My two cents about endgame and NPC's

[theszerdi 50]

Alright, perhaps I worded that poorly. Rather than nothing to do, there is little challenge once you've mastered the basics of play. Even most player squads are easy enough to track and kill. Surviving and building a gigantic camp full of loot gets boring after a few weeks. Been there, done that. Hunt players and their camps? Did that for a few weeks too. Now I mostly play on my server for the squad warfare and npc missions. Because it's more challenging.

Player run events are fun and challenging, but I'm not willing to invest that kind of time usually. An erratic work schedule doesn't help either. :P

[xx_fr0st-w0lf_xx 53]

I would prefer if rocket gave us the tools to build our own trading posts rather then spawn npc trading posts

[enforcer1975 1111]

Right now DayZ's popularity continues because of it's ability to be modded. If the standalone is not moddable I'm afraid it will fade within months. Personally I prefer that DayZ stay popular and vigorous by appealing to the more casual gamer. I also prefer that it do this without losing the promise and possibility. (You know what happens when a game goes too casual . . . Not that I'll mention any hugely popular MMO's here.)

DayZ isn't moddable, ArmA 2 is...

It's good if the SA wouldn't be moddable because that way nobody will water down the experience because it's too difficult for him. The game will be made as it's meant to be played. It's not a casual game either becaue you will need time to "rebuild" your virtual life from nothing. The people who will be strong are the people who invest time in the game and i'm not talking about neets having all the time they want. I'm talking about investing some time into the game instead of casually playing 10 games in the same amount of time.

Edited June 2, 2013 by Enforcer

[Clumzy (DayZ) 377]

For anyone who feels that there is no endgame content, here is a challenge for you:

Pick a town, you'll probably want to pick a small one. Go in, clear it out. This will need to be done regularly though (hopefully clearing out an area will be easier in the SA) then, with some people that you trust, start advertising your town on side chat as a safe haven for survivors. See if you can get it to work.

You're not limited by the game, you're limited by your own creativity.

[sausagekingofchicago 4711]

Personally I prefer that DayZ stay popular and vigorous by appealing to the more casual gamer.

Yeah, no thanks.

[Private Evans 1303]

Please do not let us dig hobbit houses, let us overtake villages, houses or structures like it would happen in reality...I am sure there is no fancy crappy origin constructing shit needed...it could be done more smart...establishing new social structures is the logical endgame content for me...

[Greyfoxx006 0]

I like the idea of AI NPCs because you can't honestly think, if DayZ were "real", that there wouldn't be military groups or rag-tag-teams of ex-military guys going around trying to either A) Make a profit, or B) Fuck everyone else over. So you guys think that if the Zombie Apocalypse does happen, there would just be a bunch of people looting and killing each other? you don't think there would end up being caravans or w/e going around trying to make a new start by selling stuff to the survivors? I highly doubt it. It'll always end up that some sort of "community" will always start up....for the good or bad.

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

*snip*

Literally EVERY SINGLE THING you just said, could and should be done by players.

That's the entire point.

Edited June 2, 2013 by Chabowski

[Clumzy (DayZ) 377]

Literally EVERY SINGLE THING you just said, could and should be done by players.

That's the entire point.

Um, who were you quoting there?

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

*3rd attempt*

Thank you, Clumzy, for pointing that out.

I am fail at doing keyboard.

Edited June 2, 2013 by Chabowski

[DontTrustPubs 17]

I think people are confused by two different ideas in this thread. there is scripted events. Heli flies over head and crashes, bandit camp in the woods around a fire, etc; which I like and support. Then there is full blown npc quest driven system; that I am against.

[R3cK 8]

Dayz of its most important aspect, i.e. player driven story, not plot driven story.

Right. So you have to put player features in:

- bounty hunting have already been announced

- robbing player camps

- take over (hoist up a flag/build barricades) a city or important spots, maybe a garden or farm area for food, or a fuel station, or places where you can craft special things ONLY there. like special medical supply at the hospital. so players try to take over that place to craft on this spot, or a mine where you get special stuff for explosives

- build barricades and traps for protection that area

you have to put something in that other players want to get so they fight for it.

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

I think people are confused by two different ideas in this thread. there is scripted events. Heli flies over head and crashes, bandit camp in the woods around a fire, etc; which I like and support. Then there is full blown npc quest driven system; that I am against.

Even within the examples you give, I have a different opinion.

A scripted Helicopter crash would allude to their being survivors other than the players, without showing them. I might be OK with this, provided it's a VERY rare occurrence and not the focus of the game.

An AI controlled bandit-camp, however, I don't want to see. Any AI beyond just Zeds, to me, would be nothing but interference in a game based around, among other things, social interaction.

The moment you add objectives, missions and AI controlled survivors, it cheapens the DayZ sensation into a run of the mill "game". Even risking becoming sub-par.

It should remain a rich and suspenseful, non-restrictive, player-driven experience, as much as possible.

[theszerdi 50]

Even within the examples you give, I have a different opinion.

A scripted Helicopter crash would allude to their being survivors other than the players, without showing them. I might be OK with this, provided it's a VERY rare occurrence and not the focus of the game.

An AI controlled bandit-camp, however, I don't want to see. Any AI beyond just Zeds, to me, would be nothing but interference in a game based around, among other things, social interaction.

