How to end Ganking, and support Honor [ v ]

[species5021 28]

The fact is that you can make it look pretty and elaborate on it all you want but it still comes down to that you want to add a currency system to the game, one that is highly biased in favor of the friendly player and once again a penalty system for player killers.

In current society i guess people want to see some sort justice, but in DayZ the story is created around a place of complete lawlessness. This game has no rules! To be able to implement this idea the game itself would need rules, and some sort of force to enforce them. No rules, no enforcing.

Player killing is part of the game, it wont go away and it wont be penalized. Not now or in the future. The sooner you except this the better, getting killed sucks but its one part of the game making it hard for to you survive and start over.

Remember the goal is to survive!! Players are as much a part of the game as the zombies and the weapons are. Rocket actually incorporated a player factor in the game making it harder for you to survive! It's genius..

Think about different points of view when you come up with ideas for this game, it might kill your idea or it might make it a hell of a lot better.

Edited July 23, 2012 by Tops

[thatcommiekid 57]

i want it.... but it will prob never happen.

[euryale 72]

those suggestions are

Edited July 23, 2012 by Euryale

[Gogster (DayZ) 626]

I agree with your ideas, I'm not sure on the implementation, but ways to achieve this can always be thrashed out with testing.

Personally, as much as other forum commentators are tired of people trying to introduce humanity into the game, I'm tired of their idea of chaos in the post apocalyptic world.

For starters no one truly knows what would happen. We have evidence of lawlessness in regions plagued by war and yet we see communities and people rally around to create a society in which people can live in peace and help each other. Yes there will always people who remain outside of society, becoming lawless outcasts.

The OP suggests those players would not be removed and they can continue their murderous ways, the people who want to develop a lawful way of playing have no tools in their arsenal to do so.

With that I agree it is something that should be developed.

[dystopeon 46]

why does everyone keep talking about survivors and bandits? haven't seen one since 1.5.8...

[Golgo82 28]

Doesn't fit DayZ.

How would anyone know what you did beside yourself and those directly witnessing you doing it?

-Magic.

Why would a (para)military faction give away supplies (weapons, body armor, wtf?) they themselves would need to actually stay alive?

-Magic.

Can those NPCs be killed and if yes, why don't bandits just do that and get "all" their stuff? If those NPCs are not killable...

-Magic

I dont know..maybe its just me..but theres to much magic in this for me.

[JamesButlin 108]

I was intrigued until you said about having NPCs, this game doesn't need turning into a RPG. I think more of a reward for humane acts should be a skin change for your character, same with bandits (as was before).

[daniel.owens@iqu.com 43]

TLDR; More people whinging about a problem that doesn't exist. PvP/Bandits are fine, if anything there's just minor tweaking to be done and some holes to fix. A sniper on the hill or being killed as an unarmed player are just part of the game, and a real danger for everyone.

Anyone here watch The Road? Do you think those cannibals would have said, "these guys are unarmed, we can't eat them!". Honestly, I wish all these complainers who think bandits are a bad point of this mod would just shuffle on to another game (I won't throw in the stereotypical remark here). If you don't like how punishing this game is, don't play it. Some of us don't mind being shot while unarmed, because at the end of the day, you decided where to go, your decisions led up to you being in that spot at that moment. However helpless you are, run straight to Cherno and you're gonna have a bad time.

Also note, I realize you made other points in this thread. Just saying, bandits shouldn't be restricted on how they play, just as much as survivors shouldn't be.

Edited July 23, 2012 by WintersWolf

[ChinWooMan 34]

It's funny how people don't read. "Ahaha noob is trying to stop bandits from killing"

Araina never said she/he wanted to stop bandits from killing, go ahead kill all you want. But you get a reward as a bandit when you kill someone, and that reward is their loot. But do you get a reward when you help someone? No all you loose is some of your supplies helping the fella. Araina is trying to make a balance between Bandits and Survivors. If you want to kill people for their supplies that's your reward as a bandit. If you want to help other Survivors. Your reward will come as you help.

