Don't even make third-person an option for DayZ standalone

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

Better or worse, immersion, suspense. These are matters of personal preference.

I don't know about you all, but I don't find suspense lacking an a movie that's not in 1st person. Games, where I consider character development and situation to be factors of great immersion, are no different.

@exdeath, in my honest opinion, players should have to AIM their weapons.

No overlayed crosshair, no assistance.

1st person is invariably required in firefights. But I don't want to be stuck in it all day.

Melee combat, general player to player interaction(medical etc.), long journeys. In all these situations it would be preferable to have more awareness of what my character is doing.

Clearly many, but not all, of the people ranting against this feature, are incapable of compromise, or even simple comprehension.

May the next person who mentions "head-bob" as a solution, be shot in the face with a ball of their own shite.

[Siberian (DayZ) 527]

ive said it before ill say it again..

you play ur way, ill play mine.

if you dont like 3rd person, fine go play on 1st person servers..

stop trying to paint everyone with the same brush. this isnt a single FPS game for everyone.. its a godam sandbox with inifinte play styles and options to allow those play styles.

[dystopeon 46]

@ dystopeon, I understand your mental capacity is lacking, but couldn't you try harder to offend me than repeating what I said to you?

And haggis? Really? Your cultural bigotry speaks volumes, and none of it is beneficial to your standing in my eyes.

While it seems you take pride in making yourself look like an ignorant idiot, I can honestly say, I expected better.

I know I shouldn't get my hopes up.

Maybe you should stuff down some haggis from time to time. It's obviously better for your brain than whatever you've been eating.

-

Why do people insist on trying to define Rocket's vision by their own standards?

Familiarity with the engine and ArmA's mod support are good enough reasons for the decision to base DayZ on it.

It doesn't mean that, having played ArmA, you have any foreknowledge regarding the "vision".

Any presumptions I make regarding DayZ are based on observation. To me it doesn't look like DayZ should be regarded as an FPS.

you were the first to make assumptions about my diet or can't you remember that far back?

[dystopeon 46]

And why should we get another game that dissolve it's uniqueness by trying to please the lowest common denominator. Sure developpers want money, but i'm sure dean could work for EA if he wanted.

Video game "still" is an artistic medium where the developpers can express their own vision of the game, regardless or what the fanbase "want".

I suppose i can say this again, but a suggestion forum doesn't make the development process a democracy.

If they want to make something truly unique with DayZ, they cannot satisfy just everyone, or they will be left with a pretty bland looking game.

I sincerely believe that familiarity isn't the only reason Dean picked arma as the base for DayZ, he most likely wanted the realistic shooting mechanic that you can only really find in Arma. Which, i believe will most likely lead us to an SA version without 3rd person and without aiming reticles.

word up! :)

[g4borg 74]

To say, it is an advantage for others, while the feature is available to everyone, and after the fact, that 3rd person is activated in most servers, because otherwise they have less players, speaks statistically for this not being a generally accepted idea.

I personally like how DayZ/Arma is solving 3rd person. You have a disadvantage at arms in 3rd person, but an advantage in zombie hatchet killing and spotting yourself while you move, and a slightly increased view.

In real life, you can check up, how your body lies, where you are, because you can objectify yourself and your surroundings in your brain, instictively. This process helps us playing 3rd person games more easily if it is about body control. Since one of dayZ's aspects is survival, it actually adds a lot for it to this gameplay.

Even if some hardcore players might enjoy first person, in dayZ a killer player can easily shoot you no matter how you look at yourself with one shot, while you didn't even have a clue, you were in his sniper crosshairs at all.

Since some servers have nameplates, or even the ARMA positioning turned on, or the life signs detector even working while you look at the people, I am a little bit wondering to myself anyway, why THOSE features do not annoy you more.

So I completely disagree. Disabling 3rd person would destroy a lot of dayZ's core gameplay and ruin the game. period.

[GOD™ 2795]

If you hate it so much find a server that dosen't have third person.

[Citrus 16]

Is this serious? It's already an optional thing for servers, If it were removed they would instantly loose about 80% of their players, why on earth would they do that? On a side note why are their so many my little pony bro's on the forums..... what is going on with people these days.....

[ImageCtrl 719]

I'm sure that if from the beginning would have been only the "first person" enabled many more people had opted against the "third person".

I think the "first person" needs more advertising, because it's just more rocks.

That is why I am in favor of the first 3 weeks of the alpha only the "first person" test.

hrhr, sometimes you have to force people to their happiness.

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

you were the first to make assumptions about my diet or can't you remember that far back?

I never made assumptions, I reccommended you eat more oily fish.

If you don't understand what I'm saying to you, it's not too difficult to google it.

Don't try an use my nationality as an insult, it only proves my point.

@NoCheats - Forcing anyone's preference for any length of time is selfish.

If the devs decided to change the game, I wouldn't argue. I just can't see 3dp getting the chop.

If Rocket intended to make an FPV-only game, it would have been that way from day 1.

Edited January 2, 2013 by Chabowski

[dystopeon 46]

I think you need to start getting more Omega3 in your diet.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I never made assumptions, I reccommended you eat more oily fish.

wow, you don't even understand 'assumption'. I would explain this to you, but I wont waste the keystrokes. you will always be an asshole & you will never understand why.

Edited January 3, 2013 by dystopeon

[rowdygowdy 2]

Hmm, the OP needs to add a voting poll to this thread... or scared.

[St. Jimmy 1631]

Just wanted to make 3rd Person summary:

Pros:

- You can see your character what it looks like

- Better situation awareness about your body/car/chopper (better to reverse with cars because there's no mirrors)

- Some people don't get motion sick that easily

Cons:

- Hard to shoot without switching to 1st person

Cheats:

- You can peek behind walls/bushes/trees etc. without exposing yourself

- You don't suffer effects like cold

- Broken windshield doesn't disturb

- You can see bit too well out of cars and choppers

[Lady Kyrah 1109]

I never made assumptions, I reccommended you eat more oily fish.

If you don't understand what I'm saying to you, it's not too difficult to google it.

Don't try an use my nationality as an insult, it only proves my point.

@NoCheats - Forcing anyone's preference for any length of time is selfish.

If the devs decided to change the game, I wouldn't argue. I just can't see 3dp getting the chop.

If Rocket intended to make an FPV-only game, it would have been that way from day 1.

On arma2 FPV only is a server setting (one of the veteran/expert settings), i don't think you can force the hand of the person hosting (as long as the game is a mod that is)

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

Personally, FPV is the only "expert" setting that I don't agree with 100%.

The issue isn't easily debated, because the opposing views aren't necessarily taking diametrically opposite standpoints.

Many seem to view 3dp as a cheat, while I see it purely as a way to break up tedious gameplay segments. I find being stuck in 1st person to be exceedingly boring.

In my view, DayZ is not an FPS. It's a survival adventure with FPS gunplay. That's the way I like it.

Before the discussion loops back again, I'd like to let you all know, I appreciate the chance to hear other people's views, even if we disagree.

That's the last I'll be saying on the matter, because it inevitably just descends into plain old argument, and I've had enough of it.

@dystopeon - I'm not here to argue semantics. If you were as clever as you think, you would have noticed how stupid you've made us both look.

Seeing as how you clearly didn't look it up, I'll link you to the explanation of my recommendation HERE.

You may think I'm an asshole, but I know you're an ignorant, bigoted idiot.

Once you realise I've been suggesting you do something about your apparently impaired mental functionality, you'll know I was being an asshole. ^_^

EDIT: Happy New Year.

Edited January 4, 2013 by Chabowski

[exdeath 0]

@exdeath, in my honest opinion, players should have to AIM their weapons.

No overlayed crosshair, no assistance.

1st person is invariably required in firefights. But I don't want to be stuck in it all day.

Melee combat, general player to player interaction(medical etc.), long journeys. In all these situations it would be preferable to have more awareness of what my character is doing.

Clearly many, but not all, of the people ranting against this feature, are incapable of compromise, or even simple comprehension.

May the next person who mentions "head-bob" as a solution, be shot in the face with a ball of their own shite.

Some explanation.

This game was suposed to be first person, you can sort of see it by the fact the game has fps view only servers and also have fps/3rd view servers.

Anyway, some are saying that the game NEED 3rd person view, and can't have fps view only, because the fps view is flawed.

Then some say that the 3rd person view is the one flawed.

We want a good game and if something is flawed, this thing need to be changed or removed from the game.

Based on what I said before (some say fps view is flawed and at the same time others say 3rd person is the one flawed), we have TWO choices:

1-The developer think about it, discussing with us or not, to discover which choice is really the flawed one, first person or 3rd person. And completely remove it from the game.

or

2-Have two separated servers types, one that allow only fps view (because 3rd person is flawed and would make this server worse), and another that only allow 3rd person view (because first person is flawed and having it would make the server worse).

According to you in the post I am replying to, BOTH choices are flawed and so thats the reason we need both at the same time.

If BOTH are flawed, we have one choice only:

1-Start to think about ideas on how we fix the first person view flaws and then, after we fix all those first person view flaws, all servers would only allow first person view.

[exdeath 0]

ive said it before ill say it again..

you play ur way, ill play mine.

if you dont like 3rd person, fine go play on 1st person servers..

stop trying to paint everyone with the same brush. this isnt a single FPS game for everyone.. its a godam sandbox with inifinte play styles and options to allow those play styles.

Having a server type that allow BOTH choices would be trying to paint everyone with the same brush.

If we were not trying to paint everyone with the same brush we would have:

1-FPS view only servers type

and

2-3rd person view only server type.

And IF (and only IF) you count changing the views at specific moments (at some soments [like walking] player use 3rd person view and at other moments [like firefight] the playe use the fps one) as an third style of playing this game we would have:

1-FPS view only servers type

and

2-3rd person view only server type.

and

3-Player while playing the game can change between first and third person anytime he want server type.

Having having third/fps mix and not having 3rd person view only servers (the situation we are right now) is "trying to paint everyone with the same brush"

[ImageCtrl 719]

Maybe I misunderstood you, we have fp only server.

Edited January 4, 2013 by NoCheats

[GtaSoldierBoy 11]

Third person makes me and other players feel better when your walking you get sick of 1st person literaly and third person is easier to drive and see whats happening but third person is for combat

[Shadow Man 142]

Well I may as well have one more flog at this old dead horse.

The trouble with telling players to "Go and find a 1st persn server" is that, to me, I don't want to have to play on an exclusive server. I want the game to be the same for everyone, so that being good at it, is simply about how you play, not what view you choose.

The argument that states 3rd person is harder, is true. But the game is harder for the wrong reason. If the game is hard because the other players are better me thats fine, but its not when its because there are invisible players round every corner and on every roof watching you. If they want to spy on you then they should have to expose themselves. Even if you do use 3rd person its still a stupid exploit that really puts me off. I like realism. I like the idea of trying to creep through a town (like Cherno) and attempt to use my stealth skills to "beat" other players by not being seen. You simply cannot do this with 3rd person. It forces a playstyle which makes people just run through town because there is no point using stealth, and in turn removes alot of the suspense and atmosphere.

If we are given a choice, the entire DayZ community will be divided in two. It has to be one or the other. If it ends up being 3rd person then so be it. Maybe I'll buy it, maybe I won't. For me the best thing would be to improve 1st person. No one minds about all the other games that are 1st person. Probably because they never had the choice in the first place.

On a side note...

The motion sickness IS real, I get it playing Borderlands when using mouse+keys something awful. There is a general opinion thats says (in ArmA) smoothing should be turned off but I find it helps to stop jittery movement which could cause motion sickness. It could vary depending on hardware etc.

It is possible to change the FOV in first person but I haven't checked it out.

Edited January 4, 2013 by Shadow Man

[exdeath 0]

Maybe I misunderstood you, we have fp only server.

If you were talking about me you misunderstood me, because I already know and even said in the my posts that we have fp server.

Also I am not exactly beating a dead horse.

One of my idea (based on all the stuff being said here) is to include the option of 3rd person only server type and remove the mix only. Well maybe not removing it but, if we going to have some fp only server type, also have the 3rd person only server type.

This is not beating a dead horse because 3rd person guys will like this idea and not complain, first person only likers will hate it but we already the fp/3rdp mix servers that they hate, so we will change from some bad (in their opinion) situation to some situation that still bad, ending "at the same situation".

Well, it will not be the same situation, if we exclude the FP/3RDP mix servers, and have only the FP only servers and 3RDP only servers, because with that situation, when the server owner want to have some server that will make 3rd person view players happy, he will need to make some server that allow only 3rd person view and with enought 3rdp players the amount of servers FP players will be able to play will be way smaller. Of course this could be easily fixed by allowing the 3 types of servers (fp only, 3rd person only and mix one).

[silkyskills 59]

3rd person only who's with me?

[freaky88 13]

If I remember correctly you only see 90 ° in the game, but the eye sees 180° in real life.

That's why it's third person.

EDIT: Not sure if this is correct information, but i read something like this long time ago..

eyes see 135 degrees

[sicarius93 0]

Another QQ thread. You do know if your hiding in a tree well enough that 1st person is MUCH better? Not to mention crosshairs in 3rd person isn't as accurate as 1st.

[WiFiN 55]

Another QQ thread. You do know if your hiding in a tree well enough that 1st person is MUCH better? Not to mention crosshairs in 3rd person isn't as accurate as 1st.

As it was said over 9000 before it's not about using TP to shoot, it's about exploiting it to look far over fences, around the corners, off the ledges.

In this game staying hidden and seeing your enemy before he sees you is crucial and TP ruins this mechanic remorselessly.

So the only way is either to to limit TP so it doesn't provide any exploits, or to fix FP so it has decent FOV and nonirritating headbobbing and keep tp only for the character menu or the campfire..

Edited January 4, 2013 by WiFiN

[ImageCtrl 719]

One of my idea (based on all the stuff being said here) is to include the option of 3rd person only server type and remove the mix only. Well maybe not removing it but, if we going to have some fp only server type, also have the 3rd person only server type.

Ah, ok. you are right, no beating dead horses here. Why not? If you rent a server you should have as many options as possible.