gut feelings

[TulaNoyes 5]

it would be pretty insignificant. but say a player spends most of his time hanging out in the tree line killing new spawns. and he just happens upon me and lets me live and talks to me for a bit after your around the player for alittle your guy says at the bottom "this guy gives me the creeps" or "i have a bad feeling about this guy". the other hand a player that spends his time helping others and tradeing you would get something like "he seems ok" or "i think i can trust him" or a guy thats kind of in the middle "i dont know what to think of this guy". but killing people doesnt automatically turn you into a creeper it takes into acount who your killing or if you comunicated first how bad the other person was. items that have been given to people and so on. just an idea

[nokyookami 63]

Interesting Idea ^_^

[DemonGroover 8836]

The mod had a heartbeat sound which got loud when you were near evil bastard bandits.  Its a tough one as players shouldn't be disadvantaged because of their playstyle. 

 

Tbh if you talk to some players you get a feeling sometimes that they are dodgy bastards and waiting to shoot you in the back.

[Rowdy (DayZ) 28]

I would like to see a karma system of some sort, it would need to be subtle though

[Tegla (DayZ) 112]

your guy says at the bottom "this guy gives me the creeps" or "i have a bad feeling about this guy". 

 

Why? Woud you get a floating text in real life if you had a bad feeling about a guy?

And why would you want the game to decide if you have a bad feeling about a player?

 

Talk to the guy and judge by yourself.

 

That is, if you are actually willing to talk to someone. Most of the people just shoot first, then ask questions later

[agentstaple 29]

I agree with tegla, your gut feeling should be your own. Obviously there are flaws with this because it's a video game and people wont show the same emotions. But I still don't like karma systems.

 

Definitely one of the better karma suggestions I've seen though, I wouldn't be too bothered if something like that was added (and added well).

[DMentMan 707]

no, bad idea, also suggested a quadrillion times before.

[Evil Minion 943]

No - thats something that should purely work on the player side. No artificial tells only natural ones. Just as the other wrote: The gut feeling should be your own. Also it reduces the possiblilties for deception and paranoia which would reduce the overall experience.

 

What we should have is a character identity (unbiased) where a character has a specific fixed appearance (face, body, eyes, hair, tatoos, scars) and maybe a fixed name as well. Thats crucial for a natural formation of communities and an ingame cooperation/reward/punishment system.

 

In the end every karma/morality/gut-feeling system coded into the game would impose a specific moral codex on players would severely hamper their own options, playstyles and choices. And every such system would have weaknesses and eventually label players as "good" that are actually "lawful within this specific codex" regardless of them being good in the first place. An (exaggerated) example of this can be seen here - and every single artificial system would be abusable in this way effectively only gimping every playstyle that is "outside the codex".

[umm_me 77]

Why? Woud you get a floating text in real life if you had a bad feeling about a guy?

And why would you want the game to decide if you have a bad feeling about a player?

 

Talk to the guy and judge by yourself.

 

That is, if you are actually willing to talk to someone. Most of the people just shoot first, then ask questions later

 

Can you look into the animated person eyes and see what they are thinking? Did you notice that animated face twitch as he said he was friendly?  Did the perfectly still animated character slowly move his right hand towards his pistol? When you drink water do you have to check which green status bar you have?

[Tegla (DayZ) 112]

Can you look into the animated person eyes and see what they are thinking? Did you notice that animated face twitch as he said he was friendly?  Did the perfectly still animated character slowly move his right hand towards his pistol? When you drink water do you have to check which green status bar you have?

 

I see your point, but there is no way to tell for sure that the man was a bandit, even if the system was implemented.

Back in the mod, some people had bandit skins that they got in self defence.

You could get a false message like that and shoot an innocent guy.

 

On the other hand, if the guy truly was a bandit, and a lone wolf player wanting to change his playstyle to a hero, you wouldn't trust him based on that message

[umm_me 77]

Im not totally for against the original suggestion, i kinda like its idea in theory but like you point out in practice there may be many holes in it.

 

I just think in a game theres definitely a place for text messages for things you would know like the thirst example and maybe in the right circumstances other things.

[Evil Minion 943]

Can you look into the animated person eyes and see what they are thinking? Did you notice that animated face twitch as he said he was friendly?  Did the perfectly still animated character slowly move his right hand towards his pistol? When you drink water do you have to check which green status bar you have?

Can you look into a real persons eyes and see what she is thinking? No!

Does a real person twitch whenever he tells a lie and never twitch when he tells the truth? No!

Do real people who want to shoot you always slowly move their right hand towards their pistol? No!

Do you always feel thirsty when you are thirsty? Yes!

 

Thats the difference. Its significant! The green status bar tells you something you should know. The gut feeling tells you something you should not know.

Edited October 14, 2014 by Evil Minion

[umm_me 77]

Can you look into a real persons eyes and see what she is thinking? No!

Does a real person twitch whenever he tells a lie and never twitch when he tells the truth? No!

Do real people who want to shoot you always slowly move their right hand towards their pistol? No!

Do you always feel thirsty when you are thirsty? Yes!

 

Thats the difference. Its significant! The green status bar tells you something you should know. The gut feeling tells you something you should not know.

 

Have you talked to many people in real life?

 

Play a game of poker this weekend, youll be amazed what you can see.

Edited October 14, 2014 by umm_me

[Karmaterror 982]

Why? Woud you get a floating text in real life if you had a bad feeling about a guy?

 

 

This, ok so you loos body language and stuff in a game, but there tone and what they say can give away there true intentions pretty quick. Theres always gonna be that smooth talker that gets ya to let your guard down then Bam "you are dead". That wouldn't be poss if a message came up and gave him away even though he was producing an award winning performance lol

 

Also what I quoted is my main gripe with the status messages in general....its not immersive at all, iv swapped a gui for a string of txt I must pay equal attention to :(

[UltimateGentleman 355]

Why? Woud you get a floating text in real life if you had a bad feeling about a guy?

And why would you want the game to decide if you have a bad feeling about a player?

 

Talk to the guy and judge by yourself.

 

That is, if you are actually willing to talk to someone. Most of the people just shoot first, then ask questions later

 

No but the game can't give you the same feeling you get in real life can it?

 

I think it's a good idea. Just because you get the message that someone is a bad player doesn't mean you should instantly kill them or just run away too, just that you should watch your back.

 

The game is never going to be so complex as real life, you won't be able to look at a players avatar and just know they're crazy like you would in real life.

 

It's not hard to tell what kind of person someone is at all, especially in this world where you're either a killer, not or will do anything to survive it'd be immediately obvious to anyone surviving and meeting people in this situation who to stay the fuck away from.

But the game can't get that across to you at all.

 

 

It's definitely better than "MrSwagKilla killed MrDoughnut" messages showing up isn't it? So that after you see MrSwagKilla having killed 20 people you stay away.

 

 

This, ok so you loos body language and stuff in a game, but there tone and what they say can give away there true intentions pretty quick. Theres always gonna be that smooth talker that gets ya to let your guard down then Bam "you are dead". That wouldn't be poss if a message came up and gave him away even though he was producing an award winning performance lol

 

Also what I quoted is my main gripe with the status messages in general....its not immersive at all, iv swapped a gui for a string of txt I must pay equal attention to :(

 

Assuming that they have or use a microphone at all. It's not hard to pretend over the internet either nobody is seeing your face as you put on that evil "He gon' die!" grin.

 

There's nothing wrong with status messages.

You can't feel that your avatar is hungry so what would the use be in the game not notifying you?

 

 

The only problem is how it works, it would need to be like if you're talking to someone and looking at them I think.

So that you couldn't be trying to sneak up on someone 10m away and have them know you're there because "I sense an evil presence nearby...!"

[Tegla (DayZ) 112]

I think it's a good idea. Just because you get the message that someone is a bad player doesn't mean you should instantly kill them or just run away too, just that you should watch your back.

 

You know very well that the majority of the players would just shoot the guy instead of taking their chances.

In case you missed it, i'll quote my own post elaborating why it in fact is a bad idea

 

 

 

Back in the mod, some people had bandit skins that they got in self defence.

You could get a false message like that and shoot an innocent guy.

 

On the other hand, if the guy truly was a bandit, and a lone wolf player wanting to change his playstyle to a hero, you wouldn't trust him based on that message

 

[Evil Minion 943]

Have you talked to many people in real life?

 

Play a game of poker this weekend, youll be amazed what you can see.

There is a distinct difference between reading someones behavior and reading someones mind. This suggestion is akin to some "I can feel this one has good cards" sixth sense and not like "this guy is acting like he has good cards". In fact you can also read ingame behavior - probably much better than some "moral codex enforcing karma system" that also does not show the true intentions but rather gives you something like a personal history instead.

