WTF is happening to the server community.

[Suicide Mouse 50]

You let players define their own value and own consequences and they won't have any reason not to kill.

You add a mechanic to change that and you're taking liberty away and being arbitrary.

Let's all just agree that there's nothing to do in here, kay? There is no solution, this is not going to change and no suggestion is decent.

This will spare the time of everyone typing and reading stuff that won't solve anything. Let's all just stop this and conform.

[SkepticJerry 0]

There's only one way to solve this dilemma. You have to make players worth more than a can of beans or some ammo.

There should be more cooperative elements to the game, like blood packs for example. Kill as many people and who you like, I don't care, but make certain elements of the game require the cooperation of another player. There has to be a benefit to the players for NOT killing each other.

Something like blood transfusion is key to this. The game requires you get a transfusion FROM another player. Perhaps food shouldn't give back blood. Blood could return VERY SLOWLY at a constant rate only if you are WELL FED. Otherwise, the only way to get back quickly is to have another player give it too you. All this talk of realism and I never had a can of beans heal a cut or make me instantly "200 points" healthier.

Perhaps bandages should work something similar. If you bandage yourself, perhaps it only slows the bleeding and you trickle blood (Say 1 point every 10 seconds) for a period of time. Eventually it stops and you you can SLOWLY heal as above. Having a bandage applied, or first aid administered, from another player, stops the bleeding instantly and starts the healing process.

How about infections? You SHOULD get an infection from zombie attacks. YOU WERE BITTEN! It makes your player continue to get more ill and degrade his abilities. The only way to cure this infection is help from another player.

Things like this would require you to seek out other survivors or join clans/groups as survival is no longer tied to kill or be killed. This doesn't punish anyone for play style and makes other survivors more valuable than a can of fucking beans.

[Enigmazzz 3]

Jesus H christ.

I feel your pain Rocket' date=' i really do man, how long has this mod been out now? a month or more? and most people STILL dont understand what youre trying to do here.

I think this is a kick in the balls to the way developers treat their players, i mean, look at the state of this fucking thread, you present this idea of a brutal post apocalyptic world where its dog eat dog and what do you get? people want BALANCE? fucking BALANCE? are you shitting me? the mechanics are balanced, players just need to fucking ADAPT.

[/quote']

I don't think even you understand. Considering how little he speaks of this, I think none of us do and none of us should act like we do. Rocket always showed concern about the devaluation of life that would cause killing a casual thing. He's just stating that people should try to do something in the game instead of expecting the game to solve it for them (even if it's not possible in this scenario). He doesn't agree with what's going on know, he showed concern in previous situations that life expectancy went to the gutter. He's just tired and backed in a corner where there's no real solution to fix this. I can opnly assume the thousand of things that he has in mind now, but certainly "Oh, this is the game I wanted!" it's not one of them.

More than anything, this game is a social experiment, so any and all of the suggestions in this thread will more than likely flat out kill what the game is about.

The game is amazing BECAUSE there is no punishment/reward for certain actions, what people do, they do because they want/have to, as soon as you introduce some arbitrary scale of punishment and reward you kill that spontaneity, even now, with the humanity scale hidden, ive started seeing alot more interesting situations arising in the chat channel, because there isnt some ever present number judging your actions now. If anything, the game could use LESS restrictions.

What the 'solution' is (if any) is implementing more indirect reasons to do things, more loot areas, different kinds of loot etc, introduce aspects of the game that can be completed in groups, solo, whatever.

Just dont start introducing bullshit arcade style mechanics that funnel you into one camp or another, simply for the sake of someone's definition of 'balance'.

It really is interesting to see how gamers react when there is no 'us vs them' mentality to fall back on when it comes to conflict, we're so used to being pointed in the direction of what to shoot at and why we should shoot at them, that when presented with a completely free form, open world, it all goes to shit and people cant handle it.

