Factions - just a matter of time

[S3V3N 1402]

The one thing I hope for is that factions will be made and will be consistent throughout servers. Factions will create goals, and goals will clash with other faction's goals. They will create their own stories, but each faction will also have their own goals, which you can chose to pursue or not. If Rocket needs a writer, I am up for it (I have experience writing screenplays and short stories); goals need to be minimally intrusive and be designed in multiple stages + branched objectives.

I imagine you can join a faction according to your current gear. So, only a guy who has military equipment will be able to join a military squad. Ranks among a faction will be distributed according to days survived+zombie kills. The highest ranked official of a faction may enlist 2 bodyguards.The military will shoot down anything and be ruthless like the bandits, but they also have missions, e.g. to establish a sattelite link to restore communications or reactivate an overseer drone and scout an area. Every faction would have unique goals and can chose to play them out or to make up their own goals.

some faction ideas:

military - players with military gear can join

military goals: long term objectives, multiple stages

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bandits - players who kill 5 or more surviors can join

bandit goals - bandits have 0 objectives, except to cause havoc + set up camps

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survivor - anyone can join

survivor goals: survivors have short time/single objectives and low tier "rewards"

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medics - anyone with a stock of at least 5 medic supplies can join

medic goals - short term, long term (reinforce health care in the north)

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traders - traders can be joined by anyone with an alice pack or larger

trader goals: long term goals, mid term goals, diplomatic goals (secure help of other groups to establish trade posts)

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postman - anyone with a vehicle can join

postman goals - short term goals (supply information between factions, deliver messages, provide transport)

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later addition (one of many possible ones):

engineers - engineers have a toolbag (needs to be repurposed a bit and made more rare)

engineer goals - engineers can build vehicles from parts and mod existing vehicles

---

Factions could be chosen at given locales, e.g. if you want to join military - at military camps, if you want to join regular survivor, at bars, if you want to join meds at hospitals, traders at shops, postman at gas stations, etc. You would think twice before killing any of the higher tier groups, because they may be able to help you and your faction more when they are alive. I imagine goals of the factions to be interlinked, so you will require , e.g. a postman to help you out at some point of a (particular) mission.

Of course, there will still be a lot of shooting among the low tier factions, but I think higher tier players will be less frequently found in spawn areas than now. There will even be occasional kills among the same faction and groups within a faction will clash over the same objective. Some missions could include betrayal to reach a goal faster and make it your choice how you want to play it out, from a moral standpoint.

It will be much the same like when we are clashing over goods in a supermarket now, but there will be something more than just the looting to it. Every decision you make may benefit your group or it may degrade it. It may happen that someone plots against their leadership and takes over the senior role for himself. It may be that a group splits and assumed a new leader and they decide to fight a different fight. A lot of dynamics are possible there.

>>EDIT>> I would like to link to this thread, as I believe the two ideas compliment each other and would work in union:

http://dayzmod.com/f...tion-lifecycle/

Edited July 27, 2012 by S3V3N

[S3V3N 1402]

Here is how a mission could start for the military. Take note that I had to use some backstory to get the events started, but every item and piece of equipment you get during the mission will be unique and won't respawn. So, if anything goes wrong, or something is lost you will have to retrieve said item(s) from whoever stole/found it.

Mission: Overseer

Briefing:

a)

"There's a military drone that was on transport to the northern airfield. When the convoy struck problems we lost contact. Investigate the area and retrieve the drone."

b ) you find:

All vehicles of the transport have been disabled. Look for:

1) a mechanic to help build a new transport from spare parts and the remains of the convoy.

2) alternative means of transport

Bring the Drone to HQ and refuel it (with grade A, high octane fuel!).

c) Access the drone's control station and find out the password. The highest ranking officer had the password and keycard on him. He and some men made it to one of our radio stations and reported in, but contact was lost in the vicinity of ... (city). Find the squad and investigate what happened to them.

d) Use the control station and fly the drone to ... (area). Report your findings to HQ

If you find a heavily populated zombie zone

1. 
   Let the current group leader make the decision to arm the drone (search for rockets)
   
2. 
   Let the current group leader make the decision to take a contingent of soldier there and clean the area
   

additional (+)

If you find bandit camps in the vicinity make them your secondary objective.

e) Establish a military outpost in the cleaned area and maintain it. Find a postman and send SITREP to the civilian populace about the new base.