 

Even worse: Your gut feeling would tell you that someone you never met and who is absolutely honest and really wants to help you is lying to you because he killed some guys before without you even knowing about this.

Edited October 14, 2014 by Evil Minion

[Karmaterror 982]

No but the game can't give you the same feeling you get in real life can it?

 

I think it's a good idea. Just because you get the message that someone is a bad player doesn't mean you should instantly kill them or just run away too, just that you should watch your back.

 

The game is never going to be so complex as real life, you won't be able to look at a players avatar and just know they're crazy like you would in real life.

 

It's not hard to tell what kind of person someone is at all, especially in this world where you're either a killer, not or will do anything to survive it'd be immediately obvious to anyone surviving and meeting people in this situation who to stay the fuck away from.

But the game can't get that across to you at all.

 

 

It's definitely better than "MrSwagKilla killed MrDoughnut" messages showing up isn't it? So that after you see MrSwagKilla having killed 20 people you stay away.

 

 

 

Assuming that they have or use a microphone at all. It's not hard to pretend over the internet either nobody is seeing your face as you put on that evil "He gon' die!" grin.

 

There's nothing wrong with status messages.

You can't feel that your avatar is hungry so what would the use be in the game not notifying you?

 

 

The only problem is how it works, it would need to be like if you're talking to someone and looking at them I think.

So that you couldn't be trying to sneak up on someone 10m away and have them know you're there because "I sense an evil presence nearby...!"

 

True its not hard to lie over the net, but its the questions they choose to ask and the order they ask them....even when they type there are tells.

 

It might just be me but lets use your food example. Dean said he didn't want a gui...what do we have right now....a gui on the inv screen AND those intrusive status messages.

 

I do think it should inform us but do it with a sound or an animation....or both. Let the physical appearance of the char tell us not the in game chat system spamming messages every two mins....or 2 seconds if its raining lol.

[umm_me 77]

Even worse: Your gut feeling would tell you that someone you never met and who is absolutely honest and really wants to help you is lying to you because he killed some guys before without you even knowing about this.

 

 

That honestly sounds like a pro to the system.. mistakes happen and maybe youll regret it and thats a good experience over all.

 

Again not overly supporting the system, i like it in theory more then i think it can work in practice.

[UltimateGentleman 355]

True its not hard to lie over the net, but its the questions they choose to ask and the order they ask them....even when they type there are tells.

 

It might just be me but lets use your food example. Dean said he didn't want a gui...what do we have right now....a gui on the inv screen AND those intrusive status messages.

 

I do think it should inform us but do it with a sound or an animation....or both. Let the physical appearance of the char tell us not the in game chat system spamming messages every two mins....or 2 seconds if its raining lol.

Yeah but still not hard to pretend and it's hard to go by someone's voice alone they could just sound like a douchebag but not be or sound nice but be a douchebag like you've never seen before.

Appearance is a far greater tell in most cases, the looks people give you, the slight twitches of them suppressing their anger over something you said, the sweat on someone's face from being nervous.

The game can't show you these things so it takes an important line of defence you have in real life out of meetings.

 

We need a GUI because without one we don't get a buttload of information available to everyone with their senses you can't eat or smell a fruit in the game and personally know it tastes rotten the game has to tell you and only giving you visuals is a bad way to do it as with food it can look delicious but smell like it'd take down an elephant.

"Nobody has a GUI in real life" arguments don't cut it, this is a game, it needs to make up for the real life features it just can't have.

 

You know very well that the majority of the players would just shoot the guy instead of taking their chances.

In case you missed it, i'll quote my own post elaborating why it in fact is a bad idea

Not really, usually it doesn't even get as far as a conversation :P

 

Bandit skin is a bad idea as is this purely being based on kills it should take in to account multiple things to build up a "profile" of your avatar essentially.

Like if you're geared up and you shoot fresh spawns that should count towards you being bad.

But if they attacked first or had a weapon ready then it shouldn't.

 

Same as with any player if they were shooting at you it should count as a self defence kill.

 

They'd have to develop a system to calculate these things of course but it'd be do-able, way better than gaining a bad guy skin.

[Tegla (DayZ) 112]

They'd have to develop a system to calculate these things of course but it'd be do-able, way better than gaining a bad guy skin.

 

Well, if they actually manage to do that, i may change my opinion.

