Attention: Rocket. Please review the DayZ server host rules.

[Mysticales 118]

Ok I read what you say but

1: How do you prevent "leetism" now with "whitelisting" users on your server. Now for a game that connects to central hive, you are locking, kicking, banning people you dont approve of.

2: Kicking possible hackers, well thats a trick isnt it. Id say you could kick them, but how do you prove they are hacking?

3: How do you control server admins on a global scale thats EVEN for everyone? This IS alpha again. Which means everyone should be testing the same, allowing for fixes etc. Example. If EVERYONE did the lockdown. Hackers/exploiters wont get in. Ok sounds great.. um.. one issue, how does battleeye detect those people? How do new exploits get recorded, patched against? During alpha its BETTER to lock those down before beta builds and final builds.

[CaptHazzard 3]

I am a new server admin, who almost did not become an admin because of the rules set in place by Rocket. I decided that I would and try my best to follow the rules with hopes they would change. I can even agree with most of the rules.

I understand that the mod is in alpha and we as the community, in a sick and perverted way, need the hackers if we want a truly playable and enjoyable game once it goes to beta and full release. However the one rule that really bothers me is not being able to ban suspected hackers from the server that I have paid for to provide Rocket's testing. I understand that there are admins out there that would use the ability to ban people for their own gain, and in those cases those admins/servers should be removed from the game. What percentage of the server admins would abuse something like this? My guess that at first maybe 10-15% but once the initial group are blacklisted I would say maybe 2-5% out of 1000+ servers.

Ok I read what you say but

2: Kicking possible hackers, well thats a trick isnt it. Id say you could kick them, but how do you prove they are hacking?

In response to this, if the admin sees the person spawn something in, even an item that is in the mod but not already in the person's inventory (ie they spawn a weapons crate in) that should be all that is needed 1st hand knowledge. If a server admin is looking through the server logs and sees something tied to one player then that should be enough. What most server admins have been asking for is the ability to ban someone from 1 server without having to provide video evidence to be able to ban a person. Will people get unfairly banned? Yes, but from 1 server. Do they have other servers to go to and play? Yes several others. Can a player who has been banned appeal the ban yes.

Given that the current process in place is not able to stop even the basic hacks server admins should have a little more control over the servers they are paying for. Some of the responses that I have seen from the Dev team is making me rethink if I want to keep my server up or not. If there is a valid reason to not allow server admins the ability to be able to ban a person from the server they are paying for and making available for free, other than a small portion of the admins will abuse it, please inform us.

[BlueShock 7]

zoop wants to password servers? I recommend banning him to be honest. :)

need somewhere to hide your tent camps eh?

[carcher7878 6]

zoop wants to password servers? I recommend banning him to be honest. :)

need somewhere to hide your tent camps eh?

must not be an admin..

I understand that since the mod is still being built with the possibility of actually being a game of its own is in dire need of open servers to watch people server hop, hackers doing their thing, people duplicating things, admins abusing, players abusing. All of this is recorded in one shape or form I'd imagine, otherwise its a waste of time.

My question is, Will this continue when the Mod turns into a full game, or is no longer in Alpha.

My only issue is about kick/tempban/permaban. If I buy a car and Chevy said this is how you have to drive it and allow the public in it. I'd lol. If Im paying for it, yeah I can follow the rules, not kick people to make room, ok no problem. But why do I have to prove why I kicked/banned a possible hacker? Wouldn't is be the Kicked/banned person that would have to prove otherwise? and if they couldn't well there are about another 2300 servers out there. Thats my only issue. If we have to follow the kick/ban rules to the T. Then we need the server hosts to Lower their prices, or Dayz team needs to host some of their own. Then they can read over all the logs they want to see what are the issues, to see who is using what to exploit their game/mod. And allow the people who pay to host their own private servers. If they send information to the team, great. If not eh.. they cant bitch that something isnt working right. If it wernt for the admins paying for servers, Dayz dev team would be working on something else. If every paying admin said screw it and all servers shut down. The game would be done until the team did a full release. The ONLY rule I see that needs worked on is the kick/ban rule. If this Mod/Game is going to succeed. The people willing to pay money to host the game for players around the world to test/play it, need to meet in the middle. or servers will drastically fade.