Any experiment is only valid if the condition of experiment are appropriate. If the mechanics and closed system which in this case is game are not appropriately simulating the tested effect, then the result of experiment is worthless since its skewed by the mistake in calculations.

I dont quite get why people talk about DayZ as if its somewhat unique experiment testing human behavior - its not the first game with pking, not the most punitive, and not the most aggravating either. Ultima Online for example was much better experiment in that aspect since actions had social consequences and people could actually do something against the problem they were faced with. In DayZ theres no such options/tools given by the system. The attacker is always a winner -the risk of being defender is incomparable higher. The way the "killers" act in DayZ would only be compared with suicide bombers irl - they dont take "their" death in consideration.

Theres nothing deep or realistic about whats happening right now. Its just another game where PKing is an option. The problem is not with PKing itself - problem is with lack of other mechanics and content.

[UbiquitousBadGuy 846]

As of right now, there is no difference in accomplishment from a pvp'r who dies consistently in Cherno to the survivalist that camps in the North for days on end. Not where the game is concerned.

As long as both groups enjoy what they do, they are experiencing the side of DayZ they want and arguably the one they deserve. Neither is more correct but still this sense of imbalance remains. It's the sense of effort that goes into being a survivalist compared to the anarchist. You want to last the longest and hopefully find some cool toys along the way. The pvp'r is just interested in shooting things. Both, arguably, get enjoyment out of their preferred play-styles but one takes a hell of a lot more effort to achieve. Human nature generally follows the path of least resistance unless you introduce riskier alternatives.

[FlowerChild 1]

Rocket, I just wanted to say that you're my new modding hero. I'm the author of a fairly popular Minecraft mod (Better Than Wolves) and similar to you I've also worked as a professional game developer.

I've been following your mod with keen interest the past few weeks, and some of my users have been pointing out the similarities in our way of thinking, so I just wanted to chime in and voice my support for your whole creative process and your absolute pig-headedness in refusing to allow popularity determine the course of the mod (an attribute which we very much share and which I believe is absolutely crucial to maintaining a creative vision).

This thread in particular has just been downright classic IMO, and I've found myself cracking up laughing at several of your responses today, especially knowing they could have very well come from my own lips.

My personal favorite so far:

So the DayZ world has gone to shit? Good. We're on track then. Because its a fucking Zombie Apocalypse.

Preach on brother :)

[Shag 90]

This thread started out with an example of (and I saw something similar today) four of five brainless deathmatch types running around elektro. I have no issues with any type of gameplay machanic you want to employ, but sometimes they snap you ou of the illusion of the setting.

I have seen threads about zombie olympics, where players pick up a horde of zombies and run through cherno.

i'm not going to make any other remark on this other than, it is breaking the suspense of disbelief somewhat. something that the excellent base of arma and the brutal bleak gamesetting you have fostered with no rules really caught my imagination. there aren't enough original games with freedom to do what yoy want. I love the two extremes of human nature, hunter and survivor. I myself murdered my first survivor today, because he had a good weapon, then felt guilty for ages - perfect! do not change this.

I understand the hypocracy of taking issue with this. what can i do to chaneg this myself? avoid the areas... ok agreed. I just think it may be wiser to make the juiciest areas, the most attractive targets for everyone, more of an ordeal. the disrespect people are showing the zombie apocolypse is just breaking the illusion.

I know, it isnt finished yet. but i will keep playing and keep giving my feedback. please don't rage if it isn't what you want to hear :)

[alchemy1002 5]

TCM approved.

[Chief Savage Man 0]

its emergent gameplay dude people are going to take from it what they will take from it and you gotta deal with it

[Snowjump 1]

I suggest "The bean war" is not a problem (so doesn't need to be solved), it is situation, maybe hard situation for someone. But I always thought that this game is hardcore, just find your way to survive.

I was shoted few times, I helped few players, some players helped me, and nothing changed my role in this game. I only get more experience and could survive longer.

[Dragunov (DayZ) 4]

mechanic:

Allow the creation of servers designated Survival servers, characters from survival servers cannot join normal servers, Survival servers do not allow players to shoot each other, only to team up and fight zed, clear towns, build stuff etc.

There is no need to force anything on anyone, all you need to do is provide the option.

[rocket 16567]

... but certainly "Oh' date=' this is the game I wanted!" it's not one of them...

[/quote']

This wasn't really supposed to be a game, it's more of an anti-game. And what I've always wanted is a something that makes people think and moves people to question the same bullshit we've been feeding out for ages.

Well, we have that. The greatest movie I ever saw was Salò. It made me feel physically sick. I was angry for days after seeing it. I was so ANGRY at the director for what he made me feel. He took all these things I valued, love, sex, intimacy, emotions, and then stripped them down and hung them out to die, one by one.

Then I realized, it's the greatest movie I have ever seen, because it moved me so deeply, it shook every part of me. It's a pretty ballsy thing for a director to do, and he did it.

So what do I want to do with my life? Well, something unconventional. I want a game that makes people think, about game design and question things about themselves and explore stuff. A game where people are arguing about it in the forums, talking about it on twitter, having an opinion on it.

This is a project for people who want to try something different, have some different experiences, feel some real emotions in a game. For anyone who doesn't, have some of this and this.

[frankysan 1]

believe or not but i managed to read all this crap from page 1...

dunno what's in your brains guys, but when i play on ts with my friends it's part of the fun having a crowded area where people shoot on sight. Raids in Balota airport are fun only because of the insane amount of players hunting decent equipment around there. If you want to cooperate the north of the map is there for a reason, i can't think why you would stay on that crappy coast!

and as rocket is trying to say if you are cooperating with someone and u STILL get killed by random bandits, well.... be glad this is not a real zombalipse

---

gief grey's anatomy lootable skins

[Reign19k 1]

Something tells me that most people that play in "sandboxes" have no fucking clue how to operate in one.

"Anti" players operate using the same fucking mechanics that "carebears" do. If you don't like it, surround yourself with other like minded players and do something about them. Stop trying to get the developer to intervene because you can't operate in a sandbox. Murderous players also die when you shoot them in the fucking head.

[proxzor 3]

... but certainly "Oh' date=' this is the game I wanted!" it's not one of them...

[/quote']

This wasn't really supposed to be a game, it's more of an anti-game. And what I've always wanted is a something that makes people think and moves people to question the same bullshit we've been feeding out for ages.

Well, we have that. The greatest movie I ever saw was Salò. It made me feel physically sick. I was angry for days after seeing it. I was so ANGRY at the director for what he made me feel. He took all these things I valued, love, sex, intimacy, emotions, and then stripped them down and hung them out to die, one by one.

Then I realized, it's the greatest movie I have ever seen, because it moved me so deeply, it shook every part of me. It's a pretty ballsy thing for a director to do, and he did it.

So what do I want to do with my life? Well, something unconventional. I want a game that makes people think, about game design and question things about themselves and explore stuff. A game where people are arguing about it in the forums, talking about it on twitter, having an opinion on it.

This is a project for people who want to try something different, have some different experiences, feel some real emotions in a game. For anyone who doesn't, have some of this and this.

I hereby want to thank you again for this awesome game. I don't know what to say but to blame it on the new generation man. People want to play games that are easy nowadays. They want to do nothing at all and everything must be easy to do. I am really glad how this game works and hope it will never be made easier. I enjoy every second I spent in this game and you should let the haters hate man. If they dont like it, fuck them. You're doing a lot of work in your free time and you earn a lot of respect. These ungrateful shits should just fuck the hell off if they don't like it. Or make their own modification instead if they know it better. Once again, a BIG thank you man.

[Felix (DayZ) 21]

This is a project for people who want to try something different' date=' have some different experiences, feel some real emotions in a game.

[/quote']

This being the first game in a while that I've felt tensions, excitement or any real sense of weight to choices. You'd done a great job so far.

[marxismftw 1]

There's a lot of words here in this here thread by people asking for the game to be changed to fit particular play-styles and methods of cooperation - mostly from survivors looking to team up with other people in game. I'm not one of those people. I'm a member of one of the "bad guys" that rocket talked about in a post earlier in this thread, and rarely to we talk about what we do or what makes us successful, but I will try and offer at least some perspective.

Pandemic Legion (from EVE Online) branched out to become more of a close-nit gaming community as opposed to a 1 game specific guild. While all PL members play or have played EVE at one point or another, our other games community includes not just our members (about 400 different people), but also former members, members of allied and hostile alliances in game, and even RL friends of members. We're used to organizing large numbers of players against specific objectives or other player groups and have a lot of experience in what's commonly known as griefing or meta-gaming. In EVE this is the difference between winning and losing (though not to say we always come out on top). Many of our members, including a large pool that adopted DayZ early on in the development cycle have been playing Arma II and OA for years. The perma-death aspect, the sandbox nature of the environment, and the fact that players make the rules and drive the content made the mode widely popular inside PL, far beyond the traditional Arma II crowd. As a result, we have a lot of active players and the infrastructure to support them, and we aren't looking to make any new friends.

We work in groups to accomplish our objectives, we know where everything spawns and the most efficient methods of obtaining good gear, we know how to work zombie agro to our advantage, we know the best places to approach and cover a location from, we know the best sniping locations for all of the important towns and landmarks in Chernerus, and we have the best gear and significant stockpiles for when we need to rearm. We have cars, helicopters, and camps on many servers. None of this prevents us from getting killed of course, but the chances of you looting my DMR and NVGs and getting away alive before I can reclaim my gear is pretty slim.

I'm surprised however that many people are looking to team up with randoms in game and that they think there should be incentives for that. Chernerus is definately a place where groups survive better than individuals, but it is in developing an organizational structure beyond global chat that people see success. Many complain that they can't trust the people around them and they are right - you can't. You don't know them, you haven't worked with them, you haven't screened them, and with over 100k unique players now, you'll likely never see them again (and visa-versa). If you want to develop the community and organization to allow you to survive and prosper, you need to go the extra mile to create that community. Find like-minded individuals either with real life friends or organize them here on the forums and then establish a communications structure - people that you communicate with out of game are much less likely to pop you in the back of the head when you least expect it.

I don't hate most of the suggestions here that make the world and the zombies more dangerous and more interactive, however that isn't going to solve your issues.

You want it to be one way, but it's the other way.

[melanko 0]

Now' date=' I have yet to see a single non "wishy-washy" idea above that even resembles a game mechanic. Please don't just post your ideas. Ideas are worthless. Everyone has ideas. Mechanics have value. Post mechanics, and I will consider them.

[/quote']

Well a mechanic I was thinking about recently is make certain 'high end' areas of the game require two or more people to access. Places that are surrounded by high walls, high debris, blocking debris et al.

This way if you want to get into some of the richest resource places you need to have a friend and that will limit lone wolfs that do nothing but shoot first.

[Suicide Mouse 50]

... but certainly "Oh' date=' this is the game I wanted!" it's not one of them...

[/quote']

This wasn't really supposed to be a game, it's more of an anti-game. And what I've always wanted is a something that makes people think and moves people to question the same bullshit we've been feeding out for ages.

Well, we have that. The greatest movie I ever saw was Salò. It made me feel physically sick. I was angry for days after seeing it. I was so ANGRY at the director for what he made me feel. He took all these things I valued, love, sex, intimacy, emotions, and then stripped them down and hung them out to die, one by one.

Then I realized, it's the greatest movie I have ever seen, because it moved me so deeply, it shook every part of me. It's a pretty ballsy thing for a director to do, and he did it.

So what do I want to do with my life? Well, something unconventional. I want a game that makes people thing, about game design and question things. A game where people are arguing about it in the forums, talking about it on twitter, having an opinion on it.

