Dayz SA to be a failure

[Michaelvoodoo25 3120]

In general.

If you don't like it, Don't buy it.

Why worry about it, people will hear about it and wonder why they don't have it. they will (With any brain cells) look it up on the tube' and make a decision on the game.

[entspeak 374]

As other's have stated, the SA will go back to DayZ's roots. I agree that private hives (believed at first to be the savior of the game because of the ability to whitelist) have become one of the big failures. The problem is that, rather than playing the game as is or coming up with their own variant, they choose to customize the game and still call it DayZ. They tend to cater to those who don't like the survival aspect of it and, so, you have custom loadouts... or worse, custom loadouts if you give the admin money. Hopefully, the SA will be able to severely limit hacking and scripting by design... thus making private hives unnecessary. My hope is that, should private hives be added, that the admins will not have the ability to customize loadouts. If you want to rent a server and play DayZ, you should rent a server and play DayZ... not your own interpretation of DayZ-lite. Leave game-altering customization to modders when that becomes possible with the SA.

Currently, the private hives are spoiling players (and, in some instances, milking them for cash with the promise of easier gameplay). Custom loadouts confuse players as to what DayZ actually is. I've seen this first hand playing a DayZ variant where, because some admins decided to add back in a particular over-powered weapon, players believed that weapon was actually a part of the variant game when it wasn't and got mad when the creators went so far as to make that weapon (and all other weapons not included in the variant of the mod) weigh thousands of pounds so that you couldn't even move if you picked one up.

[Zombie Jesus 723]

The problem with allowing private hives and mission file editing is that humans are naturaly drawn to the path with least resistance. We like to take the easy way out. It'd just leave us with the same problem that we have now in the mod... It would be impossible to find a populated vanilla (i.e. the way the game was intended to be played) servers.

I honestly hope the standalone is never opened up to modding.

I always find this position to be strange, here we are fans of a game born from modding and people are actually against modding. I understand some of the concerns with the crazy starting gear and extra vehicles (although within reason I think the vanilla DayZ servers never had enough to begin with, but that is just a difference of opinion), but user generated content has brought so much to the mod that I think many miss all the good. All of the maps would not be possible without user generated content and while some of the extra additions might not be up your alley they can add quite a bit to the game. Adding in extra points of interest to a Chernarus server can liven it up, instead of just focusing on the run up to the NWAF or Stary you could add a couple of barracks to the NEAF and suddenly have two norther points of interest.

You can add bases with unique features or gear that groups can fight over and even though I do not love Origins myself (mostly due to the people who run the mod being control freaks), some of the changes they have made ended up adding quite a bit of content.

[Mos1ey 6301]

I always find this position to be strange, here we are fans of a game born from modding and people are actually against modding. I understand some of the concerns with the crazy starting gear and extra vehicles (although within reason I think the vanilla DayZ servers never had enough to begin with, but that is just a difference of opinion), but user generated content has brought so much to the mod that I think many miss all the good. All of the maps would not be possible without user generated content and while some of the extra additions might not be up your alley they can add quite a bit to the game. Adding in extra points of interest to a Chernarus server can liven it up, instead of just focusing on the run up to the NWAF or Stary you could add a couple of barracks to the NEAF and suddenly have two norther points of interest.

You can add bases with unique features or gear that groups can fight over and even though I do not love Origins myself (mostly due to the people who run the mod being control freaks), some of the changes they have made ended up adding quite a bit of content.

I know it's sad, but IMO it would be for the greater good, and you must be able to see where I'm coming from.

90%+ of my playtime has been spent in DayZ Chernarus anyway, I enjoyed DayZ+ but other than that found all the other modceptions to be a nice change to break up the monotony but never anywhere close to as good as the vanilla mod. Chernarus+ will bring a lot of changes with all the new areas and changes that have been made to the old ones, hopefully bringing more variety in gameplay with them, and don't forget we have things like disease and sickness coming that will change how the game plays big time too.

[badluckburt 974]

Private hives won't really be necessary I think. Balance is hard to find but I'm sure we'll get there in the end. The people who play the 300+ vehicle servers or other variations of the original DayZ can still continue to due so as long as those servers keep running the mod. I don't see why you would not want to play something the way it was intended, maybe that's my problem.

On another note: we still don't know what's going to be up with the infected in the SA. All they have shown is that the pathing has been improved which makes them much more dangerous already, chances are everyone will be done with KOS because it's just too dangerous and almost certain suicide. Since the performance of the whole has been improved, what if there's a mob of 100 zombies around Chernogorsk? I'd like to see someone fire a shot then.

Stealth and / or teamwork will probably be necessary in SA I think, more than they are now.

[madmega 16]

Private hives won't really be necessary I think. Balance is hard to find but I'm sure we'll get there in the end. The people who play the 300+ vehicle servers or other variations of the original DayZ can still continue to due so as long as those servers keep running the mod. I don't see why you would not want to play something the way it was intended, maybe that's my problem.

On another note: we still don't know what's going to be up with the infected in the SA. All they have shown is that the pathing has been improved which makes them much more dangerous already, chances are everyone will be done with KOS because it's just too dangerous and almost certain suicide. Since the performance of the whole has been improved, what if there's a mob of 100 zombies around Chernogorsk? I'd like to see someone fire a shot then.

Stealth and / or teamwork will probably be necessary in SA I think, more than they are now.

Very well said

[digitalprime 36]

Hello there

One would think that the mod officially or unofficially will simply port over to A3 and will continue on from there.

There will always be those who wont want an unmoddable "hardcore" experience. A mod will be the way forward.

If there's no way made for mods to be possible (as we are led to believe for the initial release) then A3 is the most obvious tangent.

Rgds

Lok

You really think DayZ will be allowed to be ported to A3, when DayZ is using 2.5 engine. Thats competition to the SA. Why would rocket want that. A3 is more advanced then 2.5 which the DayZ SA will be using, It makes no sense. DayZ is only a mod because it started this way, and it IS going to evolve into its own game. Rocket is crazy is he allows HIS ip to be ported over and still modifiable while wanting to create a proper IP in a fully fleshed out game as the SA

Fair enough, he should allow the mod to stay where it is, But to keep supporting it, and to allow it ported over to A3 is suicide for the SA and i dont think Dean is that stupid.

[rn_max 202]

Porting the DayZ mod to A3 will only make it prettier, not magically give it the extensive custom feature set of the SA.

Wasteland is already on A3 Alpha.

Edited April 4, 2013 by RN_Max

[Fraggle (DayZ) 15720]

Also, DayZ is using Arma 3 assets where required and much of the engine code and most of the new content has been written from the ground up purely to suit DayZ. It will also be using things that are an improvement on Arma 3, player skeletons for example for improved animations. Arma 3 still uses the old ones.

The engine is now so customised it's fair to say it's unique to DayZ. A mod on any engine will still have all of the issues inherent with it being a mod. In fact porting it over to the Arma 3 engine will probably open a whole new world of issues and bugs as Arma 3 is still in alpha and has a long way to go before it's complete.

Edited April 4, 2013 by Fraggle

[specterm 25]

So your point is that, you been killed and got angry to many times and now want the game to change to your liking?

Nope.. I'd rather not play at all. But I keep checking back to read all the complaints from people that are sick of the current game style too. great mod though. It is very exciting when your new.

[OrLoK 16185]

You really think DayZ will be allowed to be ported to A3, when DayZ is using 2.5 engine. Thats competition to the SA. Why would rocket want that. A3 is more advanced then 2.5 which the DayZ SA will be using, It makes no sense. DayZ is only a mod because it started this way, and it IS going to evolve into its own game. Rocket is crazy is he allows HIS ip to be ported over and still modifiable while wanting to create a proper IP in a fully fleshed out game as the SA

Fair enough, he should allow the mod to stay where it is, But to keep supporting it, and to allow it ported over to A3 is suicide for the SA and i dont think Dean is that stupid.

Hello there

I think one would have to be naive to think that there will not be an unofficial port to A3. The coding is so similar. But I believe the SA will have its own path and the two will, for the most part, be uncomapareable.

The mod will continue on it's own path as will the SA.

Look at the mod now. There are so many 1337 loadouts and 200+ vehicle servers, that's not what Dayz was originally about.

The SA will use it's own engine and the functionality will massively differ from A3.

Dont forget what will be stripped and altered. Yes the core may be similar but the end *game* will be very different.

Rgds

LoK

[aussiestig 681]

You really think DayZ will be allowed to be ported to A3, when DayZ is using 2.5 engine. Thats competition to the SA. Why would rocket want that. A3 is more advanced then 2.5 which the DayZ SA will be using, It makes no sense. DayZ is only a mod because it started this way, and it IS going to evolve into its own game. Rocket is crazy is he allows HIS ip to be ported over and still modifiable while wanting to create a proper IP in a fully fleshed out game as the SA

Fair enough, he should allow the mod to stay where it is, But to keep supporting it, and to allow it ported over to A3 is suicide for the SA and i dont think Dean is that stupid.

Have you been following the tumblr updates, and all the new stuff that Rocket said at PAX? The DayZ SA is a totally different game. You can no longer compare the mod and the SA because they are very different games. Even if the mod was ported over to Arma 3, it'll never be competition for the SA. It's as simple as that.

[_Anubis_ (DayZ) 139]

SA and dayz mod are obviously similar in concept, gameplay and structure, so one does not need Einsten IQ to sense a competition (especially taking in account dayz is free but SA is not).

dayz is a mod of an engine. It is based on Arma2 but it could be ported to Arma3 (see Wasteland). Arma3 is a newer and better engine hence the dayz mod could benefit of this.

So the more options are there on the market to have similar games (dayz on arma2, dayz on arma3, SA) the more people will choose and buy one or the other (if one can afford all, godd for him of course), it is called fragmentation.

No supplier likes fragmentation, it reduces revenues.

_Anubis_

[Xianyu 820]

So basically, you won't have any 500+ vehicle servers and therefore you think the standalone will fail?... uh... huh...

You realise that the fans of the game actually avoid those servers, right? A proper vanilla server is gold these days. It's only the little CoD kiddie wankers who go to the 'omg start with sniper rifles and a fully repaired humvee 24/7 daylight custom weapons!' servers.

[declan223@gmail.com 271]

False. Whilst you can expect the numbers of players of the mod to drop, you can also expect to see people continue to playing the mod.

It's going to be updated by Razor and his bunch of chaps still, too.

Who introduce an anti-teleport scrip that fucks you around if you've got a hero skin.

[Serious Stan 202]

dayz standalone will be your new life, decide wich one you want to live! or DIE HARD!§

[madmega 16]

SA and dayz mod are obviously similar in concept, gameplay and structure, so one does not need Einsten IQ to sense a competition (especially taking in account dayz is free but SA is not).

dayz is a mod of an engine. It is based on Arma2 but it could be ported to Arma3 (see Wasteland). Arma3 is a newer and better engine hence the dayz mod could benefit of this.

So the more options are there on the market to have similar games (dayz on arma2, dayz on arma3, SA) the more people will choose and buy one or the other (if one can afford all, godd for him of course), it is called fragmentation.

No supplier likes fragmentation, it reduces revenues.

_Anubis_

That doesn't matter that much since all those games belongs to Bohemia.

[_Anubis_ (DayZ) 139]

That doesn't matter that much since all those games belongs to Bohemia.

Nope. It matters a lot to them... It is about the money they could make:

dayz freeware mod on arma2: zero revenue if someone owns already arma2, otherwise revenue for an arma2 CO license

dayz freeware mod on arma3: zero revenue if someone owns already arma3, otherwise revenue for an arma3 license

SA payware: revenue for one license of SA, ON TOP OF any arma2/arma3 sales

So BIS may get more or less money (*zero* money in some cases!) depending on what is or will be available on the market.

Now think a little bit whether BIS would like to end up in a situation where they can get more money or less money and what they will choose.

It is all about maximizing ROI, just like making a port of SA to console. More sales (more $$$).

_Anubis_

Edited April 5, 2013 by _Anubis_

[byrgesen 1341]

Hello there

I think one would have to be naive to think that there will not be an unofficial port to A3. The coding is so similar. But I believe the SA will have its own path and the two will, for the most part, be uncomapareable.

The mod will continue on it's own path as will the SA.