The same Statement you wrote

"Player 2 tries to help Player 1 from being mauled by zombies, only to be shot and looted for valuables. Now disgruntled, player 2 instinctively shoots player 3, who was unarmed and only in search for a water source. Player 3, Who in turn will never trust anyone ever again and begins his own cycle of distrust...etc etc etc."

It's the same reason I have become a monster and kill everyone that gets near me for self defence.

Edited July 23, 2012 by ChinWooMan

[Grackel 1]

~Araina

Shoot first, ask questions later.

[xximrtwoixx 104]

Welcome to WROL, the state of nature is a bitch.

And it is complete bs to say you don't already get jack for helping other players, yes you lose your gear/supplies but you should be gaining an ally, from my experience this ally will usually last beyond one in game death and because of this is much more valuable than any gear.

Thus there is already an inherent balance to pvp in game, get their loot or their co-operation, is that person alive worth more than what they have on them. I don't disagree that there is little to no trust left in the player base and this is obviously factored into the decision they make when deciding to pull the trigger, it simply means there is less value attributed to their co-operation (maybe negative even).

The player on the other side also makes the same economic decision about you, is your co-operation worth more than your gear? I know that when I'm desperate, like I need a transfusion I will take more risks because someone's co-operation is worth more than their gear then.

All "friendly" players are employing a survival strategy just as all "bandit/KOS" players are employing a strategy; I think that you can easily tell what strategy is more successful as it has been widely adopted by other players. Again this is the state of nature, this is evolution in action, the weak and unsuccessful are eliminated. Don't dismiss this for metaphorical crap, it is what is really happening, this is a survival game and as everyone tries to maximize their chances of survival they mimic evolution. But because its a game and people can respawn all lambs will eventually become lions. That gets us to where we are now, a landscape of carnivores who have eaten all the sheep and are forced to turn to cannibalism. I'm not a scientist but this doesn't sound like a promising outlook for survival.

Rocket could address this by adding content that allows sheep to be sheep or adding in mobs to act as sheep, but I think he realizes that AI cheapens the experience and that sheep will always complain when their being eaten.

TLDR: All Ricks will become Shanes

Edited July 23, 2012 by xXI Mr Two IXx

[zipper 69]

It's funny how people don't read. "Ahaha noob is trying to stop bandits from killing"

Araina never said she/he wanted to stop bandits from killing, go ahead kill all you want. But you get a reward as a bandit when you kill someone, and that reward is their loot. But do you get a reward when you help someone? No all you loose is some of your supplies helping the fella. Araina is trying to make a balance between Bandits and Survivors. If you want to kill people for their supplies that's your reward as a bandit. If you want to help other Survivors. Your reward will come as you help.

The same Statement you wrote

"Player 2 tries to help Player 1 from being mauled by zombies, only to be shot and looted for valuables. Now disgruntled, player 2 instinctively shoots player 3, who was unarmed and only in search for a water source. Player 3, Who in turn will never trust anyone ever again and begins his own cycle of distrust...etc etc etc."

It's the same reason I have become a monster and kill everyone that gets near me for self defence.

If you honestly don't believe there is reward in helping people, you are a large contributor to the main issue people actually have with PvP in DayZ. It takes about 5 seconds to realize some of the many benefits to be gained from playing with another player.

[ChinWooMan 34]

If you honestly don't believe there is reward in helping people, you are a large contributor to the main issue people actually have with PvP in DayZ. It takes about 5 seconds to realize some of the many benefits to be gained from playing with another player.

I never stated "Playing with another player"

I have issue with PvP? Haha, don't make me laugh bro, I don't mind PvP because I have the right to PvP too bruh.

The reward from helping a random guy is probably, "Thanks". It actually makes me feel good getting thanked by someone specially through voice chat but it rarely happens.

[zipper 69]

I never stated "Playing with another player"

It's the same reason I have become a monster and kill everyone that gets near me for self defence.

If you kill everyone that gets near you you have a problem playing with another player.

[ChinWooMan 34]

Kid if your going to be like this in the forums to me and probably someone else in every post they put up.

You probably have to hop off my dick and everyone's that you are on.

And yes I do have a god damn big problem with every player that gets near me. Either they try to kill me lure me. Kill or be killed, and that's what keeps me alive in-game and will.

