The ONLY Realistic Way to Prevent Deathmatching: Make DayZ a Living Hell

[The Burned Man 20]

I seriously want this thread to come up as a serious suggestion for the Devs to think about in the long run. This is a zombie apocalypse SIMULATOR for fuck's sake' date=' not just another damn game to eat cheetos to.

[/quote']

It doesn't matter what caused an apocalypse, the outcome is always the same, back to tribal state, which means people will tear everything that is not part of their tribe apart unless there is enough room and resources for everyone.

Basic human nature. It's why we turned out so well.

[Time Glitch 453]

I seriously want this thread to come up as a serious suggestion for the Devs to think about in the long run. This is a zombie apocalypse SIMULATOR for fuck's sake' date=' not just another damn game to eat cheetos to.

[/quote']

It doesn't matter what caused an apocalypse, the outcome is always the same, back to tribal state, which means people will tear everything that is not part of their tribe apart unless there is enough room and resources for everyone.

Basic human nature. It's why we turned out so well.

Keep saying that word...Tribe.

Right now, it's so easy to survive...Nearly everyone is on their own. This shouldn't be possible. One man vs the zombie apocalypse should be torn to shreds unless they are INCREDIBLY careful and good at survival. Right now, anyone can do it.

That's why the difficulty should go up. So people form small groups...Tribes if you will...And take care of their own.

Isn't that more exciting than everyone for themselves, like a damn FFA Deathmatch game?

[The Burned Man 20]

All you would do is eliminate solo play and make a "FFA" deathmatch into a team deathmatch with multiple teams on one map.

And there are already a lot of small groups playing the game.

I'm sure the majority is playing with at least one partner, because it gets pretty boring alone after a while.

The game was always like this. Near the coast you were usually killed by lone bandits, cities are deathtraps, if you moved inland to the better loot you had to deal with groups that claimed the NW airfield or devils castle etc.

What the game really needs is a better way of communicating, the direct voice and chat was broken so long, most people don't even know it exists.

Oh and another thing, were you already playing when rocket released that broken patch that increased the zombie spawn rate to insane amounts?

We already had the living nightmare and it didn't stop people from killing each other at all.

[beeek00 1]

Seems to be a lot of agreement in this thread, so let's not debate the obvious. I've only logged 24 hours in the DayZ world so far, so take my thoughts for what they're worth...

In the event of a RL zombie outbreak scenario, I would not be an anti-social murderer by nature, however I would revert to that style at any moment in 1\20th of a second without remorse to protect the lives of my loved ones. :heart:

Suggestion 1 >> Unless DayZ gives me loved ones to protect or a reason to work together you may expect little from me beyond a well placed sniper bullet coming from high in the tree line in the head of a zombie near you, or your head as it may amuse me.

With a text apology about seeing you on the other side first before you go, of course :D

Suggestion 2 >> Infected women, children, babies and animals.

Suggestion 3 >> The ability to melee with a stick or rock if weaponless.

[logan23 118]

I agree 110 % with the Original Poster!!

Great Post!

[Powell (DayZ) 734]

I agree 110 % with the Original Poster!!

Great Post!

indeed. *brofist*

[Kolchak (DayZ) 5]

Keep saying that word...Tribe.

Right now' date=' it's so easy to survive...Nearly everyone is on their own. This shouldn't be possible. One man vs the zombie apocalypse should be torn to shreds unless they are INCREDIBLY careful and good at survival. Right now, anyone can do it.

That's why the difficulty should go up. So people form small groups...Tribes if you will...And take care of their own.

Isn't that more exciting than everyone for themselves, like a damn FFA Deathmatch game?

[/quote']

Actually this makes absolutely no sense. Ever wonder why the people in zombie movies who always go to the "Safe Zone" die a horrible death? Cause it's NEVER a good idea. Zombies are predators, predators move in game trails and stay where they can get food. More people = more food, more people = more noise, more people = easier to be seen. Back when the game first started, every time I tried helping strangers, they were a bigger problem than the zombies were. Cause none of them had discipline or knew how to keep from being seen. I'd tell them to crouch and slow down, they'd do it for a minute or so, then start running again. Survival is not a matter of "He who has the most guns wins" It's a matter of he who is smartest wins. I've snuck up on a sniper on the hill above elektro taken the M4 from his own backpack and shot him with it before. If I had a group of 2 or 3 people, it would have been much harder, cause we would have had a bigger chance of him hearing us approach, instead all I had to do was wait until I heard him start firing to move. Having a bigger group only guarantees an easier time surviving if you don't mind being exposed to other groups and zombies because your goal is to shoot everything you see. If you're trying to be stealthy, a big group is just a big target.

