This game will fail long term if the PK problem isnt addressed

[A Bush killed me 189]

They just need to get ride of the hackers,

They just need to get ride of the hackers,

this wont happen until its stand alone. Arma is to easy to hack. Especially with battle eye being terrible.

[skyter 299]

The simple fact of the matter is that we never will and never could.

Asking rocket to implement some "tool" that makes it so I will suddenly want to spend my evening with any random 15-year-old, Mt. Dew swilling loud-mouth is like asking him to figure out this whole cold fusion thing while he's at it.

Game mechanics cannot create social relationships. only we can do that.

I don't group with random people in the game because random people are random, and on average do not play the game with the care and respect that I do. They run when they should walk, shoot when they should wait, stand when they should prone, get lost, turn circles, shoot friends, attract unnecessary attention and generally become a deadly liability as likely to get me killed as anything else. And when I try to give them advice, they ignore it or complain.

Nothing rocket can possibly do will change this. People are who they are and no game mechanic is going to make them a different person.

I play with people I know and trust. If I meet them randomly in game and they seem to be a reasonable person and we talk and I find out they are in the same time zone and have the same play habits as me, I might start considering sharing out-of-game contact info with them so they can join our circle of trusted friends.

WTF are you talking about

Rocket's talked about implementing group mechanics in at least the last 3 interviews I listened to/watched...

"I HAVE 1000 POST I R MUST B RITE"

This forum is filled with Dumb fucks.

[ZedsDeadBaby 2287]

WTF are you talking about

Rocket's talked about implementing group mechanics in at least the last 3 interviews I listened to/watched...

"I HAVE 1000 POST I R MUST B RITE"

This forum is filled with Dumb fucks.

I'm talking about the fact that "group mechanics" can't make someone a better player or a better listener or a better friend.

If you're an idiot, you're an idiot; if you're unsafe and reckless, that's what you are, and no amount of mechanics are going to make me want to spend my leisure time watching you endanger my life and the lives my of companions.

I'm all for more team play mechanics. I'm all for more group play. I support every feature and mechanic that requires cooperation and communication and planning and organization and trust and teamwork and friendship. I'm just going to do them with people I already know. People who have already proven themselves reliable, loyal and trustworthy. I'm not going to run out into the dark of the night and expect that some random jagoff I bump into is going to be fast-friends with me, able to communicate, cooperate and participate on the level that I expect (nay, demand).

Do what you will. Say what you will. Implement whatever mechanics that you want. You cannot turn an "average" player into someone that I want to spend time with. I have standards and most people don't meet them and no mechanic is going to change that.

I'm not saying I'm "better" than anyone or superior. Just that I have a style and I expect to play with other people who share that style, and adhere to it with the kind of dedication and focus that I do.

Look, the bottom line is people already know how to talk to one another. They already know how to make friends and plan events and organize things. We've known how to do that since before the internet existed when we had to plan neighborhood baseball games. We don't need rocket to come along and teach us how to do that. We need rocket to give us mechanics that the groups we already have the power to form can use to accomplish more complex and complicated things in the game and have a more lasting and notable effect on the world around us. Make a name for ourselves. Make a story that other people want to read.

He can't implement friendship and relationships. That's something we just have to do. He gives those things a place to thrive but it's not his job to create them.

And, yes, if I run into people who don't fall into this category, I'm going to open a new cavity in their body with the hopes that one or two of the more important organs in their body will fall out rendering them harmless to me. Maybe I'm not necessarily interested in what their particular hopes and dreams were; maybe I just want to make sure they don't get in my way?

And if they see me first? All the better. That crack and that moment of realization as the screen fades and the scoreboard appears. Your heart beating almost audibly in your chest thump, thump, thump and suddenly you're sweating and you don't know why and holy fuck a video game's not supposed to make you feel this way?

That's okay. I'll pick up and start over. And maybe one day we will meet again.

Edited July 25, 2012 by ZedsDeadBaby

[wallpaper42 4]

I agree I got this because I wanted a realistic zombie survival simulation not deathmatch mode. Are they ever going to bring back the bandit skin or chat or something so people actually have some way at all to know who to trust?

[Karlash 3]

The problem isnt the game machenics, Its the idiots that play. Every multiplayer game will have issues and at the moment it doesnt matter what game you play, you will have the rotten apple that ruin it... The Bandits that kill everyone on sight are just like WoW lvl 85's running around the lowbie area and killing all the lower tiers that cant do shit to them.

