ethics of first kill

[boonaroony 10]

I have been impressed by the way day z makes you think about your actions. The other day I killed for the first time.

 

I was typing a message to a friend on stream when my character starting making noises. I got back into game and some guy was punching me for no reason so I had to shoot him (I have no issue with this kill).

 

10 min later, I was running down a road in a town and came across 3 guys all running towards me about 100 m away with guns out. I jumped behind a building and then poked my head around the corner to see them stood in the road about 50m away looking around. they looked threatening so I shot one of them and he died. The other two ran away. I did not go near the body because I feared a trap/reprisals.

 

What is everyones view on the morality of this? I probably could have run away/hid, and have pondered this since it happened. They did seem to be a significant threat however...how would you have dealt with this situation?

[hozzdutch 49]

After playing for a week or so on dayz now, I've turned into a heartless bastard.

Too many times have I been killed by people who acted friendly to start with.

Too many times have I been killed by people who appeared to ignore me and then turn on me and shoot when my back was turned.

 

Now I kill on sight.If i see someone with basic gear, still trying to get their stuff together, I still kill on sight. This person is just going to be my murderer when they find a weapon of their own.

[MrBecause 11]

I think you acted right in that moment, but you could've probably avoided this whole situation by watching the city from a higher point first and not using the road. I always do that or have a sniper watch the town to inform and cover me. 

[libertine 351]

In a zombie apocalypse everyone would have a gun when traveling, and as powerful ones as they could get. IMO, In The Walking Dead, the only reason they rarely had powerful weapons until the later episodes was because the director/writers thought it would have made killing the slow zombies too easy.

 

Also, Chernarus is a strange land where there is a lot of killing just for fun for some apparent reason. Do you roleplay knowing this or roleplay not knowing this?

[TokumeiSennin 34]

I think you choice right way. Even if you don't want to kill on sight, every time you met stranger, you don't have any proof that he is frendly or want to kill you. Now its like in animal world, both side watching careful and if someone do suspicious move, then can be perceived as a threat. If 3 guys running to you, without any sign of frendly way then you have full right to perceive them as a threat. If they want to be frendly then its up to them to act non suspicious.

[Hrki 94]

its all fun and game ^^

[eleventhavenue 204]

After playing for a week or so on dayz now, I've turned into a heartless bastard.

Too many times have I been killed by people who acted friendly to start with.

Too many times have I been killed by people who appeared to ignore me and then turn on me and shoot when my back was turned.

 

Now I kill on sight.If i see someone with basic gear, still trying to get their stuff together, I still kill on sight. This person is just going to be my murderer when they find a weapon of their own.

 

Never say that. You are free to KOS as much as you want, no one is going to stop you. But never say that everyone else wants to kill you too. It's untrue and I also find it quite insulting.

[LDClaudius 3]

Every time I try to survive in Cernarus, it feels like I'm trespassing in this island no matter what I do. There will be people that would try to kill me, I'll have to defend myself for the sake of the Survival of the fittest.

Edited February 12, 2014 by LDClaudius

[Thundertom 1]

I love this game, simply because of what it does to your decisions making. I think we all start out being the good Samaritan, and find out there is no right or wrong.

[1S1K-Airborne 148]

After playing for a week or so on dayz now, I've turned into a heartless bastard.

Too many times have I been killed by people who acted friendly to start with.

Too many times have I been killed by people who appeared to ignore me and then turn on me and shoot when my back was turned.

 

Now I kill on sight.If i see someone with basic gear, still trying to get their stuff together, I still kill on sight. This person is just going to be my murderer when they find a weapon of their own.

 

Couldn't be more true.

 

KOS or prepare to get KOS'd in return.

 

Welcome to the KOS Deathmatch Permadeath Standalone.

 

Unless they implement a Humanity System like the one below in my sig..............it will be that way forever.

[dekartz 315]

How would I have dealt with the situation? Probably did something stupid and got killed.

 

What do I think about your handling it? You responded to both situations in a reasonable manner, three well-armed guys probably aren't well-armed by accident. You had the element of surprise and got them to scatter rather than engage. As for the guy punching you in the head? Well he was punching you in the head.

[Helix2000 128]

been playing a couple months. my first kill was with a magnum. shot a guy who had been hunting me with a fire axe. no problem with this, he was a threat. killing new spawns, or people with very little gear, unless they are a threat, i will try to avoid the meaningless killing.

[blunce 991]

After playing for a week or so on dayz now, I've turned into a heartless bastard.

Gooooood .. Goooooooood .. Let the hate flow THROUGH you, Anakin.

[Just_Alive 9]

I posted a rather lengthy description of my first kill in the "your first kill" thread (post#100 on page 6 if you're interested) but my second in game kill was even more emotionally wracking, which is what I absolutely love about this game. I'll keep this as brief as possible, basically I was approaching the NE Airfield and saw someone suddenly pop up running around in the tower. Going off of my previous experience at the Airfields, where I had been attacked as soon as another person saw me, every time, I brought up my mosin, aimed, and fired a single shot, and he dropped immediately. I felt a little twitch of guilt, as he was just another person running around in the open, possibly a new player, looking for gear like all of us who aren't hopping servers, and started jogging towards the tower.

 

Just as I was getting close, I see him stand back up and start moving, which scared the hell out of me, and made me dash behind the small shed next to the Tower, and get on my mic "Hey ? ... are you friendly ?" (a stupid question, in hindsight, but I was utterly confused, this was the first time I potentially had the upper hand in the situation, and had never talked to someone over the mic and gotten a response) A tiny voice replied cautiously "yeah, i'm friendly ... did you shoot me ?"

 

"errrmm .... I fired a warning shot, I didn't hit you, did I ?" (the ease with which this lie flowed forth really bothered me) he replied "Yeah, someone shot me and I fell unconscious ..." (I could see and hear him rustling about in the Tower, probably wondering where in the hell I was, and scared sh*tless) we talked back and forth for a few minutes, and I decided I wasn't comfortable killing him, especially since there were only 3 or 4 people on the server, something felt even more wrong about murdering a guy in such a low populated world, so i told him where i had seen a sporter 22 and 3 30 round magazines, obviously dropped by someone who hit the airfield first and found a better weapon, then turned and hauled ass away, using the hangars and trees for cover.

 

Once I was at a good vantage point, I spun around to watch the Airfield through my scope to make sure he wasnt planning any shenanigans. after 10 minutes or so i spotted him running full speed in the same general direction I had left, one rifle slung at his back and another in his hands ... apparently he had decided to grab the sporter I had told him about. Thinking back to all the times I had been betrayed, murdered, and shot in the back, something came over me and i raised my Mosin and took another shot, missing, but alerting him to someone's presence, and leading to a good 20 minutes of him running around, hitting treelines and searching in a panic for me. I took another shot as he was running across my screen, meaning to end the cat and mouse, and he dropped. I waited a few minutes to be sure, then got up and sprinted towards where he fell, and as I crested a small hill and saw no body, I realized I hadnt hit him, he had just run below the horizon at the same moment I fired.

 

My heart started pumping, panic setting in as for the first time in the past 40 minutes I didnt have the upper hand. There were a few buildings immediately nearby, and that was when I saw him peeking out around the corner looking at me. I dropped the mosin and switched to my FNX as i started running laterally, emptying the magazine in his general direction and causing him to turn and run behind the building. I quickly swapped mags and rushed down the opposite side, slowing as I reached the corner, dropping to my knees and inching around to see him peeking around the opposite direction, weapon down, and asking "hey man, is that you ?..." i put two shots into his back ... he fell to the ground, and as i approached, I put another two into his face, and searched his bag.

 

This was where I lost it, I felt like a monster... his backpack was FULL of books ... all different, all classic literature ... he had maybe 4 or 5 rounds of ammo, a little food, and a ton of books ... he was obviously someone who was roleplaying, travelling the world, surviving, and trying to preserve all these classic works in the apocalypse ... he wasn't a bandit, or a murderer ... he was, if anything, the first and only "good" person I had ever met in the game, and I had stalked, lied to, hunted, and murdered him in cold blood ... and I felt like a monster.

 

Not many games, if any, can play with your emotions like this one, and that single 45 minute or so interaction with a single person ... I couldn't bring myself to take anything from his corpse, or hide it ... I left it laying there, facedown in the dirt, as some kind of memorial to my sin, and made my way to a nearby house to log off for the night, and ponder what I had done.

[herrjon 478]

I either avoid or approach in a friendly manner.  I haven't killed anyone in SA, and from my years in the mod, I've only killed 1 in cold blood (which I regret), with the rest being where I had no other choice or I had a patients life on the line.

 

In the first one, there wasn't much more you could've done, he clearly wanted to take advantage of you and KO you.  You could've maybe shot his leg or tried to knock him out, but for both of those you're basically leaving them for dead anyways.

 

For the 2nd, you had first sight so you made the voluntary choice to take a life.  You can easily avoid them by seeking concealment, figuring out where they're moving and avoiding their line of sight.  It's even easier in SA with the number of enterable buildings no one bothers checking.  Beyond that I've approached heavily armed people like that before, just chat with them, build rapport, offer any assistance, and walk away unharmed.  If they do see an opening and fire at me, I usually accept it or run, I'm not going to bait an engagement.

 

But yeah, in terms of morality and all that, you're welcome to play however you like, but when you get into it, you do second guess yourself and think if it could've gone down another way, and think that they could have just been another survivor like yourself, trying to do their best to survive, and you just ended their life (play session).  Food for thought for converted KOSers due to a bad experience.  Think of that feeling of when you got killed by someone out of the blue, and realize that's the feeling you're imparting on others when you needlessly kill them because "they could be a future threat".  Just play smarter not harder.

Edited June 21, 2014 by (TMW)HerrJon

[umberfive 89]

Never take a friendly stance towards fresh-spawns. They are the biggest threat as they have nothing to loose. I am against fresh-spawn hunting on the coast line. But if one becomes a threat, I will kill him.

 

My first kill was to avenge my comrade. They shot first, so I do not feel any remorse.

[Marcthomas_420 4]

It sucks having great gear, then you are distracted for a moment and a fresh spawn knocks you out with a few punches.

[zeeabo 92]

I have killed twice so far in my few weeks playing.. neither one I feel particularly proud of lol.

My first kill was back in my first week playing while I was still learning the basics and extremely on edge. I was rummaging around in a prison building at NEAF, just trying to find anything useful. So far it was my 3rd visit to NEAF, the first two had ended in KoS deaths.
After a few minutes scavenging for some supplies, I started hearing signs of another player's presence, and immediately start crapping myself. I crept upstairs into the dorm, hid behind the bunks right of the door, and took stock of my situation.

I had no melee weapon, but I did have a 1911 with a chambered round and 3 or 4 loose bullets. I drew it and pointed it at the doorway, listening to the footsteps and my heartbeat getting louder each passing second. I must have waited there for 10 minutes.

Next thing you know, there he is. He ran into the room straight between the 2 bunks left of the door, facing away from me and innocently looting. But there he was, a threat all the same.
I was so shot with adrenaline, I didn't even take the time to register if he was carrying a weapon, I didn't consider that I had a mic and the upper hand. I simply hesitated for a moment, then I shot him in the back, right between the shoulder blades. I couldn't get a shot at his head past the bunk.
At that point, he either died or fell unconscious, I'll never know because without ever saying a word, I went and punched his head in till there was nothing left but mush.
I didn't even take the time to look at the trinkets carried by the man I had just murdered, the fear was just so primal and raw. I had to get out of there to log off and have a nice cold shower. I felt absolutely horrid. Much worse than I imagine the person who's character I just killed did. But I was alive. So alive.

Since then I have only killed one other player throughout multiple player "interactions" (mostly involves watching people from half a KM away lol.. one bambi I gave some beans to and another I ran into this morning in the far north, had a chat, and both went our separate ways with no hostility at all) and that was while he had a gun pointed in my direction. He was standing on the police station with sks drawn looking around, I was on a hill overlooking the whole town, looking through my scope but with no bad intentions, just watching. But then he turned with his sks, and faced directly towards me, I was literally looking down his barrel. Thing is, I was about 350m away proned under a nice bushy 'triangle tree' I call them, and I'm really not sure he actually saw me.

But I popped him anyway, one shot one kill, because you can never be sure when someone's pointing their gun towards you, especially when you are beyond talking distance. I hadn't seen anyone else in the few minutes since initial contact with this guy, but hung around for a few more minutes to make sure nobody wandered out anyway. Eventually went and had a look at his body, his sks was loaded and he had a few clips worth of loose rounds. I literally could have been half a second from death when I fired that shot. I highly doubt it, but you never know.

 

This is why I love this game, it forces you to make decisions you don't think you'd have the heart to make until you do. I just want to be friendly :(

Edited June 21, 2014 by zeeabo

[Just_Alive 9]

I have killed twice so far in my few weeks playing.. neither one I feel particularly proud of lol.

My first kill was back in my first week playing while I was still learning the basics and extremely on edge. I was rummaging around in a prison building at NEAF, just trying to find anything useful. So far it was my 3rd visit to NEAF, the first two had ended in KoS deaths.

After a few minutes scavenging for some supplies, I started hearing signs of another player's presence, and immediately start crapping myself. I crept upstairs into the dorm, hid behind the bunks right of the door, and took stock of my situation.

I had no melee weapon, but I did have a 1911 with a chambered round and 3 or 4 loose bullets. I drew it and pointed it at the doorway, listening to the footsteps and my heartbeat getting louder each passing second. I must have waited there for 10 minutes.

Next thing you know, there he is. He ran into the room straight between the 2 bunks left of the door, facing away from me and innocently looting. But there he was, a threat all the same.

I was so shot with adrenaline, I didn't even take the time to register if he was carrying a weapon, I didn't consider that I had a mic and the upper hand. I simply hesitated for a moment, then I shot him in the back, right between the shoulder blades. I couldn't get a shot at his head past the bunk.

This is almost an exact duplicate of my third, and least guilt inducing kill. I basically consider the airfields and military zones to basically be a Kill or Be killed no mans land. I've never once had someone initiate contact with me there with words instead of a barrage of bullets, so on one of my trips there, maybe my second week in I was in the same situation, looting the two floor jail, I had shut the door behind me, I almost always shut the outer door, I dont know why ... maybe hoping once, just once, a damn door will make a sound when opening, lol. and gone straight upstairs, looking for a large caliber gun, as all I had was a 1911, and thankfully a single mag for it. I was rummaging about upstairs, and actually found an M4 (with no ammo, of course) and was pulled out of my excitement by the sound of someone loading a weapon below me.

 

Now scared out of my mind, I crawled to the upstairs door and shut it, then, in a blessed moment of terror driven genius, put my unloaded M4 against the wall straight in front of the door, and moved to what was your exact same position, behind the bunk beds to the right of the door. I had my 1911 out and waited, sights up, staring at the door, feeling my heart pounding a slow and steady beat. I swear it was at least 5 minutes, i was starting to think he must have heard me, or maybe found what he was looking for and moved on without coming upstairs. Then, literally the moment I started to move, the door swings open and he walks in, looks down, and walks right up to my trap, I breathed a little sigh of relief and squeezed the trigger. Five shots, probably one would have been more than enough, and he dropped to the floor. I came around the bunk, closed the door again, and put the last two bullets in the back of his head. Whoever he was, he was fully geared, m4 with all the attachments, kevlar, assault pack, all the goodies, and ammocans full of 5.56

 

I had set a trap, and it went flawlessly. I actually felt proud to kill him, because I knew if I had walked downstairs, or gotten on my mic, I likely would have been the dead one. I was outgunned, but I had kept my wits long enough to come up with a beautiful plan, and it worked.

 

After rearranging my new gear, I swung open the door and moved downstairs, rounded the corner and came face to face with two more, fully geared, m4's raised, and had a split second to wonder if they were friends of his before I was cut down in a spray of bullets, "you are dead" staring me in the face as i listened to them both emptying their magazines into my body.

[zeeabo 92]

I was rummaging about upstairs, and actually found an M4 (with no ammo, of course) and was pulled out of my excitement by the sound of someone loading a weapon below me.

 

Now scared out of my mind, [...]

 

lol, this game eh?! Smallest thing just absolutely sets you into a state of panic.

 

That last paragraph was a kicker, DayZ in a nutshell lol.

Edited June 21, 2014 by zeeabo

[General Zod 1118]

 

Unless they implement a Humanity System like the one below in my sig..............it will be that way forever.

No!

Go to whatever hippie happy place you crawled out from and stop trying to get that system in, it was said it will not be implemented end of story. 

[Bigbadchuck 97]

Started playing a week ago.

For my first kill I got the drop on a guy coming off the stairs in the tower at the north west airfield. After being KOS'ed several times before this I don't trust anyone. I tried to tell him to put his hands up but he turned to me with a weapon so I killed him.

Must say I love the way this game makes you fear for you online life.

[tom0311 1]

Started playing a week ago.

For my first kill I got the drop on a guy coming off the stairs in the tower at the north west airfield. After being KOS'ed several times before this I don't trust anyone. I tried to tell him to put his hands up but he turned to me with a weapon so I killed him.

Must say I love the way this game makes you fear for you online life.

 

 

It really does. I haven't even killed anyone yet, and I always have my mic on so I can speak before I shoot, but I'd hate to lose all the cool stuff I've found. Since the update the z's seem a lot easier to kill, so all there is to look out for now is the other people.

Edited June 24, 2014 by tom0311

[Fear The Amish 40]

It depends entirely...

 

Personally i play as a Hero/Protector with CQF we have an extensive ROE. Basically attempt contact, give warnings, do not fire unless they are considered a threat (raising weapon without responding, Hostile actions, taking fire from them, etc). So i have died many times but also have saved and helped many people. To me the fun of this game is gearing up and then helping people. I have given away thousands of cans of beans/food, Tons of Medical supplies, and other basic supplies. The most rewarding thing is when you help someone out under fire by removing the threat, and getting that Thank you. It makes up for those times were you get shot for just being friendly. But remember the KOS crowd, Banditry, and all the other "negative" interactions make this whole playstyle valid, without them this game would be much less interesting and i hope they don't change... Just realize people like me will be watching and i rarely miss my first shot.

Edited June 24, 2014 by Fear The Amish

[Street Elite 14]

If you kill someone who bears any sort of threat, its not really KOS. KOS is highly considered killing without thought or consideration or analysis.