Bow crafting - natural resources

[mercules 1290]

Stealth against Zombies and Animals will be coming. At that point you should be able to sneak up on them if very careful. 

[pilgrim* 3514]

..//..

Yew was just preferred because it had different colored heartwood and sapwood, making the bow-making process easier, as well as standing up to compression well. (ie, being powerful) You can make an "adequate" bow from pine if you know what you are doing.

 

Also, you can increase the power of a bow (by making the stretching of the back/compression of the face more difficult) by either cable-backing the back, or by layering sinew on the back before it dried, from nock to nock. 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cable-backed_bow

 

By layering sinew on the back of the bow, from nock to nock, you essentially make a composite bow

 

As you say yourself - "Not quite"

 

The YEW heartwood and sapwood have very different compression and elasticity properties - the boyer used this quality to shape the bow to the required parameters. this explains the preference for Yew.

 

The English longbow was very powerful - it required great force and long training to use. The action was a whole body movement called "stepping into" to the bow, rather than "drawing" the bow,  and even today remains found in France can be positively identified as English archers because of the extensive compression deformation of the lower spine, resulting from years of employing this technique. This deformation is distinctive.(I say 'English' but many were Welsh, of course). longbow arrows were 30 inches long, or more.

 

<<My yeoman father taught me how to draw, how to lay my body in my bow ... not to draw with strength of arms as divers other nations do ... I had my bows bought me according to my age and strength, as I increased in them, so my bows were made bigger and bigger. For men shall never shoot well unless they be brought up to it.>>

 

A recurved composite bow - say with horn tips and bound leather reinforcement - for instance a Mongol bow - was much shorter (the longest historical recurve composite are about 4 feet?) and required very much less strength to pull. It was not a primary requirement of archers equipped with 'short' composite bows (in war) to kill the enemy, (this a modern fictional Holywood invention) only to lodge one or two or more barbed arrows in his body parts. These wounds almost certainly cause death by infection within a few days to 2 or 3 weeks (meaning, you get 1 arrow in your thigh you're fated to a horrible death within days, if you get 3 or 4 scattered around your body, you cant even fight or move effectively). This was primarily "very demoralizing" (you bet) for the target, who in addition was also severely hindered by the pain of dangling shafts with their barbed heads in your muscles, and any combat movement was rendered difficult (eg the use of banderillas in bull fighting).

 

But The overall argument you put forward is perfectly valid and interesting - only remember that many different bow have been developed for different reasons. historically you reinforce (and recurve) a short bow to increase acceleration on the string, but if you reinforce a longbow no one can bend it.

 

Re "hunting" both in DayZ and in Real Life:

 

In Africa, the Americas, and Europe (across all the continents) traditional game hunting with weapons, except small game e.g. rabbits or birds - was 'mainly' by spear, if possible with iron heads - (in Africa provided by Arab traders).. the spear's effect is the same as a short-distance very heavyweight arrow, and much more immediately damaging - but not usually fatal. The strike is intended to be eventually crippling. Stalking and tracking is the key to this Real Life hunting tech.

If archery was employed in hunting; arrow strikes were expected to wound and slow the beast, not expected to kill it outright (but you can always be lucky) - bowshots were habitually followed by a (maybe long) period of tracking while the animal lost blood and strength and was worn down and extremely hindered (like the warrior, noted above) by the dragging arrows buried in it's flesh.

 

But - yours is a good post. thanks Whyhero123

+ Beanz, - I'm only picking you up on the "not quite" because you seem interested in the subject, and you're ... 'almost' ... right on everything (not quite).

 

A note for further up the forum (Jexter) - Yew trees were NOT grown in Churchyards to provide bow-staves, this is a standard myth (work out why it's not true, for yourself, if ya want, it's really quite interesting .. )

Already in England before 1415 CE  there was a tax on imports - each imported barrel was taxed 4 bow-staves (and it was up to the importer where he got them, but they had to be brought from abroad). The English had already run out of Yew to supply their archers. The tax was later raised to 10 bowstaves per 'tun' (by Richard III) and caused a lot of complaint .. a couple of central European rulers made immense profits by destroying whole regions of yew (eg in Poland) to supply the English demand.

 

And a note completely off the point: The duke of Wellington - a thoughtful lad - asked the War Lords ( the high command) for a unit of English longbowmen during his campaign against Napoleon (Waterloo) because soldiers no longer wore body protection - and trained archers could easily loft 10+ arrows (over an equivalent distance and each with enormous hitting power) in the time taken for one single musket volley+reload (musket has greater impact, but immensely slow relaod). The high command seriously researched and discovered that there were no longer enough trained men in England to provide him with his unit, and training up to the standard would take many years.

 

*

 

I think in DayZ an ash stave with a point, - fire-hardened, or a stone knife (arrowhead), or some other knife attached with rope or gaffer tape - would be a sane and reasonable thing. It's a standard survival gambit, right? .. just a decent SPEAR. OK?

 

xx pilgrim

 

without more details - "Traditional English longbows are self bows made from yew wood. The bowstave is cut from the radius of the tree so that sapwood (on the outside of the tree) becomes the back and forms about one third of the total thickness; the remaining two thirds or so is heartwood (50/50 is about the maximum sapwood/heartwood ratio generally used). Yew sapwood is good only in tension, while the heartwood is good in compression" This is a rare quality in woods.

