The Difficulty of DayZ

[CaribeanSoul 10]

Well I can agree that the top gear should be more rare all around. Random crash sites are random though and it's possible you just had an incredible run there ... or are just lucky in general. Or maybe the crashes need to be toned down. It's really hard to tell when every kid sniping elektro has a ghille, as50, m4-sd or thermal, tons of ammo for all of it and a full toolbelt. Somehow I just don't think they found all that stuff legit. It's going to be really hard to judge any of it until they plug the holes and do a gear wipe.

[falconne 13]

Oh buu-huu. If you dont know it already: if you take stuff from a tent, the stuff will be back at the tent at next server reboot. A tent = duping factory. There is no cheating because that is actually how they work. Should it be fixed? OF COURSE IT SHOULD. But for now this is how tents work and have been doing so for a while.

Now, i am not sure how people fill their tents with this most awesomesauce gear, but for sure taking stuff from someone elses tent is not cheating.

BTW on the topic of finding good gear easily: in three hours today i found seventeen helicrashes (five servers, the infamous "sobor-vybor field run"). If tents would work now, I'd say my camp on my "home server" would have some awesomesauce gear piling up pretty fast.

So you use known bugs and server hopping and claim the game is too easy? And you want the base game to be remodelled and rebalanced... in such a way that would force everyone to use the bugs and exploits to survive?

What... what?

[SillySil 295]

Killing zombies isn't fun, that's one of the problems. The close combat in arma is just bad. Plus the zombies constantly zigzag or do weird stuff, like when they are around 5 meters away from you, they suddenly get a boost and are next to you, hitting you and clipping through you cause the animation sucks.

[sausagekingofchicago 4711]

So you use known bugs and server hopping and claim the game is too easy? And you want the base game to be remodelled and rebalanced... in such a way that would force everyone to use the bugs and exploits to survive?

What... what?

I don't server hop or use tents. Game is still too easy. I'd just like the game to be more challenging for experienced players.

[Maxgor 2314]

The game will only become harder once its fixed. Zombies are broken, loot is really easy to get (I've seen super markets where you can find like 3 Alice packs in them among other great gear), and the only real danger are people camping cities, something you only have to visit for a short bit to get supplies and then leave.

[latster@gmail.com 4]

Getting basic gear is more down to luck than the difficulty setting of the game. Sure, Zombies are a hassle and will catch you out if you're not extremely careful and patient, but you're more at the mercy of the server/DayZ code than anything. I know where to find things, i'm not a noob, but on several occasions the game has screwed me over by spawning nothing but tin cans or being beaten to the punch by someone else who has just left cans. It's pure chance either way. Fix the loot spawns and getting a starter weapon and food won't be so hard.

Zombies need a lot of tweaking to get right, once they've stopped being able to walk through walls, then the 'difficulty' of the game can be addressed. I personally don't think it needs to get any harder than it currently is. If you think the game is too easy, try setting up a camp in the middle of Cherno or NW Airfield to challenge yourself!

[flimsypremise 94]

I've been killed 18 times today just trying to get basic equipment, and every time I went to recover my corpse, it was bugged. So no, I don't think it needs to be made harder. I think every second of developer time spent on this mod going forward should be spent fixing existing bugs.

[puydor 0]

Bump!

[sostronk 334]

I play legit and do no duping, server hopping, hacking or any exploit I know whatsoever. I don't use tents and dont touch vehicles, only ride bicycles when I find them.

Food, water and medical supplies are way too easy to come by. I only carry one primary weapon with me at all times and my Alice pack is full of food, water and medical supplies at all times. Usually when looting I will eat and drink since Im full of food and water and found more. There are way too many canned foods in the game as it is, then you can hunt on top of that. Hunting should be a necessity after the first hour or so of a life. I constantly pick up soda cans and dont even touch the water bottles... which should be a necessity to keep and refill regularly. If you hit up a hospital once you have all the medical supplies you need for tens of hours, which is rediculously easy to do. Zombies pose no threat whatsoever once you know how to deal with them properly.

I don't loot bodies for ammo or weapons as I want to take out the factor that i may be using duped/hacked weapons, yet weapons and ammo are still really easy to come by for low and mid range weapons. Hit up a couple of deer stands (which are way too easy to loot with only 3 zombies) if you have an AK (insert variant) and you will have all the ammo you need. If your using a different primary like CZ550 you will get all the ammo you need and then some from barns. All low and mid range weapons and ammo are easy to get. I can't comment on high level because of the graphical glitches I cant get close to military spawns very often.

There are only a few loot items that are even close to being balanced. NVGs and range finders seem about right. Pretty much everything else is too common.

Edited August 22, 2012 by sostronk

[joeoblong@yahoo.com 614]

7. add some danger to forests, they are like sanctuarys now with the exception of random players. maybe diseased wildlife? Zombie bears, wolfs and bobcats? wondering zombie-hordes?

