Realistic gun mechanics like Reciever

[freeman83 51]

I've been hooked on this indie game called Reciever lately, and i think these type of mechanics would add another element of tension to dayz if implemented. The gameplay revolves around the reaalistic mechanics of a gun, so if you want check how many bullets you have you pull out the magazine and look, if you want to load a bullet in to the chamber you pull the slide, if you want to check to see if tere is a bullet in the chamber you hold the slide lock while pulling the slide. I think you guys get the idea. Imagine the tension it could add to a gun fight in dayz. that combined with the bullet drop and wind effected trajectory = too much awesomeness. who likes it? Im sorry if the guy in the video is annoying =P

if anybody wants to try the game, you can get it at wolfire games for 5 dollars

http://www.wolfire.com/

if you want it on steam, vote to green light it now!

Edited September 8, 2012 by freeman83

[attorney1977 311]

Yes I was thinking of DL'ing it.

It looks too complex for this type of game though. Receiver is totally built around the gun mechanics and doen't have to consider all the other copntrols associated with a larger scope/world game like Arma. For example, the mechanic with checking the mag would only work for some guns (not all mags have partially visible bullets). Would be nice for things like the double barrel or revolver. Some guns (in Arma, not in DayZ) have opaque acrylic mags already, so you can see the bullets in the magazine.

Would be good to have pre-chambered rounds in Arma though. 'One in the tube' if reloading from partially full magazine etc.

[Skat3rat 1633]

It looks too complex for this type of game though. Receiver is totally built around the gun mechanics and doesn't have to consider all the other controls associated with a larger scope/world game like Arma.

This exactly. Arma is already complex enough and adding even more complexity would cause for more lag and such. The game already does have bullet drop and the guns are supposed to act just like the real ones.

[freeman83 51]

Horde, on 09 September 2012 - 02:43 AM, said:

It looks too complex for this type of game though. Receiver is totally built around the gun mechanics and doesn't have to consider all the other controls associated with a larger scope/world game like Arma.

To be fair, Dayz is not as complex as Arma. some commands and functions have been thrown out in the dayz mod. If needed Dayz's controls could be tweaked to include these realistic mechanics. A good example of a complex set of functions optimised to run on a limited amount of buttons is MGS3. If something as complex as that can work well on a control pad, then a lot more can be done on a keyboard with Dayz. We have to think outside the box for inspiration sometimes.

The reason why i suggested this is because i have read half a dozen threads asking for a skill system in arma where "the more you shoot, the better you get at it", "the steadier your aim", kind of comments. Why not make the gun mechanics ultra realistic and then we will see who can learn to shoot properly. With this realistic system, inevitably practice makes perfect.

Edited September 8, 2012 by freeman83

[aksuduud 64]

Very gimmicky.

[Skat3rat 1633]

The reason why i suggested this is because i have read half a dozen threads asking for a skill system in arma where "the more you shoot, the better you get at it", "the steadier your aim", kind of comments. Why not make the gun mechanics ultra realistic and then we will see who can learn to shoot properly. With this realistic system, inevitably practice makes perfect.

I think that the player should be the one earning the skills, not their character. Makes it much more fun. Last night I got in a firefight, I had an M9 SD and the bandit I was up against had a makarov. We came across each other in the open with no cover. I nailed him three times, chest, neck, then head. He didn't hit me once. He fell down dead and the outcome came because of who had more skill with their aim and weapon.

[freeman83 51]

]I think that the player should be the one earning the skills, not their character. Makes it much more fun. Last night I got in a firefight, I had an M9 SD and the bandit I was up against had a makarov. We came across each other in the open with no cover. I nailed him three times, chest, neck, then head. He didn't hit me once. He fell down dead and the outcome came because of who had more skill with their aim and weapon.

so you like the realistic gun mechanics?

Edited September 8, 2012 by freeman83

[joeyslucky22 638]

I would absolutely love to see the receiver gun mechanics in DayZ.

Everyone needs to try this game now.

[Frozen (DayZ) 144]

This exactly. Arma is already complex enough and adding even more complexity would cause for more lag and such. The game already does have bullet drop and the guns are supposed to act just like the real ones.

arma might be complex, but at some point its not complex enough. a proper gun mechanics is what game of such type needs.

[freeman83 51]

Oh one of the other great features about Reciever is how you run by tapping W, the faster you tap, the faster you run. Adding this and removing Arma2's method of controlling running speeds will a] give the player more control and b] reduce the amount of buttons needed for walking/running leaving more buttons for the realistic gun mechanics, (for those that are concerned about the mechanics being too complicated for Dayz.)

Edited September 8, 2012 by freeman83

[joeyslucky22 638]

Oh one of the other great features about Reciever is how you run by tapping W, the faster you tap, the faster you run. Adding this and removing Arma2's method of controlling running speeds will a] give the player more control and b] reduce the amount of buttons needed for walking/running leaving more buttons for the realistic gun mechanics, (for those that are concerned about the mechanics being too complicated for Dayz.)

