Fed up

[Shabadu_ 66]

Right.

I play DayZ because I like the survival aspect of the game. It was my understanding that this is what Rocket had in mind. Surviving against the odds, fighting off zombies and the environment and other people to get by.

I've no issue with fighting other people. But only as far as the survival aspect of the game forces you into the position of conflict. You don't know who you can trust so there will be occasions where you end up fighting other survivors. That's fine and sensible and a natural part of the game.

However, it seems to me that fighting other people is pretty much the only real reason the vast majority of people play this game. I like it as a part of the experience, not as the primary focus. That's called ARMA...

Obviously, the mod cannot hold up this experience that I'm looking for in the PVE stakes because the zombies are manageable and the environment is otherwise safe as long as you keep some food and water on you... I'm hoping the SA will fix this by filling the environment with dangers, making weapons harder to come by, zombies becoming a bigger threat etc etc etc...

But as much as I think the SA will turn out to be more the game that I am hoping for. I hold VERY little hope it will become populated with people other than all the CoD/ARMA/CS/BF kiddies and griefing nobs.

Fed up and sad and those are my thoughts on the matter, these are the reasons I'm now giving up on the mod and why I quite probably won't play the SA.

Am I wrong? Am I expecting too much? Is this the wrong game? Is it *supposed* to be a PVP sandbox for kids to run around shooting each other because there aren't enough games like that already?

[sausagekingofchicago 4711]

Fed up and sad and those are my thoughts on the matter, these are the reasons I'm now giving up on the mod and why I quite probably won't play the SA.

Okay? Out of curiosity, what other games are you going to play?

[HazZarD87 166]

Oh look, this thread again....

No seriously now, the PvP aspect is what ppl make out of it themselves. That it involves shooting others that you don't know on sight will never change no matter what they do to the mod. Beyond things that would disproportionaly impact the rest of the experience just to try and discourage shooting on sight.

Fact of the matter is people will always be inclined to shoot first and ask questions later. It will always be easier to get gear off a guy after putting a few rounds in his skull than it is to collect it yourself. And since it is just a videogame where "guilt" is no factor, you can't expect people to not shoot you out of the kindness of their hearts.

I shoot on sight myself because I know that if I don't I will end up being shot at 9 out of 10 times anyway, better to remove that risk alltogether whenever the oppurtunity presents itself.

On the other hand look at it this way: The infection has affected so many people that society as we know it has collapsed, but why would that automatically mean the infected are the biggest risk? In the end they lack any cognitive function above running and chewing on stuff (e.g. us survivors). This makes them dangerous in large numbers and when you get cornered, but easy to avoid in less populated areas. The real threat will always be other people looking for an easy means of survival. There are no more laws, no more authority, Hobbes "social contract" has become void. It is the war of all against all and as he said it will be: "nasty, brutish and short." It may not be the experience you were hoping for, or came to expect from zombie movies and such. But it is how it is playing out in this apocalypse rocket created for us.

[Shabadu_ 66]

Okay? Out of curiosity, what other games are you going to play?

Probably slowly going to phase gaming out of my life. Used to play a lot of CS, OFP, Civ, Skyrim etc but getting bored of these games. I'm just bored with the whole thing of just upping and fighting people for no good reason. Currently revisiting S.T.A.L.K.E.R. though.

I disagree that shoot on sight would make sense in a post-apocalyptic zombie infected world type scenario. If the zombies are a significant enough threat, the environment is unforgiving and it takes more than half an hour to get yourself tooled up with high grade military weaponry... then people won't be so inclined to fight. The main reason DayZ is so PVP heavy is because of the reasons I highlighted previously but also because you simply respawn.

When you attack someone, you're taking the risk that you'll get them before they get you. Also, the idea that you won't be hurt in the process, even if you do succeed. In real life, that threat holds people back unless they're psychopaths. Clearly a game is never going to be exactly the same, but I find it depressing that such a large proportion of people are out to play a game like DayZ simply to run around shooting other people.

My hope is that the SA will be hard enough without all the survivor conflict that people will prefer to at least avoid a confrontation if it can be helped, because in reality that would be the more likely scenario. But this being online gaming, I have in reality very little hope that this is how it would play out. It's just frustrating that with the sheer volume of games out there that are primarily, specifically there for people to fight each other, a game where that's not necessarily the objective, becomes all about just that.

It was somewhat inevitable though, given that the game started life as a mod on a war sim. It was always going to be taken up by vast numbers of pure PVP players wanting a new experience. Possibly if the game had started life in the SA format, it might have gone differently in the beginning. But the world being as it is, it would have degenerated into this anyway.

