Banned from Eu8 for russian language

[Mojo (DayZ) 66]

Dont be stupid...and stop moving the goal posts.... Rocket said no Racist or malicious comments' date=' everyone made a big issue out of you cant kick someone for a clan member or reserve slots because it was "THE RULES" ...i just think you are trolling now, because you keep changing you point....

[/quote']

Haven't changed the point once, boss. Check it out. What I said at 3:07:

As I've explained to you several times now' date=' rocket isn't trying to turn DayZ into the world morality thoughtpolice trying to cure racist thoughts with server bans, he's trying to prevent players from being insulted or abused by other players.

[/quote']

What I said over 24 hours before that:

The point of the no racism rule isn't to try to take racists out of the world (and if it is it's a hilariously egotistical and pie-in-the-sky design goal)' date=' it's to stop racists from disrupting the play experience of others. If they're being racist in a language only they can understand, then nobody who could be harmed by that racism could parse that information, and the information which would be meaningful (in its intent to harm) becomes completely lost, and there is no need to kick/ban them for their actions because their actions are already self-limiting.

[/quote']

Wow, look at those goalposts go! They've moved so fast they literally completely circled the world to end up right back where they started!

Admittedly, I'm quite proud of myself. This troll was really hard to pull off, staying-on message like that, literally almost word-for-word. Good thing you showed up to blow the lid right off that conspiracy. They should buy you a van and a team of hip young teenagers and a plucky Great Dane, pay you to travel the country solving mysteries.

[willjad11 2]

In conclusion, we should allow people speak any language they want in the game. The end.

[jockbhoy@blueyonder.co.uk 3]

Admittedly, I'm quite proud of myself. This troll was really hard to pull off, staying-on message like that, literally almost word-for-word. Good thing you showed up to blow the lid right off that conspiracy. They should buy you a van and a team of hip young teenagers and a plucky Great Dane, pay you to travel the country solving mysteries.

Maybe i should, do you want the position of Great Dane?. :P

[jayroe 3]

Your analogy literally makes no sense. First' date=' comparing sports to the languages people speak is absurd, since sports are composed of agreed-upon rules that are in no way contingent on the languages people speak.[/quote']

It doesn't make sense to you because you continuously try to grossly extrapolate my posts beyond any intended point. I was comparing the scenarios of being able to accommodate everyone, but choosing not to because of the misconception that it might discriminate someone. That is all there was to it. You can pick apart any analogy or metaphor if you extrapolate it beyond the compared similarities. But what's the point? To prevent a meaningful discussion?

The agreed-upon rules, the clothing and most common shape of mustache of a sport are completely irrelevant to my analogy. You have people with different wants or needs and you have the resources to accommodate them all, but instead you choose to only accommodate the people with no specific wants or needs at the expense of the people who do.

Most of my TV channels are in Danish, but some are German, some are Norwegian and some are Swedish. I like to watch Danish TV or TV with Danish subtitles, so I click a Danish channel. Is this racist? Should EACH of my channels be a mix of a 100 languages so no one is discriminated?

People are different. Some are outgoing, some are shy, some feel a sense of security in understanding a language, some prefer to be around people who they can relate to, some want to discuss local events; There are a million reasons for someone to appreciate a localized server. Yet, people who ask to host a localized server are demonized and labeled as intolerant bigots.

I honestly do not see the harm in offering both international and localized servers. What's so unjust about offering something for everyone? Why exclusively cater only to the people who don't care. Offering localized servers is not aiding players with racist or hateful motives, it is allowing players to join a server where they feel the most comfortable, should those players have a localized preference or not.

Something that is a win for everyone in both the short and the long run isn't discriminatory.

Some players might prefer a localized server for racist reasons, but to simply paint anyone with a localized preference as racist is a gross and unjust generalization. The same kind of unjust generalization that is the core mechanism of racism.