[Lukio (DayZ) 24]

I seriously want this thread to come up as a serious suggestion ...

Why is this in in general discussion anyway? Imo there is no real solution against bandit-ism and its a necessity to have a certain degree of uncertainty when interacting with other players, so to me people who want to be bandits & murderers are perfectly fine to do so.

The only thing that may need a change is the KoS issue, many people who shoot other players aren't even real bandits, they've just learned that currently its safer to shoot than to try to socialize.

It will also take a very long time to turn around these personal experiences, as the human brain tends to have a knack for negative experiences.

[AWad 0]

Making the game harder will increase the murder chance...

If I have NO food and I see you, why wouldn't I kill you in hopes that you had some?

Your argument doesn't make sense, if you made the game harder then people will 100% murder on sight.

If this was a real world scenario and you saw another person with food and a gun. You would murder him for his gun and food without question. The odds of another human being "nice" and giving up a precious resource is almost non existent.

Countries go to war over resources right now and we aren't even in a tight spot. What do you think would happen if food and water were almost impossible to find?

If Day Z was harder and food, water, ammo, etc were even less common. I would probably abandon my group I'm with and kill everything I needed to, to live.

Harder = More Murders...plain and simple.

[bad_mojo (DayZ) 1204]

Making the game harder will increase the murder chance...

If I have NO food and I see you' date=' why wouldn't I kill you in hopes that you had some?

Your argument doesn't make sense, if you made the game harder then people will 100% murder on sight.

If this was a real world scenario and you saw another person with food and a gun. You would murder him for his gun and food without question. The odds of another human being "nice" and giving up a precious resource is almost non existent.

Countries go to war over resources right now and we aren't even in a tight spot. What do you think would happen if food and water were almost impossible to find?

If Day Z was harder and food, water, ammo, etc were even less common. I would probably abandon my group I'm with and kill everything I needed to, to live.

Harder = More Murders...plain and simple.

[/quote']

You're missing the point. If I'm struggling to stay alive by myself, I'm not going to kill someone to get their beans and gun if I already have beans and a gun. I'm going to try to get them to help me survive. Other players become loot. A limited resource that is needed to survive.

If it's next to impossible to stay alive by yourself, but easier in groups. Then we'll see a whole different social game.

[Hoplite17 1]

Keep saying that word...Tribe.

Right now' date=' it's so easy to survive...Nearly everyone is on their own. This shouldn't be possible. One man vs the zombie apocalypse should be torn to shreds unless they are INCREDIBLY careful and good at survival. Right now, anyone can do it.

That's why the difficulty should go up. So people form small groups...Tribes if you will...And take care of their own.

Isn't that more exciting than everyone for themselves, like a damn FFA Deathmatch game?

[/quote']

Actually this makes absolutely no sense. Ever wonder why the people in zombie movies who always go to the "Safe Zone" die a horrible death? Cause it's NEVER a good idea. Zombies are predators, predators move in game trails and stay where they can get food. More people = more food, more people = more noise, more people = easier to be seen. Back when the game first started, every time I tried helping strangers, they were a bigger problem than the zombies were. Cause none of them had discipline or knew how to keep from being seen. I'd tell them to crouch and slow down, they'd do it for a minute or so, then start running again. Survival is not a matter of "He who has the most guns wins" It's a matter of he who is smartest wins. I've snuck up on a sniper on the hill above elektro taken the M4 from his own backpack and shot him with it before. If I had a group of 2 or 3 people, it would have been much harder, cause we would have had a bigger chance of him hearing us approach, instead all I had to do was wait until I heard him start firing to move. Having a bigger group only guarantees an easier time surviving if you don't mind being exposed to other groups and zombies because your goal is to shoot everything you see. If you're trying to be stealthy, a big group is just a big target.

