The PvP Discussion Thread

[Jrod (DayZ) 3]

If given a chance to play on a PVP or a non-pvp server with unlimited slots. ALL of you will choose non-pvp no doubt. You all talk like you're hardcore' date=' but really you just joined the game like me when it was viral.

[/quote']

This could not be more false. There are groups of people who only play PvP. These people go out of their way even at times to avoid the other aspect of PvP, which is PvE. I could give you some great examples, but already wasted enough time.

[aviatormoser 0]

This thread is endless.

Everyone has an opinion.

The PVP system is up to Rocket.

[Freeborne (DayZ) 7]

I love ArmA PvP, everything from AAS, DM, CTF, Warfare and PR, but so called "PvP" in DayZ leaves a filthy taste in my mouth.

There is absolutely no skill requirements to murder people in DayZ. Vast majority of cases I've seen, players are murdered by other players lying and pretending to be friendly, or otherwise shot in the back. The douchebags usually tell people on Side Chat they are friendly, and need help, or are offering help, just to lull players into an ambush.

From what I've seen, vast majority of players actually want to explore the mod, collect loot, and team up with other players to survive against the hordes of zombies. THAT is really what the usual zombie theme is about, and what I suspect is attracting the vast majority of players. Only takes 1 or 2 douchebags to spoil the fun for several players, and create mistrust and deception amongst players that spreads like a desease, with innocent players often killing each other out of paranoia.

We all have our opinions, but I'll tell you mine is that this is NOT how life would realistically play out in a post-zombie apocalypse if you knew you only had 1 life (like in real-life). You would want sentries when you sleep at night, and someone to help if you sprain an ankle, or your weapon jams, etc. With 99% of the population dead, you wouldn't be killing what's left of the human race for a can of beans, especially if they are killing zombies and making your world safer for you to live in.

So far I've found that people that defend the current system:

- Noob PvPers themselves.

- Noot survivors who rarely get far in the game so don't care when they get murdered.

- Lucky survivors who have rarely been PK'd, perhaps because they get lost in the woods often.

People who dislike PvP system:

- Survivors who survive for hours, kill hundreds of zombies, and often acquire good gear.

- Survivors who want to role-play the mod, and team up with other survivors.

- Anyone with balls and respects a challenge in PvP gaming.

[22nd_Chuck 1]

I just hope that rocket only implements tools ingame that allow other players to enforce the punishments for mass murdering others, instead of artificial handicaps and punishments.

E.g when studying a body, it should tell you who killed that individual, and how long ago that person was killed, what caliber of bullets are in his body, this would be a simple example of an ingame tool which would allow anti-pkers to punish the pkers, as it would enable people to track the mass murderer by following the body trail with the decreasing time of death.

While also allowing the more skilled pkers to hide the bodies in order to cover their tracks, or even dragging the bodies and placing them in such a way as to lead the anti-pkers into an ambush etc etc possibilities go on.

[noisegrrrl 8]

I just hope that rocket only implements tools ingame that allow other players to enforce the punishments for mass murdering others' date=' instead of artificial handicaps and punishments.

E.g when studying a body, it should tell you who killed that individual, and how long ago that person was killed, what caliber of bullets are in his body, this would be a simple example of an ingame tool which would allow anti-pkers to punish the pkers, as it would enable people to track the mass murderer by following the body trail with the decreasing time of death.

[/quote']

How could you possibly know who killed it?

IMO, the best solutions would be deadlier zombies, and present in the wilderness too. People will think twice before firing when this is the case.

[22nd_Chuck 1]

I just hope that rocket only implements tools ingame that allow other players to enforce the punishments for mass murdering others' date=' instead of artificial handicaps and punishments.

E.g when studying a body, it should tell you who killed that individual, and how long ago that person was killed, what caliber of bullets are in his body, this would be a simple example of an ingame tool which would allow anti-pkers to punish the pkers, as it would enable people to track the mass murderer by following the body trail with the decreasing time of death.

[/quote']

How could you possibly know who killed it?

IMO, the best solutions would be deadlier zombies, and present in the wilderness too. People will think twice before firing when this is the case.

