SA: server hopping

[SmashT 10907]

So because you may get killed its down to cod players?

Apparently lol

[rossums 2190]

So because you may get killed its down to cod players?

He probably doesn't specifically mean players that just play Call of Duty - that's a bit of a broad generalisation.

He's referring to the generation of gamers that have grown up on crappy, instant-gratification games like Call of Duty over the last 5 or so years which expect everything to be handed to them and only think about themselves - if you haven't seen the trend in the general attitude of new games you are kidding yourself.

Earlier on in development the DayZ mod was a lot more 'friendly' and players actually tried to help each other rather than killing on sight - once it became 'popular' and got more into the mainstream the 'COD-Kids' got a hold of it and just treated it like any other FPS that they played.

It's not their fault, they haven't really been given the opportunity to play a proper team game, even more team-oriented games like Battlefield have devolved to cater more to the 'SHOOT ANYTHING THAT MOVES HURR DURR' crowd, it's sad but it's reality.

You can definitely see the different attitudes in groups of players, for example:

Back when WoW was released it was a brilliant game, you could actually trust other players and it was populated by like-minded people who were playing it because they were a fan of the Warcraft world and story.

Once it became 'mainstream' as a nerdy thing to do it attracted the 'omg look at me, I'm sooooo nerdy' crowd and then the 'I play it because it's popular' crowd. Blizzard started doing things they said that they would never do just to appeal to the lowest common denominator.

You can definitely see what he is talking about when you look at the attitudes of some players but that's just what gaming has become for a lot of people nowadays,

[Imafighter 236]

Apparently lol

CoD kiddie: The guys the around around the coast with automatic weapons/sniper rifles, doing nothing but shooting freshspawns that have nothing but a Hatchet or a Makarov.

[Xianyu 820]

So because you may get killed its down to cod players?

Pretty much, yeah.

Ask anyone. The KoS mentality that infects 98% of players, the whole 'omg I'm an edgy bandit Kos'er!' came about IN FORCE after the massive influx of gamers. Before that, it was a much more sedate, less ridiculously PvP orientated experience. Sure, some of the patches that hamstrung zombies and made them no harder to shrug off than a light breeze, contributed pretty badly to the KoS mentality. But the massive influx of 'casual gamers' who came from youtube expecting 'OMG I CAN SHOOT SURVIVORS!' irreparably ruined the experience for people who didn't want a massive KoS shitfest.

Right now, the mentality of those gamers has bled through to the rest of the community, so much so that it's EASIER to shoot another survivor because they were MORE than likely going to shoot you the moment they saw you anyway. It's safer to assume that these people are going to shoot you because 90% of the time, they will. Even if you're completely unarmed, half of the community will shoot you. These are CoD kiddies. Don't like the term? Too fucking bad. That's what they are. ADD, spastic fucks who just kill people on site because it's 'fun'. Their only reason for playing the game is to shoot other survivors. And sure, maybe it's a playstyle. but it's a shit, cowardly playstyle that has successfully bled through the entire mod until it's just one big PvP match. Except you have to find your guns. Fuck, remove the zombies and you just speed up the process a little.

So I make NO apologies for calling people like this 'CoD kiddies', because associating them with 12 year old little ADD-infected shitstains who need gratification from PvP every ten minutes so as not to lose interest is an apt comparison in my mind.

[SmashT 10907]

Why not just call them casual gamers?

[syn111 2]

It is way easier than all the suggestions above. Just only allow people to logoff in the forests and not in towns,NWAF,etc.

Still possible to server-hop of course but it would take way more time, and it also addresses what I call the "reverse combatlog" or when you and your group have secured some place only for someone to suddenly login inside your secured area....

Combine that with a time limit for joining different servers and all set.

Edited March 19, 2013 by syn111

[Xianyu 820]

Why not just call them casual gamers?

Because 'casual gamer' implies that I'm talking about people who spend a few hours playing it every now and again, and not spasticated ADD-infested immature pricks seeking instant gratification.

plus, calling other people 'casuals' implies that I'm not. That I'm some kind of hipster gamer. 'Yeah, I played CoD before it was cool and I never kill people.'

'CoD Kiddie' just very eloquently brings to mind the kind of associations I want it to. That's what a word, or title, should do.

[willey.erd@oundleschool.org.uk 506]

Just saying.. This is going to be a STANDALONE, not a MOD. /reference to our previous argument :P

On a more serious note, why do you keep assuming the absolute worse about features, as if nothing is going to be changed? Fair enough, you have a good point and it's an important issue, but at least try to be optimistic! :)

[p4triot 207]

Divide the map into different sections each with not more than medium-high level loot spawn location. Everytime you server hop you spawn on a random spot in the area so you will never be on the exact same spot which sort of solves this problem.

Good idea here. Every time you log on a diff server you respawn at the beach, with your gear and all, but at a random place as if you were random starting again. I mean, if you are swithing servers isnt like you have a camp where you did unlog right? there wont such camp in the new server so you dont need to respawn there anyway..

