Ban all Bandits!

[BL1P 252]

didn't read you lied in your thread title.

was maybe good but cant be arsed with people who lie

[Capercaillie 16]

A few notes for OP:

First of all, the 4. issue - that is, lack of trust causing the KoS... You do realize that the trust issue is mainly a consequence of the other KoS issues?

People don't start playing this game always assuming the worst. I did not start out shooting everyone on sight. And the noobs I've met in the game - they usually have been the most trusting / friendly players out there. People start shooting on sight after they have gotten shot too many times and they lose the trust to the other players. Naturally, once the trust has been lost, it starts spiraling the KoS even further. But it wasn't the seed for all of it.

Although, I guess nowadays with a lot of talk about the KoS, etc. etc. - even many new players probably know that they will probably be shot on sight, and thus even the noobs might start out with a heavy mistrust toward others.

So, you cannot solve the trust issue alone. As long as there will be excess killing for the other reasons (1. - 3.) as well, there will be little trust.

Also, I guess it might even make sense to add a fifth reasons for the KoS / banditry. Which is the player's "feelings" in general towards the rest of the playerbase (this is quite closely related to the trust, but from a slightly different angle)... By this, I mean the frustration / anger towards constantly getting killed on sight by other players regardless of being friendly. When those experiences are far greater in number than any positive experiences, the player's view is skewed toward seeing the other encountered players mostly as dumbasses. And this shift of view enforces the idea that "It is ok to shoot the other player, because he's probably one of those f*cking dumbasses that would shoot me on sight". Basically, because the player cannot identify the other players (no more bandit skins), he just has to generalize all of the players in that "dumbass" group. And we all know it is totally okay to shoot at those dumbasses. So, we're not talking about only trust here... We're talking about the general perception and attitude towards the game's playerbase. Players having negative feelings towards the other players will certainly add to the KoS attitude.

And as far as the actual side chat goes... Yeah, without it, the communication is pretty much crap. I understand the reason for getting rid of it, but until there are those radios/walkie-talkies or something else to patch up the gap, there will be little sensible communication occurring in the game between "random" people. So, I guess I would prefer having side chat over the current situation, but I don't really care at the moment... as now I'm back to hunting all the players along the coast I can find - and I don't really need any chat for that. The less chatter, the better - At least they cannot tell the other players the location where I'm on a murderous rampage.

"You do realize that the trust issue is mainly a consequence of the other KoS issues"

Yes, I do realize that! Can't say its mainly a consequence, it was at start, but as time goes by it becomes both the consequence and the reason.

example to sort it out

player1: "hey, i wonder who's that guy over there, I'm gonna go talk to him, maybe we can group up"

player2: *shoots player 1 immediately.*

player1: "fuck this, you can't trust anyone in this game, I'm gonna just kill everyone on sight now to not die myself!"

player3: "hey, i wonder who's that guy over there, I'm gonna go talk to him, maybe we can group up"

player1: *shoots player 3 immediately.*

player3: "fuck this, you can't trust anyone in this game, I'm gonna just kill everyone on sight now to not die myself!"

For player 1, lack of trust is the consequence of becoming a KoS guy (ie. he couldn't trust player 2 as he first thought). As player 2 kills him, player1 loses all trust to other players.

BUT for player 3, the reason he got killed, was because player 1 doesn't trust anyone anymore, he will KoS instead.

NOW that player 3 doesn't trust anyone for the same reasons, both the lack of trust and KoS problems form a vicious circle: KoS -> another player gives up finding trustworthy players and starts KoS himself -> another player gives up finding trustworthy players and starts KoS himself -> another player gives up finding trustworthy players and starts KoS himself......

See where I'm going? The point of my OP wasn't to categorize these killing reasons, well it was for the part to make an argument, but for the argument "we are lacking trust" my OP is enough. Anyway, lack of trust is both a consequence and a reason to KoS, doesn't really matter though.

"as now I'm back to hunting all the players along the coast I can find - and I don't really need any chat for that"

see, even YOU are a REASON for the KoS thing! BECAUSE of you many players don't trust others!

Don't take this offensively, I do it too, but just to point it out in this reason/consequence dilemma..