[adharma 20]

I think Whitelist servers are in pretty big need. What other game restricts people forking over their own money to be so nazi-controlled like this?

I ran a very popular MC server for a long time. I know from experience that Whitelists are often a very necessaries option.

Edited July 31, 2012 by adharma

[AADiC 182]

zoop wants to password servers? I recommend banning him to be honest. :)

need somewhere to hide your tent camps eh?

Here is clue, seeing as you don't have one.

[Desertstriker 5]

I don't care if the guy who kills me got his gear from serverhopping or farming at night servers or farming the locked server. After all, IRL apocalypse there WILL be organised groups that already have guns and gears to do stuff.

I care if cheater kills the whole server for kicks and giggles, and admins can't do nothing about them because cheater then will whine on forums about admin abuse.

And I don't understand why kicking out cheaters is less important than banning bunch of guys who want to lock server.

Edited July 31, 2012 by Desertstriker

[CamP 81]

If Battleye has not detected the hacker initially, allowing him to roam around the server for a few hours isn't going to help in any way. It's not like Battleye is actively collecting this guy's data, it doesn't even know he's doing something wrong to begin with. Like I've said, I've only banned hackers who blatantly spawn shit in front of me. I can't even get the guy who teleports everyone to a single location because it's pure chaos in those situations.

Also, another reason why it's become difficult to catch the teleporting hackers is because now they teleport you into a confined area with a ton of zombies, they don't do any of the killing, the zombies do.

[vfig 33]

I’m a player, not a server admin, but:

Good communities require trust. I see from the long list of rules and the hive blacklisting that by and large the dev team do not trust server admins; and in return, server admins do not trust the dev team not to blacklist them for trying to run their own server sensibly (e.g. banning hackers and so on as discussed above).

This has to change.

To the dev team: you need good servers. You need to extend more trust to server admins in general, and empower them to make the right decisions for kicking/banning players from their server. There will be some rotten apples—and the hive blacklist obviously needs to remain to deal with them—but they will not be a majority. Start with a small group of server admins you know you can trust to responsible, and give them freer reign. Encourage them to nominate other admins they know to be responsible, and grow the “known good” group organically. But you have to start with an offer of trust, and revoke that when it is abused. It is much more tractable for you to identify and blacklist the abusive 10-20% of 1,000 servers than the abusive 10%-20% of 1,000,000 players.

[suito 17]

Perfect rules:

BEWARE - The same restrictions apply to Non-Dev run servers!

- IT MAY NEVER BE PASSWORDED

- NO OTHER KEYS OR MODS. NONE. PERIOD.

- MAX OF 2-4 PLAYERS(Based on the max. slot of a server, so i thing a 40person server can make place for max. 5 clanmember(including admin) KICKING TO MAKE ROOM FOR 'FRIENDS' OR CLANMATES

possibility to kick/bann hackers/exploiter on a local list

- NO LOCKING THE SERVER

- NO EDITING DAYZ/MISSION FILES

- IT'S YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO UPDATE YOUR SERVER TO THE LATEST VERSION OF DAYZ

-BATTLEYE MUST BE ENABLED

- Minimum slot count of 40 (30 for countries where bandwidth is expensive i.e. developing countries)

- Their are only two reasons why you, as a server owner, should ban a player on your server. Those two reasons are: Malicious talk, and racism. You may not ban a user for stealing your loot, killing you, spying on you, etc.

- You may only kick for disruptive behavior (such as continued VOIP over side channel). But you may not kick due to race or language or because the person does something you do not like.

- Kicking for extremely excessive ping or desync is permitted, but if abused is grounds for blacklisting

Failure to adhere to these rules will BAN YOUR SERVER'S IP from DayZ.

EDIT: WoW nice, forum destroyed my text lol :-)

at all, the only changes i want to have are: Server admin of full servers can make place for up to 4players (40slots) 5players(50slot) and so on.

admins should allowed to bann users that cheat/hack or using exploides

Edited July 31, 2012 by Suito

[Zoop 343]

Ok I read what you say but

1: How do you prevent "leetism" now with "whitelisting" users on your server. Now for a game that connects to central hive, you are locking, kicking, banning people you dont approve of.

2: Kicking possible hackers, well thats a trick isnt it. Id say you could kick them, but how do you prove they are hacking?

