50 cal crybabies

[Zombie Jesus 723]

I've had this argument with some peeps at Balota Buddies. Seems like people can't defend the whole .50 cal thing without becoming personal, raging and accusing that the sole reason why others want these removed is that they don't know how to play.

Both sides are prone to nonsense though, go read through some of Xianyu's well thought out posts on the subject (heavy sarcasm intended). Both groups get into a rage and claim the other group doesn't know how to play the game.

At the end of the day games are supposed to be fun and if people have fun with them in the game then more power to them. Just do not touch my M14 Aim and I will never whine one way or the other.

[onemeanls1z28 12]

so we are back to reality topic. i thought it was just pixels rendered for our enjoyment. ok. i have already suggested my points as far as aiming. standing and hip fire accuracy lowered prone accurate only. how much does an engine weigh and can a alice pack really carry one. DMR svd m24 all should have lower hip firing accuracy or a second side option like the 45 degree picatinny offset they sell for a red dot. those are not valid points if your talking reality.

and you honestly believe the czech republic ( where chernarus was based upon) doesnt have arms smuggling. that right there is laughable. but if you want reality please stay with reality if you want balance that chose that option but you can have both

Edited May 31, 2013 by onemeanls1z28

[onemeanls1z28 12]

zombie jesus i am with you on that i love the m14 aim that is my weapon of choice.

[Fonebook 126]

You want a valid reason?

The player health was raised in DayZ, seemingly to make the gunfights last a little longer and be more interesting. In ArmA2 you go down really quick and really easy, from most all guns. Sure some more than others, but the bullets are much more deadly in general. The decision to add health to the player shows that DayZ intended for the player interactions to be a little longer and more eventful than just quick bullet kills. Yes realism is desired, but so is engaging game play. Obviously there has to be a balance struck here and the .50 cal sniper rifles upset this balance. Every other gun takes a fair amount of skill to one-shot a fully blooded player. It does not make sense that the largest most bulky gun in the game is also the easiest to kill with (in many but not all situations). It seems to me that all the people who's play style revolves around the guns that take the least skill are the ones that need to update their play. Now they will have to develop skill. Saying that people getting shot by .50s are lacking in skill is a fair point, but people who go to great lengths to keep an easy gun in the game that requires no skill are hardly able to have a skill-based discussion on the matter.

I feel that there is a place in DayZ for .50 caliber rifles, but other things need to be addressed first. Adding wind or other difficulties to sniping would be a good way to bring them back. As it stands right now, however, the .50s throw off the game's demand for skill to succeed. More than likely SA might be the only place .50s make sense, as the loot will be much better managed.

[onemeanls1z28 12]

but Dayz is not a FPS shooter it is a survival mod correct. Realism is the biggest point antisnipers press. when you start to balance or "nerf" a game you will have a BF3 copy cat. Players cannot run into a city street and expect not to get shot thats just plain dumb. i have addressed my opinions on accuracy with scoped weapons about hip firing and laying prone several times. i agree a 50 or even a anyting above a 7.62x51 should be able to shoot standing but removing them to balance players is just wrong

[onemeanls1z28 12]

and in all honesty if you put yourself in a position to get shot by a sniper, whether it be a 50 m24 dmr svd that your tactics need to change. because when the 50 is removed the next complaint will be the DMR.

[Fonebook 126]

Wait a minute here. I am not arguing that the combat between players need to be balanced, but that a guaranteed one shot kill weapon goes against the level of skill the rest of the game demands. I am not talking balance so that combat is fair, you misread my point. I am arguing that such one-shot weapons go against what DayZ is trying to achieve overall. Otherwise they would not have raised the blood level of the player. DayZ is about interesting player interactions and the one-shot .50s are counter to that aim. I am talking about balancing realism and game-play, not PVP combat.

Removing them until another solution can be thought up and tested makes perfectly good sense. Realism is not the only argument against the .50s anyways. There are more I can keep going.