I can't see how they would go about that, but seems plausible enough for me :)

[Airborne28 4]

I agree with tegla, your gut feeling should be your own. Obviously there are flaws with this because it's a video game and people wont show the same emotions. But I still don't like karma systems.

 

Definitely one of the better karma suggestions I've seen though, I wouldn't be too bothered if something like that was added (and added well).

Kosers ( murderers) dont want it as they are able to avoided. I have several people in my group that like kos fresh spawns. I think its stupid and dont play with em unless its a large op. They do it out of boredom, or for simple things like food and expediance. Heros want the system as it will enable them in their misguided thinking that people wont kos them as often.

Now to play devils advocate here, most people say " well in real life i wont run a certain way or have a koser tag" . True, but in real life there are subtle clues about you that give your motives away. If a system were made, it should be nothing more than clues about posture, their speech tells the rest of the story.

Now im a bad player. Im not a koser or a bandit or a hero. Im me. If i am put into a situation where someone seems cautios to talk, ill listen. If someone asks for medical help, ill throw a bandage or splint on the ground. If somone is unconsious, ill revive em but handcuff or take their weapons to feel them out.

Typicaly it seems that children are the ones who play the wounded animal trick.

[UltimateGentleman 355]

Well, if they actually manage to do that, i may change my opinion.

I can't see how they would go about that, but seems plausible enough for me :)

I don't think it would be all that difficult really.

 

Of course I don't know the specifics but I'm sure most of the details needed are already recorded in the server, who fired what gun and who killed who etc. I doubt they could make it perfect but it would be a cool feature that to my knowledge has never really been done before.

 

Now to play devils advocate here, most people say " well in real life i wont run a certain way or have a koser tag" . True, but in real life there are subtle clues about you that give your motives away. If a system were made, it should be nothing more than clues about posture, their speech tells the rest of the story.

Hmm, I'm inclined to say no to that posture part I don't think a system like this should really alter the look of your character at all, there's plenty people in the world who look like nice people but it's only when you meet them up close and see their behaviour that you can tell they're a little funky.

 

 

The only thing that there's an issue with is that people could go on mad killing sprees, get a buddy to kill them and watch their stuff then gear up again having a "neutral" avatar, then they could help a few people and be "good"

While simply preparing to slaughter every unsuspecting fool who takes the messages to heart.

 

I guess people would learn that the messages are simply a guideline and not necessarily fact they shouldn't be so blunt as to say "this guy is evil run away or kill him" just something like "this person gives me an odd feeling" and for positive "this person feels welcoming" perhaps.

 

Lot of people are just going to kill over the "odd" or "bad" feeling, for sure.

But I don't think that's any reason to not attempt this system at all, at least it would get some people talking and being friendly instead of just instantly shooting each other.

If people have more freedom to engage each other and backstab each other rather than just kill from a distance that would be great.

 

Currently you're a dumbass to just go up to people but with this system involved you could walk up to them with your hands up in a desperate situation like starving and if their avatar doesn't get a threatening feeling from you maybe they'll help.

 

Killing everyone you meet isn't surviving, anything to reinforce that is very positive.

[Lady Kyrah 1110]

And so for the millionth time again,

 

The real question is, why should there be any kind of "retribution" for killing other players? Because lets face it, sometimes the goal IS to make you leave the server or deny you to play.

Edited October 14, 2014 by Lady Kyrah

[UltimateGentleman 355]

And so for the millionth time again,

 

The real question is, why should there be any kind of "retribution" for killing other players? Because lets face it, sometimes the goal IS to make you leave the server or deny you to play.

Why should that be allowed? Everyone has the right to enjoy the game don't they? I don't see why that sort of attitude should be tolerated.

 

Anyway not much of an issue here are bad players going to cry because a message comes up for people suggesting they might be?

They're probably aiming to kill who they're talking to anyway so...what's the issue?

 

Boo hoo it might be a bit harder to deceive people but it's already dull in that that's almost all there is in the game, it's not like negative gameplay styles are being rejected it's the positive ones that don't get a helping hand.

Why should everyone feel obligated to be a dick? It being 50/50 would be way more interesting. Currently if you don't immediately assume someone you see is going to attack well you haven't played the game long enough.

 

I don't see what people find so exciting about it all being murder and torture.

 

 

It should never be so black and white as you are bad or you are good karma but some indication that you would obviously get in real life would be fantastic for people who want to co-operate and survive. People who don't have plenty guns etc to kill people with, so what's the harm?