I just move away for human I come into contact with because Humans in real life or a game like this cant be trusted, its what makes this game appealing... however just because someone doesnt like the deathmatch style of play that going around doesnt mean you have to leave and play CoD or L4D... the arent many games out there like this I have been looking for a Game like this for ages now and wow the choices you make in the game are similar to what you will face ina real life situation of this nature.And yes as stated by many if this was real you would have your Bandit that rob, pilage and kill but this senseless murder of any and all, unarmed or armed is just lame.

side note: being told to leave this game to go play L4D or CoD is like telling a person to stop playing world of Tanks to go play Tank simulater... ppl waht to play this game, but because the hate getting capped every time the enter a town they must leave, Killing everyone is missing the point of the game as much as the ppl who say there shouldnt be PvP, If i was running low on ammo/food/water I would kill, in a game or real life (ofc not as the world is now, but in some kind of zombie world or nuclear wasteland) survival is key, how ever human contact is as important and food and water, but afterall this is a game and if you find the need to be stupid and just kill because you have everything and killing zombies is not fun well then go ahead but then expect to have ppl upset.

Sorry for the long message last point thou, why is your play style more important than someone elses, if other ppl want a more pve game experience why should they be told to leave, why is it PvP player always win in games, as much as pvp DOES work in this game, pvp ruins the enjoyment facter of most games, because of ppl who dont care about oter player... but in the same breathe making this game only pve is going to be stupid, the only real solution is ppl need to learn to respect others, respect is always expected but not given

[fearz0r 128]

While i don't agree with the op because its just a matter of how you play the game, it does sadden me to see just how many children (based on the type of replies here) there are playing this game..

[Theo.VII 0]

Go back to COD.

[Gadget (DayZ) 25]

The problem isnt the game machenics, Its the idiots that play. Every multiplayer game will have issues and at the moment it doesnt matter what game you play, you will have the rotten apple that ruin it... The Bandits that kill everyone on sight are just like WoW lvl 85's running around the lowbie area and killing all the lower tiers that cant do shit to them.

I just move away for human I come into contact with because Humans in real life or a game like this cant be trusted, its what makes this game appealing... however just because someone doesnt like the deathmatch style of play that going around doesnt mean you have to leave and play CoD or L4D... the arent many games out there like this I have been looking for a Game like this for ages now and wow the choices you make in the game are similar to what you will face ina real life situation of this nature.And yes as stated by many if this was real you would have your Bandit that rob, pilage and kill but this senseless murder of any and all, unarmed or armed is just lame.

side note: being told to leave this game to go play L4D or CoD is like telling a person to stop playing world of Tanks to go play Tank simulater... ppl waht to play this game, but because the hate getting capped every time the enter a town they must leave, Killing everyone is missing the point of the game as much as the ppl who say there shouldnt be PvP, If i was running low on ammo/food/water I would kill, in a game or real life (ofc not as the world is now, but in some kind of zombie world or nuclear wasteland) survival is key, how ever human contact is as important and food and water, but afterall this is a game and if you find the need to be stupid and just kill because you have everything and killing zombies is not fun well then go ahead but then expect to have ppl upset.

Sorry for the long message last point thou, why is your play style more important than someone elses, if other ppl want a more pve game experience why should they be told to leave, why is it PvP player always win in games, as much as pvp DOES work in this game, pvp ruins the enjoyment facter of most games, because of ppl who dont care about oter player... but in the same breathe making this game only pve is going to be stupid, the only real solution is ppl need to learn to respect others, respect is always expected but not given

I couldnt agree more.

My eyes have been opened from the replies (from both sides) of this thread. One thing has become crystal clear - I keep forgetting its an alpha and the constant player killing might change as there becomes more to do. Secondly, it probably wont change - look at some of the aggressive, rude, sarcastic, clear anti social people that have posted replies to what I felt was a fair view of the game. It appears that the majority are hostile irl - this leads me to my final thought.

Its easy to assume (and people keep saying similar things on here) that you would have to shoot on site irl if there was a zombie apoc, because of lessons learnt in the media and games like this prove it. I am not so sure... The difference between being able to hit respawn button and the fact that theres no real risk of just going around on a PK rampage means theres absolutely no risk to being a player killer, irl you might miss, your weapon may jam or the bullet could be dud, you may even draw attention from several other nearby survivors or zombies - attention that even the baddest of bad asses would not want to put on themselves in a real world scenario. No doubt people will start flaming about it being a game now, yet those same people have previously said it wasnt a game but an anti-game, that will make some fun reading ;)

[RapturJesus 90]

Didn't even read the OP. But I think it goes along the lines of "I GOT KILLED!!!?! LIKE WTF!?!! MY BUTTHOLE HURTS!!!"