[jayroe 3]

What I said over 24 hours before that:

The point of the no racism rule isn't to try to take racists out of the world (and if it is it's a hilariously egotistical and pie-in-the-sky design goal)' date=' it's to stop racists from disrupting the play experience of others.[/quote']

So it's not really about racism, but about disrupting the play experience of others?

Well, in that case "can't we just ignore what the racists write?" "we don't have to read their messages." "Nobody's forcing us to read them."

I'm strongly opposed to racism, but from the perspective of someone disrupting my play experience, one line of a foreign language takes up just as much of my often inadequate chat box as one line of racism. At least that's how my chat box sees it. It's a real bigot.

What do you call this thing where you one second tell players who feel that their play experience is disrupted by foreign chatter that they can simply ignore the chat and then the next second you argue that racist chatter is wrong, not because of it's malicious nature, but because, wait for it... It disrupts the play experience.

[Deneme 8]

Whenever any of my English speaking friends and me start playing on a RU server we usually get kicked off as soon as we start speaking English. If you want to speak different languages and not get banned on the English speaking servers, then how about this gets fixed as well?

[jockbhoy@blueyonder.co.uk 3]

So it's not really about racism, but about disrupting the play experience of others?

Well, in that case "can't we just ignore what the racists write?" "we don't have to read their messages." "Nobody's forcing us to read them."

I'm strongly opposed to racism, but from the perspective of someone disrupting my play experience, one line of a foreign language takes up just as much of my often inadequate chat box as one line of racism. At least that's how my chat box sees it. It's a real bigot.

What do you call this thing where you one second tell players who feel that their play experience is disrupted by foreign chatter that they can simply ignore the chat and then the next second you argue that racist chatter is wrong, not because of it's malicious nature, but because, wait for it... It disrupts the play experience.

Good point JayRoe..... a pos rep for that

[rocket 16567]

Arggggggggggggh god you guys are like a bunch of lawyers!

This kind of rule isn't a priority to change. We are trying to STANDARDIZE all rules across all servers. This includes difficulty settings. Customizing some rule isn't what we want to do when we are consolidating this. Please don't pick apart everything here, we can do that later. For the moment, a question was asked, we've explained that we don't want to look at this now for pragmatic reasons. Too much time has been wasted on this already.

As I said several times, we will look at this again later. For the moment, the rule stays as it is. Kicking for "different" language is a no go.

[jockbhoy@blueyonder.co.uk 3]

Arggggggggggggh god you guys are like a bunch of lawyers!

This kind of rule isn't a priority to change. We are trying to STANDARDIZE all rules across all servers. This includes difficulty settings. Customizing some rule isn't what we want to do when we are consolidating this. Please don't pick apart everything here' date=' we can do that later. For the moment, a question was asked, we've explained that we don't want to look at this now for pragmatic reasons. Too much time has been wasted on this already.

As I said several times, we will look at this again later. For the moment, the rule stays as it is. Kicking for "different" language is a no go.

[/quote']

LOL...I hear ya'...if i wasnt arguing on here i would be arguing with my old lady.... but at least she understands me :) end of thread for me.

[Mojo (DayZ) 66]

Maybe i should' date=' do you want the position of Great Dane?. :P

[/quote']

Yes!

[Vladivar 12]

There's no rule about this per se' date=' but I choose to do it anyway, regardless of the rules.[/quote']

But wait, you just said...

It's that simple. If you as a server host want continued access to DayZ SQL servers and DayZ updates' date=' you will abide by the contract that will give you access to that. If you don't like that contract, you don't get to keep all the perks with none of the downsides. You sever the agreement, and with the cons so go the pros.[/quote']

Why do you feel it legitimate for you to choose which rules you wish to follow or challenge (regardless of whether I/the next guy agrees with your stance or not) but not others? Why don't you server your contract?

You don't get to have your cake and eat it' date=' too.[/quote']

Indeed

[wakey 2]

Normally I doesn't have anything against Russians (Or any other nationality for that matter). But ffs they can be annoying when they start spamming the chat. And 99% doesn't give a s*** if you ask them to keep it in English (Or whatever language the server belongs to).