[Heathcz 84]

http://m3report.word...com/2011/02/17/

Yeah because normal people cant have a 50 cal. the mexican cartel across the pond has plenty of them. read the first paragraph. A BArret 50 cal was used to bring down a helicopter in a gun fright with police. you know ive seen a lot of sniper videos and they all have one thing in common. YOUR WALKING IN THE OPEN DIPSHIT!!!!!. now obviously making an accurate red dot scope with 2 broken bottles and some damn duck tape is more of a reality than finding a M4 with a red dot @ an overrun military checkpoint. how about this you dont like to be killed by snipers or red dots. actually learn to play the game. your in a hell hole and there will be bandits scoping cities. now if your going to take an evening stroll through electro than yeah you deserve to have a 50 cal to the eye socket. i hate when people complain about something that they can easily fix by actually learning to play. but hey thats just my opinion

I want to thank to my mum, my brother and my father for allowing me to read this beautiful comment. I thank you sir. BEANZ

[-Gews- 7443]

I am arguing that such one-shot weapons go against what DayZ is trying to achieve overall. Otherwise they would not have raised the blood level of the player.

Guaranteed one-shot weapons, yes, but any 12.7 hit center-mass should be the end of a player...

[Auslovich 48]

See, if they made a 50 Cal. like an RPG, in the way that it took up the backpack slot, and you could only used it proned or crouching it'd be much better than just removing it, and be more realistic.

EDIT:

Or, make it swing so much while standing up fully it's impossible to aim.

Edited May 31, 2013 by Auslovich

[Mos1ey 6301]

but Dayz is not a FPS shooter it is a survival mod correct. Realism is the biggest point antisnipers press. when you start to balance or "nerf" a game you will have a BF3 copy cat. Players cannot run into a city street and expect not to get shot thats just plain dumb. i have addressed my opinions on accuracy with scoped weapons about hip firing and laying prone several times. i agree a 50 or even a anyting above a 7.62x51 should be able to shoot standing but removing them to balance players is just wrong

And when you run around with a 14lb rifle plus heavy ammunition you aren't creating a BF3 copycat?

Edited May 31, 2013 by mZLY

[Fonebook 126]

Guaranteed one-shot weapons, yes, but any 12.7 hit center-mass should be the end of a player...

I definitely agree with you, even in the extremities those large bullets really tear stuff up. I am not saying that the bullet shouldn't kill you, but that a big bad one shot kill weapon cuts out all the interesting things that happen after a player is unconscious and bleeding from a sniper round. I haven't been told officially, but I assume the player health was raised for this reason, to make engagements more interesting. Realism is important but it isn't the sole focus of this endeavor. With or without .50s people will still get shot in the head and die instantly plenty. It's just that one shot kills take good shooting skill with every weapon except two, which kind of make them stand out as an oddity in the game, no?

[creature 1189]

The point is moot. The whiners and "it's not realistic" groups will get their way and any guns they feel should go, most likely will.

I do find it funny how alot of the aformentioned like to play "military style" DayZ. Even most clans have ranks and such yet "we have to remove these OP guns!"

"Oh, but leave us our heli's k!" :rolleyes:

[St. Jimmy 1631]

If I walk in the street surrounded by zombies I wouldn't expect some 12yo kid to just have some fun with super cool .50 caliber and shoot me kilometer away from the forest just for fun. There needs to be some nerf and downsides when you're shooting and keeping very heavy, big and loud gun. I liked that .50 calibers and some machine guns disabled your backpack slot so you really needed to consider twice if you want to take that gun because then you have only a pistol as a backup and only couple slots remaining in your inventory for ammo, food and drink.

/I never understand why AS50 was added in DayZ because M107 was enough and it took the backpack slot but even that doesn't take anymore because AS50 doesn't either. Really stupid balance move if I can say.

Edited May 31, 2013 by St. Jimmy

[onemeanls1z28 12]

what is the other argument and hey i like the way you debate. no sarcasm intended at all. but back to your argument, lowering repeatable shots and lowering hip firing accuracy is a proper balance. now i agree being able to place three rounds of 50 in the black with three seconds is bullcrap. and i know first hand is next to impossible. but removing them completely just to appease players that dont agree with sniping is balancing PVP regardless. when i first played this game i played like a dumb ass and ran through a city and got sniped. one hit. now i creep through cities, E and Qing corners and playing like a real survivor and snipers arent a bother now its the Shoot on sight players that give me grief but im not complaining. they play a certain way and so do i. i love knowing that someone can take me out with a single hit if I screw up.

[onemeanls1z28 12]

St jimmy and there lies the problem why would you walk into the middle of the street in a zombie apocalypse, learn your corners, stop running into the open and play like someone is out to kill you. you wont have to worry about snipers

[Mos1ey 6301]

what is the other argument and hey i like the way you debate. no sarcasm intended at all. but back to your argument, lowering repeatable shots and lowering hip firing accuracy is a proper balance. now i agree being able to place three rounds of 50 in the black with three seconds is bullcrap. and i know first hand is next to impossible. but removing them completely just to appease players that dont agree with sniping is balancing PVP regardless. when i first played this game i played like a dumb ass and ran through a city and got sniped. one hit. now i creep through cities, E and Qing corners and playing like a real survivor and snipers arent a bother now its the Shoot on sight players that give me grief but im not complaining. they play a certain way and so do i. i love knowing that someone can take me out with a single hit if I screw up.

