Should we scrap bandit models?

[Oblivious (DayZ) 0]

If it stays in the mod long term, it should be a low priority feature. Something to entertain once things are farther along. So drop now it if it's getting in the way. Personally, I would rather see players get a random skin on character creation. Would aid realism, groups, and stalking/scouting.

I do however like the concept of hunting bandits, for those with a hero complex.

[Rinner23 5]

Vote: Humanity reset on spawn.

[The Killing Joke 43]

Vote: Do away with the morality system.

Caveat: Fix the way we can identify players, so we can effectively say, "Look out for that Rinner23 guy, he's a PK'er!"

Sidebar: I like Rinner23. He's a funny guy, and doesn't afraid of anything.

TKJ

[Rinner23 5]

Vote: Do away with the morality system.

Caveat: Fix the way we can identify players' date=' so we can effectively say, "Look out for that Rinner23 guy, he's a PK'er!"

Sidebar: I like Rinner23. He's a funny guy, and doesn't afraid of anything.

TKJ

[/quote']

I like the idea of some sort of system to identify players but by OTHER players instead of the system itself. That way even innocent players could get tagged.. interesting.

However I can imagine the technical challenges of this would be even more demanding than the bandit model idea in the first place.

At this point I agree maybe just scrap the entire humanity system for now and focus on other issues. It does seem to be the consensus.

[The Killing Joke 43]

I like the idea of some sort of system to identify players but by OTHER players instead of the system itself. That way even innocent players could get tagged.. interesting.

I wholeheartedly agree. There is no argument from me in regards to the fact that it is unfair for people to be able to kill other players to the point of exhaustion' date=' and then 'pop out', rename themselves, "Joe Niceguy", and pop back in and tell everyone, "Hey, I'm a bandit hunter. Let me join your team, and I'll knock them all out."

However I can imagine the technical challenges of this would be even more demanding than the bandit model idea in the first place.

It's possible that it's a tough thing to do. I haven't coded in a couple of years, and don't have access to the ArmA code, so I can't say one way or the other if it might be easy. Maybe it's as simple as locking the player name for a determined period of time. Maybe it's not.

At this point I agree maybe just scrap the entire humanity system for now and focus on other issues. It does seem to be the consensus.

It's a tough argument to be made from both sides, and believe me, I do appreciate the nuances of both. (I guess what I'm saying is, I'm really not as big a dick as I play on the internet.)

;)

TKJ

[donalonzo 0]

If they are a problem, get rid of them.

[Lady Kyrah 1109]

I like the idea of some sort of system to identify players but by OTHER players instead of the system itself. That way even innocent players could get tagged.. interesting.

I wholeheartedly agree. There is no argument from me in regards to the fact that it is unfair for people to be able to kill other players to the point of exhaustion' date=' and then 'pop out', rename themselves, "Joe Niceguy", and pop back in and tell everyone, "Hey, I'm a bandit hunter. Let me join your team, and I'll knock them all out."

However I can imagine the technical challenges of this would be even more demanding than the bandit model idea in the first place.

It's possible that it's a tough thing to do. I haven't coded in a couple of years, and don't have access to the ArmA code, so I can't say one way or the other if it might be easy. Maybe it's as simple as locking the player name for a determined period of time. Maybe it's not.

At this point I agree maybe just scrap the entire humanity system for now and focus on other issues. It does seem to be the consensus.

It's a tough argument to be made from both sides' date=' and believe me, I do appreciate the nuances of both. (I guess what I'm saying is, I'm really not as big a dick as I play on the internet.)

;)

TKJ

[/quote']

It's simple, arma doesnt have a mechanic to change the model of an actor on the fly, i let you imagine what rocket is actually doing to make it happen.

[masterjts 1]

Take them out if they are a problem.

I like the system but at this point they dont really do what they intended because a lot of bandits are in civilian skins and a lot of civilians are in bandit skins. You dont know based on their skin right now anyways so just take it out until you can find a better solution that isnt such a PITA on the servers.

On a side note. One thing I dont like about the bandit skin is the face wrap. If you are in a group you cant tell who is who because the only custom feature is covered (their face.)

[pastyvirgin 3]

if scrapped, should still be an option for character profile to wear the skin....its too badass to just scrap forever :(

[metal_izanagi 3]

Okay, that quoted post wasn't even by me. It was by Rinner23.

Back on-topic, allowing players to tag others as a feature of the mod would encourage, as I suggested somewhere else, I forget exactly where, mob rule/popularity votes. Does this /really/ need to be a mod where goons can just troll all over the place as part of the damn system? Then you'd have people being harassed by constantly being tagged with stupid crap, or outright lies. Pretty sure BI doesn't want that kind of PR with a mod they're actually interested in working with. As for the "bigots" thing, I didn't mean that there are bigots in the mod. It was a reference to how lawlessness always has a foil, no matter how grimdark you want the setting to be. Don't jump on a soapbox without reading a bit first, man. You've been getting /really/ defensive about this. Chill, we're here to have fun, not I dunno, mock people that are insecure about humans to begin with, and hate the idea of a zombie mod where the zombies are an afterthought to the humans. If I wanted to do the whole "everyone is a suspect, you're going to get killed for no reason" thing, and all the stress it comes with, I'd just go to Uganda.

The moral system needs to be there in some form, for sure, because otherwise it's safer to only refrain from shooting your friends, and kill everyone else. With all of this realism talk, turning the game into Lord of The Flies with zombies like that is kind of dumbing it down a bit.

Adding peacekeepers would /greatly/ expand things, with positive humanity gained from killing bandits. It would also prevent people from accidentally being labelled bandits just for taking out a guy who killed another player out of nowhere. That would be three factions right away. Bandits, Peacekeepers, and the Survivors caught in the middle of what would likely be daily skirmishes between the two fightey groups.

Would also mean that you could stay in a "grey area" by balancing bandit/survivor and peacekeeper kills, meaning if you were really that hellbent on not wanting anyone to know if you're trustworthy or not, you would have to work for it. Humanity should gradually rise over time, and be increased by doing things like leaving supplies in stashes, bandaging the injured, and so on. Sure, people would farm that stuff to keep in the "grey area" of Survivor, but that's going to happen regardless, and at least the decent folks that play the game to play, and not to step on everyone else, would have real options.

Bottom line, if you're not playing to have fun, but to get your kicks from frustrating and upsetting other players, you shouldn't be welcomed in the community, and moreso, BI shouldn't want you as part of the playerbase. Just because it's a game doesn't mean it's okay to be an asshat about it. Some of the stuff that happens in EVE Online is exactly why it's always going to be a niche game. A majority of people tend to not be interested in dealing with backstabbing assholes in a game, when they probably have to do that in real-life already.

[The Killing Joke 43]

Okay' date=' that quoted post wasn't even by me. It was by Rinner23.[/quote']

My apologies. Totally a bad copy/paste, but I accept the blame for causing this issue. I have since edited my post to reflect the change.

Bottom line' date=' if you're not playing to have fun, but to get your kicks from frustrating and upsetting other players, you shouldn't be welcomed in the community, and moreso, BI shouldn't want you as part of the playerbase.[/quote']

This.

Just because it's a game doesn't mean it's okay to be an asshat about it. Some of the stuff that happens in EVE Online is exactly why it's always going to be a niche game. A majority of people tend to not be interested in dealing with backstabbing assholes in a game' date=' when they probably have to do that in real-life already.[/quote']

Hold on there just a second.

:D

EvE isn't a niche game. It has (admittedly) a huge learning curve, but it is much, much more than you're giving it credit for. I would like to publicly defend the difference between 'griefers' and 'people who play the game as it was intended to be - harsh and unforgiving'.

Please don't take my EvE examples as something that is bad about the game. Open-endedness and flexibility is something to be celebrated, as it gives people opportunities to make the game different from what's out there already. There are already a lot of great, great games, where the opportunities are available to do one thing - kill other players in 1-on-1 action, and I would like to think that Rocket's mod is already more than that.

TKJ

[viral187 2]

Yes scrap them. There would be no way to ID anyone like that IRL.

[Tyshalle 0]

Yes, scrap them. I'm a fan of letting players choose their own skins, but I think forcing appearance changes based on whether you're a murderer or not is far too gamey in a game that successfully goes for full immersion and realism in most other ways.

[PinkTaco (DayZ) 2]

No. It adds excitement when you see bandits!

[The Killing Joke 43]

No. It adds excitement when you see bandits!

Let's say you see one, and kill it. Let's say you see another, and kill it too. Let's say you kill a whole whopping heap of them, and now, you get turned into one. Is that ok with you? That is the current way it's possible.

What you see isn't necessarily what you get.

TKJ

[hazdude222 0]

Keep the skin, it puts noobs off becoming an asshat to everyone they meet.

[ultraspank 0]

No keep them, the humanity system is awesome, it should just be perhaps a bit more difficult to become a bandit.

[stripes 92]

Poll won't let me vote but I vote no keep them. How else will we know who is a player killer?

[seannybgoode 10]

Yes, scrap the bandit/survivor system altogether. Everyone is a bandit anyway. I've been shot first by so many survivors anyway.

[Sauerkraut (DayZ) 0]

I lack the required permission to vote in the poll, but i too vote No.

The humanity system in my opinion is great. If anything, it should be expanded. Custom models should be available to you based upon your humanity score. For example, if your humanity is extremely high, you could choose between several skins, all directly related to your humanity score. Maybe a John Wayne skin for those who romp around slaying bandits, maybe a scientist skin, maybe a doctor skin, all available to you based upon the way you play the game. Just my 2 cents.

[Jugg 33]

My preference would be to keep them and develop the system so that there is more skins involved in both higher and lower humanity.

With that said, if its causing technical issues remove it until a later point or change the system so that it takes affect when you have logged off and back in rather then instantly. Whichever helps more.. but its definitely something that should remain a part of the experience. Especially when there is vet servers with no way to even ID friends without coms.

[Mrazik (DayZ) 0]

I believe a nice solution would be to have a small stat list shown when you aim at another player. A simple list of how many zombies and people that they have killed would very much help one to make a quick judgement of character.

I feel overall though, that the game should not be able to make character judgement for players, which is essentially what the bandit skin does. It tells other players that the game has predetermined that an individual is a "bad guy" according to its standards. A more open system that allows other players to pass judgement of each other would be more realistic and beneficial.

We all know that some bandits have received the skin according to unfortunate circumstances. Therefore, the line that is drawn by the game for good/bad should be dropped, and a system which forces a player to pass their own judgement should be implemented.

[simasz 15]

If the bandit skin is gained "unfortunately", then why not implement a factor of continuity? For example you keep the bandit outfit if you kill a survivor every hour or something like that. Then the "Oops" bandits would get back to survivors. And the bandits who keep killing people, if they try to get a survivor skin to be able to kill quicker, that would enforce them to kill less just for that.

[ytman18@gmail.com 9]

I think a person who makes a life of killing and thievery would attempt to hide their face from whatever semblance of society remained. Maybe make it harder to be one/less obvious one is (handkerchief around the face).

[rossmum 7]

Yes, scrap them. Technical problems are not worth going through when they are rather arbitrary, a lot of people with bandit skins were just defending themselves and it leads to a lot of ingame drama when one of these guys gets shot on sight. Make players a little more hesitant.