Why is the world of dayz so static ?

[pogosphere 27]

Before i start:

Plz dont answer the following questions with :"Its just an alpha!"

Its just an alpha for almost 3 years now.
You are working very hard on becoming the next duke nukem forever.

The rant is starting in   3,2,1 ....  hf.


The Questions:


Static world:

-Why is the world in the game so static.I cant even destroy a wooden fence or door, with an axe.Even half life 2 , nine years ago , had destructible wooden objects.
 You must not even look at games like crysis,battlefield,the division or infamous-second sun, which have state of the art physics.Almost every game since the last 10 years has a physic  engine to some degree, you have none, not in the slightest!!Beside of text-fade ins and opening animations for doors, there is absolute no hint of interacting with the environment.

What sense makes a large map, when players on the map cant even interact with objects on the map in a physical way, because the server cant handle the traffic, or runs out of memory.
Your netcode is terrible optimized since arma 2. I cant even play arma 3 with an geforce gtx 780 on high settings(high not ultra!) on most server, without heavy framedrops almost everywhere on the map.

Nearly every action in this game from opening a waterbottle/can to climbing over a fence , drinking water, eating , fighting with an axe or your fists feels ether:

-clunky
-is clipping
-incorrect animated(opening waterbottle and drinking out of it without taking of the lid,...)
-is only represented by text fade ins.
(Is it to much to ask to put animations for pumping a well, in the game, instead of fading in text.This game is not a text adventure like "myst")
-has no physical impact-animation on the enemy/object, if hitting it.
(If you hit a man with an axe in the face, then his head should split. If you hit him with a dull objekt like a fire-extinguisher he should bounce to the ground asap )

or most of them at the same time.

Have you ever heard of "the last of us", "mirrors edge" or "zeno clash" (plz google them if you need to see how good combat/-animations should be made):

the last of us combat:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgaUBI3o7Hw

zeno clash combat:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JA0uTRHyGh8


Zeno clash is an indie game , if you try to argue that last of us has higher production value...


look not even these guys having fun and they get paid for having fun at games. Look at 1:22:00 and at  1:30:40  in there stream:

"http://de.twitch.tv/destiny/b/490335809"



 

Graphics:


-Why are the graphics so mediocre. Why don't you at least use the graphic-engine of arma 3 instead of arma 2.5.
 There are so many good engines out there, look at games like :

 -the division
 -watchdogs
 -crysis 3
 -Infamous
 -dying light
- the witcher 3
- destiny

You made so much money with games like arma 2 , arma 3 and dayz so far. So why not invests some of that money into a good,stable  engine for dayz to give the fans something
back for their money.

Have you ever heard of proper shader use, dynamical lighting or just even bump mapping when you want to simulate the shape of a brick wall, instead of putting an absolutely flat looking  texture on the wall of a brick-building.

Are you planing on developing this game for direct 9 + graphic cards  ?

Here are some videos for you so that you can look up at all the dx 11 features:
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/hh404562(v=vs.85).aspx
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkKtY2G3FbU





Nontranceparent developmentprocess:


-Why is your developmentprocess so nontransparent. Can you at least say how many developers are working at the moment on dayz and have worked on the game in the past?

 You are working since almost three years on dayz now and all you have to show us is the map which alleady existed in arma 2 sligthly altered, with accessible indoor areas now, changeable clothes and an inventory and item managment system.

 I have never seen that some developer is so proud of his inventorysystem. You act like an inventory is something groundbreaking which has never done before in video game history.Nearly every itembased game has an inventorysystem in some form.
 
So plz stop this copy and paste mentality and give us something worth our money . Why would anyone buy arma 2 again for 60 dollars just because you renamed it as dayz.I don't care how you call it, at this point its still arma 2 mp with more indoor areas which look even worst than the outdoor environments from a graphical standpoint.

If you sell it on steam for 30$ as alpha version and if you planning to sell it in the price-area of arma 3 after release, then we should get at least the same quality as in other triple A titles which coast the same amount of money , which means same graphics ,same physics.

And some zombies which are not stucked in the furniture and can actually kill you, where also nice to have.

If arma2 and 3 where priced only with 20 dollars at there release date, i would not care or rage , but you where priceing them as triple A (60$) and delivering every time a very unfinishedexpirience, which was even broken to some degree and had to rely heavily on mod suport , made much money out of it and thank it to your costumors in this way by delivering this state of the game after three years of alpha.