[Gadget (DayZ) 25]

Go back to COD.

I dont know where you got COD from but you are mistaken. COD is one of the worst (yet most financial successful) games ever to be released. I would rather watch paint dry than play COD, so please troll better next time and pick something else, maybe BF3?

[Gadget (DayZ) 25]

Didn't even read the OP. But I think it goes along the lines of "I GOT KILLED!!!?! LIKE WTF!?!! MY BUTTHOLE HURTS!!!"

Yay, another flame post!! Oh joy, I love being abused more on the forums than in the game, it makes the game feel like a safe place. Come back player killers all are forgiven, you can kill me all day long, please please just anything to take me away from the arseholes on the forum.

[Gadget (DayZ) 25]

Another thought Ive just had - for comment / flame - delete as appropriate.

How about if the murder count remained even after death on a fresh spawn, and you could reduce the murder count by 1 for every 2 or 3 players you bandaged or morphined etc, maybe only classing someone as a bandit when theyve killed 10 or more people. Then we would have a clear view when playing as to who's probably an arse and who isn't - yes I know it would change the balance completely but maybe just maybe it would make it slightly more forgiving for players who want to play the 'good' role. Its not ideal but it would at least force a balance shift - if the variables were tweaked just right it could mean that say 20 or 30% of people keep repeatedly player killing, with a chunk of neutral players that kill a bit and heal a bit, with say 20 or 30% of players that help people and know who the clear enemies are.

EDIT: Possibly even reduce murder count over time - now there's an idea that may (along with the above) shift the balance in a controlable way. We always WANT player killers, I agree it just wouldnt be the same game without them, but its all about risk - at the moment there no risk to playing like an arse.

Edited July 25, 2012 by Gadget

[Keurk 4]

Sorry for the long message last point thou, why is your play style more important than someone elses, if other ppl want a more pve game experience why should they be told to leave, why is it PvP player always win in games, as much as pvp DOES work in this game, pvp ruins the enjoyment facter of most games, because of ppl who dont care about oter player... but in the same breathe making this game only pve is going to be stupid, the only real solution is ppl need to learn to respect others, respect is always expected but not given

while i completly agree with you about the respect stuff, i completly disagree with you about the "pvp ruins the enjoyement facter".

You see, today you have thousands games on the internet. Some games are solo, some games are coop, some games are PVE focused, some games are PVP focused, some games are sandbox.

this one is a sandbox game (where players makes the world, meaning : you want respect, you have to work for respect, you have to get stronger to make other people affraid to be disrespectfull about you, you have to make friends to increase your reputation and give people the "i wanna respect this guy, this guy is respectfull".

Dayz, sandbox FULL LOOT (mean ,no matter what you think, pvp focused game ((pvp include team, make friends, fight others, well you know what it means))) include in the main basic features the fact you will have hard times (because survival, etc) include the fact you have to get stronger to protect your shit , and so all this mean the fact you'll be in big danger most of the time, with people trying to kill you for what you have,for fun.

Respect: in this game ,with the basic features previously mentionned, respect is to accept thoses playstyle.

I do accept the fact you like pve, you like to kill zombies.

Accept the fact i'll kill you if you are not taking care of you or your buddies.

I play alone, accept the fact you'll have more chance against me if you are a 3men group. Accept the fact your 3 men group will have less chance against a heavly geared /experienced team of 8 friends.

Problem is not the respect . It is here on the forum. It isnt in the game ( well it is with cheaters but you understood my point)

Since day one of your gametime (your or any players here) you choose to play a game with thoses features.

Caricatual example: you choose to go on a MMORPG and say "ho shit, i don't want to play with others peoples"

Yet you choose to play dayz, full loot and sandbox game (sandbox here mean you want something ? ((a team, friends, respect, reputation, to affraid people, build a camp ,etcetcetcetcetc) WORK to accomplish your goal(s). But expect peoples with differents goals will maybe be on your way ,specially if you ARE their goals, or if you are a problem for them to reach their goals.

Respect start from here, from your point of view, get some brainstorm.

Sorry for my english

[hunterkilla 67]

I think you shouldnt have two seperate modes one linked to the hive and one not. The idea is everything you do is fleeting and you can easily lose what you have and go back to the beginning. Having a safer than safe mode just makes the game lose all its tension and becomes a walking simulator.

If you are dying all the time and not lasting over 30 mins you need to change how you play. I get into cherno, gear up and get the hell out. Sure I die sometimes but no problem and I try to play tactically to reduce the chances of being shot whilst someone is being chased by zombies.

