The one and only Anti-PVP/PvP Discussion thread! Whine/discuss here!

[UnrealUndead 0]

What if you guy as no weapon yet cause all the game is spawning is tin cans. oh wait you just shoot him anyways cause your not roleplaying in the game your just shooting people cause you want too' date='and you get free stuff, maybe crappy stuff but its free to you so why not shoot them, they are obviously not trying to play the game correctly

[/quote']

Play the game correctly? There is no way to play it correctly, everyone plays how he wants, and I like the way the game is right now.

[thywolf@live.ca 3]

Play the game correctly? There is no way to play it correctly' date=' everyone plays how he wants, and I like the way the game is right now.

[/quote']

Where you made supplies impossible to get to because of barbwire fences and then go shoot people trying to survive because you can?

Sorry I thought this was not COD for a second there, my bad

[UnrealUndead 0]

Play the game correctly? There is no way to play it correctly' date=' everyone plays how he wants, and I like the way the game is right now.

[/quote']

Where you made supplies impossible to get to because of barbwire fences and then go shoot people trying to survive because you can?

Sorry I thought this was not COD for a second there, my bad

Yeah the barbwire fences are really stupid, but u wont change that there are some guys who just shoot everyone, its fun for them so it will be in future too... u can make it more difficult for them but u wont forbid it.

Sorry for my bad english :D

[unknown..2..u 0]

I played operation Flashpoint and all of the other Arma series before i ever played COD, i also hate the fucking bandits and think too many of them ruin the game.

Does that make me a COD kid?

Or does that make you a fucking idiot?

[dajonkel 3]

My view on this is pretty simple; "Bandit" players in Arma2/DayZ mod are comparable to let's say people playing Grand Theft Auto purely to race with cars, whine about cars, cheats about cars, mods about cars and don't care one bit about -everything- the game really is.

In the context of the DayZ mod I'm willing to go as far as saying they are RUINING not only the "real" players fun, but also the developers who are forced to deal with "cars" all the frigging time while they wanted to focus on everything else the game has to offer.

Especially when keeping in mind that there's specific "racing" games for people who just want to "race".

If it were my mod I'd have everyone who wanted to play fill in a request form.

[MindYourBulletz 0]

this is your story.You guys hate bandits? like legacy perfectly said' date=' do something bout it. You can't remove a mechanic only because you don't like it. and in a full loot open world with pvp, you can't ask so closed mind stuff,specially in a sandbox.

Some people don't even read patch note and still complain."ho, make something to detect bandits".Now you have the heart sound when you target bandits since days..morrons(i didnt say carebears cod kiddies hoyeahhhh!!!!).Enjoy.

[/quote']

I agree, without us bandits, DayZ would be boring and wouldnt be at its full potential as it is now..

[Somrik 0]

See i think the problem is that right now there's no incentive to trust and not kill anyone else.

"Who is this? I dont know him. He doesnt know me. I dont trust him. He doesnt trust me. He's probably going to shoot me. I SHOULD SHOOT HIM FIRST!"

As for one of the first posts: "Create a safer environment..."

Like what? Shooting the others first? There's no bandit skin anymore or at least not one that is changed automatically. So now everyone is a potential target.

Well... I guess if everyone's dead its a very safe environment.

Compound that with the fact that there is literally no penalty to killing other people.

Sure on non-hardcore servers you can see the name but if you kill someone pretty far inland by the time they get back you're long gone. Or hiding in the hills watching them through a scope and killing them again.

[funionz 7]

Round and round we go, 40 pages strong of the same arguments with the same answers

[septuscap 42]

I think I have mentioned this twice: you should not have to contact someone on a forum to avoid shooting eachother on sight' date=' it should be possible within the game. If you are talking about this actually happening randomly in-game, then yes, it CAN happen, but you need to be extremely naive to even dare getting in a situation involving another player right now. I've had someone say "friendly!", where he would just shoot me in the face the second I let him approach me.

[/quote']

First off, how do you think bandit groups are set up? You think bandits just walk up to each other and go "BANDIT?" "YEA MAN LET'S TEAM UP"

Because that's literally what survivors do. AND THEY EXPECT THAT TO WORK.

Of COURSE you need to meta the game to a degree, because there is this thing called LOGGING OUT. You don't spend 24/7 with your trusted friends in this game. You need to meta to ask your buddy if he's going to play, and if he's still where you guys last logged out.

