First vs Third Person Discussion (Dslyecxi video)

[dgeesio 1034]

how about some people cant play in first person as it makes em sick ? not me but others.

 

some people cant play with certain fov , head bobbing different views 3rd person 1 st person.

 

this is why i say dont just use a exploit to try to condemn third person.

[Siberian (DayZ) 527]

because if both exist 'First person only' will become marginalised, just as it is in the mod.

 

why on earth do you guys want a feature that would be called a wall hack in any other game?

 

 

numbers dont lie.. if the majority wanted 1st only, they would play there..

 

the simple fact is many many players like 3rd person..

 

get over yourself.

 

if 1st person servers have low pop. its a direct reflection of the player base that likes it. same as pure PVE servers, they exist but ina very small amount, but you wont see me on a soapbox yelling to have those servers banned/removed.

[Siberian (DayZ) 527]

I can understand that you like 3rd person just fine. Why can't you understand it really doesn't have a place in a first person shooter game? There is a reason the game genre is called "FIRST PERSON Shooter". Really people... how simple is that? ^_^

 

 

its not a FPs game thou.. CoD is that way --->

 

 

dayz (SA) is a sandbox survival sim.  BIGGGGG difference

[Siberian (DayZ) 527]

master of the devastating metaphor =)

 

its a tough fight ahead, so many guys in denial.

 

i just scanned CoD forums, BF4 forums and CSGO forums and nobody is clamouring for 3rd person,

 

i might register and make the suggestion, i'm sure even those communities will tear me apart, as this one quite rightly would for suggesting such a game breaking feature.

 

 

while there dont forget to ask about adding survival elements and PVE gameplay..

 

oh wait, its a totaly different fricken genre..

 

/facepalm

[Skat3rat 1633]

how about some people cant play in first person as it makes em sick ? not me but others.

 

some people cant play with certain fov , head bobbing different views 3rd person 1 st person.

 

this is why i say dont just use a exploit to try to condemn third person.

 

Yeah my friend gets headaches if he plays in First person for too long.  Even with head bob off.

[Fraggle (DayZ) 15720]

I thought we'd moved on to discussing a decent compromise?

 

Look, people that want it removed and people that don't are literally never going to agree.  

 

There can be no debate about the fact that currently the 3rd person camera in DayZ has too much freedom of movement allowing players to exploit it, that is just a fact.  Surly the next logical step is to discuss how it could be fixed to keep everyone happy.

Edited August 23, 2013 by Fraggle

[Garmalak 16]

Disable the free look camera.

Simple.

[fluxley 2228]

Disable the free look camera.

Simple.

 You'd still be able to see over walls without exposing your body. it just means you'd have to move the whole character rather than just the head.

[Siberian (DayZ) 527]

I thought we'd moved on to discussing a decent compromise?

 

Look, people that want it removed and people that don't are literally never going to agree.  

 

There can be no debate about the fact that currently the 3rd person camera in DayZ has too much freedom of movement allowing players to exploit it, that is just a fact.  Surly the next logical step is to discuss how it could be fixed to keep everyone happy.

haah i love how you disquise your personal view on 3rd person, then go on to talk about how it can be "fixed"..

 

if you love 1st person, thats cool, but plz dont pretend 3rd person needs "fixing"...

 

its a server option just like all the other ones, or do you want all those options removed to ???

[terrvik 2409]

its a server option just like all the other ones, or do you want all those options removed to ???

 

I do. :)

[Fraggle (DayZ) 15720]

Same here :/

 

If you think a magical periscope cam that allows people in a game like this to look around corners and over tall walls without risk isn't broken then I'd suggest maybe you just got too used to it.  

 

I also get the feeling you've just jumped onto the end of this thread and haven't read much of the solid reasoning already offered for needing it to be sorted.  If you read my other posts you'll see that yes, I do want as many options as possible removed from server admins.

Edited August 23, 2013 by Fraggle

[Cap'n (DayZ) 1827]

Fix the camera to where it can no longer provide such an advantage, and stop these assholes who think that they're entitled to make everyone play the same as they do. THERE ARE FIRST PERSON SERVERS FOR A REASON.

Edited August 23, 2013 by Cap'n

[terrvik 2409]

Fix the camera to where it can no longer provide such an advantage, and stop these assholes who think that they're entitled to make everyone play the same as they do. THERE ARE FIRST PERSON SERVERS FOR A REASON.

 

There's no reason calling me an asshole just because we are having an discussion. Chill.

[Siberian (DayZ) 527]

Same here :/

 

If you think a magical periscope cam that allows people in a game like this to look around corners and over tall walls without risk isn't broken then I'd suggest maybe you just got too used to it.  

 

I also get the feeling you've just jumped onto the end of this thread and haven't read much of the solid reasoning already offered for needing it to be sorted.  If you read my other posts you'll see that yes, I do want as many options as possible removed from server admins.

so basicly as long as the options being removed are the type that you like its all good ???