There has to be a compromise that is at the very least semi-realistic, as in real life that mass murderer would most probably have developed an MO which would set how his murders look appart from the rest, e.g if he uses a crossbow, the victim would always be shot in the same place, or a trophy take from the body of some kind, this would be pretty hard to add into the game, so it does make sence that if a player has surpassed a certain ammount of kills that you could tell who he kills, and time of death could be justified by how body the warm is, and if its cold, it would display time of death as unknown.

[jacobite 1]

There has to be a compromise that is at the very least semi-realistic' date=' as in real life that mass murderer would most probably have developed an MO which would set how his murders look appart from the rest, e.g if he uses a crossbow, the victim would always be shot in the same place, or a trophy take from the body of some kind, this would be pretty hard to add into the game, so it does make sence that if a player has surpassed a certain ammount of kills that you could tell who he kills, and time of death could be justified by how body the warm is, and if its cold, it would display time of death as unknown.

[/quote']

Except that's all only possible and avoids the fact that people can easily kill indiscriminating.

[22nd_Chuck 1]

There has to be a compromise that is at the very least semi-realistic' date=' as in real life that mass murderer would most probably have developed an MO which would set how his murders look appart from the rest, e.g if he uses a crossbow, the victim would always be shot in the same place, or a trophy take from the body of some kind, this would be pretty hard to add into the game, so it does make sence that if a player has surpassed a certain ammount of kills that you could tell who he kills, and time of death could be justified by how body the warm is, and if its cold, it would display time of death as unknown.

[/quote']

Except that's all only possible and avoids the fact that people can easily kill indiscriminating.

i doubt that is ever going to change in this mod, highly doubt the devs will add anything artificial to stop that, but it would be great if they would give us the tools to hunt down the player killers.

Loosing all their gear and having to start over again, while everybody knows your a pker is punishment enough isnt it ?

[dacaveboy@hotmail.com 6]

I made an account just to reply to this post.

I had this argument with a friend of mine yesterday and I feel the current setting is a true sandbox. It leaves it up to us to regulate the game. Dont like PvP? Avoidance. Stay off the coast, be sneaky, take your time. Only team up with peeps you trust.

Really dont like PvP? There is nothing stopping you from forming your own group of enforcers to go out and hunt down Bandits. Encourage the community to out the bandits and do their bit to hunt them down. Then suddenly you have a goal and direction. Theres bandits in them there hills so round up the posse and clean em out.

One way the game could help perhaps is have an automated rumour system. If a bunch of players die in one area it could pop up a rumour message saying that such and such an area isnt safe and is populated by bandits. Perhaps have random messages pop up with such things occasionally. Or perhaps have it to players. "rumour has it that theres a guy around Novy Sabor whos got a few kills..." or something like that. It wouldnt kill realism to much, a lot less then hard punishments put on the person like they die easier or whatever. You always see it in movies where rumours spread amongst survivors about safe zone and dangerous groups etc.

But in all honesty I think the current system provides us with everything we need to manage it. We are the community and it is up to us to police it in game. If you are that sick of it, then get a group and fix it. The human race didnt stand around screaming at the sky telling it to stop the bad people.... well you kind of do but that didnt stop practical people from actually stopping them :P

I haven't died in game yet (but I just hit the average life expectancy so am on borrowed time) and I'm happy hiding in the woods and not taking massive risks. PvP doesn't bother me at all and just adds to the immersion.

As for bean coast, I think its necessary to spawn there as it helps new players A LOT with navigation. Its easy to get location and direction when your on the coast, and not hard to head immediately inland to avoid trouble.

[ThatGuy (DayZ) 47]

How would you approach this situation in real life?

It's the end of the world, every man for himself, and some asshat has completely lost his marbles and is off shooting people, or is just trying to live off stealing from others.

You stay in large groups that make it impossible for your standard bandit or even a small group of bandits to engage without casualties. You don't cross open areas or draw a bunch of attention to yourself. You suspect anyone with high power assault rifles or other types of PvP-centric weaponry. You don't warn them, shoot them all on sight(unless someone can vouch for them). Whenever you are engaged by one of them you find cover to communicate immediately and clearly your situation over global/side chat, and any survivor in the area should immediately and unconditionally render assistance. Hell if it bothers you that much make a forum thread where survivors can openly report bandits and backstabbers with last known locations and screenshots.