If you approach a stranger, have a buddy keep sights on him while you get closer to try and communicate. STAY BEHIND COVER UNTIL YOU'VE ESTABLISHED COMMUNICATION. Figure out what's going through his head. Test him while your friend is still on overwatch -- is he trying to lead you into a trap? Betray you? Chat a bit and see if he seems amiable; or if he seems disconnected somehow, like maybe he's IN ANOTHER TEAMSPEAK ORGANIZING AN AMBUSH.

This is the kind of effort bandits put into their kills. Whether they trick some one into trusting them, lead entire groups into ambushes (see:

), stalk prey while hiding in the shadows, figure out what you're doing and cut you off for that surprise head shot, etc.

City/Base building and the like will be welcome additions to the game if/when rocket gets around to it. But this game is no place for bad players.

[Mr Muggles 19]

this is your story.You guys hate bandits? like legacy perfectly said' date=' do something bout it. You can't remove a mechanic only because you don't like it. and in a full loot open world with pvp, you can't ask so closed mind stuff,specially in a sandbox.

Some people don't even read patch note and still complain."ho, make something to detect bandits".Now you have the heart sound when you target bandits since days..morrons(i didnt say carebears cod kiddies hoyeahhhh!!!!).Enjoy.

[/quote']

I agree, without us bandits, DayZ would be boring and wouldnt be at its full potential as it is now..

Sniping people from 500m away?

You and your lot are not bandits, you're cowards.

[teih 36]

First off' date=' how do you think bandit groups are set up? You think bandits just walk up to each other and go "BANDIT?" "YEA MAN LET'S TEAM UP"

Because that's literally what survivors do. AND THEY EXPECT THAT TO WORK.

[/quote']

Bandits and survivors are two completely different things. On one side you have the bandits who seek to take advantage of other people, form gangs and take controll over their environment. On the other side you have the survivers who solely wish to get through the crisis alive, surviving the ongoing threat of the harsh environment, zombies and bandits, while also meeting up with fellow survivors along the way who share their goals and problems.

Now, think about real life criminals for a second, or more specificly gang members. Do they trust others in their environment? No. Do they Accept random people into their gangs? No. This is why meta-gaming is required for that type of gameplay, just like joining a real gang requires more than just walking in and asking for a membership (which also is the case for most internet groups/clans).

On the other hand, let's have a look at every day people (the survivors). In THEIR environment do they trust others? Mostly yes. You can walk down the street and expect to be safe. Can you do that in a gang-environment? No. Now I know what you are thinking: "But they aren't in their environment anymore!". Yes, that is true, but you are a product of your environment, and if you read Squatthrust's post on page 35 for a lesson on human nature, you'll see why the current state of the survivors in DayZ makes absolutely no sense.

They mostly don't even seek out gang environments at all, and usually go in small groups (hence why a bloody forum application should not be necessary), maybe with people they don't even know. It only makes sense in terms of survival. Maybe they'll part ways at some point, or maybe they'll stick together.

Do you see what I am getting at here? In a zombie apocalypse normal every day people would not go through the same process as bandits in order to join groups, not to mention that you CAN'T compair organized bandit gangs to small time groups amongs survivers who stick together in the moment, and not in the long term. It's painfully obvious.

As for survivergangs or whatever you want to call them, they naturaly go through the same process as the bandits, or any other organized social group, although I assume these gangs would be very rare.

Of COURSE you need to meta the game to a degree, because there is this thing called LOGGING OUT. You don't spend 24/7 with your trusted friends in this game. You need to meta to ask your buddy if he's going to play, and if he's still where you guys last logged out.

Hence my previous posts which explained these things.

The game needs a way to see the difference between survivors and bandits so that we don't NEED meta-gaming for the very basics of social interaction, and you completely fail to see that we aren't just talking about longterm cooperation between players here, but situational ones as well. Some of us enjoy meeting NEW people in games (yes, other than your real life friends, believe it or not.) and not only on the forums, for reasons I have - as I said- already explained before. It should be a part of the survival experience, JUST LIKE THE PVP ASPECT WITH BANDITS IS A PART OF THE EXPERIENCE AS WELL :).

If you approach a stranger, have a buddy keep sights on him while you get closer to try and communicate. STAY BEHIND COVER UNTIL YOU'VE ESTABLISHED COMMUNICATION. Figure out what's going through his head. Test him while your friend is still on overwatch -- is he trying to lead you into a trap? Betray you? Chat a bit and see if he seems amiable; or if he seems disconnected somehow, like maybe he's IN ANOTHER TEAMSPEAK ORGANIZING AN AMBUSH.

