to another, is it really DayZ's goal to separate people with different preferences?

Is it not stated that DayZ is supposed to be an anti-game? are the devs supposed to be looking at the level of popularity of servers instead of the underlying issues that 1st person players are talking about? are they supposed to be scared by the majority of people who would go ape-shit if they take out something that the majority so loved? What made DayZ so successful is its open field of decisions you have to make in game but I feel like server side options that affects the gameplay(not graphics) mechanics of an entire server and its players are taking it too far.

3rd person is a broken mechanic weather you see it or not. I'm talking out of experience here when I say that I find it way way way easier to play DayZ with 3rd person and a feature that will make the game easier than if you use another feature(1st person) is quite contradictory and broken in my book.

Because DayZ will become its own game very soon, why should it follow ArmA's "gloden rules"? Isn't it allowed for DayZ to break from it previous engine and explore different areas of possibilities? Why should the difficulty depend on the player and not on the game itself? In my opinion, it sounds to me as if you don't want DayZ to have its own rules and its own mechanics.

You contradicted yourself a lot in there. Yes you need to put in lots of hours of gametime to progress but if 3rd person is less intense and taxing as you said, what will make players stop from abusing it to progress faster than those who are using 1st person? You also said that radically changing 3rd person is a huge risk, I don't think so, I think keeping the elevation as it is in the mod, giving 3rd person players the edge over 1st person players like in the mod and overall giving the 3rd person view the huge advantage as it did in the mod is a bigger risk than radically changing it.

However this anti-game has always come with friendly fire enabled, with zombies and with customizable difficulty settings.

Anti-game or not, right now and for the last nine-net months DayZ has also offered third person servers, which isn't a sellout deviation from ArmA, because ArmA has also always offered customizable difficulty settings. ArmA is not a hardcore simulation, it's not a first person shooter, it can be, but it says nowhere that third person play is illegitimate or an exploit. BI devs have several times explained why it belongs in the game, plus they've added a solution for server admins to enforce minimum difficulty standards, if they prefer one type of gameplayer over another.

Removing third person, will have the same effect as removing friendly fire or zombies. You cannot predict the consequences of such radical gameplay changes. Right now you have the choice to play on both first and third person server, can you honestly say that if first person was completely removed from DayZ, it wouldn't influence whether you decision to buy or influence the longevity of your sessions?

My main argument is that most third person players have accepted the pros and cons of third person view. They know that a potential sniper spot is a potential deathtrap no matter if they have a direct line of sight to a ghillie suit or not. We have all accepted that this can be used to our advantage and against us, but we chose to play on these servers irregardless. Your problem seems to be, you're forced to play on third person servers and you refuse to accept it, but you also refuse to join a half full first person servers. You could care less about third person servers, if you had several full first person servers to chose from. You want to remove a very popular feature from the game, a feature that's always been here, because you don't like it, How would you like it we remove friendly fire, because some people disliked that feature and wanted to promote more player cooperation? Or the opposite, how about removing zombies to purely focus on PvP, it's the same thing.

I know all about building server reputations and populating servers. However what I don't do is join other servers recruiting players from other people's servers and that's kind of what I think you guys are trying to do. Because third person servers are slightly more popular, third person servers are all on top, when people filter for players in the server list. Then they simply join the server on the top, instead of looking for a first person sever. I'm not joining a third person server because it's on top, I join it because it's a third person server. Maybe the standalone server browser should have a more advanced filter, so you can filter for first/third person just like DayZcommander does. That way you could easily rank first person servers on top and quickly locate a server with a high population.

I also don't get how a third person player would gain superior benefits from gearing up on a third person server and the assumption that he'd dominate at first person server. Why would it be easier to farm the barracks on a full third person server for a DMR only to quickly switch to a first person server and then what? He'd be forced to play in first person view like everyone else, he'd probably have a disadvantage. I don't think this is an actual problem.

Third person is a well established, very popular feature of DayZ. It's already here, so however you define your own personal DayZ experience, popularity or not, anti-game or not, third person or not, your definition isn't any more valid than mine, only I'm not demanding that your minority preference is voted out of the game.

Edited February 2, 2013 by Dallas

[brzator47@gmail.com 524]

No feature should be kept unchanged solely on the basis that it's popular imo. Especially when you consider the main reason 3rd person became that popular in the first place was the large imbalance between it and 1st person. If DayZ standalone was to be a collection of popular features, the game would end up being not much more than a casual, watered down version of the original idea. Just something to keep in mind.

[dallas 5195]

Third person has always been part of the engine, nothing's been watered down.

[zachgibson22 14]

I'd maybe you first person if it wasn't so damn clunky. I absolutely hate firs person in this game, and i do play first person shooters all the time. But man. I think it has to do with the WAY you put you gun down when you sprint and just over all how the guns look/camera position is in first person. But make it move more like battlefield 3 or even, I hate to say this on here, like COD and I would happily play. But I do also love 3rd person. So what if you get an advantage around a corner. The other person can do the same thing.

And with the standalone coming out with al of the customization options, I WANT it to be 3rd person also. I want to see what I'm wearing!

[brzator47@gmail.com 524]

Third person has always been part of the engine, nothing's been watered down.

Crosshairs are part of the engine, have always been, and they are likely getting removed. Similar with peripheral dots. Waypoints are part of the engine. Is there any reason whatsoever to have those even as a server option in the standalone? They are a really popular feature for sure considering the number of servers they're enabled on.

[Siberian (DayZ) 527]

Why should I have to put in so much effort simply to play a great server in 1st person? Why should people who enjoy 3rd person be privileged with great number of servers with high population? Why should you cast out 1st person players who bitch about 3rd person servers when they're the one who see that they need to work harder than everyone else?

LOL, stopped taking you seriously at this point...

so if more people prefer 3rd person, they should stop being able to use it ???? hahaaha...

someone call this guy a wahhhambulance...

[Heiduk 265]

No feature should be kept unchanged solely on the basis that it's popular imo.

This 1000x.

Features, especially ones like third person that fundamentally alter the way players behave, need to be critically evaluated by the developers in the context of what they want DayZ to be. If they want a game where the player has near perfect awareness of their immediate surroundings and distant attacks are the only surprises third person makes perfect sense. If they want a game where awareness is limited and players are constantly forced to make life or death decisions based on their imperfect knowledge about what is around the next corner third person makes no sense at all.

Clearly I prefer the later, but then again I would never dream of turning off the fog of war in a game like Jagged Alliance or X-COM where death matters and tactics (with a little luck) are what keep you alive .

[jdz (DayZ) 238]

I can't believe people don't want 3rd person removed... Sure the FOV is a bit shit but that can be adjusted.

Everytime I see someone pro 3rd person I just think they're a crying noob, there's literally no reason to keep it other than exploiting it.

Arguments like wanting to see your gun model and player skin don't count either. If you want to play and look at the pretty pictures, go and play Crysis.

[Sozinho 58]

1st person makes me seasick

[DarkNinja (DayZ) 3]

1st person makes me feel sick when I play.

[plrsniper 87]

I am sure more than 50% of these "1st person makes me seasick" are actually lies in favor of being able to prone on rooftops and see people below using 3rd person exploits.

Peace, i am out!

Edited February 3, 2013 by X0TCadde