I've heard this argument before too and also find it to be a bit flawed.

Firstly, for me, the issue isn't about 'balance' at all. Night-vision goggles are another incredibly overpowered item but there's nothing 'unrealistic' about 1) finding them in soviet military areas and 2) carrying them around with you. I just wish they used batteries (which they will in the standalone, hopefully one day in the mod too). My issue is that carrying the rifle plus ammo around with you is nuts, lol. Your arms would be hanging out of their sockets by the time you got from Stary the NW airfield.

And secondly, I don't think you need .50cal rifles in the game to instil fear. A DMR, M14, FAL or even an Enfield round will drop and leave you as good as dead. I've dropped multiple players with a bog-standard M4 before they could get a shot off. Believe me, you'll still be taken out if you screw up... xD

Edited May 31, 2013 by mZLY

[St. Jimmy 1631]

St jimmy and there lies the problem why would you walk into the middle of the street in a zombie apocalypse, learn your corners, stop running into the open and play like someone is out to kill you. you wont have to worry about snipers

In zombie apocalypse I don't expect every people to kill me /just for fun when there's thousands of zombies also trying to kill me and all the others.

Edited May 31, 2013 by St. Jimmy

[onemeanls1z28 12]

mzly if your gonna take out the 50 because it is heavy stop putting engines and fuel tanks in your backpack. your talking realistic gameplay again.

[onemeanls1z28 12]

st jimmy than punish or kick shoot on sight players. simple you dont want to be shot at you want everyone to be friendly. take a stroll through southside chicago and see how that works out for you and thats without zombies. the world is a cold ass place and a survival simulator should reflect that shouldnt it?????????

[Mos1ey 6301]

mzly if your gonna take out the 50 because it is heavy stop putting engines and fuel tanks in your backpack. your talking realistic gameplay again.

They're 'engine parts' not an engine, lol. And I don't think 'there are also x, y and z issues so don't fix the issues that I like' is a very strong argument, hopefully that will also be addressed at some point down the line.

[onemeanls1z28 12]

looks like an engine block to me, but yeah rotor assembly in an alice pack is legit. im not complaining about gameplay i like it the way it is. xyz is not an issue with me buddy its with you guys that get mad at snipers.

[entspeak 374]

And... why do we need the .50 cal? To destroy heli's? Why? Certainly not to steal them, because most shots that damage a heli such that it comes down usually result in the destruction of the heli. The .50 cal allows you to kill someone by shooting them in the foot... not much skill required there. It's over-powered for DayZ and serves no real purpose. Can't say I'm a cry-baby about it - I've never been shot by one. Yes, you can reduce the ridiculous fire rate, the accuracy of hip-firing and firing in positions other than prone... but it still serves no real purpose in the game apart from the one-shot kill and the easy destruction of vehicles from more than a KM away... and it zeros out to crazy... again... it requires virtually no skill to kill with it and with hackers being so prevalent, making it rare is meaningless. So, to me, it is those whining about its removal that are the cry babies... let it go.

[Fonebook 126]

but removing them completely just to appease players that dont agree with sniping is balancing PVP regardless.

You have already made up your mind and don't seem very open to debate. I agree with sniping completely, I just think the .50 does not make sense in DayZ.

Another reason to remove the .50s is that once you take that easy stick away many players will give up on sniping completely due to the difficulty and head down into the city to interact with other players. Most players that I have played with are completely in awe of the AS50 and just believe the whole point of the game is to work towards the AS50 so they can then snipe unsuspecting players from very long ranges. Perhaps any weapon with a range over 1000m should be removed for more engaging game-play.

EDIT: oh wait that is exactly what they are doing.

Edited May 31, 2013 by Fonebook

[creature 1189]

They're 'engine parts' not an engine, lol. And I don't think 'there are also x, y and z issues so don't fix the issues that I like' is a very strong argument, hopefully that will also be addressed at some point down the line.

You don't see many posts saying "make it so I can't carry 4 wheels across Chernarus" though. It's always things that are rare and people think are OP.