Going through all of this every time you want some social contact would be ridiculous, and noone, I repeat noone would have the patience or interest to do all this over and over and over again for such a basic element in any game. It is a flawed system to say the least. Besides, most people get shot before they can even react.

Really, how can you expect the survivors to go through all of that just to get in contact with a player with common interests? The bandits play a whole different role and as I said naturaly have different approaches to the social aspect of the game.

[funionz 7]

this is your story.You guys hate bandits? like legacy perfectly said' date=' do something bout it. You can't remove a mechanic only because you don't like it. and in a full loot open world with pvp, you can't ask so closed mind stuff,specially in a sandbox.

Some people don't even read patch note and still complain."ho, make something to detect bandits".Now you have the heart sound when you target bandits since days..morrons(i didnt say carebears cod kiddies hoyeahhhh!!!!).Enjoy.

[/quote']

I agree, without us bandits, DayZ would be boring and wouldnt be at its full potential as it is now..

Sniping people from 500m away?

You and your lot are not bandits, you're cowards.

Yeah cause sniping from 10ft away is totally how it should be done. Don't call someone a coward because the other person didn't have the common sense to use cover.

Just because someone didn't rush you like an idiot and give you a chance to kill them doesn't make them weak, it makes you an idiot for not taking the proper precautions.

[teih 36]

Yeah cause sniping from 10ft away is totally how it should be done. Don't call someone a coward because the other person didn't have the common sense to use cover.

Just because someone didn't rush you like an idiot and give you a chance to kill them doesn't make them weak' date=' it makes you an idiot for not taking the proper precautions.

[/quote']

Others have mentioned this before, but how you manage to spot snipers hiding in bushes along the treelines 500 meters away - sometimes even wearing ghillie suits - is beyond me. I am going to tell you right now that it is near impossible, especialy considering snipers can show up at any given time. They don't always wait for you.

They can be anywhere, and unfortunately it isn't possible to stay in cover from every single angle.

I don't want this to go away though, but I would like it to be toned way down. Maybe making sniper rifles far less common.

[Kageru 18]

It wouldn't be so bad if it was good death-match, but really when you look at it like that the only strengths it has is a perfect environment for sniper / long range rifles and a slow re-gearing process.

[funionz 7]

Yeah cause sniping from 10ft away is totally how it should be done. Don't call someone a coward because the other person didn't have the common sense to use cover.

Just because someone didn't rush you like an idiot and give you a chance to kill them doesn't make them weak' date=' it makes you an idiot for not taking the proper precautions.

[/quote']

Others have mentioned this before, but how you manage to spot snipers hiding in bushes along the treelines 500 meters away - sometimes even wearing ghillie suits - is beyond me. I am going to tell you right now that it is near impossible, especialy considering snipers can show up at any given time. They don't always wait for you.

They can be anywhere, and unfortunately it isn't possible to stay in cover from every single angle.

I don't want this to go away though, but I would like it to be toned way down. Maybe making sniper rifles far less common.

It's not always possible, and it's not always fair. But that's what this is all about, it's just like war. There's no such thing as balance in war, there's only the victor with the superior weapons/tactics. So there's a guy with better camo, a better gun, and he's well hidden, he earned his kills. Yes, it sucks, I've been gunned down a million times by those guys, it pisses me off and discourages me all the same. Hell usually I stop playing for the day at that point. But I always come back, and I don't make a thread complaining about it, that's what separates the players from the whiners.

As of right now, sniper rifles are pretty rare. The problem is, the people who had them before, generally still have them, and the people who will server hop to get them or camp empty servers for them. Is there an immediate solution? You could place a wait inbetween connections to servers, that would discourage some of it. Maybe eliminate high end loot for servers with less than 25% of capacity?

Personally if it were up to me, i'd wipe everyones characters every major patch version (i.e. 1.5, 1.6, 1.7, 1.8) as I feel that's the only true way to "test" a new release, especially in the alpha stage. See how many people like losing their tents and trucks filled with farmed/duped loot. It personally wouldn't affect myself, as I do most of my killing with low end weapons.

As for the coastal cities, as much as it'd suck, i'd have to say the only way to really force people inland would be to move stuff farther in, either make things extremely scarce in the city (which would kinda fit, after years and years of looting, a city would be the first place picked clean) and make the random sheds and barns in the country actually worth going to (i.e. not full of hatchets and double barreled ammo). Hide ammo inside of the wrecked cars, like just a single magazine on the floorboards. We need more loot spawns in town, and randomized ones at that. Maybe add some extra places for loot to spawn then randomly choose which loot piles will actually spawn, and randomize again when piles are depleted. People have become so used to it all, all we really do is skip 90% of the town and head straight for the loot buildings we all know and love.