 

i've think i've read enuf from you to get the gist.

 

ps go back and look at the thread again, i've been in here/reading posting since inception

 

sorry if im all about NOT stepping on others toes, thats prolly not cool in this thread.

 

for a game that rocket clearly many times has said is about no rules and complete freedom of play style, theres certainly a few in here, who'd rather see a 180degre turn of game design and make a single version style of dayz love it or GTFO.

 

im just 100% completly not in agreement with that.

Edited August 23, 2013 by Siberian

[Shadow Man 142]

so basicly as long as the options being removed are the type that you like its all good ???

 

i've think i've read enuf from you to get the gist.

 

ps go back and look at the thread again, i've been in here/reading posting since inception

 

sorry if im all about NOT stepping on others toes, thats prolly not cool in this thread.

 

for a game that rocket clearly many times has said is about no rules and complete freedom of play style, theres certainly a few in here, who'd rather see a 180degre turn of game design and make a single version style of dayz love it or GTFO.

 

im just 100% completly not in agreement with that.

 

 

3rd person exploitation is not a playstyle. An exploit is a polite way of saying cheat.

[terrvik 2409]

so basicly as long as the options being removed are the type that you like its all good ???

 

NO.

 

That's not the point at all. I, and many others in this thread, just think rocket should just stick to his guns (2) and create a game without compromises or listening to everyone. If he tries to please everyone he will end up pleasing no one.

 

If this in the end means that there will still be a side chat and third person then, well, so be it. I will always remember DayZ as that game with potential that didn't have the balls to upset people in the end after all, and wait for another game dev to try it again in the future.

Edited August 23, 2013 by Terrorviktor

[Shadow Man 142]

numbers dont lie.. if the majority wanted 1st only, they would play there..

 

the simple fact is many many players like 3rd person..

 

get over yourself.

 

if 1st person servers have low pop. its a direct reflection of the player base that likes it. same as pure PVE servers, they exist but ina very small amount, but you wont see me on a soapbox yelling to have those servers banned/removed.

That is a very bad justification. Numbers don't always show you the absolute truth. The answer is in human behaviour.

 

A game is made, then a game mechanic is introduced that can give an advantage but is left as an option. Because it gives the player an advantage then of course people use it. I want DayZ to be 1st person only, but I use 3rd in the mod because I'm otherwise disadvantaged.

 

If for some reason 1st person suddenly gave the player an advantage over 3rd users, you could bet your life masses of players would start using it.

[mercules 1290]

how about some people cant play in first person as it makes em sick ? not me but others.

 

some people cant play with certain fov , head bobbing different views 3rd person 1 st person.

 

this is why i say dont just use a exploit to try to condemn third person.

 

Great, except you can turn off the headbob motion and movement blur off and 1st person becomes exactly the same as 3rd except you are not 1.5 meters up and back from your character's perspective. So that argument is debunked. 

 

its not a FPs game thou.. CoD is that way --->

 

 

dayz (SA) is a sandbox survival sim.  BIGGGGG difference

 

It's a FPS survival sim. The difference is not that big. It is built off a FPS engine that should never had have 3rd person in it. It actually becomes harder to survive with 3rd person turned off since you can't see Zombies over fences, or have to actually look over the edge of a building to see where people are. It's not "Simulating" much in 3rd person the simulation actually comes in when you are locked into the perspective of your avatar instead of being able to see all the way around it. So even if it wasn't primarily FPS it would still be better in first person because that better simulates the survival aspect.

 

 

Yeah my friend gets headaches if he plays in First person for too long.  Even with head bob off.

 

I'd be curious to see what he has turned on and off... My wife doesn't when going first person with stuff like headbob disabled and she gets motion sick in cars just from riding in them.

[Siberian (DayZ) 527]

. 

 

 

It's a FPS survival sim. The difference is not that big. It is built off a FPS engine that should never had have 3rd person in it.

says you..

 

guess what just because you think arma/dayz shouldnt have 3rd person, doesnt mean it shouldnt.

 

clearly the devs thought different.

 

were not talking about a option/feature that was patched/added in later on.

 

3rd person has always been a part of the game.

[mercules 1290]

says you..

 

guess what just because you think arma/dayz shouldnt have 3rd person, doesnt mean it shouldnt.

 

clearly the devs thought different.

 

were not talking about a option/feature that was patched/added in later on.

 

3rd person has always been a part of the game.

 

This is a fallacy called "Appeal to Tradition". Just because something has been done a certain way in the past does not alone grant it merit to be done that way in the future. 

1st person is better for FPS and Survivor Simulation games for the following reasons.

1. More realistic - You only get information you could gather if you were there in your avatar's shoes looking through their eyes. This is better for FPS and is more fitting for a SIMULATION.