People die in zombie movies when they go to safe zones to keep the movie interesting >.> Movies definitely aren't used to base reality on. And you can't think you're the only smart person in the whole entire game. There's other people who can think. You just met a bunch of new players or something. Humans are social animals, it's wired into them (this is psych/sociology 101). Humans would group and work together if a zombie apocalypse happened.

What needs to happen is exactly what the op said, limited the tool-belt, limited amount of items in inventory, and limit the amount of resources. This way people will need to work together. Only have room for a knife and an axe? Better team up with the guy with matches. Not enough room for medical supplies? Better team up with someone who can carry around medical supplies. In real life, people will team up and work with what their are good at (medicine, farming, scouting, etc).

Because I believe (and I'm sure others do to) some sort of skill tree should not be implemented, the only way to add this realism element is make people not be able to carry everything they need. As it is right now, the fact I can carry a primary weapon, secondary weapon, tons of ammo, tons of tools, tons of medical supplies, and tons of food/water is ridiculous. I'm kinda starting to think that limiting resources might not be even needed, if we simply limit inventory space. You can still lone wolf it up though. Need some medical supplies? Go into town and find someone to trade with. No need to group up, just some good ol' fashion bartering.

[Skvid 3]

I dont know if its possible or was suggested before, but if the skill system was implemented, it would offer diversity for the players. The skills would level in a simmilar way they do in elder scrolls games, when you do stuff of some sort you increase it. I.e bandaging will increase your first aid skill, and shooting the sidearm will make you more profficient in it (accuracy, reload speed, faster lining of sights after sprinting, lesser penalty if you have injured arm(s), i dont know if the current blood ammount effects your aim, but if such feature was implemented (which i think is cool by itself) the players skill in the sidarm proficiency would reduce the penalty as well).

There could also be textbooks and magazines scattered around the world that would work the way they do in fallout2. You read (learn) it and gain permament bonus to whatever the textbook is about.

These features would offer diversity among players, and making some items require high skill (blood transfusion being one of them that only highly skilled docs could perform) would make those characters a high valued teammates. If you are a lone wolf bandit in need of medical aid you might think twice before killing another player, maybe he has the skills you dont and he can help you... And no, killing him and eating his brain wont grant you the knowledge he posseses :D

[Naykon (DayZ) 25]

I'm all for more incentives to co-operate, but making the world harsher will make me kill you more.... especially if I can't find food or water

[mcf 0]

to the OP, nice thoughts and effort. However, I think that would actually create more pvp. What needs to be done is not adding more items and not making them rare. But infact, making items harder to acquire in terms of dodging zombies. At the moment you can solo farm all items to survive very easy. If we make it so that large buildings can only be farmed coop...that would encourage coop play. Lonewolves can still farm houses/shacks/barns etc. Coop play needs to be encouraged, but not through making items rare.

[Al Bundy (DayZ) 0]

As long as it's harder but POSSIBLE to survive solo, I'd be fine with these changes.

However if it's impossible to solo, it's just going to backfire. I'm normally pretty passive but if I was unable to enter a town to get food on my own, I'd become the hyper-aggressive shoot on sight player you're trying to prevent.

[boneboys 7988]

Some people have asked that this be moved to the Suggestion Forum.

I don't see any.

+ infected

- food & ammo

are not suggestions but simple tweaks, that in my humble opinion will break the delicate balance that the game has in its present state.

Being infected is already in place and anti-biotics are very very rare.

The enviroment is already harsh, hence the temperture system.

Now we all know that some things do not work as intended at the moment (Alpha).

Now, as a player I really do enjoy the unexpected encounters when moving around as a free agent, I have let one guy go through my Alice_Packs to take blood bags for his mate, another guy gave me a compass.

Yesterday a guy helped me out in a barn and then went his own way, I asked him if he needed anything, "no thanks" said he and off he went.

I've been in a small group of people 3/4 + myself and that was ok but it was only then that I became aggressive towards other people !!!

So, trying to force people to work together using the OP suggestions will not work, as far as I am concerned.

I write as a player, not as the Mean Mod Boneboys.

Now if Time Gliche would like to compose a list I will move the Thread to the Suggestion Forum.

Thanks.

[Cormac McCarthy 15]

i wanna play lone wolf, and be able to get anything a group can get.

[jayarr916 15]

Making things scarce would still make people kill other people for their things. Thus, making it harder will also move people towards killing other players for their gear to make it easier.

There isn't really a solution to PvP. You either know someone who you can team up with or you have a 1% chance of finding someone that won't actually shoot you in the back.

[Hoplite17 1]

If everyone had everything they needed, people would still shoot on sight. The op isn't trying to keep people from pvping, just trying to stop shooting on sight for no reason and some cooperation. Making resources scarce will stop people killing just for lolz and will encourage trading and keep people from wasting ammo to shoot every single person they come by. Also, the other half of the op's post is about adding in game mechanics to have people cooperate, which will very well encourage cooperation. The op isn't trying to "solve" pvp, isn't stopping people from being lone wolfs, and isn't forcing people to cooperate.

[Broviet_Chaz 0]

PREFACE (Apparently this is necessary)

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I am NOT calling for the removal of PvP. I simply want to see there be some INCENTIVE for being friendly' date=' while simultaneously maintaining the goal of the mod: A hardcore zombie apocalypse survival simulator. Bandits are a part of this game, and they should ALWAYS be a part of this game.

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========================[/quote']

I think we can all agree that there is simply too much murder right now. There's no incentive not to kill. We've tried bandit skins, getting rid of global chat...All of these are very gamey solutions. And none of them have worked.

Here's what I'm proposing, Rocket and team. Rather than come up with some mechanic to help out one side or the other, or do some kind of balancing act...Do something different. The reason we don't work together is because we can survive alone. The reason we shoot on sight is because we have nothing to gain from teaming up.

So let's set the world on fire. Let's watch it burn. Let us feel fear; That same fear we all felt when our boots first landed on the shores of Chernarus.

Let's Make DayZ a Living Nightmare.

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You already start with next to nothing. Good. That sets the table. Canned Food is scarce. Canteens are as precious as gold.Weapons are a luxury, and ammo doesn't last long. Finding the tools you need to start a fire and cook a meal? Good luck. And if you don't find food or water, both of which are incredibly scarce? Enjoy dehydration, or starvation. You won't just die from some ticking blood bar. Your vision will blur, you'll be tortured by the sounds of your stomach aching for food. You'll barely be able to keep crawling forward. You'll pass out from exhaustion, and die curled up on the ground, without so much as a whimper.

The Zeds are more numerous. They prowl the streets of cities in packs, and must be avoided if you hope to survive. The Zombies have begun to migrate to forests, and herds of them roam the countryside. Nowhere is safe from the infected, and their numbers continue to grow. Areas that have been densely populated with infected for a long period of time are now more difficult to breathe in. Death stinks the air, and if you spend too much time there, you might get sick. You'll cough if you don't have a surgical mask, or at least a scarf to wrap around your nose and mouth.

And what of your injuries? That scratch could get infected if left untreated. You'll need sterilization materials, such as rubbing alcohol or peroxide. That last bout with the Infected didn't break your leg, but you sure as hell can't run on it. Maybe you got lucky and it hit your arm instead. Can't use your primary with only one good arm. Morphine isn't going to heal those broken bones of yours...Only give you the ability to walk on it for a period of time. And if you keep using Morphine? Well, you'll become addicted. Then you'll need it if you don't want the shakes, hallucinations, and sickness.

The environment is unforgiving and harsh. The coast is plagued with deep fogs, and ripping coastal winds that chill you to the bone. If you manage to make it off the coast, beware the sun. Running too long in the sun can cause heat stroke and exhaustion. If you take refuge in the mountains, be prepared for a drop in temperature, and cold wet nights. Further north, expect cloudy skies and torrential rain which chills you if left unchecked.

You're only one human being against a world that is designed to kill you. So how do you survive?

You MUST cooperate.

Maybe that scarce can of beans, or that canteen of water, can satiate 2 people rather than one. Maybe a pair of eyes covering your six increases your chances of survival when scavenging in an infested city. Maybe when you can't walk on your leg, a friend could take you on their shoulder so you can walk again. Maybe someone could set and splint that broken leg of yours. Maybe someone can bring that fever down by tending to you while you're sick and unable to take care of yourself. Maybe being within close proximity to others makes you share body heat when the temperature drops. Maybe that other person has the matches, and you've got the hatchet.