Would they be wondering how they as a horde ended up wandering in the wilderness? Philosophical zombies I dig it.

[SmashT 10907]

The game already has a steep learning curve, but once you figure it out is too easy, it needs to be more difficult for veteran players without making it any harder for new players then it is now.

[CaribeanSoul 10]

Ok ... how about this as an experiment. Try surviving without visiting the big cities (or any town with a supermarket) and not going to NW airfield. When I first started I was trying to avoid those locations (because I was sure I'd get shot in the head the second I went near them) and let me tell you that's a different experience. Maybe they just need to ramp the zombies up in those kind of premium loot locations. After I started going to cities and stuff I couldn't believe all the crap I was finding in the stores. I saw a grocery store with 5 alice packs in it and almost fainted.

So as an experiment to provide feedback for the game ... maybe some of you will give that a shot. Pretend the cities have way too many zombies to handle without a large group of players or something. Then see if the difficulty feels any better to you.

[sostronk 334]

Ok ... how about this as an experiment. Try surviving without visiting the big cities (or any town with a supermarket) and not going to NW airfield. When I first started I was trying to avoid those locations (because I was sure I'd get shot in the head the second I went near them) and let me tell you that's a different experience. Maybe they just need to ramp the zombies up in those kind of premium loot locations. After I started going to cities and stuff I couldn't believe all the crap I was finding in the stores. I saw a grocery store with 5 alice packs in it and almost fainted.

So as an experiment to provide feedback for the game ... maybe some of you will give that a shot. Pretend the cities have way too many zombies to handle without a large group of players or something. Then see if the difficulty feels any better to you.

I used to do that all the time. Its definately a slower start. But I was still surviving for a long time. Probably the biggest issues I have with it are getting a map (which id probably have to get from a deer stand). Food and water would be fine. Medical loot would be scary because no morphine which makes climbing any ladder a nightmare. But bandages and painkillers are still in abundance. Weapons pretty much have no effect, apart from maybe that early bit of picking up a mid level weapon from firehouse. But there are plenty of decent mid level weapons at barns before you hit the deer stands.

Ill try it again, but I imagine it will be really easy. I struggled with it, but that was because I only recently started playing and was learning the game. Then let you know how I go :)

[CaribeanSoul 10]

Yeah the morphine is an issue with that for sure. (Maybe cheat a bit into the city for a few morphine because there's no point in crawling around all day.) I had the worst luck finding food in the small towns early on. I died once from starvation. Couldn't find any matches to cook and couldn't find a can of beans to (literally) save my life. But that could just be my horrible luck.

[aussiestig 681]

Anyone who's played chernarus apoc would be with me when I say that DayZ is extremely easy when it comes to zombies.

In chernarus apocalypse, it takes around 5 shots to a zombie's torso to kill it, AND if you get hit 3 times you die.

If DayZ was like that, it'd be impossible, I know. But they could atleast make zombies a little harder, and you lose more blood when they hit you. Zombies aren't even a threat right now, DayZ is just a big deathmatch with zombies in it as a distraction and an annoyance.

[puydor 0]

bump ! :)

[sostronk 334]

Yeah the morphine is an issue with that for sure. (Maybe cheat a bit into the city for a few morphine because there's no point in crawling around all day.) I had the worst luck finding food in the small towns early on. I died once from starvation. Couldn't find any matches to cook and couldn't find a can of beans to (literally) save my life. But that could just be my horrible luck.

Had a go at it tonight after I killed teleported to the middle of nowhere from a hacker. Turns out I didn't need to hit any major town as I found Morphine in the first Deer stand I come across (which was fairly lucky since its like a .02% chance of getting it. I spawned in Cherno and left straight away. Ive pretty much got all the necessity items I need. 2 water bottles, 4 soda cans, 6 cans of pasta/baked beans, Enfield and about 5mags, matches, hatchet etc. The only major item Im missing now is probably a hunting knife. Once I get this Im pretty much set and only need to worry about players.

My impressions, barns are way too generous. They give you mid range weapons and all the food and water you need. Barns and "pubs" were the most beneficial places. TBH I think I could probably survive purely of looting barns though and leaving every other building. The enfield is great for dealing with Zombies (one hit). Ill probably have to hit up deer stands a bit though as they are the only place I know that spawns them outside of major cities, although I think pubs might as well.

Ive run across copious animals so far and they seem to be programmed to walk right in front of you. Id love a skill method for tracking them down. As it is I run through a field and any cow, goat or sheep decides to get up close and personal for a hello. Kind of frustrating seeing those cows without a hunting knife but Im probably don't even need them, just I prefer hunting for the 800 blood cooked meat gives you compared to the 200 for canned food.

The two water bottles I have are enough for me to do a few loot runs before I have to return to a watering hole.

Food and water are way too easy to come by. Ive passed up so many cans of soda and pasta/baked beans because I don't have the storage space (Ive still only got a basic coyote pack).

