A mechanic to prevent DayZ turning into a massive DM

[terrvik 2409]

1. Improve Z behaviour. They should walk (not aggro) towards ALL sounds in a large area. This will make you think before firing your gun. This would A) increase the risks of firefights, even if you win and B) reveal a campers location since there would be a lot of Z-people around a location from where shots originates.

2. Decrease the accuracy of guns and spawnrates of scoped weapons, sniper rifles and military grade weapon.

Fights should be awkward. There is no fun in sniping people with an Enfield rifle from a couple of hundred meters.

3. DECREASE THE AMOUNT OF AMMO!

Having even FIVE bullets for your sniper rifle should be considered a luxury. Now you can run around with a backpack full of the stuff. If you encounter another player you should think more if it is worth wasting those precious bullets for the lulz or save them for later when they are needed.

Making the players aware of the risks (and increasing those risks) will get rid of the bandit "problem" (deathmatching) without some stupid punishment mechanic.

[gizm0 96]

1. Improve Z behaviour. They should walk (not aggro) towards ALL sounds in a large area. This will make you think before firing your gun. This would A) increase the risks of firefights' date=' even if you win and B) reveal a campers location since there would be a lot of Z-people around a location from where shots originates.

2. Decrease the accuracy of guns and spawnrates of scoped weapons, sniper rifles and military grade weapon.

Fights should be awkward. There is no fun in sniping people with an Enfield rifle from a couple of hundred meters.

3. DECREASE THE AMOUNT OF AMMO!

Having even FIVE bullets for your sniper rifle should be considered a luxury. Now you can run around with a backpack full of the stuff. If you encounter another player you should think more if it is worth wasting those precious bullets for the lulz or save them for later when they are needed.

Making the players aware of the risks (and increasing those risks) will get rid of the bandit "problem" (deathmatching) without some stupid punishment mechanic.

[/quote']

I think this would be the best as it would require deathmatchers to have to work hard to even be able to cause as much grief as they do now.

[Dinnj 4]

Making weapons unrealistically inaccurate does not sound like a good idea to me. Artificial variability is going to make people have a sour time when it goes wrong for them. The day I find that a Lee Enfield isn't hitting its mark at 200m is the time I consider a game to stop being a simulation. Decreasing spawn rates of military grade weapons is only realistic. There are way too many. Scoped weapons are not uncommon, there is no reason they should be rare.

I am in favour of decreasing ammo but please note that it is far more likely to increase PvP, not decrease it. There is absolutely no reason that it would decrease PvP. When I had 5 bullets left in my Makarov I reasoned that if I aggrod a group of zombies I was screwed. I knew I had to use my very very scarce ammo on another human - I can reliably shoot one person to death more than a potential group of zombies. This would guarantee me a weapon with ammo, risking the zombies would not.

I still hate how I can't find one of these threads without reading "grief", "wrong", "deathmatchers", "CoD washouts", or "ruined my life".

[terrvik 2409]

The accuracy question depends on what kind of characters we play as. As ArmA is a military simulator we play the vanilla game as trained soldiers. Are we supposed to be that in DayZ as well? I know I wouldn't know how to survive for shit in an apocalypse scenario, gun or not. :)

Whether or not PvP is affected by the amount of ammo isn't really relevant in my opinion. If you kill a guy for ammo that's fine, because there is a reason for it; survival. I suggest it as a means to stop people camping a roof with a large supply of ammo just to annoy people. Defend different playstyles all you want (I know I am) but that kind of playing should realistically be very hard to accomplish.

[ikaiyoo 1]

The only way that you can keep this mod from becoming one huge DM... no there isnt a way that you can, the mod is already a DM by designating rare and ultra rare equipment that everyone wants to get. Even if the only thing it is remotely suited for is killing other players.

The only way you can even attempt to get away from that would be to allow admins the ability to designate their server a PvE server. By doing this it would allow a couple of things. It would increase the spawn rate and spawn number of the zombies on the server to make them a serious threat, and 2. The penalty for multiple killings is kick or ban. There is no way to not ever kill someone. And you cant turn off friendly fire. But if a person specifically comes into a PvE server and starts killing multiple players it is allowed for the admin to kick and ban that player from the server.

