New weapon confirmed? VSS Vintorez

[stielhandgranate 480]

No they weren't by any stretch of the imagination.

 

Prior to the adoption of the ak74m side rails were not very common at all. Even to this day with side rails being standard issue optics on russian firearms are extremely limited.

 

Heck The Russian Military adopted socks for the first time ever in 2013 that alone should tell you how obscure expensive optics would be for regular forces.

 

You keep mentioning socks when we're talking about guns. I don't see any advantage to your idea of "remove all customization, give all optics to sniper rifles". Sounds like easy mode for the sniper crowd and deletes a feature that allows players to personalize their kit. Should all M4A1s start with M68s or ACOGs, RIS handguards, and AN/PEQ-15s? There isn't even any certainty that these AKMs and AK-74s are Russian in origin and not East German or Ukrainian, or some side rail built model.

 

 

 

 

[gibonez 3633]

You keep mentioning socks when we're talking about guns. I don't see any advantage to your idea of "remove all customization, give all optics to sniper rifles". Sounds like easy mode for the sniper crowd and deletes a feature that allows players to personalize their kit. Should all M4A1s start with M68s or ACOGs, RIS handguards, and AN/PEQ-15s? There isn't even any certainty that these AKMs and AK-74s are Russian in origin and not East German or Ukrainian, or some side rail built model.

 

Socks was just an example to show you the poorly kept state of the Russian Military. It is just now in its infancy of a modernization process.

The pictures you post and see of Russian troops with optics are the vast minority those are the specialized well equipped units. The vast majority do not have those means , heck something as simple as night vision goggles is not standard for every Russian soldier. They are only issued weapon mounted night vision in super low numbers.

 

The AKM absolutely should not have a side rail, the ak74 also should probably not have one either if it is of Russian origin, the ak101 aka ak74m should.

 

As to the gameplay reasons I am not saying give the customization to Sniper rifles I am saying keep it authentic and realistic.

 

If indeed Russian Origin AKms and ak74s then they should not have a side rail.

The Ak101 or ak74m should they change it should have a side rail but mounting a Pso -1 of either variety should not give accurate elevation adjustments since the turrets were calibrated for the svd in 7.62x54r or 9x39.

[Katana67 2907]

Socks was just an example to show you the poorly kept state of the Russian Military. It is just now in its infancy of a modernization process.

The pictures you post and see of Russian troops with optics are the vast minority those are the specialized well equipped units. The vast majority do not have those means , heck something as simple as night vision goggles is not standard for every Russian soldier. They are only issued weapon mounted night vision in super low numbers.

 

Okay, a few things here.

 

1. The Russian military isn't/wasn't the only military present in Chernarus

2. Assuming DayZ takes place in the same universe, the Russians that were deployed to Chernarus were well-equipped (see ARMA II)

3. Where are you drawing these "facts" from about the Russian military optics distribution? Because if Ukrainian separatists and/or rank-and-file military folks can get optics, western kit, weapon modifications, and suppressors regularly, I would think it's entirely plausible for them to be a regular occurrence in a place like Chernarus.

4. The Russian military isn't some backward organization fighting with bows and arrows. They deploy with, and employ, a wide range of optics and attachments. They aren't in the infancy of modernization, they're a modern military.

5. Even if it's just "a few specialized units," how does that help your argument? Their special operations community alone is massive.

 

Again, this all operates on a few assumptions (i.e. that DayZ is in the same universe as ARMA II and/or that real-world Russian military equipment somehow matters in fictional DayZ). None of which are agreed upon.

Edited April 2, 2015 by Katana67

[stielhandgranate 480]

Socks was just an example to show you the poorly kept state of the Russian Military. It is just now in its infancy of a modernization process.

The pictures you post and see of Russian troops with optics are the vast minority those are the specialized well equipped units. The vast majority do not have those means , heck something as simple as night vision goggles is not standard for every Russian soldier. They are only issued weapon mounted night vision in super low numbers.

 

The AKM absolutely should not have a side rail, the ak74 also should probably not have one either if it is of Russian origin, the ak101 aka ak74m should.

 

As to the gameplay reasons I am not saying give the customization to Sniper rifles I am saying keep it authentic and realistic.

 

If indeed Russian Origin AKms and ak74s then they should not have a side rail.

The Ak101 or ak74m should they change it should have a side rail but mounting a Pso -1 of either variety should not give accurate elevation adjustments since the turrets were calibrated for the svd in 7.62x54r or 9x39.

 

You keep on thinking "these are a specific Russian surplus AKM and AK-74 that never had an accessory rail" and pretending Russia sent it's most ill equipped and outdated forces to Chernarus during Harvest Red when in ArmA 2, when the forces depicted were well equipped. What you advocate for offers noting of value to the game experience in while trying to sell it as "authentic". Russian troops often take PGO-7 sights designed for RPGs and work them with 5.45 guns as well as PSO-1 scopes or even buy aftermarket parts for their issued guns. This should be allowed in game as well and is quite realistic.

[-Gews- 7443]

So I'm wondering, in game, should I just adjust by pressing page up and page down, or do the chevrons actually correspond to the proper distance? Note though, as I said, the AK and AK-74 still use the same scope in game which is just nuts.

Short answer no. Just use page up/down.

[Tiger205 48]

In fact the AK74 in DayZ has the side rail modelled so it's just plain dumb it can't take the PSO. Hell, it should be able to use all of the M4 optics because it can have a RIS mounted on the side rail.

[Sike (DayZ) 8]

I was under the impression the devs wanted to cut down on omnipotent snipers. Now they are introducing a permenantly silenced, pinpoint accurate, and full automatic one? Talk about S.T.A.L.K.E.R. fan wank.

AS Val would be much more appropriate if you want to go down that road.

[Cap'n (DayZ) 1827]

Much rail. So Russia. Too Ukraine.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think that any CDF gear we get should reflect that of the modern Ukrainian army.

[Chaingunfighter 917]

I think that any CDF gear we get should reflect that of the modern Ukrainian army.

As well as the past CDF army we saw in ArmA 2 - the bulk of their guns should be basic surplus Eastern equipment, like AKMs and AK74s, as gibonez said, however they should retain/expand upon their large modularity just as Katana67 and Dale Gribble say.

 

In the end we need a good mix of gear; old Soviet equipment can be the bulk but new Eastern equipment should still be available. