Why all the judgement?

[umm_me 77]

I guess I just dont understand the appeal to wait so long for PvP, but hey thats just me, you can like anything you want to like :P

[ValentinBk (DayZ) 60]

I guess I just dont understand the appeal to wait so long for PvP, but hey thats just me, you can like anything you want to like :P

harteman pretty much nailed it. DayZ is probably the best pvp experience I had.

Edited October 28, 2014 by ValentinBk

[DocWolf 146]

That's entirely different those games are completely PVP focused DayZ is not, you can PVP but it's not a matchmaking based deathmatch game where the mission for everyone is to kill everyone.

 

If someone isn't looking for a fight and gets sniper from miles away in somewhere innocent like any random town it's not PVP it's shooting fish in a barrel. If they seen you and tried to escape but you killed them, PVP. If they had no weapons at all and cowered in a corner while you came over to shoot them, PVP. If they didn't know you were there at all and wouldn't have noticed you on that kill 300m away it's KoS/camping.

 

You can hardly classify PVP in DayZ exactly the same as an FPS or any other game specifically made for people to fight each other and nothing else(minus occasional co-op)

I fear I'm not following you.

I'm a very practical person, so let's talk about real examples here - something down to earth. Days ago I was on the woody hills northwest of Novodmitrovsk's industrial area. I was travelling towards Cernaya Polana from Turovo, trying to avoid roads...the last two encounters with other players weren't friendly at all, and in both I ended respawning on the coast.

I used my scoped SKS time and time again while I was on that hill: I was decently geared, and I wanted to be pretty sure no-one was around before crossing open ground. So it was scope-zoom-look, wait what was that? Scope-zoom-look, ok nothing to worry no WAIT! Scope-zoom-look again. All my paranoia was rewarded when another player appeared on the main road apparently travelling from Svetlo towards Cernaya Polana. I followed him from distance, watching him looting the northest outskirts of the town I needed to loot myself...and then decided to kill him. Yeah, why not playing the "friendly" card, trying to go "hey dude need help" and whatnot? Sorry, I wasn't confident. Something (him, or my previous experiences) was putting me on edge. I couldn't turn around and loot something else because I needed food badly, and without gas stove or matches hunting was not an option. Svetlo is a spawn point and too small; Turovo and Karmanovka were already looted. Novo, maybe, but I was already in Cernaya Polana...

So I followed him, watched him for a while. And then killed him. Bang, he's down. From his point of view it was KoS...a round to the head coming out of the blue. But was it REALLY killing on sight? Actually, no. I had motivation, I had the means, I took some time and actually followed him. Are you trying to tell I wasn't "versus" him? Or that I'm a bad player because I didn't revealed myself first? I seriously can't understand all this debate about KoS. How do you know the guy sniping you is doing so just for teh lulz? How do you know that he just happened to spot you and simply slagged you instead of saying hi? Maybe he need something you have (or something he thinks you could have). Maybe he was stalking you from the previous town you visited. Maybe he's not sure he can survive a trading encounter gone bad, and don't want to look at his shoulders every time he loot a house in the same city you're in.

Edited October 28, 2014 by DocWolf

[pillock 850]

So I followed him, watched him for a while. And then killed him. Bang, he's down. From his point of view it was KoS...a round to the head coming out of the blue. But was it REALLY killing on sight? Actually, no. I had motivation, I had the means, I took some time and actually followed him. Are you trying to tell I wasn't "versus" him? Or that I'm a bad player because I didn't revealed myself first? I seriously can't understand all this debate about KoS. How do you know the guy sniping you is doing so just for teh lulz? How do you know that he just happened to spot you and simply slagged you instead of saying hi? Maybe he need something you have (or something he thinks you could have). Maybe he was stalking you from the previous town you visited. Maybe he's not sure he can survive a trading encounter gone bad, and don't want to look at his shoulders every time he loot a house in the same city you're in.

 

I think this is fair comment.

 

Generally, I try to behave in a way that does not appear threatening. I know someone might be watching or trailing me, however careful I am, however much I sneak and scope and manoeuvre and crawl etc. If I saw someone moving like that, I'd think they were a threat, especially if they had military gear. But if I saw someone walking along a road in civilian dress, without a weapon in their hands, I'd be more likely to approach them. Therefore, I employ that sort of movement myself. It works sometimes, I think, but it's impossible to know for sure - anyway, I've only very rarely been sniped from distance out of the blue, except in military bases and Berezino.

 

For me, you have to weigh up the risk of being spotted by a hostile and shot, with the risk of never meeting another friendly survivor. I'd rather suffer the odd KoS death than never have interactions.

[over9000nukez 199]

See, I view that as foolhardy, myself.

 

I assume people are with friends at all times.  I have to prepare for that, because sometimes it is true.  I'll be sniped or snuck while my hands a full with holding up someone.  It happens.  Hell, fresh spawns are used as LURES by the smarter groups out there.

 

Safety first, always, where survival matters.

that's why i don't stand out in the middle of the open when taking a hostage, only idiots do that.

