Bullet Penetration

[joaby 25]

Ok, I'm making a new thread because people are getting hung up on how unrealistic the concept of Ghosts is for their zombie apocalypse game.

Bullet penetration should be a thing.

First - bullets do actually penetrate bodies in certain situations IRL. So REALISM

Second - A good shooter with a good weapon should be able to put down multiple zombies at once. Their flesh is weak and bruised. Also, at the moment I get ARs and Sniper rifles for human hunting, but bullet penetration would make these weapons goals for more than just self-defence/pre-emptive strikes.

Third - It would open the game up to so much hilarity. Blue on blue situations would be far more likely when a stack of zombies attacked, and if this game isn't about pissing off your friends I don't know what it's about.

I'm sure there are other reasons for it as well - throw them in below!

[bad_mojo (DayZ) 1204]

Like I said in your other thread, only problem I see with this is the ease of exploiting it to kill many zombies in a building. They all nicely line up and walk slowly. It's not a game breaking exploit, just something to consider.

[Dreganius (DayZ) 55]

I am probably mistaken, but I thought ARMA2 already had bullet penetration in terms of walls and stuff? I never really tried before, but I still thought it existed :/

[Xelacalle 0]

Good to see you split this off, as I said before, I completely agree. Bullets from high-powered weapons should at least have a chance to go straight through zombies and players alike. It would add another small measure of realism to the game, and I feel would generate yet more stories to tell of adventures in DayZ.

Your last bullet, thinking you were done for, manage to two-for-one those bandits that were hunting you. And the amusing incidents you laugh off later when you accidentally kill your friend through that walker.

Obviously, bad_mojo makes a great point - it could be exploited. But I think it would work fine if there was a limit to penetration, or a reduced chance to penetrate if the bullet already passed through something. Personally, I don't think killing two or even three zombies with a single bullet from a sniper rifle is too unrealistic or game-breaking.

Anyway, great idea, wish it was in the game already. +1

[bad_mojo (DayZ) 1204]

I am probably mistaken' date=' but I thought ARMA2 already had bullet penetration in terms of walls and stuff? I never really tried before, but I still thought it existed :/

[/quote']

Bullets do penetrate some things, like I've killed them through tents before. But, I'm pretty sure it doesn't go through a body.

[joaby 25]

I'm 100% they don't go through bodies, but yeah they do punch through some walls and stuff. I've definitely shot dudes through tent walls before.

[cyanyde 165]

I thought this could already happen, but I've never had the chance to try it. I could see a bullet going through one, or even two zeds, but there should definitely be some sort of friction working on the bullet to slow it down so that we couldn't take out 10 zombies all standing in a line. TF2 allows that to happen.. Shibby2142 has a video of him taking out a whole line of players.. that would just be lame, in this game.

[Dreganius (DayZ) 55]

Thanks for clarifying that. The more you know.

[joaby 25]

Well yeah, bullets slow down and in most cases begin to fragment on impact, so you'd definitely want to see it not killing a whole bunch of people with one bullet, like Indiana Jones with a Luger or something.

I'm sure it doesn't happen right now though. I tried it out yesterday with my SAW and it was always 1 zombie at a time.

[Dreganius (DayZ) 55]

I don't think that many weapons should have the ability to actually pass through multiple zombies, but it should happen for high-caliber rifles and such. After all, that's what a high-caliber rifle can do.

[infinitegrim 47]

Like I said in your other thread' date=' only problem I see with this is the ease of exploiting it to kill many zombies in a building. They all nicely line up and walk slowly. It's not a game breaking exploit, just something to consider.

[/quote']

Military ammo for M4/M16/M249 is designed to fragment and wont be effective on anything but the first thing it hits.

[KWilt 157]

I can see this making sense for higher-caliber rifles like the AS50. I mean, when's the last time you saw an anti-material rifle round not penetrate a fleshy human being?

[7-75 callaghan 43]

Bullet penetration already exists in terms of walls etc. depending on calibre and velocity. However in terms of bodies, it would only really happen with high power sniper rifles and so on. So not important enough to justify the development resources and additional server load.

[joaby 25]

At point blank range (where this idea gets the most hilarious) guns would absolutely have penetration regardless. From 2 metres away a revolver would be the scariest weapon you ever saw. And I don't know that it would be that big a draw on 'development resources and additional server load'.

