Players going insane on too many player kills

[panque 45]

Great read for everyone in this thread: The Walking Dead (Comic book, the TV show will get there eventually). It portraits survivor-survivor interactions in a very interesting ways (mostly on the 30 or so latest issues).

[iceman28001 36]

I skipped all the other posts, just read OP.

Answer unforuntally is, it is a game. The one problem that you can't overcome in a simulation type game, is the fact that it is still a game... People will not act the same, can try as hard you want to force them to act as if it were real. As rocket progresses the mod, and hopefully makes it harder.. the player-player kill will drop to within "reason."

You will see people say, don't punish player killings etc... etc... Should not have to have a certain suit or nametag or color, the game itself as in its difficulty to survive and increased risk to reward ratio, will have to be the punishment in itself.

As of now, a player can snipe you from 400m+ outside of town. Do you think a sniper rifle shot only travels 400m etc? In a desolate no cars or machinary time, that sound goes a long ways with no interfernce. Everyone zombie withing 800 or more meters should sprint in that direction. I see people complain about zombies being able to hear to far or see to far, they want them to blind and deaf.

Fuck em, MAKE IT HARD! As of now, taking shot(scale 1-10) 2 risk of taking a shot, reward 1-10. Why not just shoot?!

Ramp that up, 12 risk of taking a shot, 1-10 reward... When you got 35+ zombies coming at you after that shot, you better hope that guy you killed had ammo+food+water+medical supplies.

Edited July 14, 2012 by Iceman28001

[SillySil 295]

See its people like you that has never tried standing in a situation that required you to shoot that has a weird grasp on what happens to the human mind when they actually pull the trigger. I've shot at others in afghanistan, I've even killed a taliban, and I dont have any problems whatsoever with that. He was a threat, I took him out.

Someone's a threat/enemy you take him out.

Now about the people that kill for fun, well, its a game you there's bound to be people who play it like that, but I'll be damned if I'm to be punished for killing others just because some kids kill people in cherno. If you have a problem with people killing you for fun, then don't go to cherno or electro, problem solved.

That's why there needs to be a good system that's going to punish only unprovoked killing and not too much either just enough to make people think "Do I need to kill that guy?".

Bullshit. 7/10 of all players i meet on all servers that i dont know, are friendlys. Every time i play dayz without fail i end up in a large party of randoms that just bumped into one another. Sure il kill the odd few that dont speak fast enough but that is all. your mentality of the game comes from your stupidity of falling into the shoot on sight playstyle. Created by bandits to stop us banding togeather. Im not saying trust everyone...far from it.

I've never met a friendly in this game unless I first talked with that guy on a forum or whatever. Ever.

Just killing everyone you see is not the intended way of the game.

Seems to be everywhere I've played.

The point is you choose your action. Not let some stereotype make that decision for you.

Everywhere I've played it seems to be "shoot first or die" I've tried at the start to be friendly. People would just use the sound of my voice saying "friendly" as target indicator.

[Alexey Zemanov 6]

And is the law seriously the only thing stopping you from killing everyone on sight except your friends?

there is no penalty for it, while in real life people (at least a part of them) aren't psychopaths

Seems like you don't know the inclinations of a real survival situation. Let me tell you (as some idiot ranting on the internet), if you ever happen to get into such a situation and actually survive it you will feel from the very bottom of you heart that you are able to do anything at anytime ... and most certainly you will be quite disgusted of yourself.

You don't need to be a psychopath to step out of your socialized habits; fear for your live and for your loved ones is always a good motivation for... anything.

Edited July 14, 2012 by Alexey Zemanov

[SillySil 295]

Morality isn't a fixed point in space and time, it changed greatly during human evolution and isn't universal to every societies and keeps evolving, sometimes leading to curious things, like considering a woman's ankle to be offending or making canibalism a tradition for generations in some tribal societies.

Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't killing your own always considered bad? And since there is a handful of people wouldn't people try to avoid killing the rest of the humanity without a serious reason?