- Mission Accomplished -

• 
  

Military Base benefits = permanent ammo crate + storage zombie free military zone (no zombies spawn inside), safe place for vehicle repairs/modding vehicles.

Military Base downsides = area around it is attractive to zombies, civilians/bandits approaching it are shot without warning

Military Base benefits from future missions = upgrades to the base + new base items

Extra: Equipment to build bases is delivered by airdrop, after successfull completion. Airdrops can be raided like everything else.

Extra 2: the Password and keycard are a unique item. Whoever posesses it can use the drone. It can be stolen, as can the drone.

Extra 3: There is only so few fuel available as to keep the drone in the air for the duration of the mission. You will be able to distill more high octane fuel, after you have done more missions and got the equipment.

Edited July 27, 2012 by S3V3N

[govnogaming 52]

Sounds more like single player missions. A faction system is more meant for private servers with smaller member bases (~200-300 people). It allows them to control and regulate exactly how to join a faction and such. On such a large scale, basically everyone would be able and choose to join the military faction since it has higher rewards. Then it's just like playing normal DayZ with a boost to getting better rewards/more rare loot.

[S3V3N 1402]

Yes govno, but the military also has a command structure and deserters are shot and hunted. That takes one division by itself. It would be enough to raise the bar to make sure that only the most experienced players get to join the high tier factions, such as military (e.g. military equipment, 500+ zombie kills + 50 days survived); also there isn't only the military, but it will be the only faction that receives new items through air drops.

It may also be possible that air support ends after a maturation period (they will be very rare anyway). Let's see how the military can hold up then and which other faction may take the upper hand and by which moral standards they will win. I'd really like to give the civilians more power, as in unique ways to track and direct zombies to use them against their enemies. That would only work by unque research trees (e.g. learn to create zombie bait), which is something that doesn't fit with Dayz.

I think my original idea has to be modded towards player with skills such as "mechanic" or "medic" applying for military positions after they have proven their worth in the other factions. This is a WIP thread and missions and ideas are subject to change.

You must try and see the mission I described as something as priming for future story. Everything can be stolen, ambushed and will be in flux. If you want stability you will have to work for it. If you want to roam around freely for only an hour a day, stay out of factions.

The whole point of my suggestion is to gradually introduce new and believable elements, as there are plot points and turning points introduced in stories to keep things interesting. People with creative ideas will mix up the elements and create something completely unpredictable by me or anyone, now.

Edited July 27, 2012 by S3V3N

[T'goonda 3]

this game is all about players and how they would survive if you want to be part of a faction join a clan. there are already differant clans like you say for the factions

[T'goonda 3]

this game is all about players and how they would survive if you want to be part of a faction join a clan. there are already differant clans like you say for the factions

[S3V3N 1402]

What we have at the moment is organized as if we were playing Counter Strike - all are external solutions that require servers and lots of people who have too much time, or are simply very dedicated. It's not revolutionary or novel, like the rest of DayZ.

What I suggest is a solution that works entirely ingame and is not a makeshift solution. It is persistent, and doesn't rely on external servers/forums/Skype. DayZ is a world after a zombie apocalypse. It strives for realism - why then would I want to go out of the game and join some external forum? It breaks the fourth wall and is totally superfluent when there can be mechanisms that are truly native to the game and build into it.

Edited July 27, 2012 by S3V3N

[Quagmire (DayZ) 119]

This mod was built to be a sandbox, an anti-game survival simulator. Not a rail-shooter, CoD clone with scripted events, objectives and the like.

And as T'Goonda said clans already simulate such things, some have large bases set up to provide a safe location for people to trade items without being harassed by others or backstabbed and many, many more schemes.

[RunningScared 4]

What we have at the moment is organized as if we were playing Counter Strike - all are external solutions that require servers and lots of people who have too much time, or are simply very dedicated. It's not revolutionary or novel, like the rest of DayZ.