Where did all the money went into? If you want people to pay for premium quality than you need to give them premium quality and there for you need to invest in infrastructure
like a healty amount of developers a good stable and bugfree engine,good netcode. I cant see any of that in your products.


I expect a lot of hate from the mindless fanboys :


So dont dissapoint me.
 

Edited December 27, 2013 by pogosphere

[Max Planck 7174]

Single player games/small maps is not the same as multiplayer games/large maps.

Dayz is multiplayer, has a very large map and an emormous draw distance.

Edited December 27, 2013 by Max Planck

[Diggydug (DayZ) 331]

I stopped at when you started asking why the development process is so nontransparent.

 

I'm not sure if you're trolling or not, but just to be safe, I'll give you an actual response and keep it short.

 

You're asking why they don't have the best of every game you listed, all packed into one, when they had no intention of doing that in the first place. Did you play the mod or look into it? Did you see that and say, "Wow I bet the Standalone will be that and then some!" Half-Life is famous for physics. Crysis is famous for graphics. Mirror's Edge is known for the parkour aspect it revolves around. The list goes on.

 

 

DayZ is known for survival, the PvP interactions, and the sheer size of the map. Those games don't have that, why aren't you disappointed in them for lacking such simple things a mere mod had? This just seems like a personal problem, really.

[King of kong 1117]

Yeah, good idea.....Take the shitty and laggy ArmA 3 Engine and put it here....The graphics are great, you want to basically make the game so nice looking that you'd need a NASA PC to run it

[intensity (DayZ) 312]

Actually, you can destroy buildings in the mod with satchel charges, so I assume later on in SA you will be able to do the same. As well as chop down trees and build structures and such. Heck in this early release we can't even set tank traps or wire fences, not that I'm missing that. I'm happy with the graphics and the quality of the map.

[combatcomm1 234]

The ARMA engine is like 15 years old or something like that. It's ancient with ancient features and ancient capabilities. Even the ARMA III engine is built on top of this 15 year old core engine. I would love to see them build a new engine too. I think it's time. A lot of people will defend them on this but 15 years is a long time. I agree with you on the static-ness of the game but that probably wont change at anytime during DayZs development process. 

 

Its a core engine issue and I really hope that BIS takes the money they make from this game and starts working on a new engine. I think their loyal fans deserve as much at this point. It is almost 2014 after all and like you said, destructible environments and physics engines are becoming standard. 

 

That being said I don't agree with you on the transparency of development. No company in the world is like BIS in their interaction with their community. 

Edited December 27, 2013 by VictorM

[R.J. 70]

He has some valid points here. I feel like I wasted $60 on Arma 3 due to the lack of content and major issues with the engine itself.

Edited December 27, 2013 by R.J.

[Aussie Bogan 350]

Where did all the money went into?

 

I hear rocket fancys sheep... So i'm guessing they spent the money On agricultural products... I know it sucks right :(

 

[DocHoman 5]

Honestly if the graphics really bother you that much this early in...are you really a fan of what DayZ is meant to be? True fans of the dayz survival experience excuse its faults for the overall enjoyment of being able to play out the tension of a zombie survival scenario. This game is now going to be CONSTANTLY patched and tweaked and updated for the rest of its life, and it can only get better.

[applejaxc 2500]

I would love to see them build a new engine too. I think it's time.

 

Just to play devil's advocate, CoD and many other FPS titles still run on variations of the Quake engine.

But in answer to the OP:

 

ArmA wasn't made so you could systematically destroy each individual brick, plank, stick, twig, branch, and fragment of glass in the game world. It was designed for large-scale military simulation in which it doesn't fucking matter if you can fireaxe a fence or not; you can go over, under, or around it! (if not through it in a vehicle). ArmA wasn't made to have parkour or any of that bullshit. It's made to somewhat abstractly recreate modern(ish) military equipment and tactics in a big-ass sandbox.

 

It's amazing that ArmA has zombies in it at all.

[onty 109]

''Its just an alpha for almost 3 years now.''

 

Errm..No? The developement of the game started few months after the mod was released? That could be like ...Year and 4 months?

 

 

 

I feel like its another WarZ fan coming here to cry, just because his game is overfilled with hackers and retards and starts to lose its population.

Edited December 27, 2013 by OntyCZE

[DMZ_Sniper 73]

Oooh boy, let's do this

 

First of all, the standalone has only been in development for 1,5 years.

Half life 2, nine years ago, was also a collection of very small narrow maps, which allowed for a lot of interactivity at the cost of freedom. The maps and sections were very, very small. Hence they could use physics more loosely. Not to mention said physics would break the DayZ immersion like a mother when something inevitably goes wrong. HL2 had plenty of examples of bugs with the system. Now this is just me, but bugs are the last thing I want to add.

 

Yes, the world of Arma is very static, but it sadly has to be to allow PCs to run it at any level. BF4 runs fairly badly with 64 players on a much smaller map and a few destruction sequences, now imagine 220km2 with 50 players. It's unfeasible. And it's not their netcode that's badly optimized, it's their game.

 

And yes, asking for full animations for everything is indeed too much, especially early in the process and when there are more important issues to be solved.

 

Combat:

Please never invoke the name 'Last of Us' as an example of animated combat in a game. TLoU is an interactive movie, not a game.

Mirror's edge is a very controlled game and the combat is very controlled and focused, with little room to bug out. Arma 2/DayZ's is not.

Zeno Clash is a melee-focused game, they put all effort into animations, and have you seen how buggy that game is? Get your facts straight.

Combat could be more fluent, but it would require huge amounts of work.

 

Graphics:

You are naming, every one, games that are far smaller in scale and mostly, far more linear and controlled than Arma II/DayZ. Witcher 2 is wrecking PCs to this day with its graphics, and you want them in DayZ while keeping 60+ FPS? Forget it. DX11 is simply too heavy for the type of game. You don't see Just Cause 2/GTA IV using amazing graphics. The bigger the world, the more graphical fidelity you sacrifice. No matter how much money you throw at it, there are some things you just can't do yet.

 

Nontransparent development process:

 

I actually agree with you there.

Edited December 27, 2013 by DMZ_Sniper

[bad_mojo (DayZ) 1204]

It's like you did no research on anything but want to complain about everything. I can't be bothered responding.

[R.J. 70]

I hear rocket fancys sheep... So i'm guessing they spent the money On agricultural products... I know it sucks right :(

 

Is it possible to have an intelligent discussion or debate on here sans the ridiculous hipster photos and quotes?

[Ozelot (DayZ) 394]

I tend to agree with the OP, but most of what he says will be blatantly ignored by the eat-it-up fandom around here.

[applejaxc 2500]

Honestly if the graphics really bother you that much this early in

 

The graphics aren't going to improve, large-scale. Trees are going to look like green rectangles from a distance and buildings are going to look like gray trees; graphics isn't an issue of development focus right now, and likely ever. (I'd imagine there will eventually be SOME changes, like higher-resolution inventory icons or more detailed weapon models)

Short of playing the game at 300% 3D resolution, it's going to look the same as ArmA 2.

[Ineedscoffee 464]

I'll answer your questions with one of my own.

Where's your rising claim to fame? Why haven't you developed everyone you want in a game and released it to the masses yet?

Go ahead, take your time, I'll wait.

[Bribase 251]

You make some good points. I think that DayZ would benefit from having some form of physics engine implemented. It's great deal of work but it would benefit the gameplay in enormous ways from everything from loot to vehicles.

 

Unfortunately what you are doing is comparing DayZ, which began it's life as a mod for an ancient game engine, to games which have budgets in the tens of millions, vast teams of devs and shareholders to keep happy. It's comparing apples (pristine) to oranges (Badly damaged).

 

What I find perplexing is that you think that the devs have not been transparent on the lead up to release. The guys post updates and announcements on this very forum. Dean updated his blog when he got the chance, explaining that the reason why he hasn't gotten around to it is because he has been doing the expo circuit with extended Q&A which we can watch on youtube. I'd be surprised if the lead developer of The Division, Watchdogs or Crysis 3 has this level of back and forth during development. You also have to bear in mind that DayZ as a concept has been plagiarized by competing developers; often ones who are willing to push out a sub-par knockoff of DayZ with a shorter develpment time. I'd be cagier than Dean has been during development if I were in his shoes.

 

I know you're going to simply accuse me of being a mindless fanboy. Just try to reply to my points as you do it.

Edited December 27, 2013 by Bribase

[epicpwnerer 1]

Its just an alpha for almost 3 years now. - the mod is completely different from standalone please understand this, they are working on things from scratch kinda as they want things done properly and plus if you take time to read the development roadmap you will notice that graphics optimisation isnt implemented yet. 

 

I cant even play arma 3 with an geforce gtx 780 on high settings - dude take some time to read about the arma engine before you slate it as it doesnt utilise gpu like most games, most stuff is done on cpu

 

 I have never seen that some developer is so proud of his inventory system - wouldnt you be proud of something you made? makes a change from the faceless corporations like ea etc if i had put the time and effort in to coding the inventory system i would be damn proud of it

 

-has no physical impact-animation on the enemy/object, if hitting it. - the ragdoll physics havent been put in yet as they are focussing on stability atm again if you had taken the time to read the roadmap you would know this

 

and comparing graphics of single player  that can cache data and fake backdrops to a mmo that is rendering a 230 square kilometer map and anything you can see you can run to, then go play those limiting games pls 

 

yes the virtual reality engine that arma uses is a bit clunky but it works and bro play battlefield 4 for terrible netcode and then compare it to arma 2/3 

 

op must be a troll in summary and new to arma in general :) 

 

and bohemia interactive isnt a triple a gaming company, it doesnt have the huge resources in game development and the cash to throw into coders etc, its only just got a sound engineer worjking on adding proper sound into the game

 

and when you start up dayz do you take the time to read the disclaimer before clicking on "i understand" if so why bother posting this?

[crosa 93]

how about get an imagination... some things just arent possible... go play BF4 if you want pretty graphics and ridiculous environment destruction. this is a zombie survival game...

[Aussie Bogan 350]

Is it possible to have an intelligent discussion or debate on here sans the ridiculous hipster photos and quotes?

 Hush, hush you will make the baby cry :D

 

[Captain Pronin 28]

Its been an alpha for almost 3 years now? You sure about that?

[onty 109]

Why is everyone brining up ''The Division''? Why do you think its gonna be so great?From STAGED 5 mins long video?

 

Hooollyy shit i can shoot and create holes into a billboard!! Shit i just closed doors of a vehicle i was taking cover behind...So much DETAIL..

But in total that game isn't going to be made by players...It's gonna be you and few of your friends VS AI world. with lots of location/mission loading and some Team Deathmatch missions....GEEZ....DayZ world might be static...But not even your super great won't have anything else apart from you destroying glass and making some holes into a vehicle and all of that is just going to dissapear as soon as you leave the mission location....

 

However in DayZ..You leave a vehicle somewhere, it stays there in the condition it was left there...You abadon a camp it's gonna stay there...This game doesnt need destrucion, what for? What would be the point?

 

It'd be like in battlefield..Just after server restart everything would be back on its place if you would like it to be saved..Whole chernarus would be just wasteland in few weeks....Destroying ''small things'' like wooden fence..ALright i am kinda sure it will be in the game...It was in the mod/Arma...If you hit a wall/fence with a vehicle it'd go down don't see a problem with destroying wooden fence after taking some amount of dmg.

Edited December 27, 2013 by OntyCZE

[R.J. 70]

Just to play devil's advocate, CoD and many other FPS titles still run on variations of the Quake engine.

But in answer to the OP:

 

ArmA wasn't made so you could systematically destroy each individual brick, plank, stick, twig, branch, and fragment of glass in the game world. It was designed for large-scale military simulation in which it doesn't fucking matter if you can fireaxe a fence or not; you can go over, under, or around it! (if not through it in a vehicle). ArmA wasn't made to have parkour or any of that bullshit. It's made to somewhat abstractly recreate modern(ish) military equipment and tactics in a big-ass sandbox.

 

It's amazing that ArmA has zombies in it at all.

 

Points noted, but the SA was supposed to be different than the mod and altered to the scope of Dayz. As the OP stated, it's alot of the little things that make interaction with the environment more entertaining and enjoyable. 

 

 

[onebadbasterd 59]

Before i start:

Plz dont answer the following questions with :"Its just an alpha!"

Its just an alpha for almost 3 years now.

You are working very hard on becoming the next duke nukem forever.

 

Can you point out under wich rock you've been living for these past 3 years Sir?

 

I do beleive you that you have no clue of what you are speaking about.