Mouse acceleration = NO!

[lipemr 160]

It IS a feature. My point was you can twitch shot to a large degree, just trying areally unrealistic spin will result in a punishment.....id love to see something like this in every shooting game out there. All 1:1 is is easy user friendly mode, with just the sligtest ammount of patience this system can me learned quickly. And it really makes you think when in a gunfight, not just spaz out like on a "twitch shooter" and hit your target through mucle memory.

 

 

Mucle memory plays a part IRL but ever situation is unique. The grouns your standing on, its elevation, stance, footwork, so much has to be factored in. This makes every spin different from the last, with a punishment for doing it UNNATURALLY FAST ;)

 

you never handled a rifle at real terrain on your life, did you?

 

it's actually easier than aiming with the mouse, you instinctively aim at where you want. I was in the army, did many field campaigns, Even 5kg FN FALs are easier to handle than the way it's simulated in the game.

 

The tricky thing about shooting is to stabilize the sights when you're standing and maintaining balance when you shoot, and i must say, you'll only lose balance when you're shooting a big cadridge like 7.62x39 or heavier.

 

it's a huge mistake trying to emulate shit in the game not based on real life experience, just guesses.

Edited March 19, 2014 by lipemr

[dgeesio 1034]

It IS a feature. My point was you can twitch shot to a large degree, just trying areally unrealistic spin will result in a punishment.....id love to see something like this in every shooting game out there. All 1:1 is is easy user friendly mode, with just the sligtest ammount of patience this system can me learned quickly. And it really makes you think when in a gunfight, not just spaz out like on a "twitch shooter" and hit your target through mucle memory.

 

 

Mucle memory plays a part IRL but ever situation is unique. The grouns your standing on, its elevation, stance, footwork, so much has to be factored in. This makes every spin different from the last, with a punishment for doing it UNNATURALLY FAST ;)

did you read the statement made yesterday ?

 

did you play the build that was up on experimental before they took it down ? when my post was made , all very relevant to understanding what i meant.

 

builds before were not as bad. i have played competitive gaming for years in many different games i understand mouse settings and test many hundreds of games so i understand what is a feature and what isnt.

 

the acceleration that was on yesterdays experimental build was really really bad. it was 5 times as bad as normal build for whatever reason.

 

 

so all the get used  to is and it isnt twitch is just stupid talk. i played fps since quake i realize this isnt quake or unreal or some twitch shooter . this has nothing to do with those and just the usual retards who scream bf or cod noobs will never learn i have played dayz since the start and for thousands of hrs !!!!

 

what we need to understand is its to do with the animations. yes i read previously in other threads and blogs and comments saying they were going to fix but it may take a long time but.....

 

yesterdays blog comment was contradictory to what was said...;

 

ill re-quote it and remember this went with the new build of experimental and when i tested the mouse acceleration not older builds !!!! READ THAT SENTENCE PLEASE !!!

 

Mouse acceleration and player control

"We have been changing the way the player controls their character to improve playability. There was an issue with mouse control that affected many users of high DPI mice which we have now fixed. Changes to character turning should now also be consistent with how freelook works, which was taken from ArmA3. So we hope that this will improve the situation for players although we have more work planned on this."

Edited March 19, 2014 by dgeesio

[Lady Kyrah 1109]

1:1 isn't interesting from a gameplay perspective for this game, in Arma type games the combat is already over before any bullet was fired because of equipment, headcount and location of the different protagonists. This is not a game where you just come out of improbable odds through superior barrel lineup speed. The bullet is just the punchline.

[Karmaterror 982]

I'll accept your challenge when you can produce a horde of flesh-eating zombies. This is a game. The mouse movement is an obvious mistake on their end; they've admitted as much. It's the clunkiest movement system ever. I don't want to have to swear at a game when I'm trying to turn around or fit through a door in a building. It's not realistic.

 

Also, competitive FPS gamers generally use very low sensitivities. They generally can't do a 180º spin without a metric fuckton of wrist movement/effort. Hence the reason why these exist: http://www.xtracpads.com/products.php?prod_id=5&section=1

 

Thats just a weak argument.....its just a game, who cares how the mosin sounds.....its just a game, who cares that all our stuff inside pouches gets ruined when we get hit. See what i mean? you could say that for anything, and its againt the "authentic" moto of the dayz dev team. 1:1 is unrealistic, so is mouse accel. Only difference is mouse accel at least tries to simulate the restrictions of movement human beings have. Instead of lazily add ing some head bob, and leaving it 1:1.

 

I would go as far as to call myself a cometative L4D2 player. Iv got somewhere in the region of 2600hrs, and regularly participate in group tournaments. I have sense at about 75%, and use a tiny mouse mat on the arm of the couch. If you normally use high dpi, and low sense then why not try changing some settings, try it with high sense low dps.....the sensitivity in arma has always been extreme. On very low sense i carnt even turn 45 degrees on my mose mat, but at 60-70 sense i can full 360 nearly twice.

 

I think if people play with some settings to get the best out of the system, instead of being stuck in there ways with dpi/sense settings (then yelling its broken), they would see it aint bad at all.

 

 

PS - I did experiment with this a while ago. It seems that if you are unarmed or weapon shouldered it becomes much herder to turn 360. Even having weapon in lowwered stance helps a hell of a lot. Maybe its a leftover from arma where it was reduced to simulate standing at attention. Or the enertia of the gun is ment to be carrying through.

 

 

Either way i think it makes gunplay into a real game of managing your emotions/adrenaline and skill, keeping calm under perassure to beat your opponent, far beyond (but not excluding) fast reaction times :)

 

 

@dgeesio, ahh sorry if i missunderstood, i thought was bbout accel as a whole. I admit i didnt play that particular build, so i carnt say anything about that. I just think mouse accel has a place in dayz, sure mess with it, this time it failed...next ime...who knows :)

Edited March 19, 2014 by Karmaterror

[dgeesio 1034]

1:1 isn't interesting from a gameplay perspective for this game, in Arma type games the combat is already over before any bullet was fired because of equipment, headcount and location of the different protagonists. This is not a game where you just come out of improbable odds through superior barrel lineup speed. The bullet is just the punchline.

this is hard work.

 

from the statement made its from arma 3 yes?

 

yet guess what all the last 7 days all i have played is arma 3 and guess what ? the acceleration is nothing like how it is in the latest build. so its just bs.

 

 

1:1 isnt interesting ? :o :lol:  wtf has interesting got to do with being accurate? <_<

 

the funny thing is these games BI make are based on sim trying to be realistic yes ? so what is more realistic ? accurate movement 1:1 with what you doing or adding elements onto the movements :lol: to make it interesting as you put it :P .

 

so this thread is not to make Dayz a twitch shooter or cod or bf or any other excuse of easier its just so you get the actual movement you make as accurate as what you move with no additions.

[agentneo 337]

Then submit a resume and quite being a prick.

 

Arma doesn't use a "floaty camera with a model attached to it" they have a system where character movements and the actual animation of it is very much tied together. Which means that there is, ultimately a maximum angular rotation speed applied to your character, what you guys call "negative acceleration". You can swipe your mouse mat as fast as you can, you won't turn faster than that speed.

And be polite when you reply don't be rude and aggressive.

Its official forums- here for us to give our Feedback and opinions from the alpha- without abuse and comments like yours

 

I can turn in real life far quicker than the character in Day Z- we know they tried to make it realistic but it simply isn't . I'm a graphic designer but have done my fair share of extreme sports and Have agility- i can swivel my hips and spin almost instantly and there isn't a maximum speed.

 

[chekovp 89]

For everyone against mouse acceleration. Go find yourself a backpack, put roughly 35 pounds worth of items in it, find something that weights 5-10 pounds to hold in your hand. With your arm holding the item extend it out in front of you, turn 90, 180, and 360 degrees as fast as you can, while trying to stop at a specific point tell me how it works out for you...

 

I'm going to guess that there was a gradual acceleration and deceleration to your movement and you were unable to stop exactly where you wanted to.

 

And for everyone bitching "the devs don't listen to the community", this is not your game, and you do not have a say in what is or is not in the game.

[Jex 1104]

It hardly flopped. Tactical shooter/realism focused shooters don't draw big audiences anymore and the FPS market is dominated by the two big boys now. Everything else is discarded and ignored and has a niche following. The Arma series itself was very niche for many years, but has only in recently years gained greater attention (much of which came from DayZ mod).

 

But you can't ignore (which you actually just did) that the mechanics (some of which are identical) are superior and better refined than DayZ.

 

 

I did refer to it as the 'focus' and I'm fully aware of it's intended purpose, but it feels artificial and a 'zoom' because it's magnification is so strong. Makes any need for binoculars almost redundant. Combined with the LOD issues on trees and bushes it makes spotting people sometimes too easy.

 

RO is a great game though I preferred the original, especially the tank battles. We had some amazing battles in tanks not to mention the infantry roles too.

[dgeesio 1034]

For everyone against mouse acceleration. Go find yourself a backpack, put roughly 35 pounds worth of items in it, find something that weights 5-10 pounds to hold in your hand. With your arm holding the item extend it out in front of you, turn 90, 180, and 360 degrees as fast as you can, while trying to stop at a specific point tell me how it works out for you...

 

I'm going to guess that there was a gradual acceleration and deceleration to your movement and you were unable to stop exactly where you wanted to.

 

And for everyone bitching "the devs don't listen to the community", this is not your game, and you do not have a say in what is or is not in the game.

trained with my cousin when he was going in marines mouse acceleration wasn't in the training. back pack we used had 65 pounds of weight.

 

never did it alter the over estimation of my movement or underestimate it. why would it? we are looking through our eyes ! they are the camera.

 

the excuses for keeping mouse acceleration are getting better and more elaborate though :lol:

Edited March 19, 2014 by dgeesio

[ninjaontour 123]

...it doesn't work it makes the game worse almost unplayable. if you arnt giving a option could i be refunded please cause i cant play the game with it on. that is not a plea for my money back its a plea to remove the feature as you may call it that makes me not be able to play anymore. its that bad !

 

That old chestnut just never gets old. I laugh every single time.

[dgeesio 1034]

That old chestnut just never gets old. I laugh every single time.

why does it never get old?

 

if someone says well fix it then you get the latest response which says its a feature but infact its worse than previous and not doing as they said that is going against what you are selling to people.

 

if a item is faulty and it isn't rectified how is it unfair to ask for a refund on a faulty product if the people who make it wont fix the bug/broken item?

 

if people like me and others don't point out things that are wrong and don't just sit back and let them slide by you would have weak as excuses and no fixes.im trying to get a small thing fixed which will help the game be better for all or vast majority. all you do is just try and point but i have asked for a refund if its not fixed which is of no help to anyone.

 

if i got a refund i get my money back (highly unlikely but it would solve my mouse issues or the games issues with mouse acceleration)

if they fix the mouse acceleration issue then im happy with the game

 

hopefully that entertains you also.

[ninjaontour 123]

You will NEVER  get a refund. You didn't buy the game on the condition that you'd get a refund if it wasn't up to your standards. That's why it never gets old, entitled people always think they'll get their money back, because they don't seem to comprehend the EULA.

 

Feel like you wasted your money? Tough shit, basically.

 

Not from BI, not from Valve. No refunds.

[Grimey Rick 3417]

Thats just a weak argument.....its just a game, who cares how the mosin sounds.....its just a game, who cares that all our stuff inside pouches gets ruined when we get hit. See what i mean? you could say that for anything, and its againt the "authentic" moto of the dayz dev team. 1:1 is unrealistic, so is mouse accel. Only difference is mouse accel at least tries to simulate the restrictions of movement human beings have. Instead of lazily add ing some head bob, and leaving it 1:1.

I would go as far as to call myself a cometative L4D2 player. Iv got somewhere in the region of 2600hrs, and regularly participate in group tournaments. I have sense at about 75%, and use a tiny mouse mat on the arm of the couch. If you normally use high dpi, and low sense then why not try changing some settings, try it with high sense low dps.....the sensitivity in arma has always been extreme. On very low sense i carnt even turn 45 degrees on my mose mat, but at 60-70 sense i can full 360 nearly twice.

I think if people play with some settings to get the best out of the system, instead of being stuck in there ways with dpi/sense settings (then yelling its broken), they would see it aint bad at all.

PS - I did experiment with this a while ago. It seems that if you are unarmed or weapon shouldered it becomes much herder to turn 360. Even having weapon in lowwered stance helps a hell of a lot. Maybe its a leftover from arma where it was reduced to simulate standing at attention. Or the enertia of the gun is ment to be carrying through.

Either way i think it makes gunplay into a real game of managing your emotions/adrenaline and skill, keeping calm under perassure to beat your opponent, far beyond (but not excluding) fast reaction times :)

@dgeesio, ahh sorry if i missunderstood, i thought was bbout accel as a whole. I admit i didnt play that particular build, so i carnt say anything about that. I just think mouse accel has a place in dayz, sure mess with it, this time it failed...next ime...who knows :)

Your whole argument is hardware specific. Different hardware reacts differently with various software settings. I've yet to see a professional gamer use a high sensitivity; you're shooting yourself in the foot in so doing.

The development team has even admitted the mouse response and acceleration is wonky. You're defending one of their errors when even they recognize it as a problem. DayZ is a FPS first and a survival game second, you need only look at the mod or visit Elektro for proof.

[chekovp 89]

trained with my cousin when he was going in marines mouse acceleration wasn't in the training. back pack we used had 65 pounds of weight.

 

never did it alter the over estimation of my movement or underestimate it. why would it? we are looking through our eyes ! they are the camera.

 

the excuses for keeping mouse acceleration are getting better and more elaborate though :lol:

Moving your eyes is not the same as moving your whole body. I'm glad your "training" with your cousin gave you such great knowledge of how movement with gear actually works.

 

My info is coming from years of experience moving with gear and weapons. Mouse acceleration is infinitely more realistic than a 1:1 mouse to movement ratio.

[Grimey Rick 3417]

This isn't ARMA, its a survival game; and I'm fairly sure this is my only real post on the subject. You also blatantly misconstrue (or misunderstand me, either way) into making it seem like I say there is zero need for any sort of reaction or shooter like skills. And no I don't die a lot, actually bugs and patch character wipes have more kills on me than other players.

Maybe you should also read the article you linked and "learn" yourself (preferably before posting it in your own defense again). There are plenty of references to the difference between twitch gameplay and skill based/slower paced/tactical gameplay.

All you have to do is watch someone like Sacriel or Ngotie play DayZ to see tactical, thought out, skill based combat as opposed to twitch combat.

You either didn't read the article, didn't understand it, or are trying to defend your earlier comment in vain. Any game on the market except turn-based games like Final Fantasy are twitch. Twitch encompasses many genres, predominantly that of FPS and RTS. Like I've already mentioned, there are varying degrees of twitch. Obviously games like Quake require faster reaction time than games like DayZ (usually), but that doesn't mean the latter isn't twitch.

TL;DR:

Twitch gameplay == any game that requires sudden reaction/movement. There are varying degrees of twitch.

Edited March 19, 2014 by Grimey Rick

[DarkwaveDomina 1099]

For everyone against mouse acceleration. Go find yourself a backpack, put roughly 35 pounds worth of items in it, find something that weights 5-10 pounds to hold in your hand. With your arm holding the item extend it out in front of you, turn 90, 180, and 360 degrees as fast as you can, while trying to stop at a specific point tell me how it works out for you...

 

I don't know if you play DayZ but you turn slower without a backpack on if you don't have a gun in your hand, so if they're aiming for what you're talking about then they're making a bit of a hash of it aren't they. Having a gun or axe in my hands all the time is one of the ways I try to deal with this nonsense.

 

I can live without exact 1:1 mouse movement, I'm just sick of my mouse stopping entirely just because I apparently move it "too fast". I'm not sure why I and others like me should be punished so harshly for using a mouse that isn't shite, or a DPI that suits me, the current system can be tweaked in a fair manner.

Edited March 19, 2014 by DarkwaveDomina

[Claw 26]

For everyone against mouse acceleration. Go find yourself a backpack, put roughly 35 pounds worth of items in it, find something that weights 5-10 pounds to hold in your hand. With your arm holding the item extend it out in front of you, turn 90, 180, and 360 degrees as fast as you can, while trying to stop at a specific point tell me how it works out for you...

 

I'm going to guess that there was a gradual acceleration and deceleration to your movement and you were unable to stop exactly where you wanted to.

 

And for everyone bitching "the devs don't listen to the community", this is not your game, and you do not have a say in what is or is not in the game.

 

 

 

 

 

All well and good but it behaves like that wether you are under load or not....so pretty pointless touting the realism card in regards to Dayz..

 

I have and always will be against mouse acceleration - it makes time put into a game pointless as the movement is very random. Gamers have always been against mouse accell and rightfully so, its impossible to build up muscle memory of your movements with it on.

 

Dayz already has enough realsim in it. And as mentioned it doesnt account for load anyway.

Edited March 19, 2014 by Claw

[ref 19]

If we are going for realism here we should remove the zombies from the game.

[Weedz 1105]

I'll accept your challenge when you can produce a horde of flesh-eating zombies. This is a game. The mouse movement is an obvious mistake on their end; they've admitted as much. It's the clunkiest movement system ever. I don't want to have to swear at a game when I'm trying to turn around or fit through a door in a building. It's not realistic.

 

Also, competitive FPS gamers generally use very low sensitivities. They generally can't do a 180º spin without a metric fuckton of wrist movement/effort. Hence the reason why these exist: http://www.xtracpads.com/products.php?prod_id=5&section=1

You should stop pretending you know what you're talking about.

[lipemr 160]

For everyone against mouse acceleration. Go find yourself a backpack, put roughly 35 pounds worth of items in it, find something that weights 5-10 pounds to hold in your hand. With your arm holding the item extend it out in front of you, turn 90, 180, and 360 degrees as fast as you can, while trying to stop at a specific point tell me how it works out for you...

 

I'm going to guess that there was a gradual acceleration and deceleration to your movement and you were unable to stop exactly where you wanted to.

 

And for everyone bitching "the devs don't listen to the community", this is not your game, and you do not have a say in what is or is not in the game.

 

what's the part of "i served in the army" didnt you get?

 

Here on my country, we do all campaign ativities with a big backpack full of stuff (including clothes, first aid kit, maintenance kit for clothes and gun, 2 1-day MRE's and more shit.) That is very similar to the Alice pack from the mod.

 

It roughly weight 15 to 20 kilos easily, plus its metal frame.

 

and my country's army standart rifle is the FAL, 5 kilos loaded, and i could still turn anywhere in the 180 degree angle in front of me in a blink of an eye.

 

Turning more than the 180 angle would take just a step or even just a torso movement, not even CLOSE to what we have in the game.

 

You probably never simulated the situation in your life, you're saying it based just by guesses.

Edited March 19, 2014 by lipemr

[Weedz 1105]

what's the part of "i served in the army" didnt you get?

 

Here on my country, we do all campaign ativities with a big backpack full of stuff (including clothes, first aid kit, maintenance kit for clothes and gun, 2 1-day MRE's and more shit.) That is very similar to the Alice pack from the mod.

 

It roughly weight 15 to 20 kilos easily, plus its metal frame.

 

and my country's army standart rifle is the FAL, 5 kilos loaded, and i could still turn anywhere in the 180 degree angle in front of me in a blink of an eye.

 

Turning more than the 180 angle would take just a step or even just a torso movement, not even CLOSE to what we have in the game.

 

You probably never simulated the situation in your life, you're saying it based just by guesses.

If you're going to lie about being in the military try to have actually held a gun in your hand before doing so.

[lipemr 160]

If you're going to lie about being in the military try to have actually held a gun in your hand before doing so.

 

are you fucking kidding me? do i need to post my pictures here, so the 12 year trolls can believe?

 

Search a little about the default combat package for the Brazillian army, kid. I was corporal there, was the best marksman on my company.

 

It's you who dont know shit about how things work on real life.

Edited March 19, 2014 by lipemr

[chekovp 89]

what's the part of "i served in the army" didnt you get?

 

Here on my country, we do all campaign ativities with a big backpack full of stuff (including clothes, first aid kit, maintenance kit for clothes and gun, 2 1-day MRE's and more shit.

 

It roughly weight 15 to 20 kilos easily, plus its metal frame.

 

and my country's army standart rifle is the FAL, 5 kilos loaded, and i could still turn anywhere in the 180 degree angle in front of me in a blink of an eye.

 

Turning more than the 180 angle would take just a step or even just a torso movement, not even CLOSE to what we have in the game.

 

You probably never simulated the situation in your life, you're saying it based just by guesses.

HA! Based on what? Guesses? Based on real life experience, my picture is of me in Iraq... Also based on the simple facts of momentum and not to mention that your character is not military trained and should not move like they are.

[Grimey Rick 3417]

If you're going to lie about being in the military try to have actually held a gun in your hand before doing so.

Obvious troll is obvious. Again, for the fourth time, the dev team has acknowledged the current wonky mouse movement as unintentional/problematic.

I swear to fuck you guys would argue that the world is flat. It's amazing. Also Weedz, please explain to me how I have no idea what I'm talking about. I played competitive CS for four years. I attended CPL with Malicious Intent and Pernicious Vengeance. We competed in upper seed CAL-m and CAL-i for our final season. We did pretty fucking good for having zero sponsors and all going to school at the same time. If you used mouse acceleration, you didn't make it to upper league play. It's completely unreliable.

TL;DR:

Mouse movement is currently a work in progress and has been admitted as such by the dev team. NOT WORKING AS INTENDED.

[spinager 152]

why does it never get old?

 

if someone says well fix it then you get the latest response which says its a feature but infact its worse than previous and not doing as they said that is going against what you are selling to people.

 

if a item is faulty and it isn't rectified how is it unfair to ask for a refund on a faulty product if the people who make it wont fix the bug/broken item?

 

if people like me and others don't point out things that are wrong and don't just sit back and let them slide by you would have weak as excuses and no fixes.im trying to get a small thing fixed which will help the game be better for all or vast majority. all you do is just try and point but i have asked for a refund if its not fixed which is of no help to anyone.

 

if i got a refund i get my money back (highly unlikely but it would solve my mouse issues or the games issues with mouse acceleration)

if they fix the mouse acceleration issue then im happy with the game

 

hopefully that entertains you also.

They meant turn your WHOLE BODY. Not just your head. Because you know, when you're not free looking in game, your whole body moves.

 

I've always liked the camera movement of the Arma series. And changed the feel from traditional FPS. Why change it? I never heard an out cry during the Arma 3 Alpha. And its pretty much similar game mechanics. 

Edited March 19, 2014 by Razgriz Berkut