This is a project for people who want to try something different, have some different experiences, feel some real emotions in a game. For anyone who doesn't, have some of this and this.

This is exactly what I wanted too. As soon as I heard about it I assumed there would be some sort of penalty, if not at least some consequence, for killing people, and I immediately accepted whatever they would be. I thought "I know I'll be punished for this shit, but I'm going to be an assassin and just live with the consequences". I really wanted that because then people would know "Oh, there are this and that consequence to kill and this guy killed me with no reason anyway. He didn't looted me or anything, he just killed me even being aware of what would happen to him." He would reflect upon this and how there are people in this world that really chose that way, aware of everything that could happen they just didn't care because that's who they wanted to be. This it's what it was going to make me feel something, and maybe make the victim feel something too, reflect about the kind of person that would submit themselves to go along that path. Now everyone is killing everyone and there will be no real consequence, no weight, so I won't feel anything in killing this guys because they don't give a shit, they are all playing deathmatch anyway. All the impact that I, as a killer, would have caused in that world (which undoubtedly would be just as a heavy impact as a group of people helping others) has been taken away. That's what I was talking about all along. The chance to feel something will be taken away because it has become mundane.

I know there's nothing you can do, really, because it would impose disadvantage in some, and they just can't live with that, they want to do everything they want and have just as much chances as everyone else. This is the result of pampered kids that never had the chance to do the "bad things" of the world and now think that should be able to anything in a game without repercussion. Just wanted you to know this side of the "feeling something different with a game/anti-game/whateverthefuck".

[TheCaptn (DayZ) 12]

You let players define their own value and own consequences and they won't have any reason not to kill.

You make this same assertion everywhere you go' date=' you never stop to justify it and it's demonstrably not true, but you keep making it... I've already explained the problems in your Moral Effect Theory thread, so I'm not going to get into it again, except to say you're just wrong.

---

I'm currently on my 3rd day alive; I have 140ish zombie kills, zero murders and two bandit kills... I've made multiple trips to the NW Airfield and Stary Sobor military camp, repaired a car, lost a car, gotten into gunfights and almost always retreated instead of trying to be a hero, been stalked by a pair of bandits and escaped, made numerous trips back to Elektro and Cherno to help get newbies out of the hotzone and kitted out (generally in Zelenogorsk or Berenzino).

I am a good guy. I'm not a carebear, I'm not hiding in the woods living off wild game (ok, I did for an afternoon but it got boring). There are many like me, I've worked with them, shared resources, come to each others aid despite being complete strangers, and been shot in the back twice for the trouble. I've maintained an ethical approach to this game for the simple reason that it's [b']more of a challenge, and gives me more personal satisfaction.

That's not true of everyone, which is frakking brilliant, and I sure as hell don't want it to be imposed on anyone, because that would only devalue it for me. The harder this game gets, and the more people turn to easy PKing, the more I'm loving the hell out of it, and the more I wish whiners would suck it up and stop -demanding- that the universe be fair to them; because they might actually get their way and ruin the experience in the process.

[proxzor 3]

... but certainly "Oh' date=' this is the game I wanted!" it's not one of them...

[/quote']

This wasn't really supposed to be a game, it's more of an anti-game. And what I've always wanted is a something that makes people think and moves people to question the same bullshit we've been feeding out for ages.

Well, we have that. The greatest movie I ever saw was Salò. It made me feel physically sick. I was angry for days after seeing it. I was so ANGRY at the director for what he made me feel. He took all these things I valued, love, sex, intimacy, emotions, and then stripped them down and hung them out to die, one by one.

Then I realized, it's the greatest movie I have ever seen, because it moved me so deeply, it shook every part of me. It's a pretty ballsy thing for a director to do, and he did it.

So what do I want to do with my life? Well, something unconventional. I want a game that makes people thing, about game design and question things. A game where people are arguing about it in the forums, talking about it on twitter, having an opinion on it.

This is a project for people who want to try something different, have some different experiences, feel some real emotions in a game. For anyone who doesn't, have some of this and this.

This is exactly what I wanted too. As soon as I heard about it I assumed there would be some sort of penalty, if not at least some consequence, for killing people, and I immediately accepted whatever they would be. I thought "I know I'll be punished for this shit, but I'm going to be an assassin and just live with the consequences". I really wanted that because then people would know "Oh, there are this and that consequence to kill and this guy killed me with no reason anyway. He didn't looted me or anything, he just killed me even being aware of what would happen to him." He would reflect upon this and how there are people in this world that really chose that way, aware of everything that could happen they just didn't care because that's who they wanted to be. This it's what it was going to make me feel something, and maybe make the victim feel something too, reflect about the kind of person that would submit themselves to go along that path. Now everyone is killing everyone and there will be no real consequence, no weight, so I won't feel anything in killing this guys because they don't give a shit, they are all playing deathmatch anyway. All the impact that I, as a killer, would have caused in that world (which undoubtedly would be just as a heavy impact as a group of people helping others) has been taken away. That's what I was talking about all along. The chance to feel something will be taken away because it has become mundane.

I know there's nothing you can do, really, because it would impose disadvantage in some, and they just can't live with that, they want to do everything they want and have just as much chances as everyone else. This is the result of pampered kids that never had the chance to do the "bad things" of the world and now think that should be able to anything in a game without repercussion. Just wanted you to know this side of the "feeling something different with a game/anti-game/whateverthefuck".

Currently the concept of being survivor and bandit is not working and since this game is in Alpha Rocket is trying different things to see where the game might end. This could mean that the game could be completely different at launch but this is highly unlikely. But there are many people that are currently not happy about bandits. I am pretty sure the full team is thinking of a mechanic that would 'punish' the bandits but in the mean while we just have to wait and report suggestions and bugs. Bitching and moaning about this is completely time wasting for everyone and annoys the fuck out of the team behind this game. If you want to be a help to this game, go actually be useful and help, and if you prefer to bitch and moan about it just do something else. Play Diablo 3 its a great game, or play call of duty I dont know but don't whine about it in the meanwhile.

[Suicide Mouse 50]

Friend, I don't give a fuck about my Moral Effect Theory. It's obviously wrong and obviously unpractible. It was a result of desperation in face of the inevitable fate of the player base, that is all.

As for the rest, I applaud you. You are exactly what I described in my last post. You're having a harder time and according to semantic you are being punished for being like this, and yet you stick with it, because it's who you chose to be in this world. It's perfect, it's admirable.

Unfortunately, we know we don't make the playerbase, we are outnumbered and we won't count as this grows.

You say it's not true? Look at the numbers in the main site, that is all.

Some will be like you, but IT'S NOT ENOUGH, HUMANITY IS NOT LIKE YOU.

That's all.

---

Currently the concept of being survivor and bandit is not working and since this game is in Alpha Rocket is trying different things to see where the game might end. This could mean that the game could be completely different at launch but this is highly unlikely. But there are many people that are currently not happy about bandits. I am pretty sure the full team is thinking of a mechanic that would 'punish' the bandits but in the mean while we just have to wait and report suggestions and bugs. Bitching and moaning about this is completely time wasting for everyone and annoys the fuck out of the team behind this game. If you want to be a help to this game' date=' go actually be useful and help, and if you prefer to bitch and moan about it just do something else. Play Diablo 3 its a great game, or play call of duty I dont know but don't whine about it in the meanwhile.

[/quote']

Are you implying I'm bitching and moaning based on that post? REALLY? Out of all the posts in this sad thread you're saying that about MY post about my opinion and how I'm not asking anything to be changed?

Wow...

[Virfortis 111]

This is a project for people who want to try something different' date=' have some different experiences, feel some real emotions in a game. For anyone who doesn't, have some of this and this.