I cannot stress the need for survivor communication, with enough friendlies working together keeping each other informed you can build a network of trust and hunt down PvPers. I've been on a few times where someone was shooting up a town and a few friendlies said "enough is enough" and coordinated an assault taking the bandits down.

Police yourselves, and play smarter.

[dacaveboy@hotmail.com 6]

That guy well said. Great minds and all that.

[abysmal 2]

Here is what I feel about PvP: people obviously like the game as it is, as is visible in the meteoric growth in player numbers and perpetually full servers. Any compromise or removal of the PvP system would massively alter the gameplay. I think the worst thing we could do is totally change the game through feature creep, and break something that people obviously love.

[Survivalist_MacLaren 1]

I love ArmA PvP' date=' everything from AAS, DM, CTF, Warfare and PR, but so called "PvP" in DayZ leaves a filthy taste in my mouth.

There is absolutely no skill requirements to murder people in DayZ. Vast majority of cases I've seen, players are murdered by other players lying and pretending to be friendly, or otherwise shot in the back. The douchebags usually tell people on Side Chat they are friendly, and need help, or are offering help, just to lull players into an ambush.

From what I've seen, vast majority of players actually want to explore the mod, collect loot, and team up with other players to survive against the hordes of zombies. THAT is really what the usual zombie theme is about, and what I suspect is attracting the vast majority of players. Only takes 1 or 2 douchebags to spoil the fun for several players, and create mistrust and deception amongst players that spreads like a desease, with innocent players often killing each other out of paranoia.

We all have our opinions, but I'll tell you mine is that this is NOT how life would realistically play out in a post-zombie apocalypse if you knew you only had 1 life (like in real-life). You would want sentries when you sleep at night, and someone to help if you sprain an ankle, or your weapon jams, etc. With 99% of the population dead, you wouldn't be killing what's left of the human race for a can of beans, especially if they are killing zombies and making your world safer for you to live in.

So far I've found that people that defend the current system:

- Noob PvPers themselves.

- Noot survivors who rarely get far in the game so don't care when they get murdered.

- Lucky survivors who have rarely been PK'd, perhaps because they get lost in the woods often.

People who dislike PvP system:

- Survivors who survive for hours, kill hundreds of zombies, and often acquire good gear.

- Survivors who want to role-play the mod, and team up with other survivors.

- Anyone with balls and respects a challenge in PvP gaming.

[/quote']

I'm so sick of people like you trying to ruin this mod. The constant carebear circlejerk in the suggestions forums is borderline disgusting also. You people want to take potentially the most fun mod many of us have played in years and turn it into some safe, boring, mod with rules up the wazoo.

I'm someone who is perfectly fine with the way the mod is except for the whacky direct chat, once that is fixed then I'll have no issues with the way everything is set up.

I've gotten far in the game, I've gotten vast amounts of loot, I've gotten betrayed, and I've gotten straight up killed in firefights. I have had lives that lasted 12-15 hours, and others that have only lasted 2 hours. I have never been upset after dying, because if you go into this mod expecting to live forever you are going to have a bad time. I'm not some bullshit PVPer as you would say, although in some contexts you would think I am. One time I murdered someone in cold blood for their rifle/pistol and ammo. To them it was a random murder, for me it was complete survival since I had only 1 clip left in my revolver and I was desperate for survival.

I'm no saint, nobody is in this game, and that's the point. The point is to survive. I agree some people just sniping random people in towns is annoying as shit, and it sucks when it happens. But suck it up buttercup, because if you do anything to change it you effectively ruin a lot of how this game is played. A lot of murders in this game are not simply because of "hurr durr call of duty bang bang" although many people seem to take this stance because it's annoying to be killed; most murders have context for them, some kind of reason, perhaps misguided or perhaps not.

There is one thing I'll agree with, which is a common complaint, coastal cities are disproportionately dangerous than any other city because people spawn on the coast. I think it would be neat to have people spawn in some of the other minor cities up north, because I don't think coastal cities should be the most dangerous cities in the game. But I haven't thought about this a lot so I can't make a real suggestion without thinking about it some more.