[aHzdaNny 49]

For those that are saying adding more spawn points upon server switching could be a possible solution: With the current state of the mod, I don't run from Kamenka to Elektro if that's where a friend of mine spawns. I let zombies kill me and respawn. Repeatedly, until I spawn near Elektro. Going all in on immersion just isn't worth it anymore due to reasons Xianyu (rightfully :thumbsup:) explained above. If we assume people swap servers to loot the same place they disconnected from on server A, what's to prevent them from simply doing so repeatedly, until they spawn where they want to spawn? Sure, it may take longer but the outcome doesn't change.

Edited March 19, 2013 by aHzdaNny

[BeanerBob 0]

if you hop 2 times in a row you could be maybe not able to pick up any items for 5 minutes

[bloodriot 13]

First off i'd liek to say I don't like messing around with people's spawn locations on joining servers. It confuses players by puttings them in a surprise location where several things can go wrong not because of any form of bad judgement on the player's side. It also may cause problem for people meeting with friends where the first 10 minutes or more are spent getting new bearings and running to a meeting place.

I like server side characters/loot, much the way an MMO works because that tends to be better to forming communities of players that will start knowing eachother's reputation and facilitate relationships (friendly or otherwise). That alone gets my voite... the fact that it also prevents server hopping is the cherry on top.

Cheers.

[v3c1c 86]

Server hopping in SA - not big deal. There will be noobs 100% who will do that but I dont see HUGE problem here - let them do it. They can spend hours hooping servers and getting gear and then get killed as soon will leave the house, area what ever, with pistol ... and thay are back in spawnzone.

If they are not hackers I don't care much about them. I have killed lots of them in beginning of Dayz, I will kill a lot of them in SA - call me a noob bandit - I will call you a noob server hopper :D

[Bongofish 22]

CoD has infected DayZ? Thats the most ignorant comment i have ever read.

Justify to me, How CoD has ruined DayZ...

He's probably refering to how you can't find normal DayZ anymore. Most servers are modded to make the game easier, or more COD-like. "9000+ vehicles," "Starting gear," "Increased loot," all that crap. People may enjoy it, but it isn't really DayZ.

[mintypie007 57]

I never understood the premise of the public hive in the first place. When you change servers you are playing with a different set of users. So you can join a server with newer users and loot up knowing there is a lower risk. It goes deeper than server hoping for just more loot but includes moving servers to limit risk. Private servers which all have the same files (no modding) and separate modded servers are the way to go. Allows the super hardcore legit dayz nonsense to keep stats and allow for user expansion of the game.

[mintypie007 57]

He's probably refering to how you can't find normal DayZ anymore. Most servers are modded to make the game easier, or more COD-like. "9000+ vehicles," "Starting gear," "Increased loot," all that crap. People may enjoy it, but it isn't really DayZ.

Adding a few more cars (900 is too many) and a few news guns doesnt really ruin dayz to me. The autorefuel pushes it, but there is a way to balance everything. On my server I.have included some new things but have changed loot spawn rates, helis that are placed ate well guarded by by some seriously difficult military unitswho have a chance to have the rarest loot. They patrol as well. It has led to most ppl on my server banding together so they dont die. It has been a while since i heard someone say they were scared to explore alone. I remember when I first started and tactically moved past every tree. That is why I loved it. Dayz needs to change so ppl are uncomfortable. maybe zombies need to be more dynamic in some way to achieve this.

[sausagekingofchicago 4711]

Server hopping in SA - not big deal. There will be noobs 100% who will do that but I dont see HUGE problem here - let them do it. They can spend hours hooping servers and getting gear and then get killed as soon will leave the house, area what ever, with pistol ... and thay are back in spawnzone.

If they are not hackers I don't care much about them. I have killed lots of them in beginning of Dayz, I will kill a lot of them in SA - call me a noob bandit - I will call you a noob server hopper :D

It's a huge deal. Hopping is used for more than just farming. Any type of combat situation between groups will immediately be ruined by people who will hop to another server, reposition themselves, and jump back in behind the other group. This is simply stupid and far more immersion breaking than a silly can. Same goes for the farmers who hop around in the barracks and magically come out of a room you were just in and mow you down. Add a well organized group to the mix and the farmers/hoppers will have a home server with that specific location locked down so the hoppers can unload their loot in safety and maybe even catch a ride back to the farm sites if they do get killed.

It's a huge deal and a clever solution has to be devised if they don't want the public hive infested with exploiters.

[Maloney (DayZ) 26]

Cooldown's between when you can leave and join another server might fix this? I am certain the devs will sort it out somehow, I can't imagine them releasing the SA with such a game-breaking exploit in the hands of arseholes.

[WelshWizard 8]

Dunno if this is even possible to implement (or already been suggested) - but in league of legends right (i know totally different game, set up, system - whatever) when you leave a match early or just the lobby you have to wait 15 - 30mins before you can join another, perhaps something like this could be added in if you attempt to server hop - make your client wait 30mins before you can connect to a different server. Instant join same server you were previously on (in case you lose connection - whatever) - but give a time penalty if you attempt to join a different server. This would also have an effect on ppl attempting to ghost :)

Prob not possible - just a thought.

This is the best solution as far as I can see. Simple to implement and no immersion breaking side effects. Alot of people are over complicating it and looking for the perfect solution where none exists. All that can be done is mitigation.