2. Exposure - To see someone, you have to be visible yourself. Sure it might only be a bit of your face so you can get one eye clear and able to see, but you can still be shot in the face or a Zombie might see the movement and react. This makes the game harder but does so in a controllable fashion. It gives the game a Risk vrs Reward aspect. To see where gunfire is coming from you have to actually expose yourself to it. To spot Zombies you will have to actually move to the end of the building and peek around the corner possibly getting spotted by one that is a bit further away from the wall you are now peeking down agroing on you.

 

3. Immersive - If you look back to my first post in this thread I started playing in 1st Person and there were times I jumped or panicked or didn't see a zombie. They were a bit scary back then. Once I started using 3rd they actually stopped being scary because it was very easy to spot them all and keep track of their movements.

What are the reasons to have 3rd person perspective in the game? It isn't simulation since simulating being someone's guiding angel 1.5 meters up and back from them is NOT what the goal of the game design was. It was to be a PERSON in a Zombie Apocalypse and people can't look at the back of their heads without a lot of help from technology. 

[dgeesio 1034]

Great, except you can turn off the headbob motion and movement blur off and 1st person becomes exactly the same as 3rd except you are not 1.5 meters up and back from your character's perspective. So that argument is debunked. 

 

 

It's a FPS survival sim. The difference is not that big. It is built off a FPS engine that should never had have 3rd person in it. It actually becomes harder to survive with 3rd person turned off since you can't see Zombies over fences, or have to actually look over the edge of a building to see where people are. It's not "Simulating" much in 3rd person the simulation actually comes in when you are locked into the perspective of your avatar instead of being able to see all the way around it. So even if it wasn't primarily FPS it would still be better in first person because that better simulates the survival aspect.

 

 

 

I'd be curious to see what he has turned on and off... My wife doesn't when going first person with stuff like headbob disabled and she gets motion sick in cars just from riding in them.

then you have the animations in first person which actually cause nausia to some aswell so rebunked ;)

 

as said people are trying to efend thier own preferences and bringing easons for them not liking one or the other . even some of the admins on here for eg i know play in mainly first person so they gunna say remove 3d peson cause its obvious they dont agree with it.

 

funny thing is check all this argung then check which serves and views are most used its 3rd person servers and all the the things that the " minority" dont like.

 

i think we should delete 1st person and only use 3rd person that way everyone has same and there is no unfair advantages :lol: how about them apples :P

 

 

 

what needs to be decided who is this game being mde for ?

 

is it being made to sell big ? to more purists?

 

 

not having third person is one of the biggest mistakes you can make in this game.

[Feral (DayZ) 622]

then you have the animations in first person which actually cause nausia to some aswell so rebunked ;)

 

as said people are trying to efend thier own preferences and bringing easons for them not liking one or the other . even some of the admins on here for eg i know play in mainly first person so they gunna say remove 3d peson cause its obvious they dont agree with it.

 

funny thing is check all this argung then check which serves and views are most used its 3rd person servers and all the the things that the " minority" dont like.

 

i think we should delete 1st person and only use 3rd person that way everyone has same and there is no unfair advantages :lol: how about them apples :P

 

 

 

what needs to be decided who is this game being mde for ?

 

is it being made to sell big ? to more purists?

 

 

not having third person is one of the biggest mistakes you can make in this game.

you repeat the same nonsense again and again, you ignore points that successfully dismantle your defence of this legal but game breaking, magically inspired, supernatural 'see everything but stay hidden' invisible man feature.

 

it sucks, guys use it cos it makes the game easy and extends a players life allowing him to see without being seen.

 

its got no basis in the real world unless you believe in out of body experiences or the insane world of uri Gellar and the drug fuelled FBI 'remote viewing' program of the 1960's.

 

I think the idea of removing it terrifies a lot of players because it is a crutch, and you will need to relearn how to walk without it.

tell me how you like them apples pal? they're golden delicious

Edited August 23, 2013 by (MUC) Feral

[Garmalak 16]

Just to tell you, in FPS you can also use alt to look behind your head.

Just sayin'

[Shadow Man 142]

then you have the animations in first person which actually cause nausia to some aswell so rebunked ;)

 

as said people are trying to efend thier own preferences and bringing easons for them not liking one or the other . even some of the admins on here for eg i know play in mainly first person so they gunna say remove 3d peson cause its obvious they dont agree with it.

 

funny thing is check all this argung then check which serves and views are most used its 3rd person servers and all the the things that the " minority" dont like.

 

i think we should delete 1st person and only use 3rd person that way everyone has same and there is no unfair advantages :lol: how about them apples :P

 

 

 

what needs to be decided who is this game being mde for ?

 

is it being made to sell big ? to more purists?

 

 

not having third person is one of the biggest mistakes you can make in this game.

 

 I'd like to know why you prefer 3rd person please. Can you explain in detail?

[Garmalak 16]

Read the last twelve pages.