...eh, that's a mechanic I don't see working in DayZ. You wouldn't want to constantly be tapping W running across a field. Wolfire even mentions that tapping W only works in receiver because the map is so small and close quarters.

[freeman83 51]

...eh, that's a mechanic I don't see working in DayZ. You wouldn't want to constantly be tapping W running across a field. Wolfire even mentions that tapping W only works in receiver because the map is so small and close quarters.

You wouldnt want to but your finger getting tired from running too much adds to the realism. On the other hand just holding a button down and sprinting endlessly without fatigue is less immersive and realistic. The other benefit of tapping to run is being able to finely adjust your movement speed as you negotiate obstacles or enter a confined or cluttered area or building.

Edited September 8, 2012 by freeman83

[joeyslucky22 638]

What might work is having a stamina system implemented, and once you've depleted your character's stamina, you have the option of tapping W to continue an "emergency sprint"

Related note: I actually bought an under the desk stair stepper and plan on rigging it up so that the faster I walk/run IN REAL LIFE, determines if i'm walking/running in game. Not quite sure how I'll do that yet but it's really pretty boss getting a small work out while playing DayZ ;)

[Frozen (DayZ) 144]

You wouldnt want to but your finger getting tired from running too much is somehow.... realistic lol. On the other hand just holding a button down and sprinting endlessly without fatigue is less immersive and realistic. The other benefit of tapping to run is being able to adjust your movement speed as you negotiate obstacles or enter a confined or cluttered area or building.

if you played GTA:SA, you can remember that mechanics that required to tap run button(most people use shift or alt this point) to run faster then just by holding it. and i have to say it was awful because of fatigue. tapping W all of the time would be even worse, especially taking into account how good dayz as running simulator is.

[freeman83 51]

What might work is having a stamina system implemented, and once you've depleted your character's stamina, you have the option of tapping W to continue an "emergency sprint"

Side note: I actually bought an under the desk stair stepper and plan on rigging it up so that the faster I walk/run IN REAL LIFE, the faster I walk/run in game. Not quite sure how I'll do that yet but it's really pretty boss getting a small work out while playing DayZ ;)

The stamina system is a great idea.I also really like the stepper idea.

I have been day dreaming about how future versions of motion sensor technology could be combined with a VR headset like the Oculus rift to give complete immersion in to Virtual reality. So the motion sensor would provide full body detection with high fidelity and no latency and your in game avatar would mimic your every move accurately whilst the VR headset would allow you to view everyting in first person. So you look down and their is your hand as you would see it in RL but a 3d representation of it. Then you could manipulate objects in 3d space as you would in real life. The only remaining problem was controlling movement without an omni directional tread mill. Thats where you stepper idea comes in. The way i imagined a solution is that the a 3m circle would be drawn on the floor. the user would stand in the middle of the circle and depending on how far towards the edge of the circle they moved would dictate their movement speed in any diretion, forward, back, diagonal etc.

Edited September 8, 2012 by freeman83

[freeman83 51]

if you played GTA:SA, you can remember that mechanics that required to tap run button(most people use shift or alt this point) to run faster then just by holding it. and i have to say it was awful because of fatigue. tapping W all of the time would be even worse, especially taking into account how good dayz as running simulator is.

but was it in anyway immersive for you?

The way i see it, dayz has become popular because of the intensity and immersiveness of the situations it puts you in, so where other game developers have shyed away from including things that could punish but at the same time immerse the player Rocket has embraced these ideas, and in practice have made his concept very addictive. Before dismissing these things that may seem like to much of a annoyance for players we have to ask how they will effect gameplay and what emosions will be aroused by this. I imagine running away from a horde or bandit by tapping and getting tired while doing it will create some tension. another benefit would be the ability to finely adjust movement speed while negotiating obstacles. nobody really wants to tap to run for miles on end, but you wouldnt want to walk or run for miles on end in rl either . So do the pros outweigh the cons, that is the question.

Edited September 8, 2012 by freeman83

[aksuduud 64]

In my opinion, when you press R, you instruct your character to change the magazine and cock the gun if there is no bullet already in the chamber, breaking this up into multi-step process done by the player would do little to add serious immersion. As i think immersion comes from the big picture of being in a believable scenario having to do believable things.

[Bearded McGee 121]

Yes and no.

I'd like to see gun mechanics taken a step further, but to go the way of a gun-nut virtual waifu fantasy is a bit much.

No to safeties, manual cocking and most other menial tasks. I want a better fidelity, so to speak, on the side of how a gun handles in different situations. The always-a-round-in-the-chamber technically would be nice to implement, for example.

Edited September 8, 2012 by Axelord FTW

[Skat3rat 1633]

Yes and no.

I'd like to see gun mechanics taken a step further, but to go the way of a gun-nut virtual waifu fantasy is a bit much.

No to safeties, manual cocking and most other menial tasks. I want a better fidelity, so to speak, on the side of how a gun handles in different situations. The always-a-round-in-the-chamber technically would be nice to implement, for example.

I think that this is a good idea. Don't go over the top like Reciever but add some more to the gun mechanics, maybe the gun could get jammed from time to time, possibly guns couldn't stick out walls so when you enter a building your gun can actually bump against things and get in the way.

[OrLoK 16186]

Hello there

I would like something similar to this in game. But i'm a tech realism freak. It may not be for everyone.

The only thing i don't like is the dreadful youtube reviewer. (I also don't like him dry firing that 45)

Rgds

LoK

[Lady Kyrah 1110]

I would like a bigger focus on personal skills, however there is two types of real life skills involved in a given situation

-Thinking on your feet.

-Mulscular memory.

Most fps games, even those requiring a huge amount of skill only require muscle memory for the most time. Lining up for a headshot, reloading, crouching/proning at the right time, you don't even "think" about these things anymore. It's an easy system to setup, encourage the player to train himself to react to a specific situation.

However, for me, these skills are as "noble" as getting used to work on an assembly line. After a while it is all automatic and you barely remember what you did during your day of work.

Any idiot can become proficient at those skills.

I want more skills that require active thinking, decision making, getting out of a bad situation, adapting to unexpected turns of events...

I want less things that you can learn in a wiki without even playing the game or things that require no brain cells.

Edited September 9, 2012 by Lady Kyrah

[bazbake 456]

I fell in love with receiver a while back. It's a little heavy at first, but once you get the rhythm down, the gun itself becomes the gameplay instead of merely shooting at things. And that was a really awesome accomplishment for a game. There's a point while playing a game where you realize that you've become good at playing it, not just good at succeeding in it. When the relationship between control responsiveness and your own ingenuity allows you to accomplish some incredible feats no one had thought of before.

There's really not much skill involved in DayZ, which is probably why people get bored easily. It's your typical wiki, map, loot-farm combo that you would get in any MMO on the market today. It's nothing special with regard to combat or PVP. I think the game suffers for this.

Personally, I'm fond of games that force the player to develop a set of representative skills necessary to accomplish elaborate character feats. It's obvious that many players would never want to feel that they're not particularly good at a game in a genre that they're used to, like the FPS, and it's not like I haven't witnessed this before. A lot of people picked up Mirror's Edge expecting to just start running and magically be good at everything. They felt clunky, so they called the game clunky. They felt awkward and uncoordinated, so they called the game burdensome and difficult. Most critics disagreed, of course. In fact, with experience using the controls, you could be a spin-kicking, high-jumping, wall-flipping kung-fu master. Something that even FEAR only hinted at.

DayZ shaves off all of the real-world burdens to gunplay and makes the entire endeavor a straight-up loot fest. It throws out skill completely. It never forces you to plan or compromise or even put much thought into what you need to do.

[freeman83 51]

I fell in love with receiver a while back. It's a little heavy at first, but once you get the rhythm down, the gun itself becomes the gameplay instead of merely shooting at things. And that was a really awesome accomplishment for a game. There's a point while playing a game where you realize that you've become good at playing it, not just good at succeeding in it. When the relationship between control responsiveness and your own ingenuity allows you to accomplish some incredible feats no one had thought of before.

There's really not much skill involved in DayZ, which is probably why people get bored easily. It's your typical wiki, map, loot-farm combo that you would get in any MMO on the market today. It's nothing special with regard to combat or PVP. I think the game suffers for this.

Personally, I'm fond of games that force the player to develop a set of representative skills necessary to accomplish elaborate character feats. It's obvious that many players would never want to feel that they're not particularly good at a game in a genre that they're used to, like the FPS, and it's not like I haven't witnessed this before. A lot of people picked up Mirror's Edge expecting to just start running and magically be good at everything. They felt clunky, so they called the game clunky. They felt awkward and uncoordinated, so they called the game burdensome and difficult. Most critics disagreed, of course. In fact, with experience using the controls, you could be a spin-kicking, high-jumping, wall-flipping kung-fu master. Something that even FEAR only hinted at.

DayZ shaves off all of the real-world burdens to gunplay and makes the entire endeavor a straight-up loot fest. It throws out skill completely. It never forces you to plan or compromise or even put much thought into what you need to do.

I think we are on the same wave length.. I enjoy playing racing simulations with a force feedback wheel because Real world skills translate to the sim making it ultra satisfying when i battle it out and win.

As i understand it, Rockets intention is to make dayz a unforgiving and realistic apocalypse simulator, so surely these gun mechanics are right up his street.

On a side note, after playing reciever the Colt 1911 A1 is very familliar to me now. i could probably operate the weapon in RL thanks to reciever.

Edited September 10, 2012 by freeman83

[Zeppa 562]

Something like this with dayz?

I like the receiver copy idea, I would play with my guns all day long ^^

[doglover 26]

Kool idea man, best idea since dogs. I hope it gets added to the game! :thumbsup: :beans: :thumbsup: