Have we forgotten our roots?

[Woftam 0]

I never played the mod, so I don't have that experience to compare SA with. As a relative "outsider," I feel like BI is on the right track. I want a rich array of post-apocalyptic concerns to manage. I want a hardcore experience that doesn't hold my hand. I want social interactions that are sometimes hilarious, sometimes fulfilling, sometimes gut-wrenching, etc. Feedback is essential in this stage, to help guide BI in making the game we're expecting. I expect the survival elements of the game to keep growing in depth and importance. Having an updated UI and a HUD as described in dev posts will go a long way to making these systems fit in a more fluid and visceral way.

Thing is, I see a fair bit of foot-stomping in this thread (moreso in others). It seems many people just can't relate to the reality of making a game, or any bit of working software for that matter. After 13 years of programming I'm still blown away by how seemingly simple features take much longer and are much more complex and subtle than I originally imagined, even in my own area of expertise. It's one thing to get your code "most of the way there." But the devil's in the details, and the last 20% takes 80% of the time.

The first time I made a prototype in Unity (DayZ clone), I was pleasantly surprised by how quickly I could get something that looked kind of like a game. Then reality set in. The reality is, it takes metric poop-tons of hacking, de-hacking, fiddling, and straight-up brow-beating to go from "ridiculous but almost game-like" to "sort of what I was thinking about but still way off."

The solution to this inherent complexity can only be approached through iteration. Iteration has a tendency to gib schedules in the face. This is the way of the alpha. BI is iterating, and they're doing it on a grand stage. This is a harrowing experience, for both BI and us. Sometimes they have to back-track. Sometimes they have to pull zeds for a minute because it's the lesser of evils. Sometimes a build blows our minds. Sometimes heinous bugs make to to stable. It's all a part of the flow.

I forgot what we were originally talking about but those are words I just said.

[pillock 850]

DayZ is a survival game. It's not a game where you get to do whatever you want otherwise it would be marketed as such and even then, you can't stick your dick up a cows arse.

Why... did you even think of that as an example?

[synystr 118]

I don't agree at all . Standalone is so addicting because it pushes the envelope on realism , attention to detail, and complexity that other games don't . Do you remember how little buildings were enterable in the mod ? Do you remember how we didn't have a "hands up button" until standalone introduced it making encounters in the mod MUCH more shallow and unnecessarily deadly than they ever could be in stabdalone (believe it or not that proximity only voice system makes a difference, you actually yet to interact with some people instead of making friends in global chat )..

Remembering how great the mod was , is a sort of fickle thing to do because what made the mod so great was that it was something that noone had ever done before : open world full loot pvp zombie sandbox environment. Now that standalone and many other games are going down this path there are two points : the first is people expect great things , and naturally standalone is highest on that list because of all this content that the OP despises and all the attention to detail put into the game . The second is that people should be putting their memories into fruition because those that did play the mod remember it for being very clunky , very simple (which OP over praises as a good thing) and very unbalanced (ppl with thermal scoped .50 cal sniper rifles camping the coast because of overly populated gun and vehicle servers .

Long story short , if you want another slapped together shoddy mod quality game then keep the rose colored glasses on but if we wanna see something that is so in depth that we really feel like we're living in the apocalypse then believe in standalone and give it time because although it's taking its sweet as time we know for sure it's going to be the first of its kind in terms of content weighed with quality and attention to detail and that it will keep everyone entertained wether you're a zombie fan or not .

All in all I think people are all very passionate about standalone but everytime a delay comes up people freak out and look for the next thing to keep them from admitting they love SA, but I for one know that standalone is going to be my only zombie game I keep for the long haul ; Mostly because Ive played them all , looking at multiplayer pvp zombie survival games especially and I have to say dayz is the one with the best potential , graphics, content with quality, and especially content balance (compared to the mod and tons of unbalanced MMOs / multiplayer games this game is balanced pretty well ).

 I just found a flanged mace and a great helm in game. How "realistic".

[Bororm 1156]

 I just found a flanged mace and a great helm in game. How "realistic".

 

Do you mean to imply those things don't exist in real life?

[synystr 118]

Do you mean to imply those things don't exist in real life?

 

So do inflatable My Little Pony sex dolls, but that doesn't mean they should be included in an apocalypse simulator who is trying to be realistic.

 

But what you're saying here is that upon finding an 800 year old piece of head gear in the apocalypse, your immediate thought would be to put it on? 