[teih 36]

It's not always possible' date=' and it's not always fair. But that's what this is all about, it's just like war. There's no such thing as balance in war, there's only the victor with the superior weapons/tactics. So there's a guy with better camo, a better gun, and he's well hidden, he earned his kills. Yes, it sucks, I've been gunned down a million times by those guys, it pisses me off and discourages me all the same. Hell usually I stop playing for the day at that point. But I always come back, and I don't make a thread complaining about it, that's what separates the players from the whiners.

As of right now, sniper rifles are pretty rare. The problem is, the people who had them before, generally still have them, and the people who will server hop to get them or camp empty servers for them. Is there an immediate solution? You could place a wait inbetween connections to servers, that would discourage some of it. Maybe eliminate high end loot for servers with less than 25% of capacity?

Personally if it were up to me, i'd wipe everyones characters every major patch version (i.e. 1.5, 1.6, 1.7, 1.8) as I feel that's the only true way to "test" a new release, especially in the alpha stage. See how many people like losing their tents and trucks filled with farmed/duped loot. It personally wouldn't affect myself, as I do most of my killing with low end weapons.

As for the coastal cities, as much as it'd suck, i'd have to say the only way to really force people inland would be to move stuff farther in, either make things extremely scarce in the city (which would kinda fit, after years and years of looting, a city would be the first place picked clean) and make the random sheds and barns in the country actually worth going to (i.e. not full of hatchets and double barreled ammo). Hide ammo inside of the wrecked cars, like just a single magazine on the floorboards. We need more loot spawns in town, and randomized ones at that. Maybe add some extra places for loot to spawn then randomly choose which loot piles will actually spawn, and randomize again when piles are depleted. People have become so used to it all, all we really do is skip 90% of the town and head straight for the loot buildings we all know and love.

[/quote']

Good post.

But the problem is that unlike in a war where there are ways to counter snipers in different ways, there really isn't much you can do against them in DayZ, unless they are extremely clumbsy.

They need to be less common, and less, well, invincible out in the woods. In cities atleast they are possible to spot, and you can stay in cover from the typical sniper spots (like roofs and the likes). I'm not saying I have a solution to the whole forestsniper issue, and there might not even be one.

And also - although many do - most of us aren't "whining", but trying to give constructive feedback from the alpha in order to share what in our eyes works and doesn't work, in order to improve the game.

Other than that I agree with you, and maybe, as you said, if the issues with server hoping is dealt with it will automaticly go down to a more managable level.

[dallas 5195]

On a 225km2 map you can't really blame people for sniping and there's alot of ways to avoid snipers or atleast become less of a sitting duck. Sniper set up where most players congregate. It makes absolutely no sense to cast your spiderweb, where there's no flies. Snipers, like predators are drawn to wateringholes, where there's most traffic and where their prey are forced to enter their kill zone.

If you absolutely must enter Cherno or Elektro, keep on the move, do not cross open areas or move in a too predictable manner. Keep cover close and change direction constantly, skip through alleys and turn every corner. Inside the city, be constantly aware of tall buildings and the surrounding hills. Exiting cities, search for concealed escape routes, treelines and terrain.

[FlashHawk4 44]

My attitude is this:

Sniping is unfair. Extremely unfair.

But that's what war is. It's not a duel in the modern world. People don't go around designing weak points in tank armor "for the love of the game". They try to figure out the best way possible to increase their asskicking abilities without getting their own asses kicked.

Snipers are soldiers' worst fears. They can be shot at any time, from anywhere, even where they think they're safe. You don't know where he is, you don't know where to shoot, you don't know what to do. But they don't get to complain, they have to deal with the sniper then and there.

Soldiers have procedures to deal with snipers when they fire, and how to make themselves less appealing targets. When in urban areas, they cling to walls and stay low. They don't move in straight lines when they cross open areas. They have patrols, searches, air support, and countersnipers.

Why can't you do those things? There's nothing stopping you from organizing them. Maybe that should be your longstanding goal. Instead of mindlessly pulling beans and bullet from the ruins of society, plan ahead, and pick a goal. Mine is to acquire a helicopter and set up a base camp. Yours can be to set up a group to hunt them down. Go watch some documentaries or something. Learn, don't complain.