Look at the mod now. There are so many 1337 loadouts and 200+ vehicle servers, that's not what Dayz was originally about.

The SA will use it's own engine and the functionality will massively differ from A3.

Dont forget what will be stripped and altered. Yes the core may be similar but the end *game* will be very different.

Rgds

LoK

Just to back LoK up, i know for a fact that the team behind DayZ 2017 is aready full at work with a port of the mod.

Its gonna be called 2017 and they expect to have an early version done in a couple of weeks.

So theres gonna be unofficial DayZ port on Arma III for sure, its happening right now ;)

Edited April 5, 2013 by Byrgesen

[madmega 16]

Nope. It matters a lot to them... It is about the money they could make:

dayz freeware mod on arma2: zero revenue if someone owns already arma2, otherwise revenue for an arma2 CO license

dayz freeware mod on arma3: zero revenue if someone owns already arma3, otherwise revenue for an arma3 license

SA payware: revenue for one license of SA, ON TOP OF any arma2/arma3 sales

So BIS may get more or less money (*zero* money in some cases!) depending on what is or will be available on the market.

Now think a little bit whether BIS would like to end up in a situation where they can get more money or less money and what they will choose.

It is all about maximizing ROI, just like making a port of SA to console. More sales (more $$$).

_Anubis_

Hold on m8. To be able to play a mod for ArmA 2 or ArmA 3 or any ArmaA game that supports modding, you need the game right? People have already paid for that. Now you talk about maximizing profit, when Bohemia have already, some years back, decided that they will have a engine, open for modding. They have intentionally (spelling?) decided that they don't want the cred or the profit a mod can/will receive.

EDIT 1 and 2: I quoted _Anubis_ reply into my original post and now this.

Edited April 5, 2013 by Mad mega

[_Anubis_ (DayZ) 139]

So you are saying that BIS is happy to not sell more copies of SA and would like people to download instead a free mod !!??

Where do you think BIS gets money to pay its employees (including Rocket) ?

Sorry for asking, maybe it is due to that, but do you work for a living?That changes the perspective a lot...

_Anubis_

[madmega 16]

The mod is free, but the game is not. That's profit right there. DayZ mod has led to a full game which IMO, the majority of the mod players, will buy. That's profit right there.

I don't really understand your second question, feels like you only want me to somehow agree with you, but i don't think you have really gave this a thought. I think you are ignoring the profit they make by selling the game. Hmm where do i think they get money from? wow i just don't really understand how you can ask this, but i guess anything i will or have said will not change your opinion.

And Yes, they are happy to do this since they care more about creating creative stuff then just a number on a paper or on a screen. Otherwise they would have changed their open modding engine to the opposite or have this as a feature you pay for.

EDIT: sorry if this is hard to fully understand, english is not my native language which makes it hard for me to fully express myself.

Edited April 5, 2013 by Mad mega

[badluckburt 974]

Sorry for asking, maybe it is due to that, but do you work for a living?That changes the perspective a lot...

With all due respect, earning a living does not mean it's ok to screw people over to get extra money. If you find yourself in that position, something went wrong along the way.

Also, BIS is NOT like the big corporations in the gaming industry - I bet they are gamers at heart, it shows in most of their products.

Edited April 5, 2013 by BadLuckBurt

[aussiestig 681]

Also, BIS is NOT like the big corporations in the gaming industry - I bet they are gamers at heart, it shows in most of their products.

This. I mean, most game companies are out giving day 1 DLC for $30 to add something into the game that should have been there before, and BIS is selling Arma 3 for half price on day 1, and you get to play alpha and beta while you wait for the full thing to arrive.

[OrLoK 16185]

So you are saying that BIS is happy to not sell more copies of SA and would like people to download instead a free mod !!??

Where do you think BIS gets money to pay its employees (including Rocket) ?

Sorry for asking, maybe it is due to that, but do you work for a living?That changes the perspective a lot...

_Anubis_

Hello there

As other tried to point out, even if folk stick with the mod they'll still have to buy a Bis product. Namely A2OA or possibly A3.

I doubt BI would release a product that would damage their own profits, they're a small organisation but not daft.

Rgds

LoK