I look at GTA and think that this had missions and it was a sandbox but because it didn't have other players it felt empty and lifeless. Imagine GTA V with 100 other players, are you going to get shot... yes and it will make it so much more interesting.

This game needs PVP and PVE. I think it needs more factors like temperature, less loot spawning, harder / more zombies so those who want to survive in the wilderness can do that and those who want to kill other players can. I also think it needs a way for in game communication, side channel made it possible to hook up with strangers and I had some amazing moments but now with direct channel its "Oh look there is someone... hello.... BANG" as when your up close you can't risk your beans.

Having Radios would allow people to chat and meet up and maybe having different channels would be similar to side channel, global and direct so people have the choice to turn on the radio and hear people or not. This would reduce PVP and give people the chance to risk meeting others in game.

[wallpaper42 4]

Another thought Ive just had - for comment / flame - delete as appropriate.

How about if the murder count remained even after death on a fresh spawn, and you could reduce the murder count by 1 for every 2 or 3 players you bandaged or morphined etc, maybe only classing someone as a bandit when theyve killed 10 or more people. Then we would have a clear view when playing as to who's probably an arse and who isn't - yes I know it would change the balance completely but maybe just maybe it would make it slightly more forgiving for players who want to play the 'good' role. Its not ideal but it would at least force a balance shift - if the variables were tweaked just right it could mean that say 20 or 30% of people keep repeatedly player killing, with a chunk of neutral players that kill a bit and heal a bit, with say 20 or 30% of players that help people and know who the clear enemies are.

EDIT: Possibly even reduce murder count over time - now there's an idea that may (along with the above) shift the balance in a controlable way. We always WANT player killers, I agree it just wouldnt be the same game without them, but its all about risk - at the moment there no risk to playing like an arse.

Yeah I think something like this could help a lot maybe. Like bring back the bandit skin but also have some kind of medic or enforcer skin for people who give transfusions and help others. Maybe get a new upgraded skin the more people you kill or help. That way both sides will have something to work towards and you will have a much clearer view on who you can trust. Of course this could be easily exploited if you have a friend... Man balancing a game is hard.

[andris.orinskis@gmail.com 26]

knowing you've effectively got to start the whole thing again is fine a few times but then it becomes frustrating

I think DayZ is TOO SOFT.

IRL we can collect stuff, hunt, drive cars, run etc. only until we die. DayZ allows you to respawn. IMO if player dies - he has to buy another copy of ArmA:CO to be able to play DayZ again. Then people will be thinking twice before running through cherno or coming with hatchet to NW airfield. ;)

[Sparkie (DayZ) 4]

Well then that's their choice and they lose out on business from the people they didn't cater too. A smart company generally tries to gather as much realistic business as possible and depending on how hard implementing PvE servers would or would not be, I see no reason as to why it could not be a feature in the future.

I know! I totally agree, I was totally pissed off at Matell for making a Barbie doll that I, a 26 year old man, couldn't enjoy- they should be doing more to make little girl dolls appealing to grown men! They are losing sooo many customers.

Edited July 25, 2012 by Sparkie

[E M P 10]

I know! I totally agree, I was totally pissed off at Matell for making a Barbie doll that I, a 26 year old man, couldn't enjoy- they should be doing more to make little girl dolls appealing to grown men! They are losing sooo many customers.

Ya... no.

More like being pissed off that Barbie doesn't release a darker-skinned doll to appeal to a non-white audience when you have a darker-skinned child. More like, although it's still a stretch.

It's easy to appeal to both sides with a game like this, as all it takes is a few quick changes that don't place financial risk on the game designer.

[E M P 10]

with respect to OP, indubitably. The problem is, there is no, and never has been, any plan to make this a long term playable "game." The only plan was to make a zombie mod on arma.

Uh... no. It's definitely going to be a standalone game.

[Klu 20]

More like being pissed off that Barbie doesn't release a darker-skinned doll to appeal to a non-white audience when you have a darker-skinned child. More like, although it's still a stretch.

Huh? I'm sorry for your child having a parent who thinks there aren't black Barbies.

I will NOT troll this post today... I will NOT troll this post today.... I will NOT troll this post today...

[random51 172]

Go back to COD.

Go back to the Sims.

Another thought Ive just had - for comment / flame - delete as appropriate.