3: How do you control server admins on a global scale thats EVEN for everyone? This IS alpha again. Which means everyone should be testing the same, allowing for fixes etc. Example. If EVERYONE did the lockdown. Hackers/exploiters wont get in. Ok sounds great.. um.. one issue, how does battleeye detect those people? How do new exploits get recorded, patched against? During alpha its BETTER to lock those down before beta builds and final builds.

What I'm saying is drop the whole 'preservation of the community' thing. Give admins a bit of rope to work with and allow them control over their own servers. I really appreciate what you guys are trying to do by trying to police servers so that admin abuse doesn't take place, but it isn't working. Admin abuse takes place despite the rules you've instated. Give admins a choice. Right now you're contending with not only rampant hackers, but also admin abuse.

Give the DayZ community permission to police itself. All other FPS games leave admins in charge of their own servers, and here's the thing, most of them aren't desolate wastelands. Looking at BF3 again, people simply avoid the shitty servers and play on others. If someone plays on a server and encounters admin abuse, chances are he's going to go play on another server and not go back to the first one again. It's already happening, we see a lot of posts on these forums about abusive servers and people saying they won't play there again.

It's basically asking for a free pass to admin abuse, yes, but how many people who AREN'T currently abusing their admin privileges are suddenly going to start doing so? Is the amount of people abusing their servers going to kill the DayZ community off? I highly doubt it. The hackers just might, though.

As for the hackers; do you know why hacking is so widespread for this mod? Because it's so easy to do and get away with. Hackers know that they can hack the shit out of our servers and us admins can only sit back and watch, unable to do anything about it. A giant ban wave went out last week, how soon after that did the hackers start returning? They're running the exact same hacks, they just changed it up a bit and they're fooling BattlEye again. You know what's going to happen next time they get banned again? It's going to be silent for a day or two and then they're going to start trickling back in, hacking the shit out of servers.

All I'm saying is set up a trial period. Let admins control their own servers and see how it goes. If it doesn't work out, reinstate the old rules and watch as hackers ruin the game for everyone again.

How many other developers tell their server admins they're not allowed to do anything to prevent hackers?

Edited July 31, 2012 by Zoop

[Zoop 343]

zoop wants to password servers? I recommend banning him to be honest. :)

need somewhere to hide your tent camps eh?

Why do people always assume every single admin wants to abuse the system. Do you even know how ironic it is that you're accusing me of wanting to hoard equipment in a game I haven't played in a month? Do you know what my uber leet gaming PC at the moment is?

A Samsung RV510. 2.09Ghz Dual Core, 2GB ram and a state of the art integrated Intel GMA4500M. AMAZING!

Last night, trying to play Divine Divinity on this thing was impossible due to low framerate. So, really, how do you suppose I run DayZ on this thing without making it melt onto my lap? How am I supposed to hoard equipment on a server I don't even have any means to play on?

[phil 103]

People who think every admin wants to just kick and set up camps? There are much easier ways to get gear through duping!

We don't even have a camp or vehicle hoard on our server, and we prefer to just go with the flow as having shit loads of vehicles, AS50s etc is BORING and not how the game is supposed to be played.

[jskibo 143]

People who think every admin wants to just kick and set up camps? There are much easier ways to get gear through duping!

We don't even have a camp or vehicle hoard on our server, and we prefer to just go with the flow as having shit loads of vehicles, AS50s etc is BORING and not how the game is supposed to be played.

Amen!

Our small group had two servers, dumping one shortly.

We spend maybe 5 - 8 hours a week on the one we have left. Most of that time is running down to the coast to help one of us that got killed make it back. Actually find that a bit more challenging than playing "how many more DMR mags can I stuff in the tent before it ejects out the side 50 ft"

We had a truck, used it once and it got stolen, oh well. Found a car, got it moved, spent awhile looking for parts to fix it to green, found all the parts and the car is gone...Oh well.

I guess I don't get the hacking part or the collecting part (farming)? This isn't WOW, you don't really win by collecting the most gear or kills (or magic hats and staffs).....hell you don't really win at all. The challenging part for me has always been, can I get enough gear quickly in Cherno or Electro to make it safely off the beach and far enough north to stay alive, should I shoot that pig or hatchet it to make less noise?

Oh well, I'm sure we will tire of this soon enough and go back to playing ARMA Co-Op mode.

Edited July 31, 2012 by jskibo

[Treehead 11]

Whats the problem with private servers? I know, the community thing and stuff. But what exactly are you afraid of if people start whitelisting their servers?

That clans start to farm NWAF and Heli Crash Sites and flood public server with their harvested über-gear? Srsly? This would be much worse than hackers spawning jets, helis and über-gear from thin air on all public servers? Think again.

A lot of people want to host their server but are reluctant to do so because of the insane rules. Renting a server for DayZ is pretty expensive and I will draw my credit card in the same moment you loose the rules and give me some rights as a server admin. I can pay three MMORPG accounts or one fresh new game every month with the money I need for hosting an own DayZ server and I would prefer the DayZ server. But not if if the server gets full, I and my buddies can´t even play on it because of the kicking rules and the people playing on my server get killed by hackers.

Let us PW and whitelist our servers and you will get many many new servers for testing and most of them will be public. At least try it for 2-3 months. We all hope for a standalone game with many public servers hosted by you at the end of the year and no one really believes that the hacker problem will be solved within the next weeks/ months. Make the situation better for us who simply want to play the game right now.

Edited July 31, 2012 by Treehead

[RitterOhnePferd 1]

And to add another tiny bit to this topic: When we got our server I wasnt sure about all the different difficulty settings, so I started to play around, test them out to see the actual difference (like player names and distance on the crosshair; if the damage of zombies varies in different difficulty settings etc.). As the config changes required a restart of the server each time it was a bit of a hassle for the players joining as I was restarting it quite a few times until I was satisfied with the configuration. Some players complained though, and I could totally understand them...couldn't do anything though because of the "Dont you dare to set a password - even for like 1 hour to configure your server - or you'll burn in hell and get blacklisted" rule.

Actually the rules make the average player suffer as well. So in my opinion, being too strict about some aspects of the rules wont help anybody anyway. If someone abuses he will do it repeatedly and massively. Just putting a password on the server for like one hour wont hurt anybody. Softening the rules in favour of the admins would be pretty helpful.

[rocky46 16]

We have officially said no more. Canceled our server after being threatened with blacklist for (((((((LOCKING OUR SERVER DOWN WITH NO PLAYERS IN IT)))))))

We aren't even allowed to lock it empty... god forbid we were to shut it down.... I have seen threads about people wanting to blacklist servers for being shut down. This has been a waste of over $100.00 to my clan.

To ask for a refund i guess is a total waste of time...

To the last guy saying this is an alpha....

YOU SIR ARE CLUELESS

This mod is being run on ARMA2 it has been around quite a long time....

Saying this is an Alpha is like saying,They are making this game DayZ from the ground up. You sir don't know anything about this subject.

"this is an alpha" is the pathetic excuse for imcompetence thats thrown at you when ever you complain about something, and i just died again because of a stupid game bug for the 5th time in a week

[rocky46 16]

too much bullshit with hosting rules, rocket and his bullshit dictator attitude hell be asking when are you taking a break to go for a dump next

[Mysticales 118]

Ok so after shifting all these replies. I can assume the MAIN rule you all would love added is the permission to kick/ban suspected hackers you see doing "non normal" events. Is that correct? Now should the issue come up, would you all have the means to show "proof" of suspected hacking should the question come up?

[BattleFate 7]

I was thinking of paying for hosting of a server myself. I'm tired of spending hours everytime I want to play looking for a server in the appropriate timezone that's not already full. I'm especially tired of never being able to play on the same server twice because the one I played on last time was full, or wasn't even in the list anymore? (particularly when you consider the vehicles and tents are server-dependant).

And I was particularly frustrated one day when my week-old character with some pretty good gear on him suddenly appears in some sort of an airfield with a bunch of other survivors, then was suddenly dead.

So I wanted to look into my own server, where I could get my friends to log on and play. Not exclusive to us, but at least where we could be confident in our OWN server having room in it and safety against hackers (in that we'd have a whitelist of trusted players capable of accessing the server, and anyone hacking would then be removed from that list).

I toyed with several ideas. I'm a data center admin, and one of the ideas I was playing with was installing one of our unused servers in the DC and running it off of there. Another one was paying for a hosting company to handle all the setup for us. Divided among the group of us, the hosting couldn't be THAT much.