[funionz 7]

On a 225km2 map you can't really blame people for sniping and there's alot of ways to avoid snipers or atleast become less of a sitting duck. Sniper set up where most players congregate. It makes absolutely no sense to cast your spiderweb' date=' where there's no flies. Snipers, like predators are drawn to wateringholes, where there's most traffic and where their prey are forced to enter their kill zone.

If you absolutely must enter Cherno or Elektro, keep on the move, do not cross open areas or move in a too predictable manner. Keep cover close and change direction constantly, skip through alleys and turn every corner. Inside the city, be constantly aware of tall buildings and the surrounding hills. Exiting cities, search for concealed escape routes, treelines and terrain.

[/quote']

Exactly.

What's helped me most as a player is playing as the bandit sniper, you get a feel for the lay of the land so to speak, you start to realize those areas you used to crouch and move slow through were esentially killzones for snipers that had the high ground.

Whenever you move through the city, always think like your enemy, watch the rooftops. If you have a doubt about an area, avoid it. Scan the treeline for snipers, they aren't hard to make out at a distance because the grass fades after so far, and most snipers aren't good enough to hide themselves, they are just some random scrub who got lucky and found a CZ.

[Entaro (DayZ) 33]

Very few of the player kills in this game are for survival.

This is the truth of it. Sniping could be made more difficult, or more rare, sure. But ultimately the best way to deal with the issue of serial killers is by making survival a bigger element of the game.

The lack of constant survival in the later stage of character life is what fosters the environment of bored players engaging in deathmatch behavior.

Its not anti-PVP. You can't take pvp out of the game, it is a huge part of the exhilaration and constant fear/frustration. But getting ganked for no reason by somebody you didn't see 100's of meters away is just boring.

^ And that above behavior has negative consequences for the game. It fosters the KOS mentality that is more and more prevalent. It is frustrating and nerve racking enough when you encounter somebody you don't know without adding the baggage of being constantly ganked. Getting constantly ganked just reinforces a shoot first policy and further dilutes the gameplay.

[septuscap 42]

What's helped me most as a player is playing as the bandit sniper' date=' you get a feel for the lay of the land so to speak, you start to realize those areas you used to crouch and move slow through were esentially killzones for snipers that had the high ground.

[/quote']

This by far is what most survivors need to do. I don't even use a legit sniper rifle, but even with an m16 acog, it is RIDICULOUS how many survivors just crawl around IN THE OPEN.

Like I said, I've literally only been sniped twice in this game, and that's usually because my group will sweep perimeters and put in the extra leg work, and I keep track of what cover I have available and where I'm exposed.

And before some newb survivor replies, running along a tree line is not cover. I don't know how people mixed up running through the trees with running along the tree LINE where you are obscenely visible.

[rymdkejsaren@gmail.com 0]

Out of all the things that can be done I feel that fixing disconnections to bail out of fights and server hoping would be the most effective. That would bring down the amount of random killing since people would have to start taking larger risks.

A lot of the people that are going on murder streaks for the fun of it are doing it now because they are also the kind of people who will gladly expoit these features in order to stay alive. So they kill some people on one server and if things start getting hot, disconnect under fire and go on another server.

Before something is done about those two, I think a lot of this discussion is moot. People hunting PKs cannot use these mechanics against the PKs so the playing field is not level.

Just for the record, I am totally against any kind of in game mechanic that punishes you for killing survivors.

[septuscap 42]

Its not anti-PVP. You can't take pvp out of the game' date=' it is a huge part of the exhilaration and constant fear/frustration. But getting ganked for no reason by somebody you didn't see 100's of meters away is just boring. [/quote']

Finding a sniper is pretty intense. In fact one of the best feelings in the game is taking one out while he's focused on your friends and they're just wailing locations over VOIP.

"HE'S ON THE TOWER, FACING WEST ON US."

I sneak around the southeast. Ask my friend to make a diversion while I close the distance to the tower. He darts from cover to cover while I dash to the base of the tower. Climb up the ladder and dome the guy while he's busy trying to get that kill on my buddy.

Sure sometimes we'll lose a guy. If it's a good sniper, that's usually the cost of even realizing there's one in the area, but often we're alerted when some poor sod in the area gets domed and we hear the shot. When one of us DOES go down though, we're spread out enough that the rest of us can react. We're not all just huddled together like I see so many survivors doing, pinned down under a rock getting slaughtered.

Honestly 99% of the problem is bad players.