Any ways, I hope the devs of this mod don't start caving to the people. I notice it's way too light at night now, but I'm hoping that's just a lunar cycle on the maps and not the admins caving to people saying it's too dark. If they start caving to some of the, quite frankly, awful suggestions then I fear for the quality of this mod greatly.

[22nd_Chuck 1]

I love ArmA PvP' date=' everything from AAS, DM, CTF, Warfare and PR, but so called "PvP" in DayZ leaves a filthy taste in my mouth.

There is absolutely no skill requirements to murder people in DayZ. Vast majority of cases I've seen, players are murdered by other players lying and pretending to be friendly, or otherwise shot in the back. The douchebags usually tell people on Side Chat they are friendly, and need help, or are offering help, just to lull players into an ambush.

From what I've seen, vast majority of players actually want to explore the mod, collect loot, and team up with other players to survive against the hordes of zombies. THAT is really what the usual zombie theme is about, and what I suspect is attracting the vast majority of players. Only takes 1 or 2 douchebags to spoil the fun for several players, and create mistrust and deception amongst players that spreads like a desease, with innocent players often killing each other out of paranoia.

We all have our opinions, but I'll tell you mine is that this is NOT how life would realistically play out in a post-zombie apocalypse if you knew you only had 1 life (like in real-life). You would want sentries when you sleep at night, and someone to help if you sprain an ankle, or your weapon jams, etc. With 99% of the population dead, you wouldn't be killing what's left of the human race for a can of beans, especially if they are killing zombies and making your world safer for you to live in.

So far I've found that people that defend the current system:

- Noob PvPers themselves.

- Noot survivors who rarely get far in the game so don't care when they get murdered.

- Lucky survivors who have rarely been PK'd, perhaps because they get lost in the woods often.

People who dislike PvP system:

- Survivors who survive for hours, kill hundreds of zombies, and often acquire good gear.

- Survivors who want to role-play the mod, and team up with other survivors.

- Anyone with balls and respects a challenge in PvP gaming.

[/quote']

I'm so sick of people like you trying to ruin this mod. The constant carebear circlejerk in the suggestions forums is borderline disgusting also. You people want to take potentially the most fun mod many of us have played in years and turn it into some safe, boring, mod with rules up the wazoo.

I'm someone who is perfectly fine with the way the mod is except for the whacky direct chat, once that is fixed then I'll have no issues with the way everything is set up.

I've gotten far in the game, I've gotten vast amounts of loot, I've gotten betrayed, and I've gotten straight up killed in firefights. I have had lives that lasted 12-15 hours, and others that have only lasted 2 hours. I have never been upset after dying, because if you go into this mod expecting to live forever you are going to have a bad time. I'm not some bullshit PVPer as you would say, although in some contexts you would think I am. One time I murdered someone in cold blood for their rifle/pistol and ammo. To them it was a random murder, for me it was complete survival since I had only 1 clip left in my revolver and I was desperate for survival.

I'm no saint, nobody is in this game, and that's the point. The point is to survive. I agree some people just sniping random people in towns is annoying as shit, and it sucks when it happens. But suck it up buttercup, because if you do anything to change it you effectively ruin a lot of how this game is played. A lot of murders in this game are not simply because of "hurr durr call of duty bang bang" although many people seem to take this stance because it's annoying to be killed; most murders have context for them, some kind of reason, perhaps misguided or perhaps not.

There is one thing I'll agree with, which is a common complaint, coastal cities are disproportionately dangerous than any other city because people spawn on the coast. I think it would be neat to have people spawn in some of the other minor cities up north, because I don't think coastal cities should be the most dangerous cities in the game. But I haven't thought about this a lot so I can't make a real suggestion without thinking about it some more.

Any ways, I hope the devs of this mod don't start caving to the people. I notice it's way too light at night now, but I'm hoping that's just a lunar cycle on the maps and not the admins caving to people saying it's too dark. If they start caving to some of the, quite frankly, awful suggestions then I fear for the quality of this mod greatly.