That is the only way to fix that. And in all honesty I do not know why it cant be done. That way everyone can be happy. The people who want to go around killing other players will have the chance to do it, and would have servers where they could play against like minded people so they actually have a challenge. And the people who want to treat this as a huge coop where you trade loot with people help them out and team up for a time to clear a town so you can both mutually gain from it would have servers to play on. Then this would never be an issue again.

[Dinnj 4]

The accuracy question depends on what kind of characters we play as. As ArmA is a military simulator we play the vanilla game as trained soldiers. Are we supposed to be that in DayZ as well? I know I wouldn't know how to survive for shit in an apocalypse scenario' date=' gun or not. :)

[/quote']

It absolutely does not. It doesn't matter how much of a professional you are, if the sights are zerod the weapon's accuracy remains unaffected.

The world's best marksman or a kid holding a gun does not make the weapon inherently more or less accurate. If you are capable of putting a crosshair over a target you are going to hit it. This isn't the 1800s where hitting a target with a firearm was more of an art form than a simple procedure. Our military technology has come quite a way on I assure you.

When I was 14 I was given an M16 to shoot. No surprise that I could land a headshot on targets at over 30 feet far more easily than you can do it in this game. If you can point and shoot, you're going to hit it.

Training only really comes into play when someone is shooting at you, you have to coordinate in a team (We can still do this in Day Z), or you're in a tough spot. N.B. This is not always the case, building clearance is a massive exception to all this.

---

1: That is the only way to fix that.

2: And in all honesty I do not know why it cant be done.

This is where normally I'd quote myself from another thread' date=' but all my recent 100 or so posts have been deleted since the forum problems.

1: There's nothing to fix, it seems most players like the reckless PvP that takes place. If there is a solution that doesn't damage the majority, then the more casual minority should and probably will be catered for.

2: This is an obvious solution, you [b']must have realised that the devs have probably already and thought of this and deemed it not viable.

I can only offer insight into why they might have decided this. The game has an intended format, as said, it is more of an anti-game than what you would traditionally expect. As such, having different servers to cater for totally different player bases is like holding up a big sign that says;

"We're now abandoning an ideal vision and catering for petty demands."

The two servers would be essentially totally different games, it would be nothing like Day Z at all. Humans vs AI is better suited for a different game. If you want PvP to be totally removed you really should find something else to play; not because I don't want you here, I wish you enjoyed it, but because you would be better off playing something else.

A big appealing factor of Day Z is that you don't know what people's motives or intentions are. Splitting servers oversimplifies the game by letting people instantly know "This is a PvPer" or "This is a fellow carebear". This distinction is made before you even log in. All the anti-PvP carebears will flock to the PvE servers, greatly reducing complexity of player interactions in Day Z. There is no need for trust in a PvE server as friendly fire will be off. This creates boring mono dimensional play with actually less human element..

For the remaining PvP servers, the diversity will be gone. It will all be the same types of players, and due to this lack of intrigue of how people are going to react to you or treat you, the game will be lessened as a result.

[terrvik 2409]

It absolutely does not. It doesn't matter how much of a professional you are' date=' if the sights are zerod the weapon's accuracy [b']remains unaffected.

I'm mostly talking about the handling. Things like recoil and how steady you are. How used you are with handling a gun. There must be other factors in play that a game has to simulate that we in our comfy chairs aren't affected by? :)

[THUNDERMINE 2]

A note on the way Zombies should operate to make the game that much more dynamic:

1: Remove zombies from spawning, period. This is not how it would be in real life is it?

A zombie popping up next to you in the same spot you just killed one, five times in a row until you're out of ammo? lols its killed me probably 20 times.

2: Zombies start fresh with the server each reset at their normal spawn points, but THEY

NEVER FULLY DIE WHEN KILLED. How much more awesome would it be if you put a zombie down and instead of thinking that zombie was dead you were standing there nervous knowing

that anywhere from 5 to 20 minutes from now that zombie was going to get back up and start terrorizing!!!

3: the Zombies need their own AI so they can roam all over the map chasing people, but after a set time of not being aggro'd they sorta start walking back to their home areas.

4: Zombies can Aggro each other so they follow each other around sorta pissed.

This would make me that much more scared as I played

[ikaiyoo 1]

1: That is the only way to fix that.

2: And in all honesty I do not know why it cant be done.

This is where normally I'd quote myself from another thread' date=' but all my recent 100 or so posts have been deleted since the forum problems.

1: There's nothing to fix, it seems most players like the reckless PvP that takes place. If there is a solution that doesn't damage the majority, then the more casual minority should and probably will be catered for.

2: This is an obvious solution, you [b']must have realised that the devs have probably already and thought of this and deemed it not viable.

I can only offer insight into why they might have decided this. The game has an intended format, as said, it is more of an anti-game than what you would traditionally expect. As such, having different servers to cater for totally different player bases is like holding up a big sign that says;

"We're now abandoning an ideal vision and catering for petty demands."

The two servers would be essentially totally different games, it would be nothing like Day Z at all. Humans vs AI is better suited for a different game. If you want PvP to be totally removed you really should find something else to play; not because I don't want you here, I wish you enjoyed it, but because you would be better off playing something else.

A big appealing factor of Day Z is that you don't know what people's motives or intentions are. Splitting servers oversimplifies the game by letting people instantly know "This is a PvPer" or "This is a fellow carebear". This distinction is made before you even log in. All the anti-PvP carebears will flock to the PvE servers, greatly reducing complexity of player interactions in Day Z. There is no need for trust in a PvE server as friendly fire will be off. This creates boring mono dimensional play with actually less human element..

For the remaining PvP servers, the diversity will be gone. It will all be the same types of players, and due to this lack of intrigue of how people are going to react to you or treat you, the game will be lessened as a result.

1. I am so tired of hearing the word carebear. I did not say I wanted to play PvE I am offering suggestions that would actually help everyone.

2. in Arma 2 you CANNOT turn off friendly fire.

3. THE TITLE OF THE POST IS HOW TO KEEP THE GAME FROM BEING ONE HUGE DEATHMATCH. I say it in caps because you obviously did not read that. I was offering suggestions. And no it isnt that this isnt viable. the amount of code to be written to incorporate "if you are PvE increase spawn and zombie rate by X" of the mission file is negligible. If you leave it up to the discretion of the server admin as to what kind of server he wants to have since he is the one paying 75+ dollars a month to host it, then the majority of servers will be whatever the majority of people want.

4. There is a reason why when you look at the server list the game type is set to co-op. Arma 2 is a military sim game. the majority of missions played on other server are co-op, which means PvE. in an interview a while back Bohemia Interactive Studio said their focus is more along wanting players to play together rather than against. The whole part of the game this mod is based on is focused on players playing together.

There is a reason if you go to ANY MMO game that spans multiple servers you find two or even three different servers. You have PvE PvP and RP servers. because anyone who develops it knows that there are a lot of different gamers and the games they want to play.

And this whole lack of intrigue BS is BS. I am a PvP player. 9 times out of ten when I kill someone they never see me. When I am killed I never see them. There are very few times I interact with anyone before deciding to kill them because I do not luxury of finding out. Mainly because I kill everyone on sight. I have yet to run into anyone who was PvP who wanted to have a discussion before we proceeded to try to kill each other. But that is a nice try for an argument. The ONLY thing that separating people who want to play PvP from PvE is that my easy targets have now disappeared. And good. I get bored killing them. They pose absolutely no challenge. I would rather have 50 people on a server that are actively trying to kill me than 20-30 people on a server trying to kill me and the rest running around trying to kill zombies and team up with people and be friendly. the map is big enough that it makes a big difference of those 20-30 people.

oh and that whole part of you able to make a headshot at 30 ft WITH A RIFLE. not impressed. if you didnt make the headshot I would question your motor skills. I was hitting 12" targets at 12yo with a 30-30 at 250yrds. It doesnt matter how zeroed in a gun is. if you do not know how to shoot beyond 10-12 ft you will not be accurate with a pistol and beyond 150ft you wont be accurate with a rifle. And do not EVEN get me started on the fact that I am able to pull off 1200m shots in this game. For a person with no training what so ever to go and hit targets 1200m out is more than rediculous. at 1200m the recticle jump from your heart beat can cause the shot to be a foot or more off target. Anyone off the street would not know to compensate for that.

[Regicide 111]

1. There is a reason if you go to ANY MMO game that spans multiple servers you find two or even three different servers. You have PvE PvP and RP servers. because anyone who develops it knows that there are a lot of different gamers and the games they want to play.

2. And this whole lack of intrigue BS is BS. I am a PvP player. 9 times out of ten when I kill someone they never see me. When I am killed I never see them. There are very few times I interact with anyone before deciding to kill them because I do not luxury of finding out. Mainly because I kill everyone on sight. I have yet to run into anyone who was PvP who wanted to have a discussion before we proceeded to try to kill each other. But that is a nice try for an argument. The ONLY thing that separating people who want to play PvP from PvE is that my easy targets have now disappeared. And good. I get bored killing them. They pose absolutely no challenge. I would rather have 50 people on a server that are actively trying to kill me than 20-30 people on a server trying to kill me and the rest running around trying to kill zombies and team up with people and be friendly. the map is big enough that it makes a big difference of those 20-30 people.

1. Who told you this was a MMO?

2. It's not BS. It's the truth. You instantly know upon joining how people will treat you. Why play the game at all with those kinds of settings? The game will become pointless and mundane.

[Cpt.Vilja 15]

Maybe make zeds stronger and increase the zed nummbers.

It should be really HARD for people to stay alive alone.

Just like in RL. Also a bandit would think twice before shooting.

"Do i want 40 Zeds which can kill me easily, on my ass just because of some beans ?"

Make the Zeds a bigger threat !

[Dinnj 4]

1. I am so tired of hearing the word carebear. I did not say I wanted to play PvE I am offering suggestions that would actually help everyone.

Clearly I am eagerly awaiting your ideas to help me.

2. in Arma 2 you CANNOT turn off friendly fire.

You knew exactly what I meant. Let me reword it; "Prevent PvP".

3. Let the server owners decide

I don't know why you've numbered your responses like this' date=' I made two points so you could reply to them in a way that was coherent and made sense, instead you've opted for numbering random unrelated crap that makes it very difficult to have a structured discussion. I fucking hate how people are incapable of being concise.

[b']Anyway: We've already seen it isn't up to the server owners. When UK11? time froze their server it got blacklisted. The reason this probably doesn't exist is because of the reasons I'd outlined in my previous post.

4. There is a reason why when you look at the server list the game type is set to co-op. Arma 2 is a military sim game. the majority of missions played on other server are co-op' date=' which means PvE. in an interview a while back Bohemia Interactive Studio said their focus is more along wanting players to play together rather than against. The whole part of the game this mod is based on is focused on players playing together.

[/quote']

Look, as cute as how ARMA 2 is, this is not ARMA 2. Day Z is not the same thing.

There is a reason if you go to ANY MMO game that spans multiple servers you find two or even three different servers. You have PvE PvP and RP servers. because anyone who develops it knows that there are a lot of different gamers and the games they want to play.

I didn't know that rocket was trying to follow the example of companies like Blizzard.

I KILL PEOPLE ON SIGHT AND DON'T HAVE INTERESTING PLAYER INTERACTION

Wow' date=' no shit sherlock. The only limiting factor there is your play style.

-snipped anecdote- For a person with no training what so ever to go and hit targets 1200m out is more than rediculous. at 1200m the recticle jump from your heart beat can cause the shot to be a foot or more off target. Anyone off the street would not know to compensate for that.

Cool, you must have been a great shot.

Please, tell me where it is that players are making 1200m shots on players consistently. Because I think you're talking total bullshit. A few players once in a blue moon might have pulled it off, but this is not a regular occurrence.