I don't have any issues! I feel fine, thank you for your concern! If i felt that there is a problem with me i would go see a doctor.

Killing people for a bandage is cool for you. And crazy people don't know they are crazy.

How realistic is it to dely peoples the liberty to chose how they want to behave and be perceived by others?

It's unrealistic to have a conscience and feelings and them having a negative impact on you. Are you that disconnected from reality?

Sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't. That's the risk of coming with your arms open toward someone with a machinegun. I got my share of it and sometimes it creates wonderful friendships.

Also sometimes it doesn't.

Just because, you refuse to take such approach without some kind of protective mechanic in place to ensure your safety doesn't means it never happens.

Oh I've tried and then I said, fuck it. Done trying. And I've never ever heard anyone saying "friendly". Plus all those threads saying "fuck it, going bandit" kinda prove that it's not working.

Seems like you don't know the inclinations of a real survival situation. Let me tell you (as some idiot ranting on the internet), if you ever happen to get into such a situation and actually survive it you will feel from the very bottom of you heart that you are able to do anything at anytime ... and most certainly you will be quite disgusted of yourself.

You don't need to be a psychopath to step out of your socialized habits; fear for your live and for your loved ones is always a good motivation for... anything.

And I'll start killing people for absolutely no reason. Okay. The entire "maybe he's a threat to me" is a smoke, when we're talking about killing people on sight. We're not talking only about situations where you are in danger.

I have no problem with shooting people who pose danger to you. That shouldn't be penalized no matter what. But we're talking about killing on sight here.

Edited July 14, 2012 by SillySil

[RayBen 2]

This is a fking game :D how can u compare this to reality :D omg get out guys and take a deep breath . keyboard soildiers ftw....

[robosheriff 13]

The problem is that people without a mic are the ones getting killed due to lack of fast communication, and i know this because i used to play with one until it broke 2 days ago. (used ventrilo or skype to talk with mates but when i met a new guy used the ingame chat).

I talked with people fast enough to let them know im friendly, sure i got shot 1-2 times by 2/15 people but as soon as my mic broke, and i started relying on typing in the direct comm, don't know if they were just ignoring the letters or i just had bad luck and met with bandits because 14/15 people encounters ended up in a bullet in the face or a shootout and the last guy didn't had a weapon but he did tried to hit me with his flashlight.

So yea this game needs a mic if you want to team up, as for the people withoutone dunno if someone can come up with an idea to make typing in direct comm easier? maybe change the font color and increase the distance so people can "read you" instead of shooting

Another point: I believe Rocket mentioned, somewhere, that the mod is "set" post-apocalypse - like, quite a while after the apocalypse. Who's to say our characters didn't grow up in this environment? Humans are very flexible; they adapt and change to survive in their surroundings. In a world where "should I murder somebody?" is answered with the question "are they a threat to me?", what's good and what's bad slowly break down and decay.

That's right. Gettin' philosophical in this motherfucker.

Don't think stuff too much

Edited July 14, 2012 by RoboSheriff

[SillySil 295]

This is a fking game :D how can u compare this to reality :D omg get out guys and take a deep breath . keyboard soildiers ftw....

Are we in narnia fighting dragons or is this game trying to simulate what would happen during zombie apocalypse?

[Sergiy 1]

What most of us are trying to do here is bring up something that would not make being a bandit so attractive.

What I think of it is, well you are killing a person for immersion purposes, a person that can actually help you later,

this creates the whole risk vs reward, you either get some loot, or you get someone that's gonna watch you back and

provide some company in this wasteland of a world.

Of course, people will shoot on sight, that's just what they do, we cannot take that from them, it's how they decide to play the game.

Not all people would do that though, I grouped up with a random dude, we ran around the streets of Chernogorsk for a good hour,

until we got seperated and I got swarmed by a group of zombies even then he did get out of cover to try and shoot me off my back.

All in all players should not be punished for murder, I feel that trusting people can grouping up will come with the maturity of the game.