"As long as there will be excess killing for the other reasons (1. - 3.) as well, there will be little trust"

I don't believe reasons 1-3 are the reason for the most player-caused deaths. Nowadays you mostly won't even know who shot you and from where. They just think it's better to get rid of you asap.

Read my Berenzino example again, and you will understand what I mean.

Surprising face to face situations would still probably end in a firefight even if there were walkietalkies, radios, side chat or what ever.

But what I'm looking for, is to increase the cooperation in situations where communication in early phases will lead to friendliness/slight gain of trust. I'm not saying anyone should be careless and walk on the roads, use your brains ofc, but communication would help.

didn't read you lied in your thread title.

was maybe good but cant be arsed with people who lie

Well, don't think it's fine to say "I lied" in the title, it was misleading I know, but it really doesn't get anyone killed, nor does it harm anyone.

As in many posts, in forums, in newspapers, in EVERYWHERE, provocative titles are used to gain attention.

Whether it's morally right or wrong, I don't know, but what I'm sure of it wasn't a lie. In the title, I didn't claim something that wasn't true(eg. "1+1=3" (which is btw actually true if we are talking about mating couples in their bedrooms)), that would have been a (partial)lie. See where I'm heading?

Now, if you feel you were lied to, then why bother reply? Did you originally come here to rant about the beaten-to-death subject about bandits? You probably did, which makes you no better than me.

I, and many others could have lived without your shitpost.

Edited July 27, 2012 by Capercaillie

[zeeb 6]

I think side channel only should be accesible when having the radio, just my thoughts.

[Capercaillie 16]

I think side channel only should be accesible when having the radio, just my thoughts.

This seems to be quite an accepted opinion, and I have to agree with it!

[johnyflash 10]

I agree

[kyle939 20]

Bandits are scum and should be ip banned or something.

Also removing a chat channel? Why what a stupid stupid plan to do.

Also what about you getting killed. A message comes up and notififies the admin of the game so adding an email address mandatory to run a server.

Also something like a server where bandits are not allowed. Ive seen a lot of them and yet people still kill people. Annoying to hell.

I try not to shoot a zombie if I can get away with it. Save ammo. People are still shooting others for fun. I agree with what you said.

Rocket stop doing things you want and listen to the community. Would benefit a lot.

[kyle939 20]

Cannot edit my comment on iPhone.

Also I've typed sooo many times friendly but chat never seems to work and I've typed in all channels and yet still get killed and nothing comes up. I know this because I've had a friend with me and we both typed and we couldn't see any messages on the screen

[kerbholz 5]

Bandits are scum and should be ip banned or something.[...]

Nope, bandits add to the atmosphere of the game.

[...]Rocket stop doing things you want and listen to the community. Would benefit a lot.

Nope, Rocket, keep on doing things you want.

[Shotgun Master 1]

I agree with bringing the chat back, but I also think there needs to be changes made to bandits. As it is there is no reason why you would NOT become a bandit, since it IS a valid play style, everyone dies really easily from most guns, and some will have stockpiled supplies and ammo you need.

There needs to be perks to staying friendly, or disadvantages to being a bandit (or changes so that the gameplay mechanics are DIFFERENT for them). For example, you could make it so that when you kill an innocent player, it affects you psychologically. It could be made so as you kill more, your player becomes more paranoid, and as your level of paranoia increases, some side-affect will also increase, like screen blurriness, volume of the zombies sounds or the amount your weapon shakes (not heaps, just enough to notice).

Another idea would be to make it so when you choose whether your character is male or female, you could also be able to choose if it will be friendly or a bandit. Then you can start with a skin depending on which you choose, and for every HUMAN kill as a bandit you could get some bonus, like in STEALTH :ph34r: (how easily zombies can see you / how hard it is to hear you), and for every ZOMBIE kill as a friendly, you get a bonus to SPEED.

Also, the title was a downright lie, no excuses. Yes, it was misleading, but it was still a lie nonetheless.

[Capercaillie 16]

Bandits are scum and should be ip banned or something.

Also removing a chat channel? Why what a stupid stupid plan to do.

Also what about you getting killed. A message comes up and notififies the admin of the game so adding an email address mandatory to run a server.

Also something like a server where bandits are not allowed. Ive seen a lot of them and yet people still kill people. Annoying to hell.

I try not to shoot a zombie if I can get away with it. Save ammo. People are still shooting others for fun. I agree with what you said.

Rocket stop doing things you want and listen to the community. Would benefit a lot.

I have to disagree 100% on the bandit stuff, bandits are a MAJOR part of the game..

I agree with bringing the chat back, but I also think there needs to be changes made to bandits. As it is there is no reason why you would NOT become a bandit, since it IS a valid play style, everyone dies really easily from most guns, and some will have stockpiled supplies and ammo you need.

There needs to be perks to staying friendly, or disadvantages to being a bandit (or changes so that the gameplay mechanics are DIFFERENT for them). For example, you could make it so that when you kill an innocent player, it affects you psychologically. It could be made so as you kill more, your player becomes more paranoid, and as your level of paranoia increases, some side-affect will also increase, like screen blurriness, volume of the zombies sounds or the amount your weapon shakes (not heaps, just enough to notice).

Another idea would be to make it so when you choose whether your character is male or female, you could also be able to choose if it will be friendly or a bandit. Then you can start with a skin depending on which you choose, and for every HUMAN kill as a bandit you could get some bonus, like in STEALTH :ph34r: (how easily zombies can see you / how hard it is to hear you), and for every ZOMBIE kill as a friendly, you get a bonus to SPEED.

Also, the title was a downright lie, no excuses. Yes, it was misleading, but it was still a lie nonetheless.

Well, first of all your post was 99% off the topic. This anti bandit shit subject has been literally beaten to death, please type this kind of stuff on suggestions willing to remove/ban bandits & other crap.

"Also, the title was a downright lie, no excuses. Yes, it was misleading, but it was still a lie nonetheless."

Title says "Ban all Bandits"

How is that a lie?

Does it lie about some fact?

Does it give false information*?

I suppose you originally came in here to rant about how bandits are ruining the game, and that's what you did. You did it on the wrong post man, it's not about whether to remove bandits or not..

*inb4 "it gives false information on the actual subject of the thread" and everything that way..

Whenever you read a title, you (might) think in your mind "oh, this title says xxx, it MUST be about xxx".

So it's actually just a thing in your head that happens if you hang on too much to this ideology "title xxx, definitely tells about xxx"

basically, it is YOU lying to yourself if you think this way (which you apparently do). YOU make YOURSELF believe "THATS THE WAY IT'S GOTTA BE"

Now if the title was "Ban all Bandits! (this thread is about banning bandits)"

that would have been a lie.

Now that we have talked over the off topic subjects, which were still somewhat related to what I said or what I didn't say, why don't you clean up your post a bit?

Try and remove all the off-topic and unnecessary text you wrote, and see how much appropriate text there is left in your post.

Edited July 27, 2012 by Capercaillie

[Someonerandom 5]

Side chat takes away immersion and i doubt rocket will ever add it back just for that simple reason

[indominator 95]

if this game becomes nothing more than this fake survival team deathmatch, pvp, or pve i am not going to buy the standalone, but since rocket has stated many things himself in interviews that state otherwise, I will and banditry in my opinion is actually a thing that should be a little coerced, and this new patch does that

[zipper 69]

yes like in real life you should be able to hear/see their lips moving... but thats it its a game so you sometimes have to have a system thats as close as possible. pretty thoughtless reply

And the system is voice. As I said, you should not have to look at a little box to figure out what people want. Voice works just fine provided you have two things, speakers and a mic. If you fail to have either of those you are fucking up at PC gaming. People can come up with whatever reasons they want, but there isn't a good reason to have side chat back aside from people just wanting it. To say I am relieved it is gone is an understatement. I'm so tired of whiny brats trolling people over chat. All it does is make people stop what they are doing to either mute the person, or complain to the admin so they can kick them from the server. On top of that, banning someone for doing asshat things like blaring music over side channel, using racist language, or just being disrespectful to other players and admins, is against the server rules. Thank you Rocket for removing it and I hope it never comes back.