Mid ranged weapons are too easy too come by, as is the ammunition for them. Im only packing an enfield and a 1911 pistol and Ive passed up so much ammo due to being out of storage and come across about 5 enfields and about the same in 1866 or double barrelled shotguns.

[danbigs 0]

Just because you've learned the game doesn't mean the difficulty should evolve with you, if that happens very few new people will try it out and you'll be left with mostly only those who played the alpha who aren't bored yet buying the standalone.

The key is to scale the difficulty, with new sandbox features, so that experienced players have newer, more dangerous things to aim for (such as fancier equipment that is only found in areas of the map infested with larger zombie concentrations and dangerous animals) and more grandiose goals to pursue (e.g. fortification and base building).

As for you, you could either take a break from playing till more stuff is added, or do something more dangerous like hunting bandits and helping out new players. There's no point "just surviving".

I totally agree here. Game power creep is not a good idea. If you alienate new players, the game will not survive. It's best not to think "the game is too easy" - but rather "the game needs high-end content".

I agree with some others that fixing the ability to exploit zombies' running/aggro issues is needed. This will go a long way to fixing this "rearm super fast" boast people make. Once people can not exploit zombies and quick-loot, I think the whole game will change.

Also, I can't prove it, but I think that something like 80% of people playing use a buch of exploits and pseudo-hacks.

Oh, also, another good fix is to slow running in response to things like hunger, thirst, and duration of run. This also hurts people who just run zombies around.

Edited August 23, 2012 by danbigs

[CaribeanSoul 10]

I'm starting to see your point a bit more. I think I have been a little biased by a couple things:

1. I have spent most of the game trying to stealth around zombies rather than just running around like a madman and then ditching them by LOS. I played a lot at night when stealth works much better. I was getting owned by zombies a lot during the day. Usually because I got caught prone in a bad spot in a mob of zombies that were apparently professional boxers before becoming zombies. Lately I've switched to using the "run around" method exclusively and it is way easier but it feels kinda silly. So I think the zombies are plenty hard when using a stealth approach, but could use some tuning to make it harder to ditch them by running around. Honestly I think the stealth type gameplay is much more fun, but I'm also a big fan of stealth type games like splinter cell.

2. This game, I think, hates me. I have terrible luck finding things like food or morphine outside of the major cities. I hardly ever find matches. I do find piles and piles and piles of .45 ammo... which would have been nice before pistols got nerfed. The idea of sprinting zombies indoors scares me because ... well I'm terrible and getting consistent headshots is not my forte. If the zombies are sprinting around, I'm in big trouble and pistols do me no good at all. It's funny, I've set out to do some hunting and build up a little stock of cooked meat and wandered the map for a couple hours and eventually found one boar. If I don't have a hunting knife, or I'm running somewhere with a pack full of really nice stuff I don't want to drop there are animals everywhere.

[puydor 0]

Bump ! I want to hear more opinions !!!!

[sixfeetgiantbunnyrabbit 40]

I consider myself not being a total noob at dayz (i find my way around the big cities, successfully repaired a bus recently etc.) but i'm a noob when it comes to games in general since dayz is practically the first game in like 15 years i'm playing. So i'm not very skilled in shooting and propably not as comfortable with the controls like the majority of dayz players.

But even i have to complain about the game being to easy as far as zombies and the enviroment goes. If you don't want to choose the life of a bandit the game is pretty easy.

Players instead should constantly be on the hunt for supplies: food, water, ammo, dealing with infections, deseases, broken limbs that need time to cure, low blood, fuel, batteries, animal bites, various snake poisons, etc. Make the players feel uncomfortable constantly in need of something. And every find should be like finding a treasure especially weapons (besides of small guns maybe. like rocket said, my favorite weapon in the game is the Makarov too, because it's a "desperate man's weapon" as rocket put it). So loot spawns should be toned down dramatically. You should find more really common stuff instead like plates (at least to make some noise to distract zombies and players), knives, tool kits, shovels, different clothes, etc.

If the surrounding enviroment including zombies becomes more of a threat the whole game changes massively. Players would team up just because they have to simply to survive this horror. Lone wolve players would really feel like accomplishing something just because they made it through another day. And bandits keep their satisfaction of killing players but with a more realistic approach when killing for food and supplies ... and occassionally just for fun when his basic needs are satisfied.

that would be my perfect dayz experience. And the proposition of that lured me in making my gaming comeback after quitting several years ago during Lara Crofts adventures on the original Play Station.

More DayZ, less Daisy!

[Erik (DayZ) 61]

It can indeed be a bit too easy to get gear sometimes. What they should do in the standalone is to adjust the loot spawn slightly on the amount of players that are in the server or that can be in the server. So loot spawns a bit faster when theres like 100 people in 1 server and it spawns a bit slower when theres only like 5-10.