A 15 minute penalty every time you try to join a different server than the last one you played on (if you last played on that server less than 15 mins ago) would curb hopping nicely. For instance, if you're at a barracks and hop to two other servers before returning, you've just spent 45 mins of your life watching a timer count down.

It also pretty much eradicates ghosting as it would take 30mins to exploit your new position.

A penalty like this isn't too much of an inconvenience to people who change servers for genuine reasons either. If you log on for the first time in a day to find your home server is full, you incurr no penalty (> 15mins since I last played). If I lose connection and someone takes my place, I can either wait till a slot opens up and join instantly, or wait a max of 15 mins and join a different server.

KISS.

[The Shadow 119]

Because 'casual gamer' implies that I'm talking about people who spend a few hours playing it every now and again, and not spasticated ADD-infested immature pricks seeking instant gratification.

plus, calling other people 'casuals' implies that I'm not. That I'm some kind of hipster gamer. 'Yeah, I played CoD before it was cool and I never kill people.'

'CoD Kiddie' just very eloquently brings to mind the kind of associations I want it to. That's what a word, or title, should do.

But CoD Kiddie is a stereotypical name which doesnt describe all of the population, I have played every CoD but i dont kill for fun/KoS?

You cant complain about something which you can do nothing about. Dayz is about playing your own style and making your own story, if people want to play like they do, they will continue to do so, no matter what you say so you just have to learn to live with it.

Its like sitting and complaining about fuel prices and how nowadays its expensive because of the governments raising prices. Yes, 15 years ago fuel was a quarter of the price but now its not and there's nothing you can do about it. If there is nothing you can do about it, you learn to live with it and get on with life.

You will always come across people who want to do nothing but PvP no matter what game you play so why sit making stupid phrases to describe them and insulting the population of them over a forum, when you can just get on with the game and playing it how you want to play.

No one here is criticising how you have fun when playing a game so why should you criticise and degrade others on how they play a game?

Edit - Also why bring ADD into it? Are you one of those people who like to discriminate people with disorders?

Edited March 19, 2013 by The Shadow

[Xianyu 820]

But CoD Kiddie is a stereotypical name which doesnt describe all of the population, I have played every CoD but i dont kill for fun/KoS?

You cant complain about something which you can do nothing about. Dayz is about playing your own style and making your own story, if people want to play like they do, they will continue to do so, no matter what you say so you just have to learn to live with it.

Its like sitting and complaining about fuel prices and how nowadays its expensive because of the governments raising prices. Yes, 15 years ago fuel was a quarter of the price but now its not and there's nothing you can do about it. If there is nothing you can do about it, you learn to live with it and get on with life.

You will always come across people who want to do nothing but PvP no matter what game you play so why sit making stupid phrases to describe them and insulting the population of them over a forum, when you can just get on with the game and playing it how you want to play.

No one here is criticising how you have fun when playing a game so why should you criticise and degrade others on how they play a game?

Edit - Also why bring ADD into it? Are you one of those people who like to discriminate people with disorders?

Newsflash: I'm ADHD and played around about 2000 matches of CoD Black Ops. I fucking hate the FAMAS with a passion and think anyone who used it should have their own place in hell RESERVED.

I use these terms because they summon up the imagery I want it to. What else am I meant to call them?

'Those people who just want to PVP and KoS all the time'?

Or 'CoD kiddies'? I think I know which one I'll stick one.

This is a forum.

This is the internet.

We don't need to be 'politically correct'. Fuck, I'll take 'correct' half of the time and be happy. Stop getting so up in arms because the fanbase of one of the games you play is used to derogatorily refer to a group of people.

Unless you intend to tell me that CoD HASN'T devolved into 12 year olds twitch-shooters doing their stupid 'trick shots' and 'no scopes' and bullshit like that?

P.S. I criticize others on how they play the game - namely the PvP CoD kiddies who backstab and spend their time sniping people from hillsides, thinking that they're somehow 'cool' for it - because they ruin the game for the people who DON'T want to play like that. Wanna be friendly? You can't.

Find a survivor. Walk up. Say 'friendly'. Repeat, ten times. On a server without side chat. I'd say do it on a Hive server, but that's a joke, considering there's like two left.

Now tell me how many times you got shot in the face.

Extra points if you have a primary weapon when you do it. if you're unarmed, there's about a 3% higher chance of not getting your face fucked with bullets.

the 'KoS' mentality brought in by the 'casual' gamers has bled through to every single player. No one is friendly. No one pretends that anyone else might be. Even myself, who hunts bandits, I do not reveal myself to ANYONE. Period. Why? Because the ADD as fuck CoD kiddies will shoot you on sight, the 'bandits' will kill you for your loot, and then 2% of the population will run away because they either A) have no weapon, or B) actually want to play a zombie survival game.

Leaving the remaining 1% of players to actually go 'hey, a survivor, maybe we can team up! :D '

But don't worry, the CoD kiddies are hard at work teaching that 1% fucking moron that trusting ANYONE for ANY reason at ANY time will only earn you a bullet in the back.

Edited March 19, 2013 by Xianyu