Agree 110%.

[lt gunner 4]

I'm with mclaren. Mod is great as is, remember most people who do not have any issue with the mod, will not come here to complain. Just because there are a lot of complaints, doesnt mean the majority want something changed.

[David Trebecho 1]

I'm so sick of people like you trying to ruin this mod. The constant carebear circlejerk in the suggestions forums is borderline disgusting also. You people want to take potentially the most fun mod many of us have played in years and turn it into some safe' date=' boring, mod with rules up the wazoo.

I'm someone who is perfectly fine with the way the mod is except for the whacky direct chat, once that is fixed then I'll have no issues with the way everything is set up.

I've gotten far in the game, I've gotten vast amounts of loot, I've gotten betrayed, and I've gotten straight up killed in firefights. I have had lives that lasted 12-15 hours, and others that have only lasted 2 hours. I have [b']never been upset after dying, because if you go into this mod expecting to live forever you are going to have a bad time. I'm not some bullshit PVPer as you would say, although in some contexts you would think I am. One time I murdered someone in cold blood for their rifle/pistol and ammo. To them it was a random murder, for me it was complete survival since I had only 1 clip left in my revolver and I was desperate for survival.

I'm no saint, nobody is in this game, and that's the point. The point is to survive. I agree some people just sniping random people in towns is annoying as shit, and it sucks when it happens. But suck it up buttercup, because if you do anything to change it you effectively ruin a lot of how this game is played. A lot of murders in this game are not simply because of "hurr durr call of duty bang bang" although many people seem to take this stance because it's annoying to be killed; most murders have context for them, some kind of reason, perhaps misguided or perhaps not.

There is one thing I'll agree with, which is a common complaint, coastal cities are disproportionately dangerous than any other city because people spawn on the coast. I think it would be neat to have people spawn in some of the other minor cities up north, because I don't think coastal cities should be the most dangerous cities in the game. But I haven't thought about this a lot so I can't make a real suggestion without thinking about it some more.

Any ways, I hope the devs of this mod don't start caving to the people. I notice it's way too light at night now, but I'm hoping that's just a lunar cycle on the maps and not the admins caving to people saying it's too dark. If they start caving to some of the, quite frankly, awful suggestions then I fear for the quality of this mod greatly.

100 percent agree, this is survival. The one rule of survival is survive by any means necessary. This isn't chutes and ladders.

[griffinz 2816]

I think im going insane from reading the same argument in 20 different threads

[bodycount 83]

100 percent agree' date=' this is survival. The one rule of survival is survive by any means necessary. This isn't chutes and ladders.

[/quote']

But food water guns and ammo continuously respawn inside of almost every building like every 30 minutes. You have a virtual magical restocking Walmart inside nearly every town? Why are you guys shooting each other? I do not get it. It makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

You are not starving so you don't need to take peoples food because can goods are in larger supply than a church's Christmas homeless pantry collection drive.

You are not thirsty because more soda respawns than a Mountain Dew sponsored Call of Duty tournament so you do not need to take peoples purple drank.

You are not without ammo as a few steps inside nearly every damn barn house apartment or building will stock you up with more ammo than you can carry.

And you are not weaponless because rifles handguns and shotguns spawn in a incredibly high frequency all over the place continuously and infinitely.

There is NO COMPETITION FOR SURVIVAL. We are living in a fucking virtual gaming Utopia where we never have to farm to grow food, we don't have to work at the pepsi factory to make our drinks everything magically spawns for us all the time endlessly.

It is like heaven. All you have to do is spend 60 seconds crouch walking past some NPC zombies.

So why are you guys shooting each other?

Do you even know?

Are you just shooting each other for fun?

Just shooting each other to prevent the other guy from shooting you for fun?

If this is truly an experiment as Rocket claims it must surely have some of the most startling results in the history of Psychology.

They will talk about it is the Great Gank test of the year 2012.

Scientist- "We gave them everything they could ever need to survive and they still killed each other. One player kept saying repeatedly "Die bean face baddies!" as he camped the beach for endless hour after hour mentioning something about "COOL I am topping the high scores on dah websietz!".

