How can we make a players life more important than his gear?

[YACO 0]

Skill is a brilliant idea... things like you adapt your body so it's harder to get sick, don't need as much water and food, you loose less food when opening your cans with a knife (since you're better at it)... love it!

 

I'd also suggest a strong rank system... based on different metrics like time alive, maybe even amount of encounters you survived, blood bled out, broken bones, etc... kinda like battle scars... that should encourage people to stay alive even going through the worst situations to keep their record going.

[mercules 1290]

yes i know, the topic of the thread is how to make players lives more important than gear.

 

so you need to make taking a life (unprovoked)  ingame.....wait for it......game altering (to the point where someone who wants to play the game long term will think twice about doing it).

 

Right... and I am being pedantic but this won't PREVENT, which is what you stated. It will DISCOURAGE. :) We can't, and don't want to prevent it, but we do want to discourage it. Just getting the terminology right here.

[ShokeR (DayZ) 29]

Female players? A some kind of long braid...

 

 

Bigger boobs

[Dasutin 3]

The value of your character to other people is never going to equate to the value of your character to you. It's really depressing, and a huge bummer, but it will always be infinitely easier to just shoot another player and take his stuff than it will be to handcuff him, steal it, and then let him live. There's no reward for the second path, and it takes more time. Time that you could spend looting, or time that another player could be using to sneak up on you.

I love the concept of the handcuffs, and needing living players for blood transfusions and stuff, but it's never going to address the actual issue, which is that it's just easier to kill everything you see instead of take the time to work with someone or barter, or interact in any passive way.

I mean, sure, some of the issues will go away once zombies are in 100% and there will be real risk to shooting your gun, but it's not going to make people stop shooting on sight when they can get away with it, or interact with other players like they would in a real survival situation.

[mercules 1290]

Bigger boobs

 

...and people wonder why feminism is still needed.

[mercules 1290]

The value of your character to other people is never going to equate to the value of your character to you. It's really depressing, and a huge bummer, but it will always be infinitely easier to just shoot another player and take his stuff than it will be to handcuff him, steal it, and then let him live. There's no reward for the second path, and it takes more time. Time that you could spend looting, or time that another player could be using to sneak up on you.

I love the concept of the handcuffs, and needing living players for blood transfusions and stuff, but it's never going to address the actual issue, which is that it's just easier to kill everything you see instead of take the time to work with someone or barter, or interact in any passive way.

I mean, sure, some of the issues will go away once zombies are in 100% and there will be real risk to shooting your gun, but it's not going to make people stop shooting on sight when they can get away with it, or interact with other players like they would in a real survival situation.

 

Ehem... But people will value the work they put into their own character. That means they will be less likely to put themselves at risk to simply chalk up another kill. This becomes even more true when we have places we can stash gear. ;)

[5P4RK4 (DayZ) 50]

There is  a big difference between raising the value of a character, and preventing KOS. They are totally seperate. 

 

Raising the value of the character means to the player. I want my character to last as long as possible, I dont want to die. 

 

KOS for gear is a seperate thought all together. Raising the value of a character may slightly lessen it (if people don't want to take the risk), but its more about the situation earlier described. Should I engage? If i get taken hostage, do I fight back? Its more on the player who is being attacked than the attackers. 

 

I like the idea of endurance and proficiency (over time... not just repetitions). It would be cool to tie this into sickness / endurance / health as well. The way I see it a survivor who is consistently well fed / healthy would gain endurance, improved immunity etc. etc. A survivor who was not well fed for a long time would still gain endurance, but may be more susceptible to disease and infection. Putting a long term incentive on player life, and also their HEALTH would be a huge addition to survival in general.

 

Also beards.  

[Dasutin 3]

Ehem... But people will value the work they put into their own character. That means they will be less likely to put themselves at risk to simply chalk up another kill. This becomes even more true when we have places we can stash gear. ;)

Well, once you can store your gear, your life becomes even more meaningless.

It's not putting work in if you just have to run back to the woods and take some stuff out of a tent.

[Shizukage (DayZ) 17]

Beards, because when you see Gandalf come strolling through the woods, you know you're fucked.

[mercules 1290]

KOS for gear is a seperate thought all together. Raising the value of a character may slightly lessen it (if people don't want to take the risk), but its more about the situation earlier described. Should I engage? If i get taken hostage, do I fight back? Its more on the player who is being attacked than the attackers. 

 

People don't KOS for gear, they Kill for gear. KOS means shooting just because. 

People who KOS for Lulz will never stop unless it makes it to hard to play the game for them. However, some people who might have shot might rethink it just like you mentioned. 

[mercules 1290]

Well, once you can store your gear, your life becomes even more meaningless.

It's not putting work in if you just have to run back to the woods and take some stuff out of a tent.

 

Which is exactly why were are discussing finding a value to being alive and staying alive. :)

[Dasutin 3]

Which is exactly why were are discussing finding a value to being alive and staying alive. :)

I'm just saying that there's a link between that and the KOS mentality, I guess. That the value of a living player needs to go up for everyone, not just for the person who is the player.

[mercules 1290]

I'm just saying that there's a link between that and the KOS mentality, I guess. That the value of a living player needs to go up for everyone, not just for the person who is the player.

 

Very true. That is why I think each player should only have a limited number of areas they can improve. So now having someone who can repair a car with less parts than you is a nice thing to have. I know that won't stop preformed groups from killing others but it might make them more inclined to not take risks because Andrew can just run back to his body and loot it while we guard it or we can split up his gear and meet him over at X. 

Just making it a bit more painful to take a risk and fail will make some people think twice about shooting. Right now, I can get an Axe in about 30 minutes of play so why wouldn't someone try and smack a guy with a gun with an axe? If you die you are only 30 minute behind where you were. Since we don't want to make "gearing up" TOO onerous it seems giving you a better reason to stay alive than, "I might lose my gear." is a good idea. If we value the character less people will risk it. 

 

[__redruM 7]

Current game has at least one thing that makes your current life, more important than a new life.  And that's location.  If you've spent an hour going north, then you could save the next hour by staying alive, even without gear.

[Pandema 352]

We need beards.

 

Screw everything else in the game, rocket and friends, we need beards that grow over time.

[5P4RK4 (DayZ) 50]

The other thing is food (and less so water now that you can spam a pump). The amount of food you need to be "full" and not worry about it takes a while to acquire. Spawning starving / thirsty is really a great step forward. 

[ten bensons 1]

to keep KOS from happening you'd have to incorporate something somewhat unrealistic........

 

some type of "unprovoked" attack system would have to be implemented.....

 

If you make an unprovoked attack you suffer a type of PERMANENT "attribute" - permanent would mean your future characters also

 

The only way to get rid of the attribute would be to perform some type of "kind" gesture to a non bandit (or permanently attributed) type of person, this would go back to the attribute carrying across your future characters.   Having to perform the kindness act on someone non attributed would keep bandit type characters grouping together performing kind gestures on each other (that sounds odd).

 

The kindness act would have to be something difficult(not talking bandaging someone, something harder), but numerous times...not a one for one event 

 

the negative factor would have to be something game play crippling enough so that you wouldn't want to do it

 

 

I think certain mental and psychological states should be introduced that have a permanent (one life only) impact to your characters well being. What these could be and their effects is something that would need to have a lot of balance to suit all playstyles. Examples could be post-traumatic stress disorder, paranoia, depression.

 

The only problem with doing something like this is that most of us are already paranoid and suffer with PTSD, if we didnt then we wouldnt be spawning and heading straight up north and avoiding major towns and military installations. 

[gregor (DayZ) 95]

That was long time ago somewhere proposed - so-called spawning penalty. If this would tied with others suggestions, then it might work, at least somewhat. Than longer a character was "to live" in game, the close its new spawn (after death) would be to the green dashed line. Than shorter was its life, the closer its new spawn would be to red dashed line. Logically, this map is only a schematic "art", because I do not know how big will be the final map .

 

[iashford 73]

Why? You will want to cut that long hair off as it is a detriment in a close combat fight. She is way too skinny lacking fat reserves so you will be giving her more of the food just to help her survive. Thirdly, everyone knows that in a horror situation people who have sex are the next ones to die.  :P

That would make sense... If hair pulling was a feature. Until then, I'm an advocate for long hairstyles, ESPECIALLY side braids.

I like the idea of organically having developed skills. Like cutting a can with an axe becomes more precise. Depending on your diet, your stamina becomes better. As long as you take good care of your character and 'teach' them things, I don't see how it would be bad to have limited skills naturally developed. Maybe the longer you play thru different seasons, they come slightly more adaptable to the climate and get sick less? I don't know.

As for the women and the beard thing... I'm happy with slightly longer hair.

[no2_punk 2]

Some minor character progression makes sense to add value to characters.So long as it isn't too drastic. Small stamina boost for example if encumbrance was added, then a strength stat allowing you to carry that full backpack without needing to sit every half click gained from surviving for multiple days whilst travelling so many km on foot.

 

Also making death a greater threat, with some sort of timer before the next respawn. Nothing drastic but some sort of punishment for death (other than, oh no I lost my M4... off to NWAF again) would be good. Obviously the new spawn who gets KoS by a coastcamping loser would disagree but that is an issue with people and not game mechanics.

 

I wouldn't expect it to be too long a wait, but enough to make you want to survive even if you have lost your top gear in a highjacking. If the respawn timer was implemented, then yes it would suck to be killed on the coast, but it would make you try to survive that coast camper, rather than just give up and respawn elsewhere in an instant.

[JESUSARIUS REX (DayZ) 163]

I feel skills shouldn't be levels, but realistic curves. As in your stamina increases fast as you exercise in the beginning, but as you reach the limits of an average human being, your stamina increase slowly diminishes to nothing gained. strength is increased by how much loot you carry, and eventually stops giving you gains as the weight becomes "normal" to your player. you need to carry heavier items to increase your strength.

Edited December 19, 2013 by JESUSARIUS REX

[T-Dawg 6]

That was long time ago somewhere proposed - so-called spawning penalty. If this would tied with others suggestions, then it might work, at least somewhat. Than longer a character was "to live" in game, the close its new spawn (after death) would be to the green dashed line. Than shorter was its life, the closer its new spawn would be to red dashed line. Logically, this map is only a schematic "art", because I do not know how big will be the final map .

 

 This is a good idea. 

 

I also think there could be a health penalty that gets more severe every time you die. This would make people less confrontational imo and it would be a risk to attack an armed player/group. This penalty would of course go back to normal over time.

[Hetstaine 10852]

The only way to make people care about their char and its longevity ..is for the person to care about it and its longevity. I don't want a death punishment because a bunch of knob end kids don't give a fuck :)

[Dasutin 3]

The thing I don't like about a respawn timer is that it punishes the victim. I know it's supposed to be a motivation to not die, but it's also another fuel for the griefing fire. People who enjoy making the game living hell for other people will have even more power to do so.
 

[knawx 175]

The only way to make people care about their char and its longevity ..is for the person to care about it and its longevity. I don't want a death punishment because a bunch of knob end kids don't give a fuck :)

 

You're missing the point. Everyone cares about their character until they are stripped of all their gear. Then you are back to square one, you are no different than a new spawn even though you may have just survived for days before you were robbed of your things.

 

The value of your character should be deeper than just your gear.

 

What are some suggestions you may have that would meet this goal?