Now please stop being a blood sucking leach around my posts.

[zipper 69]

I'm sorry, I didn't realize you were a forum moderator and can restrict where I can and cannot post. Oh wait you aren't.

So apparently everyone who disagrees with you, and points out faults in the things you are saying, is "on your dick" and is being overly "aggressive" towards you. I don't remember ever calling you a child, or attempting to belittle your post. Why you feel you can do it to me, but I don't have the right to do it right back to you is rather amusing. I will pass though, as there is nothing of value to gain from making you look more foolish then you already have. Feel free to reply to the actual comment I made regarding the faults in your posts. If you cannot do so without throwing a temper tantrum then maybe you shouldn't be posting on a public forum.

Edited July 23, 2012 by Zipper -82ndAB-

[Deathcall 101]

I'll ramble on for a bit here, sorry if I'm repeating things already mentioned in other posts...

The Bandit / Survivor dicotomy doesn't really exist.

There's no such thing as a differentiation between suvivors. There are people who kill others and there are people who... kill others. Yes, it's true. Even if you were to picture yourself as a "friendly survivor", you'll eventually kill other survivors. Is the reason for that truly important? You killed to survive, so do "bandits". If they (or you) want to survive so they can keep enjoying the game (or anti-game as some poeple like to call it), what makes these two "groups" different?

Survivors (meaning the entire player base now) gather resources to survive. Those who chose to kill others do the same. We could argue that murderers not always loot their victims, but neither do common survivors loot every empty tin can in a building.

Killing

So we all kill. Why? Survival Instinct: We want to remain alive.

What survivors do with their lives is what usually splits them. Some will rather be friendly with most people and try to cooperate. Others will be friendly to those they know and the rest will kill pretty much everyone they come across. Motivations for playing in a particular way (be it just being a nice person, getting a kick out of popping people from a mile away, etc) aren't truly important because, ultimately, everyone is just trying to survive to keep playing the game ("living") in the way they want.

PVP

It doesn't matter if only less than 20% of the players get killed by other players. Nobody (or near that) will come to the forums to complain about an NPC killing them, unless it was a bug or something of the sort. In my experience, I actually welcome it when the game is able to best me and I die in the hands of the infected.

The problem is that most poeple expect some kind of social interaction (other than bullets to the head) from a multiplayer game, and Day Z is a deathmatch. Sometimes it's a team-deathmatch, but in the end, it's the same. Groups facing other groups are more likely to shoot each-other rather than pooling forces. That kind of behaviour is standard, and it's actually pretty natural.

In a game with no end-game objectives, it's pretty much a certain thing that this is the kind of behaviour you'll encounter. Groups will form, and they'll either mingle, leave each other alone or shoot at each other. It's exactly like the real world, and I can't really see it as a bad thing. In all fairness, it's pretty much the same with all multiplayer games.

The only thing affecting this "natural order" is the fact that due to the lack of a "persistent" world and static player base, there's no sense of "order". This translates into "lone" players joining a server and being afraid of dying because they don't know if X area is safe to enter or if that survivor he spotted looting a building is going to be friendly or not (when it should be mainly the zombies and murderers he should worry about). In a server where you actually know who you are playing with, it's much easier to interact with others, but when you are constantly unware of who is sharing the world with you, fear takes place, and fear leads to murder and banditry.

Bottom-Line

If you want this game to be more "friendly" you need to give the players more time to meet and come to know each other. You also need more "persistent" worlds. Many attempts at making "safe-heavens" failed because it's too easy to bypass "security" in player-controlled areas.

As long as there is no trust, the KOS mentality will continue.

Adding "police-effects" to the game, such as NPCs, skins, or other penalties or bonuses for playing a certain way is clearny not the objective of the devs, so it's unlikely to become reality.

I'm an always friendly player. I'm most likely going to lose my FN-FAL with NV scope when trying to talk to someone in a town. I'm okay with that. Wish it wasn't so, but it is. I'll do my best to check if the player is friendly or not, but in the end, it's a lottery.

That's the game we have, and that's life in a post-apocalyptic world.

Edited July 23, 2012 by Deathcall