Ghillie suit, rangefinder ?

[gibonez 3633]

Heh. That has been a problem with every game since sniper rifles were part of gaming.

...And don't link Ace mod, I've seen it already, and I agree with you.  :thumbsup:

 

Yup.

 

Sniping is insanely easy most of the time.

 

That can be fixed though with lots of complexity. and by simulating real life.

[nazar.nk90@gmail.com 11]

Two things:

1. We're going to assume zombies tell the difference between the living and other zombies via scent, so no go on the ghilie making you invis to zed.

 

2. If you're so sick of seeing people run across the NWAF, why wouldn't you pretend you're a man for a little and engage those guys at close range instead of relying on chickensh*t sniper tactics?

Two things:

 

1. I'm going to assume zombies don't have a sense of smell...

 

2. Just a little reply on what you said...imagine you having a choice IRL (if you were in a combat zone) of finding a sniper to kill an ememy or actually charging your enemy down and having a large chance of yourself dying. What would you do ? Would you be a man and go die ? Or wait for a sniper? DAYZ is realistic combat and surviving simulator. This isn't Call of duty...in real life you camp and camp and camp some more...whatever prevents your ass from getting shot.

[Katana67 2907]

1. I'm going to assume zombies don't have a sense of smell...

 

Hasn't been rendered in-game as of yet, although might be an interesting idea. I remember reading a cool 28 Days Later comic collection a while back, and one of the storylines noted that the infected used certain scents to home in on survivors. Could be an interesting consequence if you try and disinfect yourself, or apply certain items to your character which make the player more susceptible to zombie aggro.

[hefeweizen 254]

Two things:

 

1. I'm going to assume zombies don't have a sense of smell...

 

2. Just a little reply on what you said...imagine you having a choice IRL (if you were in a combat zone) of finding a sniper to kill an ememy or actually charging your enemy down and having a large chance of yourself dying. What would you do ? Would you be a man and go die ? Or wait for a sniper? DAYZ is realistic combat and surviving simulator. This isn't Call of duty...in real life you camp and camp and camp some more...whatever prevents your ass from getting shot.

1. In what zombie literature/movie/television series is this the case? Any?

2. You'd probably have to get right up on your target because in real life sniping is a helluva lot harder than it is in any video game. But since it is a video game and therefore sniping = easy mode, the devs should do whatever they can to balance combat toward close and medium range encounters.

[hefeweizen 254]

Hasn't been rendered in-game as of yet, although might be an interesting idea. I remember reading a cool 28 Days Later comic collection a while back, and one of the storylines noted that the infected used certain scents to home in on survivors. Could be an interesting consequence if you try and disinfect yourself, or apply certain items to your character which make the player more susceptible to zombie aggro.

That would actually be an awesome idea, having to bathe or mask your scent otherwise your aggro range for zed would be larger. In addition to 28 days later zombies, Romero and Walking Dead zombies also smell their prey. But 28 Days Later zombies are the closest to DayZ zombies so I'd go by that standard.

[EvilTigerAce 131]

Idea to make improvised ghillie suits hard to craft:

 

5 wooden sticks needed. (Combine wooden stick to get doubled stick, then again, again, etc.)

 

Then attach the coupled sticks to a coat or jacket. (hoodie or shirt is not possible)

-attach them with rope or duct tape or something else... not sure about this

 

Then add 2 burlap sacks, this will make a Improvised Camo Jacket or Improvised Camo Coat (so your blue coat will transform into some kind of beige one, with sticks and burlap parts)

 

Then add 5 stacks leaves or 5 stacks of grass (you can get these from bushes/fields)

- Leaves will make an autumn ghillie suit (brown/orange), grass will make a summer suit (green)

 

You now made an Improvised Ghillie Suit! :D

 

edit

You can do the same with pants (no jeans!), but then with 3 stacks of leaves/grass, 3 sticks and 2 burlap sacks.

 

Nobody seems to care, lol.

[hombrecz 832]

It is not too terrible yet.

 

The weapons added in the game thus far are civilian heavy focused and nothing is jarring yet.

 

We have a heavy focus on hunting and civilian firearms weapons I would expect in the Czech Republic where the weapon inspiration is taking place.

 

More russian and russian military weapons are sure to come they are just not finished yet.

 

The AKM, AK74 and the SVD are on their way.

 

Hope you are right.

Wish we had AK74 (or vz58) from the very beginning though, but whatever.

[gibonez 3633]

Hope you are right.

Wish we had AK74 (or vz58) from the very beginning though, but whatever.

 

I am sure they will both come soon.

[nazar.nk90@gmail.com 11]

1. In what zombie literature/movie/television series is this the case? Any?

2. You'd probably have to get right up on your target because in real life sniping is a helluva lot harder than it is in any video game. But since it is a video game and therefore sniping = easy mode, the devs should do whatever they can to balance combat toward close and medium range encounters.

 I don't know where people get this idea that "sniping is hard IRL"...it's completely false. Sniping WAS hard irl 60 years ago. With today's technology and weaponry you can easily hit a target in no wind situation at 1000 yards with a good weapon system. There are even scopes that zero for you...and you don't have to do anything but pull the trigger. A child can understand the mil-dot system or how the SVD PU score works it's nothing too difficult to learn. Even I can hit an 8 inch steel plate at 400 yards with my 5.56 AR which means I should be able to hit someone with an m4 across the airfield first shot in DAYZ. In my opinion the only things that should affect how accurately you shoot is your state of health (if you're in pain or have broken limbs), weather (high winds and what not). I think broken scopes should still shoot consistently but not on zero...and not have a random chance of going anywhere. 

 

Also since zombies don't exist and are known to be pretty much brain dead from all the fictional movies and books...I don't see how senses like smell and eyesight and hearing are working for them because you need good brain activity for that. I think zombies should have a good sense of hearing and low sense of vision during day time. And no sense of vision during the night. Sense of smell should only come into effect if you are 5 meters or closer to the zombie.

[gibonez 3633]

 I don't know where people get this idea that "sniping is hard IRL"...it's completely false. Sniping WAS hard irl 60 years ago. With today's technology and weaponry you can easily hit a target in no wind situation at 1000 yards with a good weapon system. There are even scopes that zero for you...and you don't have to do anything but pull the trigger. A child can understand the mil-dot system or how the SVD PU score works it's nothing too difficult to learn. Even I can hit an 8 inch steel plate at 400 yards with my 5.56 AR which means I should be able to hit someone with an m4 across the airfield first shot in DAYZ. In my opinion the only things that should affect how accurately you shoot is your state of health (if you're in pain or have broken limbs), weather (high winds and what not). I think broken scopes should still shoot consistently but not on zero...and not have a random chance of going anywhere. 

 

Also since zombies don't exist and are known to be pretty much brain dead from all the fictional movies and books...I don't see how senses like smell and eyesight and hearing are working for them because you need good brain activity for that. I think zombies should have a good sense of hearing and low sense of vision during day time. And no sense of vision during the night. Sense of smell should only come into effect if you are 5 meters or closer to the zombie.

 

What makes it easy in dayz is that the game gives you your dope right on the screen.

 

Simply press page up and your character somehow magically knows how many minutes to dial his scope so his bullet drops at whatever range he needs it at.

 

Adding wind + MOA and or MRad elevation adjustments is enough difficulty to at least mimic real life in game.

 

BTW hitting stuff at 1000 yards even without wind still takes skill and practice. Doesn't matter what weapon system you use it requires skill.

[IamDinner 28]

 I don't know where people get this idea that "sniping is hard IRL"...it's completely false. Sniping WAS hard irl 60 years ago. With today's technology and weaponry you can easily hit a target in no wind situation at 1000 yards with a good weapon system. There are even scopes that zero for you...and you don't have to do anything but pull the trigger. A child can understand the mil-dot system or how the SVD PU score works it's nothing too difficult to learn. Even I can hit an 8 inch steel plate at 400 yards with my 5.56 AR which means I should be able to hit someone with an m4 across the airfield first shot in DAYZ. In my opinion the only things that should affect how accurately you shoot is your state of health (if you're in pain or have broken limbs), weather (high winds and what not). I think broken scopes should still shoot consistently but not on zero...and not have a random chance of going anywhere. 

 

Also since zombies don't exist and are known to be pretty much brain dead from all the fictional movies and books...I don't see how senses like smell and eyesight and hearing are working for them because you need good brain activity for that. I think zombies should have a good sense of hearing and low sense of vision during day time. And no sense of vision during the night. Sense of smell should only come into effect if you are 5 meters or closer to the zombie.

 

I am not sure where you live but there is never no wind where I live.

 

Having said that most modern tech that helps sniping basically does.

 

The true skill lies in being able to get undetected into a tree outside the drug lords house in a heavily guarded area of some country have the patience and fortitude to wait three days with almost no sleep then do you job and come home alive.

 

 

edited out the vulgarity. Decided it wasn't needed

Edited April 27, 2014 by IamDinner

[xalienax 621]

That is fine but there needs to be a realistic encumbrance model to go with the ASslown 50s.

 

There is no way in hell you should be able to carry a .50 calibre military sniper weapon with a full pack and mountains of kit and still be effectively mobile.

 

I preached this throughout the mod. Make the wannabe snipers choose. Overly complex, heavy as fuck long gun with minimal ammo or a backpack and kit.

 

Not both.

