The most common 'cheat' used in DayZ...

[execpro22 128]

How about pseudo interview rather than gameplay?

 

Anyhoo, I dont believe in game comms are complete yet, so we need to see what happens at a later stage. Still a worthy discussion though.

 

Rgds

 

LoK

 

 

 

Dean was in game correct?

 

 

Sacriel was in game correct?

 

They were both talking to each other using VOIP correct?

 

 

I would call that gameplay, but you can call it whatever you wish I guess.

 

 

Tomatoe....Tahmahtow

[blissfulkunt 196]

Seriously? This is the dumbest thing to b**ch about yet. Im not gonna use phone calls to figure out where my friends are. Unbelievable.

[OrLoK 16182]

Who can not be fond of Orlok? Even when disagreeing you are abundantly nice. 

 

I agree on the loot map part although I was guilty when I first started. When the new maps came out I would try to navigate without loot maps and I found it fun, although being a DayZ veteran helps with navigation in general. 

 

I just think this is an issue of practicality. There is no way to actually meet up with friends without using some form of external communication, even setting a meeting place on an outside source is playing the game in a way not intended. Plus we all know DayZ can be long stretches of boring activities punctuated by brief moments of action and that time is easier spent joking around or talking on these outside programs. Like most of these forum disagreements both sides have valid points to make but since it is an online forum it often devolves into cursing and anger that seems way out of proportion to the subject at hand. Frankly I am not sure how you baby blues handle it. 

hello there

 

I actually love to be proved wrong and to learn from different points of view (although it can be difficult egowise to do) none of us are infallible.

 

I can completely understand folk using TS.

 

I too agree "cheating" is too harsh a term and although it can be used for that purpose on the whole (hopefully) its not.

 

What needs to be done (and may well be) is having a system in game that's so much fun that people prefer to use it over vanilla TS.

 

VOIP as many have said, is here to stay and its a brill tool, just in some situations I think it can remove some of a games challenge and fun experiences.

 

In Arma, I've been one side of a wall, separated and alone from my squad, and on the other side of the wall I have heard the whispers and commands of an enemy squad. That,  for me, was a seminal gaming experience, which just would not have happened if we were using TS. I was terrified. *it was a one life per round server which meant that id have an hour or so before I could rejoin* .Ever since that epiphany I just cant go to TS.

 

Rgds

 

LoK

[solodude23 649]

I kind of like the idea of in-game talk being always on. If you talk on TS, you talk in game. Adds back the immersion that TS removes by making it so your actual game character talks if you're talking on TS. Can't talk "behind someones back" while you're 2 feet from em.

The down side is that you're mic is always on so you'd have to mute it to not transmit in game. That'd be pretty annoying.

Of course it's not cheating, and that's clearly not what the OP meant given he used quotations. But it does create a disparity between those who use TS and those who prefer a more immersive experience and go without it.

Edited January 28, 2014 by solodude23

[Fabik 71]

I love how my 'useless' thread has generated 7 pages of comments. :rolleyes:

 

- I didn't say that VoIP should be prevented. It can't be done. Why would I ask for the impossible ?

 

Wow... so many casual players in DayZ, for whom the game is just a platform to socialize with their friends and they don't give a rat's ass if the game succeeds at being a SURVIVAL GAME and not some Second Life clone... :huh:

[cobraneo 7]

Hello there

 

I too think that TS is "cheating" as it doesnt allow for distance etc.

 

What we need to combat apps like TS is a more robust and fun in game system to use.

 

The problem is, if the devs make an amazing radio system, the "instawin" folk out there will just use TS and negate any radio effects.

 

Tying the game into TS like ACRE might be a solution. But there could be a monopolies issue with that. (Ill need to chat with my legal team)

 

I dont think using TS is as evil as proper cheating, rather I find it a shame folk wont use the in game viop.

 

Its as offensive to me as Gamma "exploiting".

 

ie..It's "bad practice" and "not cricket", but people will do it as folk are lazy. IMHO

 

Its a shame IMHO.

 

Rgds

 

LoK

I play with 2 close friends every night and the first thing we do is log on teamspeak, we spend a lot of the time running around in game just chatting having a laugh and generally catching up.

 

I don't understand the problem every organised team have used some form of teamspeak in games for years, why is this game any different?

[1S1K-Airborne 148]

is the use of a 3rd party VoIP software. :)

 

And no, I'm not trolling. And yes, I know this is a lost battle. ;)

 

DayZ characters are not telepaths and shouldn't be able to communicate beyond what 'Direct Communication' allows.

 

Oh and these cheats make KoSing an even better behavior to follow because you never know if the guy's who's acting friendly is not leading you into a trap.

 

VoIP = gamebreaker :rolleyes:

 

So you can't talk with your friends while you're playing.........unless you're within 50 feet of them.

 

Yeah, that sounds super fun, with all the KOS going on, trying to link up with a KOS'd teammate via Steam Text Message, for hours and hours and hours.

 

There hasn't been a game that I know of that's disabled or stopped or outlawed voice chat programs.

[Fabik 71]

I play with 2 close friends every night and the first thing we do is log on teamspeak, we spend a lot of the time running around in game just chatting having a laugh and generally catching up.

 

I don't understand the problem every organised team have used some form of teamspeak in games for years, why is this game any different?

 

Are you playing other games where you are a survivor washed up on a shore with nothing but a torchlight ?

[Blades of Blood 10]

Using VoIP is no different than using two-way radios in game.  Given they don't currently work at the moment, but since it's still in Alpha stage it could be a work-in-progress.  Imagine in the finished game that the radios weren't just basic commercial radios, but actual two-ways, with programmable frequencies.  A group, or squad could be on a set frequency that you couldn't pick up without extensive scanning.  Thus allowing them to talk to each other without you hearing their conversation.  The only arguable counter to this, is if it is across the map, since repeaters wouldn't work without power.  Close proximity on the other hand would in fact work.

[Blades of Blood 10]

If you want more immersion in the game voice chat, ask for the game to change the distance that people can hear you, based on the volume of your talk.  Whispering heard at 50m shouldn't be the same as yelling heard at 50m.

[ratiasu@hotmail.co.jp 122]

Consider TS as whispering, then. A mechanic I highly doubt we'll see decently implemented until beta at the earliest. And even then the "whisper voip" (if we ever even get such a thing), will still ignore walls. It's not any more an unfair advantage as having 4 titans and 6 monitors hooked up.

 

You could see TS as something which counters some of the shortcomings a videogame has which you wouldn't have irl.

Like being able to adjust your voice pitch, using gestures (for communication, not for putting up your hands or giving the finger...) facial expressions, headshakes to indicate directions without making a sound...

Need I go on?

Edited January 28, 2014 by Ratiasu

[solodude23 649]

 

Using VoIP is no different than using two-way radios in game.  Given they don't currently work at the moment, but since it's still in Alpha stage it could be a work-in-progress.  Imagine in the finished game that the radios weren't just basic commercial radios, but actual two-ways, with programmable frequencies.  A group, or squad could be on a set frequency that you couldn't pick up without extensive scanning.  Thus allowing them to talk to each other without you hearing their conversation.  The only arguable counter to this, is if it is across the map, since repeaters wouldn't work without power.  Close proximity on the other hand would in fact work.

Except when you use VoIP your in-game character doesn't make any noise. I'm guessing the use of radios will still require you to talk aloud in-game so people in that proximity will still hear you. Aka it's not like telepathy lol.

Edited January 28, 2014 by solodude23

[BL1P 252]

 

 

Except when you use VoIP your in-game character doesn't make any noise. I'm guessing the use of radios will still require you to talk aloud in-game so people in that proximity will still hear you. Aka it's not like telepathy lol.

 

 

Yer when you use the ingame radio you also use the direct chat so yes you can be herd talking into the radio.

You can also hear what is said on the radio if you are close to the person reviving the message.

 

You can also place 1 radio in a building after turning it on and use another radio to transmit to it and people will hear it in direct.

 

All tested and working :)

[bad_mojo (DayZ) 1204]

I don't see outside communication as circumventing a game restraint. I find that notion foolish at best. I regularly play with my friend physically near me. 

 

So the question that really needs asking is, what benefits will the game get by arbitrarily limiting something that seems natural to the gaming scene?

 

I knew you'd avoid the question.

[Sidewinder24 103]

I think people just need to realize that when Dean promised us the "anti-game" where authenticity was paramount, mechanics were intended to be inaccessible, and it wasn't made with everyone in mind, he, whether he knew it at the time or not, was lying through his teeth.

 

The truth is, once the casual masses got their hands on it and started throwing money at Dean, they made it their own game with Teamspeak, loot maps, 3PP view exploitation, gamma adjustments to circumvent darkness, and Dean didn't give a fuck after that. For those poor souls that still believe DayZ to be a hardcore survival game, I just feel sad for you. Moving forward based on the team's attitude toward design, things will gradually get easier and easier. You'll see your location on a virtual in-game map, you'll start spawning with your friends, PvE-only servers will start cropping up and Dean with call them "Normal" servers.

 

A year from now when people make a thread here on the forums complaining about how it's dumb that everyone spawns with an M4 and 200 rounds of ammo, there will be an uproar about how you're trying to dictate how someone else enjoys playing the game. They'll threaten, in the off chance that starting M4's are removed, the majority of the playerbase will stop playing.

 

Not conforming to the casual movement is losing battle. If you're looking for that unforgiving, one-of-a-kind experience that was described a year ago, it's time to move on because DayZ isn't going to be that game.

[wartzilla 182]

Only solutions I can think of are :-

 

Make the ingame direct chat always on with no option to disable.

If you are using TS or any voice prog or the mic it will transmit ingame, if they are with you ingame they will hear an echo every time you speak.

 

Or

 

Allow DayZ to search your pc for any other util using voip and then it should ask you to disable it or it dayz will shutdown.

 

Or 

 

DayZ uses ACRE and every server has its own TS and that TS will not allow you to join if you dont have ACRE turned on.

Servers will auto join you to the server TS.

Could they code such that the game will process anything picked up on a microphone as "direct communication"?

 

People would hate this, but I bet its easily doable and doesnt require you to worry about whatever other apps they have running.  If you dont want to make sound, you literally cant make sound, or you mute your mic.

So us minmaxers will connect our mics to phones or laptops, and we will no longer be able to use direct chat, thus making us even more likely to shoot everyone instead of talking to them.

 

Great idea. I mean, fine, it'll cause us a bit of hassle and it'll make you guys whine more about 'kill on sight', but other than that I don't really care. It's just really unnecessary to do this.

The day the dev team decides to be the first developer in history to actively hunt for VOIP programs on players' computers will be a sad day in gaming history. Not that it'll happen, because unlike this forum Bohemia is not a mental institution.

[cobraneo 7]

Are you playing other games where you are a survivor washed up on a shore with nothing but a torchlight ?

No but dayz rewards organised team play, just like all other competitive online games, and the best way to be organised is good communication like teamspeak.

 

And also its a lot more fun than just sitting for hours on end in silent.

 

combat logging, ghosting and using third party maps that's cheating

[quantum2k6 348]

Could they code such that the game will process anything picked up on a microphone as "direct communication"?

 

People would hate this, but I bet its easily doable and doesnt require you to worry about whatever other apps they have running.  If you dont want to make sound, you literally cant make sound, or you mute your mic.

ok then im using my laptop or smartphone, or tablet for teamspeak.... :lol:

 

omg

 

think -> post...

 

useless topic...

 

Edit*

 

ohhh and we forgott the good oldscool lanpartys... ;)

Edited January 29, 2014 by quantum2k6

[Mdogg2005 447]

I fail to see how using Skype to meet up with the people I play with is a problem.  If I had to scour the map to find someone I'm trying to play with I would not play.  Spending hours searching only to be killed is not fun and I would not do it.  If I want to use Skype to play with my friends and say "Ok hey I found a sign I spawned in X, where can we all go to meet up?" I am going to do so.  It makes no sense for me not to be able to.  Yes it sucks when that douchebag kid who has no skills uses it to do what he did in that video, but ya know what?  Not everyone does that.  And trying to force others away from something useful to play together just because others abuse it is fucked.

[bad_mojo (DayZ) 1204]

I think people just need to realize that when Dean promised us the "anti-game" where authenticity was paramount, mechanics were intended to be inaccessible, and it wasn't made with everyone in mind, he, whether he knew it at the time or not, was lying through his teeth.

 

The truth is, once the casual masses got their hands on it and started throwing money at Dean, they made it their own game with Teamspeak, loot maps, 3PP view exploitation, gamma adjustments to circumvent darkness, and Dean didn't give a fuck after that. For those poor souls that still believe DayZ to be a hardcore survival game, I just feel sad for you. Moving forward based on the team's attitude toward design, things will gradually get easier and easier. You'll see your location on a virtual in-game map, you'll start spawning with your friends, PvE-only servers will start cropping up and Dean with call them "Normal" servers.

 

A year from now when people make a thread here on the forums complaining about how it's dumb that everyone spawns with an M4 and 200 rounds of ammo, there will be an uproar about how you're trying to dictate how someone else enjoys playing the game. They'll threaten, in the off chance that starting M4's are removed, the majority of the playerbase will stop playing.

 

Not conforming to the casual movement is losing battle. If you're looking for that unforgiving, one-of-a-kind experience that was described a year ago, it's time to move on because DayZ isn't going to be that game.

 

I fear you are correct. DayZ has more potential than any other game to become a real hardcore survival experience, but at this point it looks like we'll be waiting for mods to see that dream become a reality.

[Mdogg2005 447]

ok then im using my laptop or smartphone, or tablet for teamspeak....

 

omg

 

think -> post...

 

useless topic...

This.  And ya know what? The same people that are bitching about this are the same people who are bitching that not enough people communicate or cooperate with each other.  Fucking cracks me up how ass backwards some of the people on this forum are.  Nobody thinks before making their stupid suggestions just because they don't like that other people play with friends and it's occasionally unfriendly to them.

[Mdogg2005 447]

I fear you are correct. DayZ has more potential than any other game to become a real hardcore survival experience, but at this point it looks like we'll be waiting for mods to see that dream become a reality.

And queue the naysayers.  Ok move along then if you don't like the game.  That'll be two less whiners we won't have to see poluting the forums with awful suggestions to "make the game better, hurr durr"

[Monkfish (DayZ) 339]

I kind of like the idea of in-game talk being always on. If you talk on TS, you talk in game. Adds back the immersion that TS removes by making it so your actual game character talks if you're talking on TS. Can't talk "behind someones back" while you're 2 feet from em.

The down side is that you're mic is always on so you'd have to mute it to not transmit in game. That'd be pretty annoying.

And muting the always-transmitting mic is... exactly the same as using PTT :lol:. Always transmitting is a daft idea anyway. How many times has someone played a game online and some complete helmet isn't using PTT and is broadcasting everything that is going on around them, presumably because they live in a factory or inside a metal bin rolling down a flight of stairs. It's disruptive, annoying and, well, a little bit inconsiderate of others.

 

There is no fix for VOIP and there never will be. The best we can hope for, as Orlok said, is an in-game system that's fun, easy and immersive, but even then people will still use VOIP simply because they can.

 

I think people just need to realize that when Dean promised us the "anti-game" where authenticity was paramount, mechanics were intended to be inaccessible, and it wasn't made with everyone in mind, he, whether he knew it at the time or not, was lying through his teeth.

 

The truth is, once the casual masses got their hands on it and started throwing money at Dean, they made it their own game with Teamspeak, loot maps, 3PP view exploitation, gamma adjustments to circumvent darkness, and Dean didn't give a fuck after that. For those poor souls that still believe DayZ to be a hardcore survival game, I just feel sad for you. Moving forward based on the team's attitude toward design, things will gradually get easier and easier. You'll see your location on a virtual in-game map, you'll start spawning with your friends, PvE-only servers will start cropping up and Dean with call them "Normal" servers.

 

A year from now when people make a thread here on the forums complaining about how it's dumb that everyone spawns with an M4 and 200 rounds of ammo, there will be an uproar about how you're trying to dictate how someone else enjoys playing the game. They'll threaten, in the off chance that starting M4's are removed, the majority of the playerbase will stop playing.

 

Not conforming to the casual movement is losing battle. If you're looking for that unforgiving, one-of-a-kind experience that was described a year ago, it's time to move on because DayZ isn't going to be that game.

That's quite the bold statement to make a mere 7 weeks or so into the alpha. You're welcome to your opinion, of course, regardless of how wrong it is, and I'll bet my left testicle that in a year, we'll have something that most certainly isn't <insert favourite shooter> in a different dress.

Edited January 29, 2014 by Monkfish

[over9000nukez 199]

are you telling me , OP, that with friends you use the direct chat? or do you play "none cheaty"

I get it its kind of weird, but everyone has the power of telepathy, only thing is you cant whiser like in IRL, so if I whisper everyone will hear me from 2 houses away. also the experience is a little bit crap if your relying on the direct chat, it would make for way better combat, being careful for the opponent to not hear you from 2 houses down, but then again, irl in a situation like that id whisper the plan to my friend, and we'd go. I use it more for when in combat, that's the most important time for it, but it is a double edged sword, the enemy could use it, and you could too.

[Mdogg2005 447]

Don't get me wrong.  That video you posted makes my blood boil.  If you use yourself as bait to fuck over legit bandits (notice how they didn't kill him or feed him anything nasty, they took what they NEEDED, let him keep most of his stuff, and then let him go saying good luck) and then call your "super uber leet killsquad" over Teamspeak to fuck them over, that's just wrong.

Unfortunately there will always be players like this.  You just need to play smart.  If someone stalls over in game VOIP, I take them out because I know what they're doing.  And you can tell a stall between a legit player.

Edited January 29, 2014 by Mdogg2005