[Eza (DayZ) 11]

This is a fking game :D how can u compare this to reality :D omg get out guys and take a deep breath . keyboard soildiers ftw....

well, people wanted realism and immersion from dayz, not just another call of duty with zombies, thats why we compare it to reality :) in my opinion this would be nice little way to add it, if done right.

[Alexey Zemanov 6]

Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't killing your own always considered bad?

Absolutely. But those guys in Cherno are not my own. You are not my own. The spartans were not of the romans. The gladiators of the one group were not the own of the other group.

[Alexey Zemanov 6]

or you get someone that's gonna watch you back and

provide some company in this wasteland of a world.

Not quite guranteed but happens sometimes and then it's epic.

[Sergiy 1]

The problem is that people without a mic are the ones getting killed due to lack of fast communication, and i know this because i used to play with one until it broke 2 days ago. (used ventrilo or skype to talk with mates but when i met a new guy used the ingame chat).

I talked with people fast enough to let them know im friendly, sure i got shot 1-2 times by 2/15 people but as soon as my mic broke, and i started relying on typing in the direct comm, don't know if they were just ignoring the letters or i just had bad luck and met with bandits because 14/15 people encounters ended up in a bullet in the face or a shootout and the last guy didn't had a weapon but he did tried to hit me with his flashlight.

So yea this game needs a mic if you want to team up, as for the people withoutone dunno if someone can come up with an idea to make typing in direct comm easier? maybe change the font color and increase the distance so people can "read you" instead of shooting

Don't think stuff too much

I Don't use a Mic cause i usually play in front of the TV and I don't want people to hear it.

My solution, /Salute.

[Golgo82 28]

What would you people think happens if a normal person starts killing? Some might not be touched by it ( at first ) but some day it would really bother you won't it? Why do soldiers recieve mental and physical aid after and during to war?

So why have a player who kills the first time have side effects from it ( use your imagination ), the second and third kill might bring him down a bit...but the more he kills the more side effect he gets ( not permanent but sporadic ), more kills and he gets delusional with side effects such as insane laughter and sudden uncontrolable moves and maybe he even fires his weapon one or two times and one day he just pops himself because he can't take it anymore...

You two cents.

Lol!

No.

Shooting a weapon needs to become a harder choice, but not like that.

[SillySil 295]

Absolutely. But those guys in Cherno are not my own. You are not my own. The spartans were not of the romans. The gladiators of the one group were not the own of the other group.

Yep tho you need to remember that most of humanity just got wiped out. Not many to choose from anymore. Edited July 14, 2012 by SillySil

[Alexey Zemanov 6]

Yep tho you need to remember that most of humanity just got wiped out. Not many to choose from anymore.

And just one life to defend. ... C'mon, they are people with guns who might be after your beans or you women! They might also be infected and not showing the symptoms that openly. Maybe they will change within the hour.

Edited July 14, 2012 by Alexey Zemanov

[RayBen 2]

Are we in cherno fighting zombies or is this game trying to simulate what would happen beeing in narina fighting dragons?

get it? both have nothing to do with reality, doesnt matter if u call it "simulation" IT WILL NERVER HAPPEN, but okay maybe im not so into it, dont want to be too rude. For me the fun should be on the first place and not the "realism"

[Alexey Zemanov 6]

For me the fun should be on the first place and not the "realism"

But that's the fun of it ... not getting spoon-fed. Not being allowed to pick whom you play with. That is the fun of it.

[Lady Kyrah 1110]

There is no such thing as a DM fest in DayZ, that's your perception.

Try to make it better for yourself, because none of us deserve anything from DayZ.

Unlike most games where there is a system, goals and mechanics that are put in place by the devs, in DayZ there isn't much of this, so "how it's ment to be played" is basically imposed to you by other players. If a clan decide that they are going to systematically hunt you down, this is now what dayZ is going to be for you, running and hiding.

If you refuse this set of rules, either get a bigger group and impose your own, or switch server. But keep in mind it's perfectly ok for peoples to persecute you to the point of making you stop playing.

Right now trust is a rare commodity, maybe it will change, maybe not. But in either either you make the best of it, or you stop playing.