It's sad that admins can't do anything against it either...

[Mojo (DayZ) 66]

Why do you feel it legitimate for you to choose which rules you wish to follow or challenge (regardless of whether I/the next guy agrees with your stance or not) but not others?

What part of "there's no rule about this and therefore I use my own judgment to extend abusive use of chat to cover this contingency' date=' which does use the in-game chat system to deprive other players of their play experience, but not in a direct manner such as insulting them explicitly" do you personally feel conflicts with "there is a strict, explicit rule about this"?

I'm just really curious about this, because I don't see a single conflict there. You obviously do, so, you know, feel free to share. I'd love to hear it.

Why don't you server your contract?

You mean precisely how I severed my hosting contract due to a completely separate rule that, unlike your example of some vague and undefined using a best judgment scenario, was a) made explicitly clear and b) made explicitly clear in a way I fundamentally disagreed with?

You mean like that?

I'm seriously wondering if you could clarify both of those a little, because I'm curious to find out if you're as clever as you think you are... or if you're as clever as I think you are.

[dazza_bo 2]

What a complete load of shit some people are dribbling in this thread. It's not hurting you when Ruskis speak Ruski so pull your head out of your arse and let people be.

[Redaen 1]

Ok so i was playing on one of the nordic servers when 10 russians started spamming the global chat. the admin repeatedly told them to speak english or risk to be kicked i.e banned if they came back to do it more. they didn't listen, so the admin kicked the lot for breach of server rules. right afterwards some came back and started bickering about racism, how only them and not the others got kicked. Well, this got me pretty annoyed.

Most would guess that an SE server would have Swedish/Nordic languages and English as its main languages to be spoken on the server. this is to make sure everyone understands, since its in the global chat.

For instance, it might happen that I (I'm Norwegian) happen to find a fellow Norwegian or Nordic player on the EU servers. instead of going straight to global/side chat and spam it with Norwegian, I invite him to one of my TS servers, or one of the many made for just these issues.

Is it hard to just jump on TS/Skype/Mumble or whatever you might use as a communicating program and talk there?

[jayroe 3]

What a complete load of shit some people are dribbling in this thread. It's not hurting you when Ruskis speak Ruski so pull your head out of your arse and let people be.

Does it hurt anyone, if a server features a localized language? Do you have to play on every single server to enjoy this game when all servers feature the same unified experience?

If all the servers are the same, what does it matter to you if a server you don't even use adheres to English, Russian or Klingon? Do you have to play on generic server #472 to enjoy the game?

This is on the level of throwing a tantrum in the movie store because you found a Spanish dubbed version of The Dark Knight. Yes, that could be very offensive, if it wasn't for the fact that you could just pick from one of the hundred copies of the undubbed version. But no, EVERYTHING has to be the way you want it, there's no room for anyone to have anything the way THEY want it. Forgive me, but that seems incredibly intolerant.

If you have hundreds of copies of something, does it hurt you, if some of them are customized to people with different wants or needs than you? If it does, it's the good ol' intolerance acting up.

Let people be.

[EmotionalFartBlender 2]

JayRoe, give it up. You cant make people like this understand your point, as they will always take the conversation on the sidetracks and make analogies and try to prove their points trough them.

Main point is, the servers should have a common language, and that is English. If u must speak your own language, find a server in your country or host one yourself. It dont matter if you speak russian, swedish, finnish, german, spanish, portugese, greece, klingon or hindi. Its just fokken irritating when one group comes to a server in great numbers and takes over the chat with a language that the rest cant understand.

I really dont get this. I understand that the servers should be the same no matter where you go. But having localized servers would only be a good thing as the ones that are restricted in life, and only speak one language, can find one that speaks their own language. Now its impossible as some rude people give zero shits about others, when they ask them to speak english and floods the chat with odd gibberish. So yeah, we get the same experience on every server, and its called unpolite russian invasion.