How about if the murder count remained even after death on a fresh spawn, and you could reduce the murder count by 1 for every 2 or 3 players you bandaged or morphined etc, maybe only classing someone as a bandit when theyve killed 10 or more people. Then we would have a clear view when playing as to who's probably an arse and who isn't - yes I know it would change the balance completely but maybe just maybe it would make it slightly more forgiving for players who want to play the 'good' role. Its not ideal but it would at least force a balance shift - if the variables were tweaked just right it could mean that say 20 or 30% of people keep repeatedly player killing, with a chunk of neutral players that kill a bit and heal a bit, with say 20 or 30% of players that help people and know who the clear enemies are.

All you've added is a metric. You've not added a reason for the bandit to care what the metric is. Indeed it would probably backfire in that bandits would seek to increase the murder count, not reduce it to carebear survivor levels.

This thread is kind of pointless, it is based upon a false premise. There isn't a PK problem. PvP is an integral part of the game. People who don't like it need to play some other game because DayZ without open-world PvP is just another boring zombie mod.

Edited July 25, 2012 by random51

[Karlash 3]

"pvp ruins the enjoyement facter".

dont know if this came across wrong in my post, but the main reason why I said PvP ruin the enjoyment factor is many because of examples I gave in my post such as players who kill on sight armed/unarmed, hatchet/gun or in an none Dayz example lvl 85's in wow killing the lowbies in a lvl 30 area... Its the stupid ppl who abuse the pvp idea. yes pvp is player vs player but whats the spot in you having a AK-47 and the dude you busy slaughtering has a flash light, I honestly dont care if I get sniped from 200metres away if Im in the open and have a gun... but when ppl spawn camp, or kill lowbies who just started its silly. My opinion, I have only been killed once buy bandits and run past a few ppl shouting dont shoot dont shoot and then moved on, but there again ppl who this dont shoot/friendly thing and kill the player when there back is turned, I think mainly ppl are just upset with how unsporting the PK'ers are..

Anyways, have fun dodging bullets and zombies :)

[Mojo Jojo 6]

That is the emotional response you are having. You are deciding to stop playing, or deciding to kill on site now instead of even trying to communicate. That is what this game as caused you to do. It's your decision, but don't shun the responsibility of your choice.

We are seeing many just go on killing sprees. We see a general "distrust" between people and less and less willing to reach out, instead opting for their ultimate survival by making the other dead.

This is the exact kind of thing the developers were looking for. Something real.

Something real? It's a bloody free-for-all deathmatch, just like every other multiplayer deatchmatch game ever made. It's a bit slower paced and built off a military sim, but fundamentally it's the same old shit in a different package. Which is exactly why people who came here looking for something different (survival horror?) are feeling dissappointment. Don't get me wrong, I think PvP absolutely needs to be part of the game. But I'd like it to be just one part of the game, not the whole thing the way it is now. The game needs to facilitate interactions between players that are not exclusively PvP. Yeah, you can work around it by organizing with others outside the game, but that's not always practical or feasible for everyone and shouldn't be required to enjoy the game.

[Mojo Jojo 6]

Every one of these threads I read brings me back to 1997- 1999. U.O. had this same fury for PKs, People who refused to learn to protect themselves complained to the powers that be. What Rocket has done here has made a home for those of us who have been homeless since around '99. This is the anti game, if you don't have an original idea to curb the pk "problem"(i dont see it but whatever) find another game. Those of us who enjoy the danger, accept the possibility of things going poorly, and just want an level of difficulty not found in todays market deserve DayZ. You want easier there are 1000's of games for you, for us there are a handful! Go away knowing this isn''t for you, and enjoy one of the endless possiblities of games out there catered to you.

*Disclaimer* I am not a bandit, and rarely engage 1st.

And if we enjoy the danger and difficulty (and frankly think the world could stand to be more difficult to survive in) but just find the mindless shoot-on-sight PvP deathmatching to be a let down, which game, pray tell, is there out there for us? I'd like to know who exactly is catering to that market?

[Klu 20]

Something real? It's a bloody free-for-all deathmatch, just like every other multiplayer deatchmatch game ever made. It's a bit slower paced and built off a military sim, but fundamentally it's the same old shit in a different package. Which is exactly why people who came here looking for something different (survival horror?) are feeling dissappointment. Don't get me wrong, I think PvP absolutely needs to be part of the game. But I'd like it to be just one part of the game, not the whole thing the way it is now. The game needs to facilitate interactions between players that are not exclusively PvP. Yeah, you can work around it by organizing with others outside the game, but that's not always practical or feasible for everyone and shouldn't be required to enjoy the game.

Um, you just took my last sentence, made it your first, added a question mark to the end of it then gave no substantial response to my post. Why did you quote me if you're not going to reply to what I said in an intelligent way?