The moment you add objectives, missions and AI controlled survivors, it cheapens the DayZ sensation into a run of the mill "game". Even risking becoming sub-par.

It should remain a rich and suspenseful, non-restrictive, player-driven experience, as much as possible.

That sounds great in theory. Are you in college? You must have huge amounts of free time to be so willing to spend others. Playing for hours and hours without ever seeing anyone else sucks. There needs to be something to motivate people to go places and there needs to be a system to distribute information about those places. I proposed a system to do that. I'm open to better suggestions. Let's hear yours.

Edit to add: My suggested system was a way to get players to interact more easily with a minimum amount of game scripted interference. A system to promote interaction without spending tons of time setting up community events. Something that will appeal to people who don't have oodles of free time (hardcore players).

Edited June 3, 2013 by TheSzerdi

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

I'd ask Rocket about that if I were you, but I'm fairly certain DayZ was never intended to appeal to casual (non-hardcore) gamers.

I understand what you're suggesting, and why, but that's not the direction I'd want SA to head.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm fairly certain I'm not alone on this one.

Considering you keep pushing your own system and your own preferences, you really ought to stop using the word "need" so much.

If you really "need" these events and objectives (and the admin-tools to control them, if need be) the DayZMod will still be here.

If enough people share your ideals, this will be easily accomplished.

[Jars (DayZ) 63]

The problem isn't a lack of end game , it's just that the early / mid game , is far too easy .

Finding food and drink is far , far , far too easy of a task and should be far , far , far harder .

Finding weapons and cars and making bases , is also way too easy .

Zombies , do not pose much of a threat right now , and are also way too easy .

Unfortunately , as is evident by all the private hives allowing all the "easy" modes in the game so people have more "fun" , making the game more "popular" , clearly indicates that the problem of an end game is not the mods fault , it's the people who play the game .

To sum up , make EVERYTHING in the game harder , and you will not require an end game past the struggle for survival .

But this is not what most people want .

[DemonGroover 8836]

I am against NPCs for the simple reason that they are stupid and another player is not - or if they are the fact that all Survivors and Bandits are humans means that there is a vast variety in skill level and tactics. AI can never compete with a human player. Not in the long run.

This is why zombies are the perfect AI protagonist. They are stupid and do one thing only - run at the player and try to kill them.

[Hetstaine 10852]

There's nothing to DO once you learn how to play. I'm a bandit because that's all that is left. Kill people for fun.

People complain about the lack of endgame when they don't realize that they can create their own. You'd be surprised by the things you can do in DayZ besides killing and looting.

You just have to think outside the box.

Over a year and i still am not at the point where i have felt the need to go bandit and kill everything that moves due to there being 'nothing' else to do, and i am sure i am not alone in this either.

Weirdly my end game as such has still been to get my survivor past that first day hurdle, then five or ten days, then push for twenty or more. Once he gets past that twenty day limit he gets jumpy and very fucking wary. If he has to journey into Cherno or Elektro, Stary or NW field then shit gets real. Sometimes it may take an hour or so on the outskirts of any of those places watching for others, stealthily cruising around hunched down awaiting the crack of a gun or some mad forest dwelling hatchet man to bust out of the woods screaming insanity at him.

Laying traps of beans and other goodies in a barbwired cachement and watching what goes down for mild amusement. Parking an ATV near a well travelled area with an M16 on the road beside it and then running out from behind a tree with a hatchet myself when someone strolls along. Plenty more to be done in a mod that is apparently played out :)

[DaGolem 95]

not a bad idea but the rocket has always said there will never be NPC's

Yeah, because Dean Hall want to go a easy way and spent not to much work on NPC KI & the performance Problems. ;)

If there is many NPC then the performance will drop down...maybe server crashes, getting laggy...to difficult for the Dev Team, it takes to much time.

So...Dean make it himself easy and say NO NPC in DAYZ SA!

And all Fanboys say " Dean Hall is right to say no to NPC´s"

For me. and like i see here, NPC´s are one of the Things that is actually a "Must have" because this is a perfect gameelement for better Lonewolf play und better Teamplay and less PVPGaming because people can Kill without hurting other Players and it is a special challenge for Group/Teamplayer and Lonewolf players.

The other thing is that there is a common enemy that brings foreign people together and forced the Teamplay with strangers...BUT...Dean Hall don´t care about this fact! He cares about to make it himself easy.

Example:

NPC Towns and/or Bases:

Hard NPC Towns/Bases can force Teamplay because only groups can attak them.

Medium NPC Towns/Bases is good for Teamplay and Lonewolf.

Easy NPC Towns/Bases is good for Lonewolf players.

Edited June 5, 2013 by DaGolem

[fluxley 2228]

Yeah, because Dean Hall want to go a easy way and spent not to much work on NPC KI & the performance Problems. ;)

Seems to me NPC's are the easy way out.

The real challenge is making a game that gives players enough tools to keep themselves entertained with only player made content.

I believe its possible, but it sure as hell isnt going to easy.

[badluckburt 974]

less PVPGaming because people can Kill without hurting other Players

You can already kill without hurting other players, people kill each other because they enjoy the challenge of fighting another human being instead of some AI.

I hope Rocket sticks to his guns and never adds NPC's. There is no way in hell that NPC's can add more than actual human beings with the ability to improvise.