Even the germans ;) will talk english on DE servers! Im used to shop from german webshops and the mofos usually reply in german when i write them in english.. hahaha.

Lol to the argument, that the rules are there to prevent people to offend one another. What a joke. Offending someone is not a problem as long as you play by the rules. And yes, we are discussing the rules here, not about breaking them, but about changing them to be better. I have been offended in Asia for my facial hair. I dont think they meant it as an offend, but after getting daily comments from random smiling people, that i should shave my beard, it sometimes felt not-so-good. Their culture, their rules - my problem if i cant handle them.

So you say racism is ok, if the one you are speaking ill of dont understand? what a load of crap. I dont see anywhere in the rules, that you cant offend others.

"- Their are only two reasons why you, as a server owner, should ban a player on your server. Those two reasons are: Malicious talk, and racism"

So speaking in your minority language on a server that is not hosted by the same language people, there is NO WAY admins can enforce these rules. So the rules are pretty much useless.

WTF is this: http://dayzmod.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=7139

Russian gibberish in the english section. Too hard to use the russian section? should we all just start posting here with our native language? Freedom of speech etc.

SUOMI FINLAND PERKELE

and fyi, i play BFBC2 and 90% with russians and have no problem. The chat in BFBC2 is of no importance, unlike the on in dayz. Actually, they should deactivate the whole damn chat as it is so unrealistic! or maby not, as it is used to talk about latest patches, warning others about new bugs and alot of really fokken important stuff. Unless the chat is taken over by some minority language.

But in the end, i dont care. I dont have a server. Was planning on getting one, if friends will chip in and are willing to play alot. But i will wait for a while. I get the rules as we are in Aplha atm. But when there is a possibility to host a server, that can reserve slots for me and my friends, the ones paying for it, im gonna look into it again.

[Mojo (DayZ) 66]

WTF is this: http://dayzmod.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=7139

Russian gibberish in the english section. Too hard to use the russian section? should we all just start posting here with our native language? Freedom of speech etc.

Pretty obvious, actually, given that I troubleshot him with machine translation.

He posted about being unable to play for four days since the update, and that he was able to connect to the servers. Logical deduction lead me to believe I could troubleshoot him in English, since he had recognized the English word "troubleshooting" and posted a technical problem in there.

Extending that logic, he didn't choose the forum at random, as he managed to find the correct forum instead of posting anywhere he pleased.

The obvious conclusion is that, since the Russian boards are buried at the bottom of the forums, with no indication at the top of the forums (the first place a person would see relevant information such as localization options or where the localized forums were located) that there was a Russian-localized forum, he scrolled through the forums until he found that most fit his needs, operating under the assumption that the forums were primarily in English, and made an attempt to communicate.

So when you ask "WHAT IS THIS?!", it's pretty fucking obvious what it is. A troubleshooting problem in a troubleshooting thread, correctly chosen, with an attempt to communicate in the only manner he knows.

[novaseline 3]

Lol this is funny. If anything some guys speaking in Russian in chat. Adds to the realism, since its based in Russia, is it not? damn right hilarious lol

[jayroe 3]

Unless you're a hunk of metal saying "I'll be back" in an Austrian accent, there's nothing realistic about having a wall of text scrolling past your visual field. Regardless of the language.

The chat is there for communicative purposes and if you want to give it a touch of realism, ask people not to use the global chat, because there is nothing remotely realistic about magically eavesdropping on a conversation 10km away.

[GrIfFiN (DayZ) 3]

If you got problems understanding of whats written, you got two options: 1. Learn. 2. Ignore. It's not the problem of the Russians if you dont understand our language. Game servers is international, just as game is. And about all this hostile feelings about Russians - go and read some good history book about WW2, you will learn, that its not us, who started this.