Great, applaud-able idea, but to quote the cliche: This is the internet. Furthermore, this is a mod, for a game, about killing people.

You can have tactical thought, plenty of planning, but you expect people to think and feel real emotions? There's not enough people to try that.

That said, this post made me do a complete turn around and I realized: We're a lot alike. I would LOVE for players to think and feel while playing DayZ, and there are clearly a small number that do. Heck, I tried to do so myself. THIS is what people have been asking: What do you want?

This right here, rocket, this is what you want. A game for people to feel emotions. Perhaps what you want is roleplaying servers, but in the spirit of DayZ, sort of like STALKER? I am curious about this. This COULD, if done right, be an amazing project, but only if the community as a whole pulls together.

What I think you're looking for is a way to get the players to think and feel, to treat their lives in-gamewith the same value they treat their own lives. That can be accomplished by pushing and hyping up the "role-playing" aspect of DayZ. It's not an in-game mechanic, just ask servers to consider switching to RP systems. Maybe just start setting the tone by saying something along the lines of "DayZ is a game that requires players to create their own story. If you're not interacting with others and just shooting them, you're doing it wrong." It would make players think, sure, but I can see why my idea is impossible at best.

[Felix (DayZ) 21]

Hmm, I wonder how much this playstyle of shoot everything simply stems from players not knowing better? I see nothing in side chat except for advice to shoot anybody you see because they're going to shoot you. Everywhere along the coast, as mentioned, is generally a warzone. Most people entering into the game because it sounded cool may not know any different.

Simply an idle thought.

[Virfortis 111]

You let players define their own value and own consequences and they won't have any reason not to kill.

You make this same assertion everywhere you go' date=' you never stop to justify it and it's demonstrably not true, but you keep making it... I've already explained the problems in your Moral Effect Theory thread, so I'm not going to get into it again, except to say you're just wrong.

---

I'm currently on my 3rd day alive; I have 140ish zombie kills, zero murders and two bandit kills... I've made multiple trips to the NW Airfield and Stary Sobor military camp, repaired a car, lost a car, gotten into gunfights and almost always retreated instead of trying to be a hero, been stalked by a pair of bandits and escaped, made numerous trips back to Elektro and Cherno to help get newbies out of the hotzone and kitted out (generally in Zelenogorsk or Berenzino).

I am a good guy. I'm not a carebear, I'm not hiding in the woods living off wild game (ok, I did for an afternoon but it got boring). There are many like me, I've worked with them, shared resources, come to each others aid despite being complete strangers, and been shot in the back twice for the trouble. I've maintained an ethical approach to this game for the simple reason that it's [b']more of a challenge, and gives me more personal satisfaction.

That's not true of everyone, which is frakking brilliant, and I sure as hell don't want it to be imposed on anyone, because that would only devalue it for me. The harder this game gets, and the more people turn to easy PKing, the more I'm loving the hell out of it, and the more I wish whiners would suck it up and stop -demanding- that the universe be fair to them; because they might actually get their way and ruin the experience in the process.

Here's your problem: You think this is how it is for everyone.

For every one of you, there are currently around 100 others that say "it's a game, kill people"

People just don't do that anymore, they don't set their own code and expect to be handheld (I.E. the government tell them what to do) so when this anti-game came along, people had no clue what to do. If you're a pioneer of how the game should be played, teach others, don't flame them and wish you could make them go die.

[Nightronin 1]

I just got off after the whole day of playing. I went from silent defender to MFKing Bandit and Goddamn this game got better(easier too)! I dunno about you guys but I love killing bandits/survivors alike to survive. It's better than going into those zombie infested areas to find loot. Just loot that poor bastard running across the hills :) If I didn't need beans and water to survive I'd go back to Lone Wolf/Silent Defender/Bandit Killer/Team player/Friendly.

Since converting to Bandit, this game now reminds me of Battle Royale. Feelsgoodman.jpg