^ And that above behavior has negative consequences for the game. It fosters the KOS mentality that is more and more prevalent. It is frustrating and nerve racking enough when you encounter somebody you don't know without adding the baggage of being constantly ganked. Getting constantly ganked just reinforces a shoot first policy and further dilutes the gameplay.

The KOS mentality hasn't changed at all. The ratio of bandits:survivors on the main page is still the same' date=' as is the ratio of survivors killed vs bandits killed. I think some one measured the increase in kills since the removal of bandit skins to be something stupid like 1%. Trying to draw conclusions from that small a change is complete fabrication.

I'm sure there was some illusion of safety -- like at least if you saw a bandit skin you'd know to just stay under that bush. But the stats haven't changed much because the game is still essentially the same; survivors running around wrecklessly getting killed by bandits, with bandits killing each other as well. (about 1 in 6 kills is a bandit dying) That's not b/c bandits are elite, it's because survivors are complete morons. The GOOD survivors are approaching players with care (almost as if they were bandits stalking their prey). Or avoiding players altogether (equally skillful).

Survivors have to become competent before anything else. Getting sniped by that obvious sniper on the tower in Cherno is worse than a rookie mistake. And those are the people complaining.

[hr']

Really' date=' how can you expect the survivors to go through all of that just to get in contact with a player with common interests? The bandits play a whole different role and as I said naturaly have different approaches to the social aspect of the game.

[/quote']

How can I expect you to put as much effort into meeting some one as I do into getting a kill?

On the one hand, you're saying this is the apocalypse and bandits are playing it like a game (not realistic that there are so many bandits blah blah). On the other, you're saying survivors would (or should be able to) just run out in the open yelling "FRIENDLIES??" like morons.

There are survivors who run around providing medical assistance for other players (see: Dr. Wasteland). There are survivors who are setting up a trade city (see: Freeside Trading Co). There are teamspeak hosts that gather as many players as possible so you can always fine some one to play with. (see: Worlds End Gaming). There are survivors who are hiding in the shadows, killing any murderers they witness. There are survivors who are stealthily avoiding any player, friend or foe. There are survivors who approach strangers with CARE (like they "REALISTICALLY" would, not just turning their back on a stranger with a gun pointed at them).

It takes skill to play this game, no denying. Taking that out of the equation makes the game WORSE, not better. No one should care that you can't run around in the open suicidally approaching anyone you see and turning your back so he can split your skull. And no one does except the morons who do this.

[rome 58]

Out of all the things that can be done I feel that fixing disconnections to bail out of fights' date=' and server hoping. That would bring down the amount of random killing since people would have to start taking larger risks.

A lot of the people that are going on murder streaks for the fun of it are doing it now because they are also the kind of people who will gladly expoit these features in order to stay alive. So they kill some people on one server and if things start getting hot, disconnect under fire and go on another server.

Before something is done about those two, I think a lot of this discussion is moot. People hunting PKs cannot use these mechanics against the PKs so the playing field is not level.

Just for the record, I am totally against any kind of in game mechanic that punishes you for killing survivors.

[/quote']

I am not barack obama, and i support this message.

[funionz 7]

Very few of the player kills in this game are for survival.

This is the truth of it. Sniping could be made more difficult' date=' or more rare, sure. But ultimately the best way to deal with the issue of serial killers is by making survival a bigger element of the game.

The lack of constant survival in the later stage of character life is what fosters the environment of bored players engaging in deathmatch behavior.

Its not anti-PVP. You can't take pvp out of the game, it is a huge part of the exhilaration and constant fear/frustration. But getting ganked for no reason by somebody you didn't see 100's of meters away is just boring.

^ And that above behavior has negative consequences for the game. It fosters the KOS mentality that is more and more prevalent. It is frustrating and nerve racking enough when you encounter somebody you don't know without adding the baggage of being constantly ganked. Getting constantly ganked just reinforces a shoot first policy and further dilutes the gameplay.

[/quote']

Barring the fact that this is the 1 millionth post along the same lines as 'i got killed by another player I didn't see, plz nerf', I will respond the most cordial and truthful way I can.

There is no possible way we can do anything to circumvent the need for KOS or PVP without stifling the playstyle of others. Plain and simple, that is undeniable fact. You can put in all the PVE extras you want, you could make it so we had entire cities that were player run and defended, and there will still be asshats camping the beach with a rifle. You can add all the features in the world, it will still happen. The sooner this community can accept this as a whole, the sooner we can all move on.