MFW

[noisegrrrl 8]

Just wait for zombies to spawn outside of towns, in the woods and such and it'll change.

[frostiken 0]

A major disaster has occurred. You've been surviving for a few days on your own. You've seen groups of people but have avoided them.

Then one day, while looting a grocery store, a woman calls out. She comes in carrying her 7 year old daughter. She says that her daughter's ankle is badly broken and needs help. Her daughter is softly crying and you can tell she's suffering from a fever. You can see that the woman has a large kitchen knife tucked into a makeshift holster clearly visible on her hip.

What do you do?

- Provide medical aid, offer to help the woman and team up.

- Provide medical aid, leave.

- Give them a token amount of assistance, and leave.

- Ignore them and leave. Probably threaten to kill them both if they follow you.

- Take everything they have at gunpoint, leave them.

- Take everything they have at gunpoint, THEN kill them.

- Kill them right away and see if they had anything useful.

- Kill the daughter in her woman's arms, and then shoot both her kneecaps. Make her watch as you rape her daughter's corpse. Put a blowtorch to the woman's face to teach her to dump her problems on you. Make her eat her flesh, then use the woman as a sex slave until she dies of infection and shock.

People bitch about RPGs that present moral choices where you only have two choices, with the 'evil' option being the equivalent of turning you into the Hitler Youth, but look at how you morons act in-game. I'll be the 'sperging basement dweller virgins just love to think they're hardasses and would pick something from the last half of the list. People in-game pick things from the last half of the list.

But in reality? No, you wouldn't. You know you wouldn't. You're just such an antisocial prick who has so few friends you have absolutely no understanding of human empathy. And most of you fat nerds would die trying to remember how to light a fire anyway so I hardly think your 'opinions' of how people would act in a survival situation matter, since you rejects of humanity would cull yourselves in the first week.

[Freeborne (DayZ) 7]

LOL. The point is to survive?

The ones trying to survive are the 'survivors' who are battling zombies, forming groups and scouting for equipment. The players PvPing don't care about survival. To them it's death-match with 30 second respawns.

Want realism? Take away global and side chat completely. It's just players typing "Anyone in Kamenka" which gives bandits a magic beacon to find victims. Take away all the overpowered weapons that litter the coastal regions. We don't need Lee Enfields, CZ50's, AK's and DMR's to kill zombies in Cherno and Elektro. Make it foggy at night with limited view distance so bandits can't track other players with flares from miles away.

Is that too unrealistic, or will it just make it too hard for the PvPers who keep campaigning that the game should be brutal and uncompromising, yet cry if it takes skill to hunt other players?

I would like to see melee weapons like baseball bats in the game too, maybe as the default starting weapon, and have military weapons removed from coastal areas. Would make it harder to just keep spawning and continuing on a killing spree.

[Jrod (DayZ) 3]

I am NOT a bandit. But I have murdered (not in self defense as most would say) people. I have looted these people. I have not killed people and let them live. I prey on the weak but only when needed. What now?

[bodycount 83]

I am NOT a bandit. But I have murdered (not in self defense as most would say) people. I have looted these people. I have not killed people and let them live. I prey on the weak but only when needed. What now?

Needed for what? It is like shooting someone walking out of a McDonald's with food in their hand because you are too lazy to walk 10 feet and stand in line to place an order.

[noisegrrrl 8]

I am NOT a bandit. But I have murdered (not in self defense as most would say) people. I have looted these people. I have not killed people and let them live. I prey on the weak but only when needed. What now?

Needed for what? It is like shooting someone walking out of a McDonald's with food in their hand because you are too lazy to walk 10 feet and stand in line to place an order.

I can understand shooting someone if he actually has something you want.

Distrust has to be a part of the game, setting traps and such as well.

Not mass-murdering for the heck of it.

The only thing needed is for zombies to spawn everywhere (but with a lower space/zombie ratio in forests for instance) and to maybe be more lethal.

This would force people to think before firing at someone since that could very well put them in trouble and force them to reveal their position.

Right now zombies are mostly a joke and the AI is too easily exploited for them to be any scary.

[Jrod (DayZ) 3]

Other people using the same rifle as you, priority one.