 

Simple and effective fix. There is a reason 50s were taken out of the mod. Ridiculous engagement ranges pure and simple. There has to be some semblance of gameplay balance decisions made, even in DayZ.

Best explination/solution ever.

 

In the post-apoclaypse people will factionalize and militarize in groups pure and simple its been seen in ever major societal collapse in history. Some times along racial lines, along religious lines, blood lines, etc but you always end up with factions led by warloards fighting over dwindling resources using those previously stated reasons to justify continues violence in an attempt to hoarde resources.

 

With that said, the idea that "this isn't a military sim" goes out the window. Military equipment will last for some time especially guns and land vehicles like Hummvees, trucks, even APCs. those wont require extensive maitenances while just sitting around. the problem, as you pointed out is the "gamey" slot based system used for the mod. Rater- let players have effectively infinate slots and the limits restricted by max VOLUME in a compartment and total weight of kit. the heavier you are the shorter you can travel before needing to stop and rest, use more watter, and move slower. if we do all that extremely OP weapons can be in as rare spawns- but if you want any kind of defensive capability you'll have to work as a GROUP. let people have thier M107s- and since they can't carry anything else without passing out after 3 mins of jogging let them also convince people to carry thier food, water, medical, and extra ammo while sittring around guarding the sniper who is only carrying his one man shoulder arty.

[IamDinner 28]

Best explination/solution ever.

 

In the post-apoclaypse people will factionalize and militarize in groups pure and simple its been seen in ever major societal collapse in history. Some times along racial lines, along religious lines, blood lines, etc but you always end up with factions led by warloards fighting over dwindling resources using those previously stated reasons to justify continues violence in an attempt to hoarde resources.

 

With that said, the idea that "this isn't a military sim" goes out the window. Military equipment will last for some time especially guns and land vehicles like Hummvees, trucks, even APCs. those wont require extensive maitenances while just sitting around. the problem, as you pointed out is the "gamey" slot based system used for the mod. Rater- let players have effectively infinate slots and the limits restricted by max VOLUME in a compartment and total weight of kit. the heavier you are the shorter you can travel before needing to stop and rest, use more watter, and move slower. if we do all that extremely OP weapons can be in as rare spawns- but if you want any kind of defensive capability you'll have to work as a GROUP. let people have thier M107s- and since they can't carry anything else without passing out after 3 mins of jogging let them also convince people to carry thier food, water, medical, and extra ammo while sittring around guarding the sniper who is only carrying his one man shoulder arty.

 

Isn't factionalizing and militarizing exactly what we already do in normal everyday world life?

[xalienax 621]

Isn't factionalizing and militarizing exactly what we already do in normal everyday world life?

Yes it would just be de centralized in the apocalypse.

 

literally neighbors shootign eachother over bread based on which side they went with...

[LimeMobber 47]

Why would a ghillie suit even work against DayZ zombies? According to the game zombies do not see well, they hunt you by smell and hearing.

 

A ghillie suilt will make you sweat more so you will SMELL more which may make you stand out even more to zombies.

 

On top of that I doubt you can move as fast in one (in real life) nor move quickly in one for as long as someone  not in one. So a zombie will likely chase you down easier

 

In addition, the suit likely muffles your hearing, and limits your peripheral vision. So while your stinking up the joint wearing one your less likely to notice the zombie that is ambling towards you from the right before he starts smacking you.

 

 

Then there is one final point. Where would you find one? Suits like this are used by hunters and snipers. So you would find one in a hardcore hunters house, a military base, or a hunting/camping store. The hunters house is likely to be empty, a hardcore hunter left with all his gear the instant he saw zombies and he is maybe 2% of the population anyway. The military base will only have them if a sniper was part of a unit stationed there, snipers are not a common part of the military so their numbers will be way low. Which leaves hunting/camping stores and those are going to be completely looted within hours of a zombie apocalypse.

 

So you have a fairly useless piece of gear that will be very hard to find and only good if you want to murder fellow survivors. In a real zombie apocalypse where the zombies are like DayZ zombies and hunt by sound and smell, not vision, being found with a ghillie suit could be  death sentence since it could mean you were hunting your fellow man. I know that if they add it to the game it will join the PayDay mask on my list of items that if I see you wearing one I will shoot you instantly no matter what you are doing.

[liquidsnake 275]

Why would a ghillie suit even work against DayZ zombies? According to the game zombies do not see well, they hunt you by smell and hearing.

 

A ghillie suilt will make you sweat more so you will SMELL more which may make you stand out even more to zombies.

 

On top of that I doubt you can move as fast in one (in real life) nor move quickly in one for as long as someone  not in one. So a zombie will likely chase you down easier

 

In addition, the suit likely muffles your hearing, and limits your peripheral vision. So while your stinking up the joint wearing one your less likely to notice the zombie that is ambling towards you from the right before he starts smacking you.

 

 

Then there is one final point. Where would you find one? Suits like this are used by hunters and snipers. So you would find one in a hardcore hunters house, a military base, or a hunting/camping store. The hunters house is likely to be empty, a hardcore hunter left with all his gear the instant he saw zombies and he is maybe 2% of the population anyway. The military base will only have them if a sniper was part of a unit stationed there, snipers are not a common part of the military so their numbers will be way low. Which leaves hunting/camping stores and those are going to be completely looted within hours of a zombie apocalypse.

 

So you have a fairly useless piece of gear that will be very hard to find and only good if you want to murder fellow survivors. In a real zombie apocalypse where the zombies are like DayZ zombies and hunt by sound and smell, not vision, being found with a ghillie suit could be  death sentence since it could mean you were hunting your fellow man. I know that if they add it to the game it will join the PayDay mask on my list of items that if I see you wearing one I will shoot you instantly no matter what you are doing.

We don't know what season Chernarus is in as of right now, so you can't say wearing warm clothing is a bad thing. And even if it is summer, it doesn't get all too hot in eastern bloc countries (20-25 celsius if it's really hot?). Also, the odour of cut grass and other plants is a lot stronger than sweat. 

I'd like to see some visual impearment, though. Maybe some grass/leaves hanging on the edges of your screen?

[xalienax 621]

only reason people object to it is because its useful for PvP.

[LimeMobber 47]

The End., on 27 Apr 2014 - 07:48 AM, said:

We don't know what season Chernarus is in as of right now, so you can't say wearing warm clothing is a bad thing. And even if it is summer, it doesn't get all too hot in eastern bloc countries (20-25 celsius if it's really hot?). Also, the odour of cut grass and other plants is a lot stronger than sweat. 

I'd like to see some visual impearment, though. Maybe some grass/leaves hanging on the edges of your screen?

 

A ghillie suit over normal clothes is going to make a person sweat even under what could be a cool day, it is what happens when you dress in layers.

 

As for the smell, that may no matter, if the DayZ zombies hunt by smell then they may smell more like dogs do which is in layers, their sensitive noses able to smell all the odors not just the strongest. So your heavy grass smell would mask you to other humans but do nothing at all to zombies.

[liquidsnake 275]

A ghillie suit over normal clothes is going to make a person sweat even under what could be a cool day, it is what happens when you dress in layers.

 

As for the smell, that may no matter, if the DayZ zombies hunt by smell then they may smell more like dogs do which is in layers, their sensitive noses able to smell all the odors not just the strongest. So your heavy grass smell would mask you to other humans but do nothing at all to zombies.

The odour of the grass masks the sweat somewhat, so the zombies won't be able to smell you as good as players without something masking their odour. And on cool days, layered clothing on itself doesn't make you sweat. Heavy labour does.

[Katana67 2907]

So I mean, either way, the primary purpose of a ghillie suit isn't/wasn't to fool zombies. It is/was to fool players.

 

While I think it could be made to fool zombies somehow (via a revamped "sight" mechanic or a new "smell" mechanic), that's sort of an afterthought.

[hombrecz 832]

And even if it is summer, it doesn't get all too hot in eastern bloc countries (20-25 celsius if it's really hot?). 

 

2 years ago, we had (in Czech rep) summer temperatures around 35 Celsius in shadow. I call this HOT summer. Not every summer is that hot ofc, but there are some, so I'm affraid your generalisation is not that accurate, but I guess you ment Russian's summer or something. Due to the size of Russia, I guess there are some parts where summers ain't tropical at all.

[mugur 123]

A ghilie suit can be used even at over 40 degrees celcius.i did it and most probably i will do it again.  People tend to believe that a sniper job is to get there, hide and wait for hours. While this may be sometime true, the emphasis should fall on "get there", a part way harder than most people think. But that's beyond op. i am all in favour of ghilie suit.

 

on second thought, i've always tend to believe that the zeds in dayz just hear and see very well. so, a ghilie might not be a bad idea if implemented correctly (thirst coming faster when you wear it, limited speed depending on rain/wet, etc etc)

Edited April 27, 2014 by mugur

[audax 207]

You will find them here

[Katana67 2907]

You will find them here

 

/facepalm

[liquidsnake 275]

2 years ago, we had (in Czech rep) summer temperatures around 35 Celsius in shadow. I call this HOT summer. Not every summer is that hot ofc, but there are some, so I'm affraid your generalisation is not that accurate, but I guess you ment Russian's summer or something. Due to the size of Russia, I guess there are some parts where summers ain't tropical at all.

Oh, so the summer is about the same as it is here in Holland. 20-25 on a normal summer day, right? 30-35 if we're having a heat wave.