 

the problem of bowstring is an interesting one, with various solutions (hemp, paracord, linen, rawhide, human hair, electrical wire, silk .. .. er.. catgut?)   but I doubt we'll see them in the game.

 

If you want to use a powerful bow - one that you can't draw with your arms and upper torso (a heavy longbow or homemade survivalist) - sit down with the bow against your feet, aim between the feet, keep your arms straight and draw the bow by lying back against the ground...ok ..( just in case anyone ever needs to know ).

 

xx pilgrim

Edited January 27, 2015 by pilgrim

[Whyherro123 2283]

-snip-

Oh, I agree.  Yew is definately awesome for bow-staves, and for good reason. Unfortunately, I don't have many yew trees in Southern New England, so I have to make due with birch, beech, and ash.

[Killawife 599]

I made a bow the other day and used it for a while. Its quite cool but the range is very short. Horribly so. I fired two metres above a zed twenty metres away and the arrow ended up at his feet :(

 I used up my arrows then tossed it.

[Dagwood 680]

I'm no survivalist or anything, but shouldn't we be able to craft a rudimentary stone axe so that we aren't as dependent upon finding one in a dangerous town? I'd imagine you would need a stone knife at the least to "wittle" a haft for an axe. We can already chisel crude knives, so an axe head isn't too hard to imagine.

As a drawback I'd say a high failure rate on carving hafts would prevent it from making survival too easily achieved.

[pilgrim* 3514]

Oh, I agree.  Yew is definately awesome for bow-staves, and for good reason. Unfortunately, I don't have many yew trees in Southern New England, so I have to make due with birch, beech, and ash.

 

If yew trees were grown in churchyards to provide bow-staves .. and the average country church at the time had a few hundred or a thousand congregation scattered around local villages - (and by law every man 14-70 obliged to have a bow) - how come old churches have only TWO yew trees growing in each churchyard ?

 

??

Edited January 27, 2015 by pilgrim

[Whyherro123 2283]

If yew trees were grown in churchyards to provide bow-staves .. and the average country church at the time had a few hundred or a thousand congregation scattered around local villages - how come old churches have only TWO yew trees growing in each churchyard ?

 

??

...Huh?

 

What does that have to do with my comment?

[pilgrim* 3514]

...Huh?

 

What does that have to do with my comment?

 

Nothing, Whyhero123

As I said - your post was good and I gave beanz for it.

Because you are into archery I thought you MIGHT be interested in the logistics (your word) of the old "yew trees in churchyard myth"

Sorry, I thought you'd read through my post. Don't blame you for not picking up on all it, no prob, it's only general interest, mainly boring. I should have written about interesting guns, on some other thread.

 

But, sure - of course you can make bows out of anything springy. use an old car leaf spring  and shape it - whatever you like.

Look around an industrial dump for 10 mins you'll find something.

You don't stand ANY chance of cutting yew anywhere in the UK, of course.. that would be a rare thing, I REALLY don't think you'd get away with it.

There are not many in England  and not many between Wales Spain, Poland, and the Black Sea, either, because already by 1450 CE they were cutting and selling central European yew them to the English, who did not have any left.

this is why right across Europe these trees have the common name "english yew"

 

 

You can still buy a nice piece of yew if you look around the net - but not a heartwood/ sapwood single piece (rare!). Or use an old car leaf spring and shape it - whatever you like..

elm, oak, hickory, ash, maple and hazel are all hard enough to be good for this type of bow but their wood will set to a permanent curve, yew will not.

(a survivalist wouldn't care).

For five centuries (and also back into prehistory) yew was the BEST and most sought after in Europe, by a long way

Last recorded killing in warfare by a serving mil. was a Brit officer who took down a German soldier in France in 1940 with a longbow.

 

But to SURVIVE:

 

If you want to (no-gun) kill for food, us a manufactured compond bow or crossbow (crossbow better because easiest to aim) and broad-head sharp-edged hunting barbs for best chance at cutting an artery or touching spine/vital point for quick death. This is not "romantic", or "archery"  just practical, for food.. Without these - use a long heavyweight spear shaft (so it punches and then drags) with a long and sharp barbed head  that will go deep and not tear loose (file down any scrap steel, etc..). This would be MY definite choice in survival. Track the beast till it stops and use a second spear .. and repeat. Some animals loose courage quickly, boar don't. Else use traps - figure a way to break the leg of a deer. and etc... 

a heavy smooth river stone held bound with with a woven leather throwing handle can do wonders (N American indian), causes plenty damage.

Edited January 27, 2015 by pilgrim

[pilgrim* 3514]

Yes the whole "Making a bow from scratch" is useless when the source of your rope keeps running away from you lol

 

Circle round far enough so you don't frighten the animal, then attack it from the front, so it is facing you - as you run in it will turn away before it starts to run, this gives you one chance to hit it.

 

OK - that's the theory - It worked for me on my second try

Then for the next 15 attempts it did NOT work...  at all.

 

So that was my limit (two days of chasing animals around fields in the open - "who is this crazy guy? shall we shoot him?"  - so I've moved on to to other things - mainly looking for rope, heh

Perhaps it's best trying animal-melee with a rapid weapon - maybe even a screwdriver ?

 

Or maybe a team effort like in the old days of boar hunting, with 3 players coming in from different sides?.. anyway, I just about gave up totally and moved on to other excitements: Growing Melons in the rain..

 

xx