I would prefer to not see the game follow the "minecraft" pricing model because it might help mitigate this to some small extent. The game being sold off cheap in alpha for a tenner will only lead to a massive influx of kiddies and people who don't mind to spend a small amount of cash on yet another shooter. The AAA game pricing model might have held back some of these people initially but not for long and not enough to prevent the game from simply becoming yet another online deathmatch. Albeit a slightly more interesting one than CS...

The main point of my thread though, is to simply ask the question: Am I wrong about this game? Is not supposed to be what I think it's supposed to be? Have I misread Rocket's intentions or did he want this to be a deathmatch with added zombie interest?

[MakeThemListen 51]

The main point of my thread though, is to simply ask the question: Am I wrong about this game? Is not supposed to be what I think it's supposed to be? Have I misread Rocket's intentions or did he want this to be a deathmatch with added zombie interest?

It's "supposed to be" whatever the fuck a player wants it to be, it's a sandbox.

[Statik (DayZ) 2695]

Will you be leaving out the front, or back door?

[Shabadu_ 66]

Like pretty much all online communities... this one is so warm and friendly ^_^

[M O N S T E R 599]

Like pretty much all online communities... this one is so warm and friendly ^_^

You're the one dictating how the game should be played.

- MONSTER

[Shabadu_ 66]

You're the one dictating how the game should be played.

- MONSTER

How?

[Steak and Potatoes 13480]

It is supposed to be a combination of both but many players have gotten skilled at surviving as with any games environment after long play time. With that said many resort to PVP as the environment has no longer posed a challenge to the players. I think you will find what you are looking for in the SA as for the mod you can try other server types that have a lot to offer in terms of environmental increases to make it harder.

[Shabadu_ 66]

It is supposed to be a combination of both but many players have gotten skilled at surviving as with any games environment after long play time. With that said many resort to PVP as the environment has no longer posed a challenge to the players. I think you will find what you are looking for in the SA as for the mod you can try other server types that have a lot to offer in terms of environmental increases to make it harder.

That's what I'm hoping for, it's just that past experience suggests even the SA will turn out like the mod in terms of player's attitude.

[M O N S T E R 599]

However, it seems to me that fighting other people is pretty much the only real reason the vast majority of people play this game. I like it as a part of the experience, not as the primary focus. That's called ARMA...

But as much as I think the SA will turn out to be more the game that I am hoping for. I hold VERY little hope it will become populated with people other than all the CoD/ARMA/CS/BF kiddies and griefing nobs.

Fed up and sad and those are my thoughts on the matter, these are the reasons I'm now giving up on the mod and why I quite probably won't play the SA.

People are not playing it how you feel it should be played, so the game has thus been ruined for you. The only way you could be more blatant with how you're dictating the way it should be played is by actually saying "This is how it should be played...."

Don't come here and talk about 'cod kiddies' and not expect people to realise that you want it to change to fit your preferences.

- MONSTER

[Inception. 9443]

Unlocked. OP has explained that he wishes to discuss the nature of the game as opposed to just ranting.

[Shabadu_ 66]

People are not playing it how you feel it should be played, so the game has thus been ruined for you. The only way you could be more blatant with how you're dictating the way it should be played is by actually saying "This is how it should be played...."

Don't come here and talk about 'cod kiddies' and not expect people to realise that you want it to change to fit your preferences.

- MONSTER

My thanks to Inception for unlocking this thread, it has become clear that perhaps my intention for the nature of the discussion was lost in my whining leaving rant! (lol you got a reply in before I finished my continued blethering :P)

Just to clarify, I wanted this to be a conversation about the nature of the game. I disagree that it's purely a "sandbox" but I do agree that it is definitely all about players making their own choices and doing their own thing. That's the very best thing about games like these, you get to play around with it. But my point is that I believed it to be a zombie apocalypse survival game and I get fed up with the fact that all it actually is, is a deathmatch. It's very uninspired and sad that the vast majority of people apparently lack any more sophistication than to seek out yet more games that revolve purely around shooting other people and/or messing with their hard work.

Perhaps this conversation has been done to death, I have to apologies for not being involved with perhaps another thread. Very much appreciate Inception giving me another chance with this one and fair play if you still feel that nothing new comes out of it then I'll stop whining if you want to bin it when it inevitably degenerates into flame wars (or before) ;)

MONSTER, at what point did I say that everyone should bend to my will and my way of thinking and do what I want? I'm asking questions, not making demands. Grow up.

[M O N S T E R 599]

MONSTER, at what point did I say that everyone should bend to my will and my way of thinking and do what I want? I'm asking questions, not making demands. Grow up.

Sigh, making me quote some more...

However, it seems to me that fighting other people is pretty much the only real reason the vast majority of people play this game. I like it as a part of the experience, not as the primary focus. That's called ARMA...

Obviously, the mod cannot hold up this experience that I'm looking for in the PVE stakes because the zombies are manageable and the environment is otherwise safe as long as you keep some food and water on you... I'm hoping the SA will fix this by filling the environment with dangers, making weapons harder to come by, zombies becoming a bigger threat etc etc etc...

But as much as I think the SA will turn out to be more the game that I am hoping for. I hold VERY little hope it will become populated with people other than all the CoD/ARMA/CS/BF kiddies and griefing nobs.

Fed up and sad and those are my thoughts on the matter, these are the reasons I'm now giving up on the mod and why I quite probably won't play the SA.

Am I wrong? Am I expecting too much? Is this the wrong game? Is it *supposed* to be a PVP sandbox for kids to run around shooting each other because there aren't enough games like that already?

And in my previous post I said that the only way you could more direct about your demands was through actually saying it plain and simply. I did not say that you actually said, but it was instead implied. If you'll reread the opening post, you'll realise that throughout you state that the game is not living up to your expectations, that the people in it are more or less just using it as another platform for their CoD play-style and that you're giving up because of all this. If there's a better way at digging your own grave here and ruining any developing discussion, please let me know.

"Grow up."

- MONSTER

Edited May 8, 2013 by M O N S T E R

[Shabadu_ 66]

You're the one dictating how the game should be played.

- MONSTER

And in my previous post I said that the only way you could more direct about your demands was through actually saying it plain and simply. I did not say that you actually said, but it was instead implied.

- MONSTER

Perhaps you'll forgive my confusion...

I can appreciate that my tone was probably quite combative, but contradicting yourself just doesn't make any sense. You're the one that took the conversation elsewhere, not me.

I'm not saying the game isn't living up to my expectations, simply that I'm not enjoying the fact that it's flooded with people that don't seem to be all that interested in what I think is the premise of the game. I hope that the SA will improve the situation, but don't expect that it really will. What I'm trying to work out is if I'm literally the only person here that thought something more could have come out of this than yet another deathmatch and if indeed that was all it was supposed to be. Running out of ways I can re-phrase the same point.

[jackghnnm78@gmail.com 23]

I feel like this topic is breached every day on the Dayz forums, and this is what I say every time:

If you are tired of the PvP, be a hero,and avoid players. Getting killed by someone is not an excuse to be angry at the game.

Learn to be more cautious and be smart about how you approach people.

The motto I run with in this game that makes me enjoy it to the full extent is...

kill only the players that get in the way of your survival

Besides this it is a judgment call.

[Saethkept 134]

Essentially OP, I think what you are missing - and I sympathize with you to an extent - is that DayZ is basically this giant, messy gift given to gamers "as is" and riding the back of something we like to call free will. In a nutshell, what needs to happen to balance the game for everyone - hero and bandit and griefer alike - is for player communities to police themselves. What I am getting at is, all forms of players in DayZ have the "right" to exist, because that is how the game was handed to us. In order for some "fairness" to exist perhaps as you would define it, either alone or in with a group you must enforce or create that fairness or order on the server you play on.

DayZ takes place in the wild west, the drug lord shooting gallery of some South American city, the streets of Fallujah - in otherwords it is a warzone, a lawless zone, it's the apocalypse. The greatest gift Rocket gave us was absolute freedom within the defined parameters of the game to do as we please. I may not like the behavior of some other players, but ultimately - by the mechanics of the game - it is up to me or me along with some friends to eke out a somewhat safe existence, to hunt and kill bandits - to do whatever must be done to survive and make the in game world a better place ... better by your own definition.

Edited May 8, 2013 by Saethkept

[Shabadu_ 66]

I feel like this topic is breached every day on the Dayz forums, and this is what I say every time:

If you are tired of the PvP, be a hero,and avoid players. Getting killed by someone is not an excuse to be angry at the game.

Learn to be more cautious and be smart about how you approach people.

The motto I run with in this game that makes me enjoy it to the full extent is...

kill only the players that get in the way of your survival

Besides this it is a judgment call.

I agree with you, I haven't died in months because I play very cautiously and avoid needless conflict. I don't go to the main hotspots (except NWAF) because there's often not much decent loot and an endless supply of tedious bambi snipers. In the past two months I've watched groups in helis raid airfields, bambis struggling with zombies (made sure they didn't get killed) and randoms running or driving across open spaces. Only killed one person because he tried to ambush me with an M4A1 CCO SD as I drove toward Krasnostav, hopped out of the rustbucket GAZ, ducked into some trees, put away hatchet, took out G36A and ended the goit.

It's nice to see that I'm not the only one that is trying to play the game differently. This is what I'm looking for, people who don't just spawn on the coast, grab a gun and go shoot the nearest person for no reason other than "it's fun". I'm trying to figure out if there are enough of us to make it worthwhile playing this game. I'm not stupid enough to think I can make everyone play the way I want or that they should. I'll walk away and find something I can enjoy, I'm just keen to avoid abandoning this game if I don't have to. Also, I don't have money to waste on shit I won't enjoy lol.

[-Gews- 7443]

Meh, did anyone really expect anything else when you dump a bunch of gamers into Chernarus and then flood the map with 50 different types of handguns, rifles and machine guns?

[Shabadu_ 66]

Essentially OP, I think what you are missing - and I sympathize with you to an extent - is that DayZ is basically this giant, messy gift given to gamers "as is" and riding the back of something we like to call free will. In a nutshell, what needs to happen to balance the game for everyone - hero and bandit and griefer alike - is for player communities to police themselves. What I am getting at is, all forms of players in DayZ have the "right" to exist, because that is how the game was handed to us. In order for some "fairness" to exist perhaps as you would define it, either alone or in with a group you must enforce or create that fairness or order on the server you play on.

DayZ takes place in the wild west, the drug lord shooting gallery of some South American city, the streets of Fallujah - in otherwords it is a warzone, a lawless zone, it's the apocalypse. The greatest gift Rocket gave us was absolute freedom within the defined parameters of the game to do as we please. I may not like the behavior of some other players, but ultimately - by the mechanics of the game - it is up to me or me along with some friends to eke out a somewhat safe existence, to hunt and kill bandits - to do whatever must be done to survive and make the in game world a better place ... better by your own definition.

Beautiful post, you're absolutely right. I'm saying I don't like the way the vast majority appear to approach the game, not that they shouldn't. I want to see if there are enough like-minded people out there to do what you've pointed out, to create something in their servers other than all-out deathmatching. If not, then I can walk away and leave them to it, it is only a game after all ^_^

[Shabadu_ 66]

Meh, did anyone really expect anything else when you dump a bunch of gamers into Chernarus and then flood the map with 50 different types of handguns, rifles and machine guns?

Some imagination? ;-)

But honestly, no. Exactly that. Which is why it's a shame this couldn't have begun with the SA and not needed the mod as a "proof of concept" as Rocket put it.

[svisketyggeren 662]

to me its pretty obvious that the reason the game has gotten pvp centric is because the survival aspect/gameplay is to easy...there are beans and sodas everywhere, food is no problem....and really thats it. Pack ur backpack with beans and soda, camp in the woods and ur surviving...

dayz fails as a suvival game...the few suvival gamemechanics we have are too simple and easy to overcome....either u camp in the woods with a pack full of beans doing nothing, or u pvp...

BUT...do not put any restraints on pvp gameplay to even it out with suvival gameplay...develop the suvival aspects fo the game and pvp will decrease

Edited May 8, 2013 by svisketyggeren

[elf cakes 559]

i completely agree with the OP. and although dayZ has become rife with cod-kiddies, there are alternatives. dayZ 2017 is really excellent in the survival aspect, zombies hit harder and food and weapons are extremely rare. the best weapon you can get is an AK-47, and about half of the players i've met are friendly. for me it's the perfect balance. i really hope they take a few tips from 2017 in the SA and for one thing i hope they remove the ridiculous military sniper rifles that people can sit on a hill with a ghillie suit 1.5km away and snipe you with. they ruin the game for me really.

in regards to op, i dont understand why this topic gets so much hate, the general consensus on these forums is that 'you do what you want because it's dayZ' doesnt really seem right to me, because i can kill everyone i see in EVERY OTHER GAME. dayZ was supposed to be different, but it's become just another military shooter.

[iPewPewU 5]

Dude idk about you, but if food was harder to find, same for drinks and basic supplies, I would be even more tempted to kill other people. Way easier to kill someone for food than actually look for it !

And even in real life, if there's a zombie thing going on, I would kill people just so they won't kill me, anything goes when the laws aren't there anymore.

Edited May 8, 2013 by iPewPewU