Again, you don't deserve to have a good time in DayZ, nobody does, this isn't some fun fair ride where everyone get his slice of emotion and everyone is happy. This is a game where every other players decide for you if you're going to have a good time.

Edited July 14, 2012 by Lady Kyrah

[Capercaillie 16]

Sounds like a carebear way of keeping bandits down. Been in the military my self, didn't bother me to much. Active recon spotter.

It's funny how your profile states you are 19 years old.....

[Lady Kyrah 1110]

Oh yeah calling peoples by age :D

I'm 30 if that helps :)

[Capercaillie 16]

The question isn't "are they a threat to me?". There is no question.

There IS a question, and the question IS "are they a threat to me?"

If you don't ask yourself this question, you are a failbandit who will die soon because of greed.

If you die to a failbandit who didn't ask themselves this question, you should probably learn to play the game instead of crying about the massive problem of dying in the post-apocalyptic world of Day Z.

Few tips you might try, and might even find helpful, though time consuming to the normal run&gun style you are used to:

- Every once in a while, STOP for a second. Hug the ground, and roll the camera around. Be aware of your surroundings.

- Always before going in ANYWHERE for the loot, SCOUT your surroundings! Always know what's behind you, and what is on the hills you see on the horizon.

- It is better to loot only 1 spot and get no aggro, than loot 3 and be forced to kill 3 zombies. Experienced bandits are not stupid: those zeds always run for a reason..

-Laying prone for a few minutes, making an actual PLAN on how to loot your next target and looking at what's going on in the town are not hazardous things for your health. What is hazardous, and pulls down the average life expectancy is being STUPID!

Follow these tips and you might see an increase in your average lifetime. But ofc, if the "laying around for a few minutes" is too much for your patience level to handle, then MAYBE you should change to another game instead of the massive QQ in the forums.

[3rdparty 229]

OK this topic has been repeated throughout the forums for so long now, i jsut wanna out line the reasons why I think this would be difficult to implement.

Reasons For:

Diproportionate amount of psychopathic behaviour

Spawn Killers

The understanding of the emotional impact of murder

Reasons Against:

Free sandbox environment, in which coding/bugs are not being exploited or hacked.

Its a choice of gameplay.

It will progressively hinder advanced/lucky players whove managed to survive for a very long time and have only had to kill out of survival and circumstance (ie havnt gone out hunting people)

The main reason however is that PTSD is not a fully understood condition in terms of causation and relapse. People accumulate it at much different rates to others even if they are goingthrough the same experience.

Simulating something that is so personally specfic and not fully understood will be very fuckign hard.

Personally I would like to see some kind of insanity affects added, but would be perfectly fine and would understand if they left them out.

Maybe if a survivor/bandit committed a massacre (kills so many peeps in such n such a time limit) there could be a mental limit mechanic that would force them to retreat and calm down/deal with what theyve done. But if this was introduced I would hope that this effect would be minimised in bandits as they continued massacres (i.e normalising themselves to it).

But so far, i really havnt seen an idea i feel comfortable with for long term insanity mechanics. No Sir ee

[Capercaillie 16]

Oh yeah calling peoples by age :D

I'm 30 if that helps :)

You probably missed the point

"Been in the military my self, didn't bother me to much. Active recon spotter"

Read that and you might understand why I pointed out that age thing.

[3rdparty 229]

You probably missed the point

"Been in the military my self, didn't bother me to much. Active recon spotter"

Read that and you might understand why I pointed out that age thing.

Peeps younger than that serving in IRaq/afghanistan

I doubt you would get an open critical answer on soldiering from someone who served in the military on this forum, (ie a mod for a hardcore military simulator).

Even less likely will there will be talk on the mental affects, bit of a taboo. Even though the most unknown controversy of iraq/afghanistan will be the soldier suicide rate that outstrips the number that actually died there.

PTSD is hard to predict in causation, relapse and affects. And is incredibly personally specific. Very hard to implement.

Edited July 14, 2012 by 3rdParty