What I suggest is a solution that works entirely ingame and is not a makeshift solution. It is persistent, and doesn't rely on external servers/forums/Skype. DayZ is a world after a zombie apocalypse. It strives for realism - why then would I want to go out of the game and join some external forum? It breaks the fourth wall and is totally superfluent when there can be mechanisms that are truly native to the game and build into it.

Dude, yer not even really talking about factions or anything, your talking about some really lame overused class quest system, for example;

"There's a military drone that was on transport to the northern airfield. When the convoy struck problems we lost contact. Investigate the area and retrieve the drone."

So do I get this quest from a guy with a yellow question mark over his head?

p.s. your title is very misleading

Edited July 27, 2012 by RunningScared

[Duckman404 37]

Rocket plans on implementing 'factions', but not at all in the way you're thinking, OP.

I remember seeing him say that he wants to use coloured armbands as a way of displaying whether a player is in a certain faction or group, but I'm not sure when or how he plans to implement it, since it required changing character models.

[hoik 415]

I think what what could be interesting about this 'tiered' factions is that high leveled factions would provide interesting 'story' moments for those of lower tiers, and those that choose solo play. What I mean is they could provode 'randomised' events such as mentioned here: http://dayzmod.com/forum/index.php?/topic/47148-dayz-massive-overhaul/ (near the end of the OP) without using NPCs. If you find a way to give players tools to create stories (that is tools that by their VERY NATURE create a story - such as markers to indicate on maps places of interest, or player made journals) rather than dictating to players scenarios, I think this would be alot more in tune with the game as well as being ALOT more interesting.

What if high level 'military' factions could get acces to medical supplies/trucks and could setup mobile treatment centers/safe zones - there is a possible story right there...but it requires imagination and a break with our (gamers) ingrained thinking, which I think is the problem with gamer driven story telling.

Edited July 27, 2012 by Hoik

[Ribano 46]

i don't agree with the OP but i think being able to label every suggestion you don't like a COD copy should be banned.

end game needs to be added but goals should be freeform. provide the materials to build, to exterminate, to trade, to travel but let people decide the projects they and their team want to undertake

[S3V3N 1402]

Scripted events is something entirely different from what I suggested. I tried to point out that these missions (that are tied in with factions) are merely starting points that make the entire sandbox situation more open to development. They provide the priming for further development. To call them scripted events is the same like calling the zombies and guns that spawn scripted events. In fact, everything in a game is a scripted event, so it makes no sense.

In the mission I described is one scripted event - the airdrop, but those would be really rare and a milestone for your group. You don't level up, you don't get more blood, you simply add another point of interest to the map that wasn't there before (the military base). I should have written an example mission for any of the other factions instead, but you probably would have still insist they are scripted. What you do is block all and any further development of the mod, because you are content with the scripted events that are currently in it. The real stories develop after theses missions, because every faction has their own agenda - and there are still the free agents who add a wildcard to the game.

Also, I didn't know about Rocket's suggestion and suggested basically the same thing in another thread, namely to give players who want to trade the option to wear a safety vest and be recognizable to other players, who want to trade. That suggestion is not far from coloured armbands, but it won't work, as was proven in the thread. Think for yourself, don't let Rocket do all the work, he can work with our suggestions and we have to give him a little help here.

What I say over and over is that these factons are free for people to join, but there is no imminent need to join a faction or change your current organisation (external servers, skype, etc). HOWEVER, in my suggestion there IS the option not to use external factors. Somebody who isn't in a faction is more likely to get hunted, but this may keep the free agents from shooting everyone and caring more about their own survival.

If you can't see far enough in the future, you don't recognize there will be some far overpowered players+groups (which is already starting to show). That is, because the game currently only rewards bandit gameplay. You could say it is scripted to support bandits.

What EVERYONE fails to see is that introducing Factions and Season Servers will make the game HARDER and not easier. It will make survival much more difficult for those who want to organise themselves out of the factions. At the same time the factions have their own agenda and will mostly leave smaller player groups alone, because they don't bother about petty criminals, given the situation they are in. If you still don't get it, IDK. Maybe I will have to make a drawing...

Edited July 27, 2012 by S3V3N

[hoik 415]

In the mission I described is one scripted event - the airdrop, but those would be really rare and a milestone for your group. You don't level up, you don't get more blood, you simply add another point of interest to the map that wasn't there before (the military base). I should have written an example mission for any of the other factions instead, but you probably would have still insist they are scripted. What you do is block all and any further development of the mod, because you are content with the scripted events that are currently in it.

Also, I didn't know about Rocket's suggestion and suggested basically the same thing in another thread, namely to give players who want to trade the option to wear a safety vest and be recognizable to other players, who want to trade. That suggestion is not far from coloured armbands, but it won't work, as was proven in the thread. Think for yourself, don't let Rocket do all the work, he can work with our suggestions and we have to give him a little help here.

What I say over and over is that this factons are free for people to join, but there is no imminent need to join a faction or change your current organisation (external servers, skype, etc). HOWEVER, in my suggestion there IS the option not to use external factors. Somebody who isn't in a faction is more likely to get hunted, but this may keep the free agents from shooting everyone and caring more about your own survival.

If you can't see far enough in the future, you don't recognize there will be some far overpowered players+groups (which is already starting to show). That is, because the game currently only rewards bandit gameplay. You could say it is scripted to support bandits.

What EVERYONE fails to see is that introducing Factions and Season Servers will make the game HARDER and not easier. It will make survival much more difficult for those who want to organise themselves out of the factions. At the same time the factions have their own agenda and will mostly leave smaller player groups alone, because they don't bother about petty criminals, given the situation they are in. If you still don't get it, IDK. Maybe I will have to paint a picture...

Unfortunately, unless you paint a very clear picture alot can be lost in translation :( . I had a re-read of your scenario and conclude that, after the initial report of the lost convoy, everything else is what COULD happen if the players chose to investigate? But it does require other assets such as the lost convey and control station (which are presumably randomly located) placed by the game - could others try using these items if they stumbled across them?? If not, I can see it as an oportunity for co-operation between factions.

So heres my twist on the scenario:

Instead of being randomly told of about a convoy - the convoy is randomly spawn into the game like crashed-helicopters. Then if someone come across it they get word to the military faction (prehaps you'll choose to say thanks with ammo or protection). Maybe this is the backstory you skiped over, but, as is, the initiation of the mission seems arbitrary.

So from there many scenarios can occur - the ones you mentioned just a sample.

For me I would suggest 1 tool that I think would make this entire scenario mesh in a player-driven DayZ kind of way - A command center/military comm system.

This is a solid way for the commander to create objectives that can be viewed/heard by military faction members - they are missions but user made (maybe this is what you were getting at all along :) )

So prehaps there are "special spawns/items" for each faction - they in themselves will not dictate a mission, but once they are located they could provide many scenarios, from co-operation to sabotage or conflict.

What do you think?

Edited July 27, 2012 by Hoik

[ollox 38]

We don't need a faction mechanic, we are humans capable of making factions without the game's help.

[S3V3N 1402]

Okay, I guess I said what I wanted to. Here is a pretty picture for everyone:

http://dayzmod.com/f...t&attach_id=881

http://dayzmod.com/f...d/page__st__120

(and no, Faction items would only be accessible to the factions, until that particular mission ends; then they become common map items and can be stolen, etc. So other players would see the wrecked convoy but perform no actions there. Factions don't have to play the missions, they can also just use the organisation and suborganisation they provide. However, missions function as tools to make new stories with them and their items.)

Let's just wait and see what the team comes up with and how well it works.

Edited July 27, 2012 by S3V3N

[hoik 415]

We don't need a faction mechanic, we are humans capable of making factions without the game's help.

You would think so, but unfortunatly being 'human beings' translates poorly to virtual world/scenarios (IMO) - it will require a shift in our (gamers) thinking more than anything else.

Edited July 28, 2012 by Hoik

[Aira 22]

@OP:

This brings a totally new light into the dayz world.

I've never thought of that, thats awesome :D

I would like to see player created stories rather than given events.

But the game would really need to provide the possibilities.

Military camps for infected free areas and providing healing and providing protection sounds awesome too :)

Would add great to the simulating nature of the game.

Like a really deep simulation of a post-apocalyptic world.

