Don't listen to the casual gamers

[Daimyo21 (DayZ) 6]

I love DayZ and think the devs are going in the right direction. I completely agree that there should be freedom of choice in terms of Hardcore "expert settings" servers (which I only play on) and "regular settings" servers that have 3rd person and mouse scrolling etc. because a majority should not have a vote for the minority and vice versa. So let the two exist.

As for the game being too hardcore. Yes as of now, with so many in-development features and functions and common problems, the game is definitely leaning to a far more hardcore edge (I've play Darkfall and AC DT so I know hardcore modes).

I just made a post about this on vehicles, and the lack there of.

CURRENTLY, its a matter of HIGH Risk (not of supplies but of TIME SPENT) vs Mild Reward (supplies arent hard to come by, the reward is simply wasting the other guys time then yours).

When you die, your off running again. The games in development, it has potential. But never shun the community behind it, listen to everyone, and find the best median to fit both sides. Darkfall failed to do this and yes, there game died and is dead. They got their wish and now more of the community hates them then likes them.

This Rocket guy could very well drive this game into the ground with a small niche of community and ignoring a vast amount of it. I try to find the perfect balance between realism and gameplay. Cause after all, I have very little time too these days, and want to enjoy great mods like DayZ and my own.

[MR DELICIOUS 297]

My favourite is when people suggest game HUD, player markings or other modern FPS conventions as though Rocket is some autistic savant who hasn't quite caught up with the rest of the games industry.

The point is that the games industry is lazy. They make FPS over FPS, and instead of asking "why is this experience "fun"?" they think "oh gee, it'd be cool to put an RC car in an FPS, because everybody loves RC cars, and everybody loves FPS!"

The entire experiment being conducted here (and being systematically proven as a "fuck you" to the games industry) is that people want more than that split second of satisfaction achieved when you fulfill the act of shooting somebody.

Modern day FPS (and I'm including BF, although that's a little bit more diverse) is a totally contrived, handheld experience of lots of little "shoot the other guy" moments sewn together. The only thing that rewards players is their twitch ability and ability to know the maps really well. There is nothing at stake, there is no need to think. Besides a K/D ratio, there is no metric of success, and no metric of failure.

In this game, a player is tested by the merit of their intelligence, moderation, social interaction and finally (and minimally) their ability to shoot. This game gives satisfaction in a myriad of different ways - whether it be successfully navigating by the stars, slaughtering and cooking a cow, saving a best friend, clearing a town of zombies, whatever.

What strikes me as odd, and very funny, is retarded game developers can SEE the COMMERCIAL SUCCESS of films like Dawn of the Dead and the 28 Days/Weeks films, and yet still fail to isolate that people don't want zombie films because they like watching people plow through zombies, they watch it because they like that never-ending feeling of dread - the moral decisions and other quandaries faced by someone at the edge of civilized society. If they stopped to ask each other "why do I like these films?" I am one hundred percent sure the answer wouldn't be "because I like killing zombies."

Until this point, all zombie games have essentially been zombie coloured FPS, with idiot developers failing to grasp why their game isn't satisfying anyone but the raw FPS crowd. They think introducing bigger guns will make it better, more interesting guns, etc etc, while completely missing the actual atmosphere and experience that they most enjoyed about these films.

So how about this pitch, retarded game devs and publishers - a wide MMO zombie apocalypse game that spawns you in an incredibly harsh environment, makes you fend for yourself, puts a time limit on all your actions as you die of thirst or starvation, there is very little other-player shooting (comparatively), the best survivors have the best weapons and the worst survivors have the worst weapons, there is no map until you find one, and if you play at night (which lasts eight hours), you have absolutely no way of seeing around. Oh, and the map is in English and signs are in Cyrillic script, so get ready to learn some Russian! That's right, this game isn't set in L.A. or N.Y.C., it's set in downtown Chernarus, a place with zero commercial or tourism appeal, that nobody has ever heard of. Oh, and the game is going to be a mod that's installed on a clunky as fuck engine with the worst inventory system in the world. You'll get hit by zombies through walls, die falling off ladders with your pistol out and generally die pretty quickly. Sound like fun?

I'm excited to see where Rocket goes next. If he's come this far and done this much, everything from here is gravy.

[oktyabr 53]

My favourite is when people suggest game HUD' date=' player markings or other modern FPS conventions as though Rocket is some autistic savant who hasn't quite caught up with the rest of the games industry.

[/quote']

Ok, I wasn't sure I like you but you hit the nail on the head with that one! (Also made me spit beer all over my keyboard). +1

[MR DELICIOUS 297]

Ok' date=' I wasn't sure I like you but you hit the nail on the head with that one! (Also made me spit beer all over my keyboard). +1

[/quote']

Haha, I post a lot of rubbish sometimes, but occasionally I can hammer out something worthwhile!

[i wub pugs 16]

To be completely fair to Day Z, even with the restricting of 3rd person, it's not terribly hard if you play with friends.

ArmA 2 in itself is a very hard game, but not many played it. I'm thankful that Day Z has really put the game into the hands of a ton of new players, but to say that 3rd person makes or breaks the difficulty is absurd because the game has a lot more modding capability that many of the "noobs" have no idea exists.

If the Day Z team got permission to implement stuff from the Advanced Combat Environment Mod then we could have a lot more going on including a better construction ability, land mines that can be burried, a lot more gadgets for realism, the list goes on and on.

Day Z has done a great job of taking the vanilla game and giving us a proper good Zombie Mod, but the Chernarus Apocalypse missions gave us a taste and they've been out forever. It's the packaging of Day Z that makes it appealing, the difficulty is not that hard.

Drop any 20 of self proclaimed "Elites" in Day Z into a COOP mission on an ACE server and even the AI will make them cry.

3rd person vs 1st is an option that doesn't add or take away for me. I'd like to see more asymmetric capabilities added, and ACE can give us that.

[rocket 16567]

The only reason the mod works, is because of what I ripped and hacked out of the engine to make it work. In my opinion, this is where many mods have come a bit unstuck. They keep adding to an already overworked engine. I started from the ground up and optimized everything until I was happy with it. The use of even single array was carefully considered due to its performance impact.

While things will be added through this alpha, the philosophy of keeping true to the core focus will remain. All new features are tested against these pillars of game design. During pre-alpha I ripped many features out, as they were somewhat inconsequential to the core experience.

I believe a good game experience is just as much about what you don't put in, as what you do. I have a strict rule of not porting anything across - everything must be rewritten from the ground up (but can use the structure and approach of something else) to ensure it is custom built for its purpose. The only exception is the dynamic weather system, which is currently pending a new system that is custom built.

[SuperRaWR 1]

It had a high difficulty before the 1.5.7 patch... and now it's ruined. Happy birthday.

[Pallidum 33]

I have no issue with anyone's preference' date=' but if you are looking for immersion, realism and fairness, first person is the only option for a game like this.

[/quote']

Fully agree with this, and I wish I could play in first person mode. Unfortunately, I'm one of the people cursed with motion sickness in certain games. ARMA2 is one of these games, and it doesn't help me if head-bob or post-processing is turned off. Going third-person lets me play this game without motion sickness.

For what it's worth, different servers having different options is a good thing, because it lets me pick and choose what servers to play on, and I usually do find one that suits my preferences.

[Metiphis 4]

It had a high difficulty before the 1.5.7 patch... and now it's ruined. Happy birthday.

You're an example of the overly-entitled, manchildren that spoil this community. Thank you for being typical and generic.

[droznig 20]

Alpha stage and this community already has an elite group? Because as we know, casual only suggest garbage and l33t shits pure gold.

How about : Please don't listen to garbage suggestion, wether or not it comes from a casual or a hardcore player.

I'm a casual and I like how hard that game is. But I won't mind if some changes create a different gameplay.

I should probably point out that the word "casual" was edited in for me by an admin, I used a different word :)

I'm just saying, making the game "more accessible" means (by definition) catering to people with special needs, if you like your games to be a challenge, you do not fall into this special needs category. The "casual" gamer can not adapt or learn and want's his precious little hand to be held all the way through in case he gets hurt or god forbid, something bad happens when he makes a mistake, of which he makes many.

The not "casual" gamers enjoy a challenge and don't mind if a game is unforgiving and in fact enjoy a game that punishes your mistakes.

[aoshi 32]

i'am a hardcore player i think, but le'ts say... 80% of player basis is casual, soo 80 of the $$$, =(

Edited November 2, 2012 by aoshi1992

[OrLoK 16186]

Hello there

To jump on the 1st vs 3rd isuue, I personally think it should be a server setting and should show up in the MP browser if possible.

Personally, I'm not a fan of 3rd person but I do know many folk like it. I have been chased out of other game forums for having the temerity to ask for a 1st person mod in some games. I just loathe looking at the back of someones head all the time. For me it ruins the immersion. But that's just me.

Different strokes for differnt folks.

The key thing is user choice IHMO.

Rgds

LoK

[Bongofish 22]

So what is the definition of a "hardcore" player?

I know for a fact that many of the people who consider themselves hardcore were the AS50 duping Cherno deathmatchers, and that seems to be exactly not what I would consider "hardcore."

[DrunkPunk 159]

Ignored the rest of your post as it's completely irrelevant to me. My gripe is simply with First Person 'addicts' that want to force their preference on EVERYONE when there are already servers where you can play with other people who enjoy the same style.

Why do you hope this mod will be first person ONLY? As I've already said, there are already servers up that are first person only, whats you're problem? Does everyone else have to play the game the same way as you?

I have to say, claiming that 1st person is more realistic is objective, it doesn't feel realistic or immersive for ME compared to third person. So claiming its the "only way to play" for realism and immersion is frankly complete bollocks. Again, its your opinion, theres no reason why other people shouldn't be able to play differently.

Stick to your hardcore servers and spare the rest of us from your preaching.

Gotta agree with this. While some options might not make sense in the game, providing the choice for people to play how they want (and have been doing so for the entirety of DayZ alpha) is the best thing you can do. Trying to force first person so you can force your preferred method of gameplay is absurd. And the reality is, if there wasn't a large desire for things like third person and crosshairs, then 90% of the servers wouldn't have those options enabled. Nametags, however, i agree need to go. But really, what's the harm in giving the people who rent the servers the option? None at all, and I'd argue there's more harm in removing that option.

[BlksnshN 127]

I use 3rd person for long hikes through the woods but mostly for driving. Your vision while driving (especially backing up) in 1st person is horrible.

Nametags, I hate. It takes away the ability to be stealthy. Might as well just sprint right to where you want to be. However, It would be cool if they worked inside like 5 meters just so you could see who you are talking too.

Crosshairs, don't care.

And I do love my waypoints.