 

you have to move them to a safe place, make them speak, and if they don't speak you shoot them, I've never died trying to take a hostage yet. again it doesn't take a lot of skill to go around shooting everything that moves, maybe skill isn't what your worried about, but rather your own sense of "safety", with your logic of shooting any "treat" your right, there could be more people in their group, and they'll come to kill you, and I'm sure its happened to you, because you made it sound like that's happened to you a lot.

 

just remember you always move you'r hostage swiftly, and you keep them in doors, you keep them speaking, and if they rebel in any way (doing stuff you told them not to, or refusing) you might give them one warning if you know you're safe, but other then that you're the boss of the situation.

 

I'm not sure how you play, if you run around and KOS, or if you try to survive and just kos when you see a player, but if im reading you correctly, you make it seem like you would shoot ANYONE, even at 500+meters away not even going your direction because they are a "treat", and don't even try to avoid them, i think you have alternative motives other then your "safety"

 

im sure you said you tried it before, but here's a challenge : go to a city where people occasionally go around, i heard you like shotguns, so carry a shotgun with you, hold someone up at gun point and rob them, its much more intense then jsut shooting them while they aren't even aware that you're there. and since you have a shotgun you would normally ruin all their gear, but here are the steps to a proper robbery:

 

1. make your presence obvious to them,(get right near them, point gun at them, and make sure they have NO HOPE OF ESCAPE, otherwise, they'll make a break for it.

 

2-3. have them move to somewhere with cover for you(and have them drop everything, as quick as possible, in case they have a hidden weapon, search them,take some stuff, and let them have their stuff back) optional: handcuff them, way safer for you honestly, I only use them when i have multiple hostages)

2-3. start conversation, (this is so they don't talk to their group members, i usually have them start saying blah blah blah over and over so that it clogs their skype/teamspeak so they cant talk to their friend anymore, ask lots of questions, and give them a rough warning if they don't respond quick enough, and tell them you know about their friends.

 

4. finish, make sure you are COMPLETELY safe before moving,( even humanize yourself through conversation in step 2-3 , tell them your name, get theirs, people trust you about 100% more when they know who to call you, and know your back-round, if they have friends, they might tell them to back off just because you were nice and let them live, make sure they stay at the spot you left them for about a minute, that way they don't give information from where your going.)

Edited October 28, 2014 by over9000nukez

[UltimateGentleman 355]

I fear I'm not following you.

I'm a very practical person, so let's talk about real examples here - something down to earth. Days ago I was on the woody hills northwest of Novodmitrovsk's industrial area. I was travelling towards Cernaya Polana from Turovo, trying to avoid roads...the last two encounters with other players weren't friendly at all, and in both I ended respawning on the coast.

I used my scoped SKS time and time again while I was on that hill: I was decently geared, and I wanted to be pretty sure no-one was around before crossing open ground. So it was scope-zoom-look, wait what was that? Scope-zoom-look, ok nothing to worry no WAIT! Scope-zoom-look again. All my paranoia was rewarded when another player appeared on the main road apparently travelling from Svetlo towards Cernaya Polana. I followed him from distance, watching him looting the northest outskirts of the town I needed to loot myself...and then decided to kill him. Yeah, why not playing the "friendly" card, trying to go "hey dude need help" and whatnot? Sorry, I wasn't confident. Something (him, or my previous experiences) was putting me on edge. I couldn't turn around and loot something else because I needed food badly, and without gas stove or matches hunting was not an option. Svetlo is a spawn point and too small; Turovo and Karmanovka were already looted. Novo, maybe, but I was already in Cernaya Polana...

So I followed him, watched him for a while. And then killed him. Bang, he's down. From his point of view it was KoS...a round to the head coming out of the blue. But was it REALLY killing on sight? Actually, no. I had motivation, I had the means, I took some time and actually followed him. Are you trying to tell I wasn't "versus" him? Or that I'm a bad player because I didn't revealed myself first? I seriously can't understand all this debate about KoS. How do you know the guy sniping you is doing so just for teh lulz? How do you know that he just happened to spot you and simply slagged you instead of saying hi? Maybe he need something you have (or something he thinks you could have). Maybe he was stalking you from the previous town you visited. Maybe he's not sure he can survive a trading encounter gone bad, and don't want to look at his shoulders every time he loot a house in the same city you're in.

Yeah that's a different kettle of fish you actually needed food and he was taking it if it was there.

 

But most players just shoot.

Someone going a different direction? Shoot them.

Someone taking stuff you don't need? Shoot them.

Don't have any weapons at all? Shoot them.

 

^ that's how most players seem to operate only a minority actually think about it beyond "Should I waste the bullets?"

[The Feral Kid 13]

The game is a simulation which attempts to be authentic and immersive.  If people are behaving in unrealistic ways, then the game is not fully successful.

 

A real apocalypse would be just as much a lawless sandbox as DayZ, but in a real apocalypse nobody's going to go looking for PVP because they're bored, or kill themselves in the hope of a better spawn.  Some people might KOS out of paranoia, but probably not the majority.

 

I don't blame players for playing how they want, but I do think the game will be better when it fosters more realistic behaviour.

Edited October 29, 2014 by The Feral Kid

[CJFlint 357]

DayZ is a surival, sand box, no safe zone, pvp, perma death game. Its a fact. Its just what it is. The minute you log onto a server, anyone and everyone is open season to be taken out by another player. Every where is a pvp hot zone. Light or high pop.  

 

With more survival mechanics added, cars, base building ect ect. It may make it so player focus on other tasks, but at the end of the day it will still be a no safe zone, pvp, perma death game.

 

"KOS" I promiss you is not going any where. Get over it. Adapt. Learn ways to cut down on it hapening to you. Be smart, be a wolf not a sheep. 

Edited October 29, 2014 by CJFlint

[Whyherro123 2283]

The game is a simulation which attempts to be authentic and immersive.  If people are behaving in unrealistic ways, then the game is not fully successful.

 

A real apocalypse would be just as much a lawless sandbox as DayZ, but in a real apocalypse nobody's going to go looking for PVP because they're bored, or kill themselves in the hope of a better spawn.  Some people might KOS out of paranoia, but probably not the majority.

 

I don't blame players for playing how they want, but I do think the game will be better when it fosters more realistic behaviour.

Actually.....

 

we have actually no idea about what would happen in the total collapse of society, because it has literally never happened in the 40,000+ years of human civilization. Yep, not once. (A pretty good track record, if I must say)

 

However, we can make a rather (highly) educated guess.

 

The study of sociology and psychology have found that the overwhelming majority of human beings desire safety, community, and well, rather "boring" lives, for lack of a better term. Apparently, we prefer to live as comfortably as possible, with few upsets. So, in the event of a total societal collapse (TSC), scientists estimate that people are far, FAR more likely to band together in tight-knit groups, usually made up of people who knew each other before the TSC (extended familial groups, or neighborhoods in the city), rather than degenerate into rabid animals, wandering and killing anyone not us. Think "tribes" or "clans", and you would have the right idea. In actuality, "lone wolves" would likely be the first ones to die off, as they have no-one to turn to if things go south (injury, no food, etc), nor can they be trusted as trading partners.

 

http://www.cracked.com/article_21251_5-things-every-movie-gets-wrong-about-apocalypse.html (Yes, a comedy website, but it links to reputable sources)

 

Not saying that there wouldn't be violence, but it wouldn't be the mindless sort we see in Day Z. It would most likely be along the lines of "endemic warfare" (look it up), or highly ritualized duels. A post-TSC society wouldn't be able to sustain itself with wars of extermination. Day Z is much the same; take out the re spawn mechanic (AKA look at Day Z from a "real world" POV), and the entire server would be empty in hours.

[The Feral Kid 13]

DayZ aims to be authentic, and that means it should elicit authentic behaviour from players.

 

If players are acting very differently from how they would in a similar real life scenario, then the game will be improved if mechanics are introduced to encourage more realistic behaviour.

 

Notice I did not mention any specific player actions.  I just think the game should encourage people to act realistically.  I am very open to discussion on what is realistic (and that is an area where we can actually be more objective than subjective).

[Mor (DayZ) 57]

With that out of the way, I want to ask this forum and those who come here to post, why all the judgement of others play?  Everywhere I look in these forums, there are people arguing about how this game should be played.  I don't understand this, or at least to me, it seems unreasonable.

Official forums are generally filled with hardcore players, especially during development. There are some people here who put in ~1000 hours of gameplay... although the vast majority of people who played the mod and bought the game, are far far far more casual.

Anyway, I suppose that they feel that by telling people how the game should be played, it will change something..

Edited October 30, 2014 by Mor

[danceswithzeds 22]

I think the judgement is from frustration by all of the Dayz fans/players. Zombies are still going through walls, there is no bike, and hacking has not yet been reduced. So I think all of us huge supporters of the game are in bitter moods both in the game and out. I'm new here on the forum but that's what I'm theorizing.

[ValentinBk (DayZ) 60]

I think the judgement is from frustration by all of the Dayz fans/players. Zombies are still going through walls, there is no bike, and hacking has not yet been reduced. So I think all of us huge supporters of the game are in bitter moods both in the game and out. I'm new here on the forum but that's what I'm theorizing.

Most of the complaining I see here is about KoS and hostile players in general. Hackers are a serious pain in the ass though, got killed at least 4 times by hackers, and today my colt (with a mag!) just disappeared from my inventory..

[gannon46 788]

Except there is a versus, its a sniper versus some poor unaware schmuck.

Its the geared player versus the coastal.

Its the hunter versus the prey.

KoS=PvP. No matter how much you cry and call people names you can't change that simple fact. Sorry people don't feel your sense of ehonor.

its not PVP its called an ambush you are attacking someone unaware who has no time to react hence they are killed now if you miss and they return fire then that's PVP just because you shoot at a human doesn't mean your in PVP until they are aware and shooting back its KOS or an ambush. not hating just stating but then again who cares killing is killing whether it for duty profit or fun-Charles manson.