Well it is, it's damned expensive, and I was still considering it, until I saw the rules. These are the ones that turned me off:

1: IT MAY NEVER BE PASSWORDED

2: NO KICKING TO MAKE ROOM FOR 'FRIENDS' OR CLANMATES (only bothers me because of rule 1)

3: Their are only two reasons why you, as a server owner, should ban a player on your server. Those two reasons are: Malicious talk, and racism. You may not ban a user for stealing your loot, killing you, spying on you, etc.

So basically, I'd be paying for a server me and my friends could play on together, and I can't guarantee that only trusted players log on, I can't guarantee my friends (or even myself) would be able to access this server if already full, and I can't ban a person from the server for being a known hacker?

So then what's the point of taking on this expense? I wouldn't resolve any of my complaints I mentioned above (except possibly not having the server there two days in a row). I'll just use one of the other servers out there. It'll save me money and hassle. Imagine if a majority of other admins also felt the same way? Imagine if the list of servers available dropped to a handful? That would dramatically hurt the game.

Now imagine if rules were slackened a bit to entice more servers to be made. I'd sign up... others would too I'm sure. We'd probably double the number of servers out there overnight.

[avid_gamer 132]

We have like 20 people in our clan who never actually played Arma.

They have all gone out and wasted $30 to buy combined operations to play this Mod.

We have all thrown $ down for a Game and a Server only to be told ... "no you can't stop those punks from ruining the game on your server that you are paying for"

It's Rockets MOD! And he is god... Wow ... that's the best reason you can come up with for being a fukin douche?

Thats the best explanation we get from (So called Forum Moderators) It's Rockets MOD ?

You clueless douche. That will be the reason this mod fails.

That will be the downfall of your hard work Rocket. Asshat moderators speaking for you.

Your inability to accept the fact that you can not reinvent the wheel (server admins have to run the servers) there is no other way to do it sonny boy. Find any game that has the admins hands tied and doesn't allow them to lock / password/ make private their own servers....

And I will show you a dead game.

[BattleFate 7]

Ok so after shifting all these replies. I can assume the MAIN rule you all would love added is the permission to kick/ban suspected hackers you see doing "non normal" events. Is that correct? Now should the issue come up, would you all have the means to show "proof" of suspected hacking should the question come up?

I would say no. BUT if the hacker appeals on the 'ban appeals page' and you cannot provide proof, then you'll need to unban him. A real hacker likely wouldn't appeal because he doesn't know if you do have the proof, and bringing this attention to himself would just get him banned on more servers. A non-hacker could appeal as you wouldn't have proof, since he wasn't hacking. A Ban mistake would then be resolved...

So it would be preferable for you to have proof, but not required if you are ok with unbanning him if he appeals. At least you can prevent him from hacking for the next hour or so on your server that way, enough for you to try to setup a means to get proof for future offenses.

[beans 93]

Yes sir, something needs to change if DayZ has any future.

I have a suggestion thread pretty parallel with this one. http://dayzmod.com/forum/index.php?/topic/50290-scripters-hackers-have-more-control-than-me-an-admin/

[F4ll3N 28]

I cant say I want to be able to password my server, but I can say it would be nice not to be treated like a potential hacker myself as an admin. I mean seriously, I am not even able to access my in game server control and kick/ban from there, I have to use my Rcon commands or go to my ACP layer. I dont see how that change is anything but a panicked response from BE to the sheer ease with which hackers we able to hijack the servers and not really rockets choice.......but still its pure retardation to have an in game server control that you lock server owners out of and kind of shows how vulnerable BE is to the most basic of attacks.

[jskibo 143]

I cant say I want to be able to password my server, but I can say it would be nice not to be treated like a potential hacker myself as an admin. I mean seriously, I am not even able to access my in game server control and kick/ban from there, I have to use my Rcon commands or go to my ACP layer. I dont see how that change is anything but a panicked response from BE to the sheer ease with which hackers we able to hijack the servers and not really rockets choice.......but still its pure retardation to have an in game server control that you lock server owners out of and kind of shows how vulnerable BE is to the most basic of attacks.

You should be able to change that BE kick in your scripts.txt file to allow access to the server tab on the maps page without kicking, however I wouldn't as it was used before by the dumb hackers to launch their .sqf's. That line will be tagged with a 5 or a 7, change it to a 1 for log only and not kick