Edited January 1, 2016 by Synystr

[Bororm 1156]

So do inflatable My Little Pony sex dolls, but that doesn't mean they should be included in an apocalypse simulator who is trying to be realistic.

 

But what you're saying here is that upon finding an 800 year old piece of head gear in the apocalypse, your immediate thought would be to put it on? 

 

Besides being possibly in poor taste, how would a my little pony sex doll damage the realism of the game?

 

They aren't 800 years old, they're replicas.

And honestly, if I did find an 800 year old helmet in the sort of shape the ones in game are in, I'd absolutely try it on.  Why not?

 

When most people talk about realism they aren't talking about a perfect real life simulation.  It's a video game.

Edited January 1, 2016 by Bororm

[Deathlove 2286]

DayZ is a survival game. It's not a game where you get to do whatever you want otherwise it would be marketed as such and even then, you can't stick your dick up a cows arse.

 

 

So do inflatable My Little Pony sex dolls

 

I thought we were playing a zombie survival game not a sex kink fetish simulator?! XD

[Nebulae3 422]

You will seldom find a weapon with ammo in the same building in SA - that easy mode version is in the arma 2 mod.

So SA is not always live stream friendly, but when u actually find ammo for your weapons - it`s so much more rewarding which u need to survive.

Zombie AI in arma 2 is just annoying garbage which is too easy to exploit and abuse to discover other players nearby in the area, or just silly like hiding in a bush when zombies watch u. And someone mentioned buildings u can`t access - very limited content FFA world with zombies in arma 2 mod.

 

SA with patch 0.59 is not a finished product guys - still an alpha with Q1-Q2 roadmap content - we still miss things like:

 

- Aerial transport

- Barricading.

- Construction (base building)

- Animal predators.

 

Dayz dev. source: http://www.dayztv.com/standalone/dayz-2015-roadmap/

 

- About SA status and some decision I don`t agree with.. There are some issues indeed at the moment like traps not working properly (grenade/rabbit traps.) range finder not working default at 6 meters. And netting is almost impossible to find near the coast line at the moment for cammo, and I don`t agree with netting current locations on the map. The whole boat system (locations) usually end up with accidents like dead newspawns near the coast from other survivors who have end game military weapons in their search of netting.

 

My point is;  it`s up to each player how to play this game, but the netting location should not promote hunting newspawns near the coast. So it`s much better if these boat locations are near lakes instead near the center of the map. Dayz devs should try to avoid end game item locations that promote killing newspawns on the server.

Edited January 1, 2016 by Ori42

[sausagekingofchicago 4711]

Now, you have to worry about farming, an overly complicated medical and food system, fishing... etc. DayZ is turning into a camping simulator that happens to include angry, pale skinned, teleporting, pugilists...

But you don't. I haven't farmed out of necessity, ever. I did it once to test it. That was the end of that. Complicated medical system? How is it complicated?  I still haven't bothered to fish in 1400 hours.  None of that is required to survive and I think that's probably the biggest problem. This game is far too easy.  I know I have a lot of experience playing it but the biggest risk I face is walking on rocks.  I don't even worry about players because the majority of them can't shoot straight or rely on getting really close with an automatic weapon.  I worry more about sprinting into a rock that is too close to a tree or that one odd rock that doesn't have its LODs set properly.

 

The devs need to crank up the brutality.   Remember the proud average lifespan that headlined the mod webpage?  I somehow doubt the average lifespan, outside of the mindless deathmatchers, is less than a week at this point.  Crank up the cold, reduce food by at least half, reduce all those ridiculous military weapons, and make the limited zeds more dangerous (even if just for now).  This game is too easy.

[Tigermonk 140]

Nice rant mate....

 

As I started I thought it was going to be along the lines of - we have too many weapons and not enough survival...but I was mistaken...

 

Fair enough, the lack of Zombies (infected...) has been a major clusterfuck and it has seen players leave the game in droves. If they don't have zombies in 0.59 (hopefully they can produce with possible dynamic hordes...see the latest status report), I will be taking a break from the game ( i currently have over 2500 hours in the SA...never played the mod).

 

At the moment, with food so abundant, fishing, farming and hunting seem to be a waste of time, but when the game gets closer to release I am hoping that food will be much more scarce, so that you will need to forage or farm/hunt/fish etc to survive...that will be when it becomes a true zombie survival game (notice how i used survival in there...as did you...its not just a zombie game but a zombie survival game).

 

The medical system is still pretty basic: break a leg - morphine or splint; bleeding - bandage, rags or sew (yes sewing...) yourself up; lost blood - IV or blood bag; eat bad food - charcoal tabs

drink bad water - antibiotics...and I think still has a way to go....I am hoping that with the new player controller we will get limping from sprained ankles, you get a broken arm - well u cant use that rifle or fire axe etc

 

Yes you can now make camps, hunt etc and live the life of a hermit...if you want to. If you don't, then don't, but there are people who want that in the game. Does it affect you if you want to PvP in Cherno or Berizino?

 

No.

 

You can still spawn on the beach, kill yourself until you get a good spawn, run up and punch a geared player in the head and take his gear...rinse and repeat. Or, if you want to tackle a horde of Zombies by yourself, go nuts....that's the beauty of a sandbox...you can do what you want.

 

I understand some of your frustration, believe me I am frustrated as hell at the state of the game at the moment, but 0.59 should (it fucking better) bring some massive changes otherwise this game is dead and buried for me....

 

Cheers

well said, and the last part 'dead and burried' is probably what it is for me until 1.0 the progress is so incredibly slow... imo... too much stuff we don't need (300 WO I weapons nobody uses etc)

I've posted a small list in the dayz audio topic section on my thoughts..

but they should fix the zombies, the enigine (having a 1,5K beast of pc.. but only running 30 fps in cherno or less is just fail.. 

so until they fix the engine (something they should have done long ago!) and the zombie/player mechanics DayZ is pretty much a NO GO for me at this point.

the hunting/small camps is cool.. but wait until we can build MASSIVE camps/semi cities like TWD... hold that with 20+ people start ur own community and survive the endless hordes knocking at ur gate..

that would be DayZ for me, with a good group of mates, fully immersed by correct audio and physics.. spending HOURS on end just staying alive. supply runs/everyone has a job style of playing.

 

Posted by tigermonk on 25 December 2015 - 10:22 PM

seasonal changes in DayZ SA... on what time frame would that be? realistic?

so 365 days would also be 365 in DayZ? hmmm very doubtful that'll ever happen.. since the engine their using right now is at its end.. (their prob. already building or looking into something new) 

the more extreme weather... would be cool.. lightning strikes, why not.. more hazard factors when you walk through the woods.. 

tornado's? in russia? unlikely... 

zombies with Xmas hat... fun if you have 2500 zombies in the game and only 20 santa hats... bardar and trade away

what would improve dayz 100% IMO

- better realistic sound pack(s) for weather/footsteps/zombies/ambient sounds (different types of birds in the woods)

- more ambient chaos (fires inside buildings/burning cars/planes at NWA etc.)

- base building/shelter building from simple materials (branches/leafs/scrap metal

- enhanced farming/growing crops

- advanced survival skills/learning system

- more animals (bees for example and working bee hives)

- aging/facial hair (being worked on by mods already)

what Don't we need:

More WO 1 guns nobody will ever use

20 additional colors of jacket X

this is just a small list I came up with on the spot, that would def. make my DayZ experience more immersive

 

Edited January 1, 2016 by Tigermonk

[maximumak777 (DayZ) 23]

I couldn't give a toss what they add to DayZ so long as they optimise the game and get the core mechanics working by the end of 2016.

[Amani (DayZ) 1]

I like the standalone and the new features. You know what we really need? A new map to play on, Chernarus is getting old, and IMO no matter how many features they add, it still feels like the same old game. Im not sure if you all agree but an additional map would make things fresh again, make things feel new and exciting maybe even nostalgic.

 

No. They have so many other things to work on including the map of Chernarus. They do not need to be developing something new when they haven't finished what they already started. They definitely don't have the resources for that idea... even if I'd like it too.

Edited January 2, 2016 by Bloodzy

[darkrider400 76]

They need to rework the entire map. The whole thing is just a half-aborted port-over from ArmA 2. They need a team to redevelop the entire map with the new renderer and get rid of the buildings that can't be entered. Literally buildings that can't be entered take up so much useless space and framerate. And the same goes with the grass, whats the point of even having it render if it only renders in a 30m radius and you're lying prone in the grass and cant see yourself when people 800m away can see you like a spotlight at night?

[Merc. 37]

 

 

The solution to this inherent complexity can only be approached through iteration.

 

 

Concord-idly, this anomaly magnanimously extroverts the solution. Argo, visa vi... you know, I forgot what I was talking about. 

 

At first glance your sentence looked like something the architect would say in Matrix Reloaded. 

 

Good post though, thanks for sharing.