Imagine you start dayz as a new player and there are cities built by players, rival cities maybe, you have to decide where to go, there are player built streets and... ok that is minecrafty like... but unfortunately i know what a minecraft map looks like after some time... chaos everywhere! So maybe only big groups of players could build something or like this...

Dunno, i'm drifting away but i think this brings a nice idea to the possible future of dayz.

Aira

[S3V3N 1402]

There will be factions, I am convinced of that. But I have come to the conclusion that these have to be created entirely from in-game oportunities and items. New items will be needed, because the items create factions (like the blood bags and morphine + scarce hospitals in the north brought forth the travelling Medics). All we need to get figured out is how these items can be put to their best use, e.g. by giving different players different parts of an item and they need to get together to really benefit from it.

There is so much to consider - this has got to be the most difficult game to design ever, not because of its restrictions, but because of its freedom. Every change changes something else, and it is hard to predict the outcome of the smallest of things. Dayz is Chaos Theory in field simulation :)

[Remscar 5]

Im pretty sure factions are ingame player created entities that do not have any RP or storyline attached to them.

While the idea is cool, it is a very drastic change from the current dayz course.

Personally I am divided on this, but the real decision is Rockets.

[S3V3N 1402]

As i said, I'm taking a different approach to my old idea, now. I think "factions" may also be a bit big of a word for now, so let's just call them "groups (with benefits)" instead.

A good example of a working mechanism are the blood bags + hunting/cooking. You regain health from steaks, but you get blood back faster through transfusions. Do you take the risk of calling on another player, or do you do it alone? You can force another player at gunpoint to take something from your inventory and heal you. I think certain part of the inventory has to be public, while another needs to be locked.

Another example that would be possible in the future: one person can repair a car, two people can build one from parts. A sniper + a spotter working together can share their provisions and live longer on one can and share one water bottle. If you slaughter a cow you get six steaks, if you put two cows together and surround them by fences they spawn a new cow every day (unless it isn't eaten).

These are all mechanisms that I believe would work and cost little effort to create. Some of these mechanics mean making items more sparce, so people are forced to use them together. Or you can localize items, so players coming from the east will meet with players from the west and supplement each other.

I'd also like players that play good and fair and help others, to become cleaner and well-fed during the game, while players that murder a lot and play egoistically will look dire and worn out; possibly they could develop addictions (cigarettes, painkillers, morphium, alc), which they can only lose by playing nice® again. Generally, sharing should be encouraged, but if you don't you will have to deal with the consequences and either keep a stash of meds ready (with the possibility of overdosing), or you will have to even things out by playing nice, every once in a while.

Edited July 28, 2012 by S3V3N

[hoik 415]

I like the direction your taking.

You might like this thread: http://dayzmod.com/forum/index.php?/topic/20352-rethinking-actions-assistance/

[Tarkastio 38]

No missions. Factions or groups, possibly, but no generated missions. There are many other games out there I could play if I wanted to complete missions.

I also dislike how you are punishing those who don`t want to have to trust their life to others, basically if you don`t become a carebear running around in a group, you are screwing yourself over?

Edited August 2, 2012 by Tarkastio

[S3V3N 1402]

As I said - items will create "missions" (purpose). Once you need more than one person to do something you need to think about how to find them. I really dislike how people are having "fun" at the moment :)

I want zombies to be a real threat,which players have to unite against, or go stealth and keep low. I also don't like all the Skype connection. If is has to happen it should all happen ingame, so you are not constantly breaking the fourth wall. It should all be in the package, instead of outiside programs. I really like that you can play solo in Dayz, but if you want to talk to people it should be possible to talk without getting shot.

One way to counteract the constant killing would be, if the players developed addictions to cope with the guilt/nightmares. So if you shoot ten players you will need to keep on taking painkillers or morphium just to keep the shake away. Then again - if there were more actions you could perform together, players could counteract the effects and win back som sanity and health that way. I'm really not for creating missions, I'm all about making the players a bit more dependant on each other, should they decide to kill for no reason. If you just ignore others on the solo run, like I mostly do that should be considered fair and square, too.

[wolfstriked 143]

I NEED FACTIONS.....just was camping a rooftop waiting for unlucky souls to come wandering by.This mod needs reasons to hunt down other players other than HEY wtf else is there to do.