Night Vision Goggles - Require Balance?

[RZ0R 65]

Hi,

I'm a console player, and I've been playing for a number of years now and one thing I've always felt could do with a little work are the Night Vision Goggles, especially in third person perspective.

I've always felt they're a little too 'good'.

I don't know how NVGs work in real life, that's not my angle, but from a gameplay perspective I've always felt like are a little OP.

I feel they at least need some kind of bezel effect on the screen, much like a scope, especially in third person, limiting field of view as a penalty for being able to see well in the dark. Maybe go as far as suggesting NVGs shouldn't work in third person? That's a harsh one, but it would make sense because you're not using your players eyes. You could argue though that being able to see well in the dark in first person vs not being able to play the TP camera over walls etc is a good trade off.

Also, the distance at which you see can detail through them maybe shortened?

Perhaps such a change would close the advantage gap between having NVGs and not having them. In addition to this it might see the player base make use of flashlights more too.

On that note, it would be interesting if lights had a very detrimental effect on NVGs, like a rifle mounted flashlight being blinding when being aimed at you with NVGs on.

I also remember reading something about the PSO1s being able to see infrared emitted by night vision devices IRL? That would be interesting if there were counters like that.

So maybe they could do with a counter too.

The recent wipe persuaded me to post this, because the first thing to do after every wipe is stash NVGs over everything else, so I'm never without them.

I actually prefer playing in the darkest nights with NVGs than I do the daytime. I find it easier to see details, especially in forests, there's no real counter and half of the players in the server don't have them. That just doesn't seem quite right.

Cheers.

Edited July 25, 2021 by RZ0R

[Homeschooliazon 87]

I like that night vision goggles are as OP as they are, it (seems) is realistic. Just as having an AK with a drum mag is OP compared to players who don't have one.

I do log out at night for this reason though sometimes, because I know that I can't do anything against night vision people.

If I want to have nighttime without this astronomical but good level of imbalance, I join a bright nights server, or a dark nights server with night vision disabled.

[RZ0R 65]

Stopping playing the game because of a single item seems quite drastic, I've never done it but I understand where you're coming from.

I wouldn't go as far as NVGs being removed, I just think it would be keeping with the game more if they came with some kind of inconvenience such as FOV limitation, more grain effect, or counter. 

They would obviously still serve as a great advantage over players who don't have them.

I suppose in third person view I've always felt illuminating the entire screen as a bit lazy.

 

 

 

['AZAZEL' 110]

NVGs should just be removed from the game. Period.

Not only do they discourage the usage of other actual light sources, but also it will always be a lose-lose situation to play at night or go loot military places if you don't have them... especially if you are decently geared.

[nemorus 266]

Absence of night vision will not change facts. People don't like to use flashlights and alike just because it makes them vulnerable to other players - especially with how light is currently bugged. I'm talking about all that glitching and problem with distance.

"(...)but also it will always be a lose-lose situation to play at night or go loot military places if you don't have them...(...)"

- If people are scared of operating at night then they should stay in their beds.

[costavojik 22]

They still run on battery I mean if you're don't hoard them you going to run out of them quickly 

[RZ0R 65]

On 7/31/2021 at 6:12 PM, 'AZAZEL' said:

NVGs should just be removed from the game. Period.

Not only do they discourage the usage of other actual light sources, but also it will always be a lose-lose situation to play at night or go loot military places if you don't have them... especially if you are decently geared.

Personally, I think I agree, I'd like to see how that would work out. For the sake of the game though I don't think its a good idea because even more people would stop playing once night time hit.

[RZ0R 65]

On 7/31/2021 at 10:04 PM, costavojik said:

They still run on battery I mean if you're don't hoard them you going to run out of them quickly 

For anyone regularly looting towns or killing other players, batteries should never be a problem. Rarely are for me anyway.

I'd considered the idea of making them consume more battery, but I don't think that's a resolution. You'd still have the disparity between those that have working NVGs and those that do not.

[Officer Failure 33]

If someone is using a light source you will see it regardless of a equipped nvg. But yea they could turn up battery usage or limit the max view or viewing quallity.

But what or how good do see when looking through a NVG in real life? I don't know but i guess its more of a googly view and maybe more grainy as it is in the game.

I really love using a nvg in the game but i barley had kills with it because lots of people log out during night and i don't roam around the coast where new-spawns are actually using their light source.

[RZ0R 65]

On 8/9/2021 at 8:55 AM, Officer Failure said:

If someone is using a light source you will see it regardless of a equipped nvg. But yea they could turn up battery usage or limit the max view or viewing quallity.

But what or how good do see when looking through a NVG in real life? I don't know but i guess its more of a googly view and maybe more grainy as it is in the game.

I really love using a nvg in the game but i barley had kills with it because lots of people log out during night and i don't roam around the coast where new-spawns are actually using their light source.

I don't know what NVGs are like in real life either, but I don't think that matters too much. If we're going to go there then I'd suggest that I couldn't eat an entire cow in one sitting, a couple of chicken breasts could sustain me for a few days and taking multivitims doesn't cure every illness I'm susceptible to in 5 minutes.

Like you suggest, I'd like to see less viewing quality, certainly less viewing range, maybe a bit of fish-eye going on and throw a bezel in there too. 

 

 

[Just Caused 423]

I don't think they should be removed because they are pretty rare as it is. Maybe add a bit grain to the image and also add blinding effect when someone flashes you with light. NVGs are supposed to be the OP'est item in the game. Even without NVGs, I can guarantee you that people still won't use flashlights in the dark. I know that will not happen because I've been playing DayZ since it started and I've seen less people use flashlights than the number of people I've saw using NVGs. They'd rather jack up gamma or walk in pitch black darkness than use light.

Edited August 12, 2021 by Just Caused

[DefectiveWater 539]

28 minutes ago, Just Caused said:

They'd rather jack up gamma

Yeah... this is the only game breaking exploit for me.
And you can't disable the gamma in settings, people will just crank it up in different ways, from Nvidia tools or AMD tools or something else...

NVGs while OP, I feel like they need to be nerfed in some "usability way", they are rare enough, so that's fine. But they also need to fix the light issues in the game (lights going through walls, lights disappearing at a certain distance...)...

Blinding effect that people suggest is a nice idea and it should be that way tbh... Along with slightly lower FOV (dark edges, kinda like binoculars)

Pistol flashlights and gun flashlights also need a quick toggle that doesn't require a player to stop doing what they are doing and wait for like a second for the animation to play out... they are supposed to be quick and effective ways to react, not make my character do the "using something generic" animation...

Edited August 12, 2021 by DefectiveWater

[Riddick_2K 174]

It doesn't seem to me that the NVG is so "OP", the night vision alone, not infrared... none of you (who complain is Over Power) play another war FPS? And even non-war... in Battlefield Hardline, which is a "Guards vs. Thieves" in an urban / civil environment, there is both "night vision" and "infrared". You know it and you adapt... it's a feature of the game.
Complaining does not seem very rational to me, even if in this forum, at least, I have also read rational objections (you should try Battlefield for a certain number of hours and see how many "babies" cry for each type of weapon/device... always accusing those who uses to be "noob", shotgun, C4, Claymore, bipod, FLIR, etc... it is a particular category which would have to open a special post).
But to return to the subject...

A couple of notes:
*) If we were talking about an "infrared", since it "should not" be a war game (but in fact too often it is!), I would agree... but a simple night vision? What does it bother you? Are you afraid of being seen by someone you don't see? It means that he is smarter and you have to learn a little more game... or get yourself an NVG, if you consider it so "relevant". Personally, I would have no problems even with an "infrared", it is a used military object, in this game you also loot military equipment... it would be logical to have this too.

*) An object CANNOT be OP if everyone can have it, and the NVGs are NOT as rare as it is believed, in fact on the map there are always at least 3! And they ONLY count on the map, that is... as soon as a player takes one (whether you use it or store it or hide it, it DOES NOT count), it is missing on the map and the game prepares to spawn another one as soon as there is a slot ( and there are always free slots... then the defects of the game, even the spawn of the objects, we all know, but that's another matter). You just need to know how to find them and get busy with a little patience and perseverance.
To me, on public vanilla servers, it has happened many times to find 2 or 3 of them... and just have to throw them away.
Then, those who have been playing for a long time know it... you go as for the "clearance sale" of shops or supermarkets: sometimes you don't find what you are looking for even after hours and hours of play... then, suddenly, you get 4, 5, or more objects of the same type at the same time and all very close... unfortunately this is DayZ too. What "should spawn" according to the appropriate file is one thing... what actually spawns in the game is quite another thing.
Just a stupid example: on my vanilla server, where I always play alone and I'm sure NO ONE gets their hands in it, I found civilian items spawned in military areas (and it is NOT my modification). Evidently a game anomaly...
Below I add the NVG string of the file "types.xml" v. 1.13

    <type name="NVGoggles">
        <nominal>5</nominal>
        <lifetime>28800</lifetime>
        <restock>3600</restock>
        <min>3</min>
        <quantmin>-1</quantmin>
        <quantmax>-1</quantmax>
        <cost>100</cost>
        <flags count_in_cargo="0" count_in_hoarder="0" count_in_map="1" count_in_player="0" crafted="0" deloot="0"/>
        <category name="weapons"/>
        <usage name="Military"/>
        <value name="Tier3"/>
        <value name="Tier4"/>
    </type>

*) Regarding the previous point ...
What is really "OP" are the special weapons, with more than good characteristics (FAL, SVD, VSS) that someone extremely lucky can get and ALL the others CANNOT!
These are "OP" weapons, but not so much for their characteristics, but for the fact that they are extremely rare.
At the moment I have 1930 hours of play with DayZ, 799 hours of which on my personal server... so surely 1131 hours done on populated servers. I played some community servers, but not much... I don't like servers full of mods, it's not DayZ anymore... I don't know how many hours exactly, but I don't think more than 200/250 hours (esteem in excess). I have at least 880 hours left for Vanilla servers. Well... I've NEVER seen a Heli-Crash. Some Police-Crash (very poor loot), but never a Heli... and the western ones can also be seen from afar because of the smoke.
On my personal server I have seen a lot of them, of course... I drive around quietly and I have increased the number... but in the Vanilla ones... 😕
And I imagine that, like when I found a crashed helicopter in MY server and inside I found only jackets, pants, and some sights... so much so that to find some good weapons I had to increase the number of these too... the same thing will happen on the Heli-Crash in public server vanilla: very difficult to find one and when you find it, only jackets, pants and some viewfinder... 😞
THIS is what I mean "OP"
Even worse if you frequent the servers of "cheaters" or "dupers"... Since these weapons are not only very rare, but also count on the player, in cargo and in hoarder. 😞
Basically, the first one who manages to find one... and it is already a very very rare event... just duplicate 3/4 copies hides them and in that server NEVER spawn even one copy: END.
This I consider "OP", and is a specific choice of these (pseudo) programmers when they implemented the "cargo" & "hoarder" flags for use on rare items. IF the game was perfect and NOT plagued by cheaters and dupers, it could go (and I don't like the concept of "very rare weapons" anyway: it's discriminatory towards players. Difficult to obtain, okay, but absolutely not rare.)
But since the game is POLLUTED with cheaters and dupers... and the B.I. seems unable to solve the problem, at least remove these 2 flags that spoil the spoils in the servers.
But... I don't think they understand the problem... in my opinion they don't even really play DayZ... otherwise they would never have done some bullshit and some would already know it without the need for feedback reports... which often do not read / reply Anyway 😞

*) I also, often, go out by night... especially if I don't have an NVG yet. But sometimes even with him, if I don't have to do something specific or continue what I was doing.
Of course it's a good tool that allows you to keep playing even at night if you need it.
Otherwise there are 2 cases:
1) Normal Servers: Yes, nights are at least "visible", and some full moon nights are just great to see... even just finding a vantage point and enjoying the view (they remind me of certain clear and full moon nights when I was still going to the woods in the mountains or to the Karst behind my city, both for hiking/camping and for caving... they were really fantastic nights... only the smell of the forest or flowers is missing if in spring / summer )
I have read, in other places, that some people complain that it is too bright and unrealistic: false. That one never walked around in the meadows and mountains on a full moon.
Then it can be argued that the Moon is not always full: right. And that with the clouds there is still too much light: right. But it's DayZ... it's anything but realistic / working.
And anyway it is not very easy to move and fight the infected... with the NVG it is certainly better. It is NOT "OP", it is just a good and useful tool.
2) Server HC: Here the nights are exaggeratedly black... you can NOT see a palm from your nose, and the chemical lights are simply ridiculous, you need at least a street torch... but that makes you a target hundreds of meters away... In DayZ it is simply impossible, or if you prefer... unplayable.
And... that ambient brightness that revolves around you like a "magical aura" is simply ridiculous and annoying.
These servers, in my opinion, are NOT usable if you don't have an NVG.
Here, until I find it, I only do the days... always and without exception, since it becomes risky even to cross the street in the city when the server is deserted, because you risk bumping into an infected just because you don't have it seen before... Absurd! An exaggerated black!
If they removed the NVGs in these servers I would not enter them anymore, because playing always and only in fits and starts to get the days and skip the nights would only bother me.

[rackinglad27 138]

On 7/25/2021 at 2:38 PM, RZ0R said:

Hi,

I'm a console player, and I've been playing for a number of years now and one thing I've always felt could do with a little work are the Night Vision Goggles, especially in third person perspective.

I've always felt they're a little too 'good'.

I don't know how NVGs work in real life, that's not my angle, but from a gameplay perspective I've always felt like are a little OP.

I feel they at least need some kind of bezel effect on the screen, much like a scope, especially in third person, limiting field of view as a penalty for being able to see well in the dark. Maybe go as far as suggesting NVGs shouldn't work in third person? That's a harsh one, but it would make sense because you're not using your players eyes. You could argue though that being able to see well in the dark in first person vs not being able to play the TP camera over walls etc is a good trade off.

Also, the distance at which you see can detail through them maybe shortened?

Perhaps such a change would close the advantage gap between having NVGs and not having them. In addition to this it might see the player base make use of flashlights more too.

On that note, it would be interesting if lights had a very detrimental effect on NVGs, like a rifle mounted flashlight being blinding when being aimed at you with NVGs on.

I also remember reading something about the PSO1s being able to see infrared emitted by night vision devices IRL? That would be interesting if there were counters like that.

So maybe they could do with a counter too.

The recent wipe persuaded me to post this, because the first thing to do after every wipe is stash NVGs over everything else, so I'm never without them.

I actually prefer playing in the darkest nights with NVGs than I do the daytime. I find it easier to see details, especially in forests, there's no real counter and half of the players in the server don't have them. That just doesn't seem quite right.

Cheers.

when having a light shined at you with nvgs on its blinding anyway so that's not a problem really. try it out and you will see what I mean, construction lights too are fantastic to strategically place around your base and blind the shit out of players wearing nvgs. 

[Tonyeh 454]

I've looked through real night vision goggles and after your eyes become used to them, you can see quite clearly. Close up. Far away is another story as everything tends to blend into a shade of green, and if a torch is shone into them it blinds you almost completely. The NVG's in DayZ are ok, but maybe a little too good. They're not crazy OP though like some might suggest. I like using them personally.

As for the advantage they give over players that don't have them...well, that's the point isn't it?

In any case, the best thing players can do if the nights are set to dark and they don't have NVG is find a place and hunker down. Then wait til morning. Much like real life would demand. I've had plenty of tense moments guarding a door of a house that I've selected for "bed time" and nights aren't really that long on most servers that I've played on. And when I'm on on official (which is less and less these days), they're bright anyway so who cares.

[RZ0R 65]

Did the NVGs get reworked in 1.14 like all the other headgear? 

Edit: I see they have. Excellent!

Edited September 3, 2021 by RZ0R

[gimmeurlard 21]

Anyone got a picture of the reworked nvg sight?

[DayzDayzFanboy 1280]

5 hours ago, gimmeurlard said:

Anyone got a picture of the reworked nvg sight?

Haven't got a picture but they do have a vignette round them

[DefectiveWater 539]

5 hours ago, gimmeurlard said:

Anyone got a picture of the reworked nvg sight?

Here. There's no vignette unless you have batteries. So you can have them in a lowered/turned on position, but without batteries there is no vignette (normal vision, no changes).

[lemmac 101]

nice... nvgs should also shine a faint light (red?) out of them (as in real life) so players not using them at lest stand a chance of spotting someone who is