Poll - Why aren't people playing hardcore mode

[LeeVanSpliff 156]

Peeking only gives you an advantage if you have 3rd person while everyone else on the server is using 1st person.

 

Nah. As late as yesterday I spotted this angry kid approaching with an raised mosin. I was close to a fence, so my 3p cam went out to where I could see him. He was far from the fence, so his 3p cam couldn't go into a position where I could be seen.

[hleVqq 139]

I'll give you beans, that's a close as I can do. Sure  you can construct specific scenarios where it's an advantage to one player but over the course of weeks and months, sometimes you're the windscreen,sometimes you're the wasp. I'm just pointing out that if you're saying it's easymode for one side in a given situation then logically it's harder than hardcore when you're on the flipside of that same scenario.

The problem is that Regular allows you to have an "easy mode". Sure, you may be seen by someone else who had a high ground before you, but that's exactly what doesn't make sense, they shouldn't have an "easy mode" against you neither! Games shouldn't allow that, unless it's not very important (like in RPGs, etc.), Why would anyone prefer playing in such a mode? Probably in hopes of being the ones to have an easy mode against the others.

 

Wish the devs came to their senses and made 3PP a private hive-only thing.

[Lithium1056 45]

They already came to thier sense and made two seperate game modes

[theirongiant 200]

The problem is that Regular allows you to have an "easy mode". Sure, you may be seen by someone else who had a high ground before you, but that's exactly what doesn't make sense, they shouldn't have an "easy mode" against you neither! Games shouldn't allow that, unless it's not very important (like in RPGs, etc.), Why would anyone prefer playing in such a mode? Probably in hopes of being the ones to have an easy mode against the others.

 

Wish the devs came to their senses and made 3PP a private hive-only thing.

 

If it was such an advantage then the person in cover would win every firefight but they don't, not even close. The standard things like superior tactics, accuracy, numbers, weapons, positioning, experience absolutely crush peeking when it comes to determining who wins. It's effect on the outcome is entirely overplayed in these arguments, way beyond it's actual effect on gameplay.

[Lithium1056 45]

It's still all going to change. The Devs reportedly read these things and will see the camera needs to be adjusted. Bringing the third person camera in tighter solves this entire problem the only thing you remotely need it as high as it is right now is vehicles

[Grimey Rick 3417]

If it was such an advantage then the person in cover would win every firefight but they don't, not even close. The standard things like superior tactics, accuracy, numbers, weapons, positioning, experience absolutely crush peeking when it comes to determining who wins. It's effect on the outcome is entirely overplayed in these arguments, way beyond it's actual effect on gameplay.

 

I'm just going to throw this out there, and I know I'm not a rare exception, but every time that I've decided to post somewhere on normal and wait for people to stray into my path with an extremely advantageous position, I have not died. I have been forced to retreat the odd time, but even with that, I've been able to fall back and find a bush/tree/fence and laugh while people run right past me.

 

Clans are no better. There's the odd group of people who are very good together, but they're so few and far between it's a non-issue. They've usually got a counter-sniper on overwatch as they explore an area anyway, so as soon as you take one of them out he'll suppress you. But, again, you can just fall back to safety all thanks to 3rd person.

 

Anyway, I don't care what mode people play in, I'm simply stating facts. I've in no way lied or stretched the truth. All of these experiences happen on a daily basis. I'm 1,200 hours into the Standalone and nothing has changed. Hardcore is a more tense experience, while Regular is just for jumping on and fucking around.

[WrecklessMEDIC 129]

I'm just going to throw this out there, and I know I'm not a rare exception, but every time that I've decided to post somewhere on normal and wait for people to stray into my path with an extremely advantageous position, I have not died.

I'm 1,200 hours into the Standalone and nothing has changed.

Ever think the reason you haven't died is because you've spent 1200 hours in the game and are just really, really good at it? ;)

EDIT: Btw 1200 hours?! That's over 40 hours a week since the Alpha came out. I really hope that's not accurate.

Edited July 20, 2014 by WrecklessMEDIC

[Lithium1056 45]

Ever think the reason you haven't died is because you've spent 1200 hours in the game and are just really, really good at it? ;)

EDIT: Btw 1200 hours?! That's over 40 hours a week since the Alpha came out. I really hope that's not accurate.

Insomnia is a bitch!

Also I think this conversation has strayed into the "L33test" corner. And rather than just go "and that's why I play hardcore" it's becoming a pissing competition.

Again it's all subject to change, and to be perfectly honest I don't currently play hardcore (but will proly start so I have a throw away besides expbranch when my pals aren't on the server we play) because it doesn't have any disadvantage to me.

All my status conditions etc are the exact same as "core" currently. And even then the only time I personally use 3PP is this long hikes between point a and point be, simply just to enjoy the scenery. So it'll really be no different in it's current state (my lack of 3rd person use probably also explains a lot of my deaths) but at this stage everything is in flux what is a thing that causes headaches today might be a whole new beast tomorrow. And zombie Jesus willing when we get further along Hardcore will be just that. Increased chances of sickness less time between bright green status and dark green, faster dehydration as starvation. Less over all health the things I actually think of when I hear there is a "hardcore" game mode

[theirongiant 200]

 

 

The standard things like superior tactics, accuracy, numbers, weapons, positioning, experience absolutely crush peeking when it comes to determining who wins.

 

 

I'm just going to throw this out there, and I know I'm not a rare exception, but every time that I've decided to post somewhere on normal and wait for people to stray into my path with an extremely advantageous position, I have not died. I have been forced to retreat the odd time, but even with that, I've been able to fall back and find a bush/tree/fence and laugh while people run right past me.

 

Clans are no better. There's the odd group of people who are very good together, but they're so few and far between it's a non-issue. They've usually got a counter-sniper on overwatch as they explore an area anyway, so as soon as you take one of them out he'll suppress you. But, again, you can just fall back to safety all thanks to 3rd person.

 

Anyway, I don't care what mode people play in, I'm simply stating facts. I've in no way lied or stretched the truth. All of these experiences happen on a daily basis. I'm 1,200 hours into the Standalone and nothing has changed. Hardcore is a more tense experience, while Regular is just for jumping on and fucking around.

 

I'd say these have far more impact on the outcome than peeking, as it should. You put an experienced player in 1pp against a noob in 3pp and the experienced player is going to win 9 out of 10 times. I also don't care want mode people play in, I think the ability of the game to be tailored to suit the experience people want to be a strength and in keeping with the spirit of it's Arma roots. I'm just tired of the vast majority of the player base being denigrated as being little more than cheats when the reality is that it has very little impact on the game, the advantage of peeking is entirely overplayed in these arguments, being put forward as the sole reason most people play in 3pp. If/When they do something to prevent peeking the majority of players are still going to play 3pp because peeking isn't the reason that they play that way. By constantly railroading the argument down this path rather than asking questions about what the true problems are with 1pp it's doing nothing to improve the situation.

 

Anyway, I've said my bit, peace out.

Edited July 20, 2014 by theirongiant74

[Oyface 74]

What are you on about, OP? The only time I don't see full or almost full hardcore servers, is like 6 in the morning

[byrgesen 1341]

 

It doesn't aim to be as realistic as possible. It aims to be as AUTHENTIC as possible. If you want realism ask to be banned by Battle Eye when you die, because guess what. There's no respawns in real life.

 

Never go full retard dude.....

 

Its a video game, and even the most realistic video games does not grant you one life and then automaticly un-install it self afterwards -_-

Your argument could not be more invalid tbh.

Edited July 20, 2014 by Byrgesen

[blowurselfup 54]

I am going to open a bean factory just for Grimey Rick

 

B)

[leviathanapsu 94]

It's still all going to change. The Devs reportedly read these things and will see the camera needs to be adjusted. Bringing the third person camera in tighter solves this entire problem the only thing you remotely need it as high as it is right now is vehicles

 

Honestly, this would be a solid solution. It would keep all of the aspects of 3p that are important to someone like myself (You know, like peripheral vision and the like) while eliminating a lot of peaking (granted not all of it) from being a problem. A fixed camera instead of one I can rotate up and down would mean no more looking down over walls and such.There'd still be a little around corners, but not nearly as broken overall.

[kakysas666 191]

ITT: casual shitters making excuses for not being real men and playing hardcore only.

 

Best example is that they complain how 1pp is clunky and 3pp is somehow magically not clunky, while IT IS THE SAME. Literally, the same.

 

I guess in hardcore with their little experience they wouldn't get as many kills as in babycore mode in Berezino shitfest. Sniping in hardcore is a lot more dangerous and it is much harder to look for people if you lose them from your sight.

 

It isn't just a difference of 1pp vs 3pp. The combat differs, the camping differs and your paths you take across an open area differs between hardcore and babycore. Just yesterday I managed to avenge my friend who got shot by 2 shitters (they obviously were new to hardcore) so I sneaked up upon them, wasted one, the other one came right to me almost and didn't see me, I wasted him when he was feeling safe behind a pine tree.

 

In 3pp mode he would have seen me coming probably, but in 1pp, he assumed I was somewhere else.

Edited July 20, 2014 by MaxRain

[sabre05 351]

Never go full retard dude.....

 

Its a video game, and even the most realistic video games does not grant you one life and then automaticly un-install it self afterwards -_-

Your argument could not be more invalid tbh.

 

 

It's a little something called. Exaggeration. Guess you've not heard of it. But my point was it's cretinous to pursue realism in a game when realism just is not fun. Authenticity is, but realism is not. If I wanted realism. I'd do shit in real life. 

[DeatHTaX 1217]

I'd say these have far more impact on the outcome than peeking, as it should. You put an experienced player in 1pp against a noob in 3pp and the experienced player is going to win 9 out of 10 times. I also don't care want mode people play in, I think the ability of the game to be tailored to suit the experience people want to be a strength and in keeping with the spirit of it's Arma roots. I'm just tired of the vast majority of the player base being denigrated as being little more than cheats when the reality is that it has very little impact on the game, the advantage of peeking is entirely overplayed in these arguments, being put forward as the sole reason most people play in 3pp. If/When they do something to prevent peeking the majority of players are still going to play 3pp because peeking isn't the reason that they play that way. By constantly railroading the argument down this path rather than asking questions about what the true problems are with 1pp it's doing nothing to improve the situation.

 

Anyway, I've said my bit, peace out.

 

I think you have missed Rick's point again. The point he's making is that 3pp gives ridiculous advantage defensively over another player who is not sharing the same defensive postion. Why on earth are you still continuing to even debate this point? It's a fact. What about "I can see you and everything you're doing and you can't see me while I prepare to murder you" is a level playing field? It has nothing to do with a "skilled 1pp vs a noob in 3pp". The FACTS are that regular is an unbalanced gaming experience in combat, and HC is not that way in its ideal core mechanics. We're not saying anyone is a huge nub if they play regular, or you're 1337 if you play hardcore.

 

Just stating facts.

 

 

 If/When they do something to prevent peeking the majority of players are still going to play 3pp because peeking isn't the reason that they play that way.

Anyway, I've said my bit, peace out.

 

What you mean like removing 3pp completely? I don't really understand how you can remove peeking without ruining the flow of 3pp altogether. 

Edited July 20, 2014 by DeatHTaX

[Lithium1056 45]

Never go full retard dude.....

Its a video game, and even the most realistic video games does not grant you one life and then automaticly un-install it self afterwards -_-

Your argument could not be more invalid tbh.

Two words Steel Battalion, weighing in at a staggering 200$ coming packaged with it's own custom 40 button controller this one of a kind Mech game (and it's expansion/sequel which required you had the controller but did not come with one which is why I say expansion) literally deleted your save file if you failed to press the eject button before your Mech exploded! There was no checkpoint system unless you ejected, because it was on the xbox and people were still trying to figure out how to import/export save files it wasn't as simple as stowing a back up file on a flash drive. You either remember to eject or started over.

Oh wait that's pretty much the same system we currently have, it just doesn't take as long to get back to where we were after we die. (Not trying to troll but your comment totally brought that game to mind so I thought if share)

[Reg Park 160]

I play hardcore way more than regular, since I'm used to FPS like COD, feel much more comfortable in first person!

[theirongiant 200]

I think you have missed Rick's point again. The point he's making is that 3pp gives ridiculous advantage defensively over another player who is not sharing the same defensive postion. Why on earth are you still continuing to even debate this point? It's a fact. What about "I can see you and everything you're doing and you can't see me while I prepare to murder you" is a level playing field?

I guess I'm still debating the point because I disagree on how much peeking affects the game and that any slim advantage it confers is also a disadvantage an equal number of times over any extended amount of hours. The OP was about finding reasons why the vast majority of DayZ SA and DayZ mod players aren't playing hardcore, rather than actually discuss those reasons out comes the "peeking babycore" stuff and the discussion is just shut down. You're not going to encourage people to play 1pp is you ask them for their reasons for not liking it and then just scream "Liar!, it's because you love peeking" in their face every time, it's fucking pointless.

[DeatHTaX 1217]

I guess I'm still debating the point because I disagree on how much peeking affects the game and that any slim advantage it confers is also a disadvantage an equal number of times over any extended amount of hours. The OP was about finding reasons why the vast majority of DayZ SA and DayZ mod players aren't playing hardcore, rather than actually discuss those reasons out comes the "peeking babycore" stuff and the discussion is just shut down. You're not going to encourage people to play 1pp is you ask them for their reasons for not liking it and then just scream "Liar!, it's because you love peeking" in their face every time, it's fucking pointless.

 

Neither of those things have happened. Neither of us have yet to incriminate anyone, or you, for being "babycore" or whatever. All we have done is BLATANTLY STATE IN A FACTUAL MANNER FOR YOU the issue with *PP in regular vs. hardcore. So I don't even know why you need to state all of that.

 

And I'm sorry you fail to see the obvious advantages of being able to see someone over a wall when they can't see you at all in 3pp, and the disadvantages to the player who doesn't do nothing but hide in a building/camp behind a wall/etc.

[Zombie Milkman 167]

I do not play Hardcore for two reasons:

 

1) Even on a regular server I never use 3PP.  It eliminates some fear, and the fear is the main reason I play this game.

 

2) It is near impossible to get all my server choices on a hardcore server (normal day/night, ping under 50, 30-40 pop, and LOW server resets).  The only consistent Hardcore server in my time zone/server lag range does a server reset so often all I have to do is go to a high loot respawn point and just camp and get everything with little fear, little effort.  What a waste of time it renders this game.

[theirongiant 200]

Neither of those things have happened. Neither of us have yet to incriminate anyone, or you, for being "babycore" or whatever. All we have done is BLATANTLY STATE IN A FACTUAL MANNER FOR YOU the issue with *PP in regular vs. hardcore. So I don't even know why you need to state all of that.

 

And I'm sorry you fail to see the obvious advantages of being able to see someone over a wall when they can't see you at all in 3pp, and the disadvantages to the player who doesn't do nothing but hide in a building/camp behind a wall/etc.

Maybe you haven't but it's a constant feature of these conversations. I agree that there is an advantage I just think it's massively overstated it's balanced by the number of times you're on the flipside of the equation and that skill absolutely dwarfs it in determining the outcome of any given battle. You can put the contrary in all caps as much as you want or add the word fact but that doesn't make it so.

One thing I won't argue is that 1PP is more atmospheric, I'd rather play that way but for reasons I can't entirely put my finger on (and nothing to do with peeking) I find it unpleasant to play in 1PP. You can thumb your nose at my reasons or tell me I'm flat out wrong in my opinions but that's the way I (and the vast majority of players) find it. If the reasons for that can be identified and fixed then maybe more people would play hardcore.

[solodude23 649]

 

*IRT all of your posts*

 

Look, I've played a share of both modes and the difference it makes is - for lack of a better word - huge. The entire reason I changed from Normal to Hardcore was because EVERY firefight on Normal felt like it was based solely on who better utilized the 3PP camera. It was seriously a "dance of the cameras" with all players too afraid to expose themselves because they know their enemy would see them using their own 3PP camera. Once one of the players gets brave enough to advance -  BOOM - he gets killed due to the other guy using his 3rd person camera.

 

Can you not see how this destroys gameplay? It literally removes the effectiveness of sneaking and tactics, no matter how effective they are on their own. Being able to look around a corner without exposing yourself is a massive game changer that rewards those who abuse it. "The flipside of the equation" is something I don't even think about - because I don't want to use 3PP to look over walls and around corners because it feels unnatural and removes the tension - which is why I choose to play Hardcore.

 

In case you haven't seen the video, here's a good explanation of how 3PP effects gameplay.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7zoVIsIT2A&list=UUtIBkKQD1u7asfuRsqSLvYQ

Edited July 20, 2014 by solodude23

[DaveATR 7]

I personally don't play hardcore, because I enjoy the third person option. I don't get into altercations with players very frequently, haven't seen one in weeks at this point. I play for the aesthetics, as much as the game play. I enjoy lookin at my toon, and his gear.

[WrecklessMEDIC 129]

The FACTS are that regular is an unbalanced gaming experience in combat, and HC is not that way in its ideal core mechanics.

Just stating facts.

Those are opinions, not facts. ;)