[EmotionalFartBlender 2]

And another one missing the point. First of all, how can an admin know, if someone in his server is using racist talk or otherwise unaxcepted talk. Maybe even exchanging exploits. There is no way if people are allowed to talk in what ever language they choose.

Its not about russians, but about languages that the admins and most players don´t understand. Most other nationality players use the common language that is english. It seems like only russians have an attitude problem and will spam the chat with russian no matter where the server is or who is hosting it. The hostile feelings against russians come from how they act. They themselves have made the situation "we against them". I would love the game to be international, but now its becoming Russian.

Its just super stupid that the servers don´t have an universal language. Really. It will only bring problems.

About the original post. I dont think its ok to kick band someone like that. But if someone keeps coming to a server and spamms their own language regardless what other players say and end up being kicked many times. I think it should be ok to ban after that. Only goal for actions like this is to provoke others and try to make their game experience less fun.

Really, if you are so restricted that you honestly only know your own language, find a server in your country. This is stupid as fuck. Its all i have to say about this matter anymore.

I dont have anything against Russians. I have a hobby irl and we have 2 russians on our team. No problems what so ever. But if they chose to speak only russian it just would not work anymore.

[solarsailor 1]

And another one missing the point.

Yes' date=' you are totally missing the point. There are rules and Rocket's opinion against banning for foreign languages, should I recite them for you?

First of all, how can an admin know, if someone in his server is using racist talk or otherwise unaxcepted talk.

Yeah, how do we know if these Russians are talking racist stuff? Let's forbid Russian at all. No talking, no problems! Great logic.

Just don't take the responsibility for that, if you don't speak Russian. Let them be. They don't care, I assure you.

Maybe even exchanging exploits.

In a global chat? Are you serious? Also' date=' if you block them, they will exchange them outside the game. What's your point?

The hostile feelings against russians come from how they act. They themselves have made the situation "we against them".

Sorry pal, you are making this situation, not them (at least not those racist Russian dicks - we have plenty of them, just like any country has). They are communicating in the only way they can, and you and a lot of other anglophonic or English-speaking players/admins are being xenophobic and can't ignore the global chat (which shouldn't be in the game at all imho). It's your problem, not their.

Also, we have the same discussion in the Russian part of the forum: http://dayzmod.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=2924 feel free to join ;)

[colonel_black 0]

Why are people still going on about this? Rocket has already stated that you cannot kick for speaking another language.

[css_god@yahoo.com 543]

Got to thank the admin though. Way too many Russians spread out on other non-RU servers' date=' causing pure Russian havoc and a general pain in the ass. No foreign language or ban, pls.

[/quote']

I have issued Kuningas a 1 week ban from the forums.

There is nothing that I despise more in this world than racism. If people would travel a bit, they would see how similar we all are. Yes, not being able to understand creates some difficulties. But we should be tolerant, treat others as we want to be treated.

Ping blocks are fine, that is indiscriminate and based on performance. But can someone please explain what isn't entirely racist about that comment.

Regarding block/ban for language. I pretty much put racism on the same level as hacking. In fact, in many ways it is worse. I can kind of understand the reasons why someone would hack. But to dislike someone simply because you don't understand what they say, that makes no sense to me.

We don't really have a lot of rules, but this one is very strong. Please respect that rule and take it as an opportunity to learn a bit more about another culture and language.

I'm not advocating for racism by any means whatsoever but I'm sorry, 'Russian' is not a race group just as being from China does not mean you are of Asian decent.

Every country on Earth can and does inhabit every race you can think of and not liking or actually hating people from a certain nation has nothing to do with a racial standpoint.

I personally do not like Russian, French or Brazilian players in online games because from what I have experienced personally over the last 15 years is they have the largest concentration of cheaters of any national groups I have come across. I hate playing games with them and this has nothing to do with their race as I do not even have a clue what their race is.

You asked for an explanation and you got one which is very rational and 100% true. You are comparing apples and oranges and basically saying they are the same thing and they are not. Nationality, ethnicity & race are entirely different things and independent of each other.