[7-75 callaghan 43]

At point blank range (where this idea gets the most hilarious) guns would absolutely have penetration regardless. From 2 metres away a revolver would be the scariest weapon you ever saw. And I don't know that it would be that big a draw on 'development resources and additional server load'.

Trust me, it would, I know the engine very well and the ballistics calculations are CPU-testing enough as it is. To be implemented realistically they would need new formulae for each bullet type and the trajectory would change with each body impact, as well as velocity, range to target etc. A calculation for percentage chance of penetration would also be needed. More trouble than it is worth considering other areas for improvement.

[DannyRed 32]

Atleast double barrel shotgun shells should penetrate. It is useless without that.

[cherocha 4]

Trust me' date=' it would, I know the engine very well and the ballistics calculations are CPU-testing enough as it is. To be implemented realistically they would need new formulae for each bullet type and the trajectory would change with each body impact, as well as velocity, range to target etc. A calculation for percentage chance of penetration would also be needed. More trouble than it is worth considering other areas for improvement.

[/quote']

I really don't think it'd have that much impact if you simplified it, ie. high calibre rounds continue on their trajectory with reduced damage after the first target. Realistically, how many targets are people going to be going for that you'd see the CPU choking much more than it already does with the plethora of calculations it goes through?

If you're talking about realism in a game, I don't think a round from my M107 would be stopped by a thick cement block, let alone a fleshy body.

Something to look at down the track, hopefully.

[joe_mcentire 2074]

from: http://www.reddit.com/r/dayz/comments/1jhkhi/how_impactproof_will_chernarus_be/

 

 

So you know the Hollywood movies, where you hide behind a car, or flip over a desk to take cover in a firefight. IRL these scenarios most definitely would kill you.
So here is my question: All the buildings, all the trees, the vehicles etc, how impact-proof are they going to be (bullet penetration)? Will there be measures implemented to make it more real and therefore highly dangerous in firefights, so that seeking shelter in a wooden cabin or taking cover behind a tree would be far more dangerous and life-threatening?
or is this gamey aspect necessary, is too much realism bad?

 

some problem and findings so far:

evergreens and bushes need to be fixed in this context.
Being able to sit in an evergreen's branches and surviving a mag sprayed at said evergreen really is just broken.

(also here http://dayzmod.com/forum/index.php?/topic/122725-fix-property-of-bushes/?p=1171916)
 

There is already a difference between hiding behind a wheel/engine of a car and behind a hull in Arma. They offer different protection from different calibres, people are just ignorant of that fact.
 

Edited September 1, 2013 by joe_mcentire

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[enforcer1975 1111]

Ok, I'm making a new thread because people are getting hung up on how unrealistic the concept of Ghosts is for their zombie apocalypse game.

Bullet penetration should be a thing.

First - bullets do actually penetrate bodies in certain situations IRL. So REALISM

Second - A good shooter with a good weapon should be able to put down multiple zombies at once. Their flesh is weak and bruised. Also, at the moment I get ARs and Sniper rifles for human hunting, but bullet penetration would make these weapons goals for more than just self-defence/pre-emptive strikes.

Third - It would open the game up to so much hilarity. Blue on blue situations would be far more likely when a stack of zombies attacked, and if this game isn't about pissing off your friends I don't know what it's about.

I'm sure there are other reasons for it as well - throw them in below!

 

1. They do, but not most of the time. It also depends on the caliber and distance among a lot of other factors.
2. A good player might be able to do that but zombies in game are not rotten zombies, they are still alive and therefor not "soft"
3. Blue on blue already happens without that because players tend to shoot other players on sight rather that remembering the positions of their comrades or due to lack of communication.

I personally would love to see bullet penetration on people,too.

 

Bullet penetration already exists in terms of walls etc. depending on calibre and velocity. However in terms of bodies, it would only really happen with high power sniper rifles and so on. So not important enough to justify the development resources and additional server load.

 

You will have bullet penetration if you are in effective range of the weapon regardless the caliber but i doubt they will have that much force to actually kill anyone who is up to 5m away from the penetrated target if it's not a big slug since the bullets will exit the body in any direction and with the bottom forward.

 

from: http://www.reddit.com/r/dayz/comments/1jhkhi/how_impactproof_will_chernarus_be/

 

That is true...i've encountered lots of players who didn't know of that fact although they were playing a pretty long time. They thought because you didn#t have a LOS to the target he can't shoot you...WRONG! I shot other players through wooden or metal walls or through vehicles in clan wars and other occasions when they provided the opportunity and i had the right weapon.