Maybe, when the world is a living hell...Other people are your only hope to survive.

It's just a thought...But I think it's the only way to keep DayZ from becoming Deathmatch + Zombies.

P.S. Might I remind everyone that this is ALPHA, and this is exactly the time when we should be trying insane, crazy stuff like this. You don't get that chance when a game is released, or even in Beta stage. We should be doing this NOW, just to see how it works.

Edit: Perfect description as to why bandits should love these changes...Written by a bandit:

Love your ideas' date=' and these are things bandits should support as well. I don't think this would encroach on pvp as much as some of you think it will. It'll just make it more meaningful which is just as important to scumbag bandits like myself. Right now killing feels cheap and meaningless, it's like a quick hit that's over way too quickly and has no greater impact. Bunch of lonewolves running around trying to get the drop on other lonewolves. If people are grouping up it's cause they're usually friends on voip and do it to have fun, not because they actually need each other. If one drops, oh well just run up from the coast and meet up and go loot/kill some more.

But imagine you snipe the medic on a supply teams group. They can't survive properly without their medic, and there's no way he can come back from the coastal spawn without major assistance because of all the roaming zombie packs.

Sure you could have joined the group and had an easier time in the game. But you decide to stick to your bandit ways and kill others anyways. That's a meaningful kill cause you've murdered not just a bag of loot but a human being that could have made your life easier.

Or you've found a fortified settlement and realize killing everyone would be stupid since they're continually bringing in new supplies, which you feel obligated to take. So instead of sitting up on a hill and killing everyone with a sniper rifle, you decide to start stalking small groups or solo runners. You easily dispatch them for their supplies that you can live off of. But eventually the settlement starts sending out teams to flush you out. Luckily you know the surrounding forests well and how to hide from humans and zombies. Crawling around in the rain, in the dark, in the mud cause that's how a true bandit should live. Not like you pansies that think loading up a dmr and sitting around elektro all day for lulz makes you a bandit.

- Medical situations can seriously make this game much more cooperative. Have situations where you need to carry/vehicle someone back to a medical tent at a base.

- Have more medical events that require a second or multiple people.

- Limit the amount of tools you can carry to like 3.

[/quote']

I am sorry but this idea is terrible. you propose that in order to prevent murder and encourage cooperation you want the game to be harder? that can, in fact have the exact opposite effect. I already have a small group I play the game with and in the world you suggest I would shoot everyone on sight who was not with me, period. Why should I risk it? Why would i even CONSIDER letting the poor sap in front of me live when he could so easily screw me and my group over OR better yet have some of the necessary materials needed to survive? Why should my and my friends co-operate with this fellow when we could simply shoot him and take that equipment for ourselves?

This situation is already present in Day Z but if it becomes even more hardcore there is a chance that it could have the exact opposite of the desired effect.

[beeek00 1]

Agree plus infected and minus supplies simply can not work and would be adverse.

I was thinking of more complex things, like mission oriented goals which endow specific skills, NP characters to keep alive i.e. a simulated family and facilitating large scale operations like securing a small town and the supporting mobilization of machinery and equipment.

In other words, starting to rebuild the society which was lost.

These are ideas which could only be implemented by the dev team with extensive core development.

Realism of ANY kind, including the limiting of weight carried is always a good idea imo.

[Jemoeder 51]

Bring a decent Direct communication ,

With voice like 2-300 meters not 80 >_>

So you can communicat from further and safer place which can result in teaming up

[Time Glitch 453]

Bring a decent Direct communication ' date='

With voice like 2-300 meters not 80 >_>

So you can communicat from further and safer place which can result in teaming up

[/quote']

This is pretty important.

Most encounters are NOT at close range, and if they are it's usually non-diplomatic. Someone almost always shoots.

[BloodPhoenix 0]

He's absolutely right. Make it a living hell. Make out lives hard. This game is now for the deathmatchers looking to suckle on a teet, this game is for those trying to survive a zombie apocalypse.

+1 and amen.

[Exectah 0]

Sharing body heat... Sounds gay to me. :shy: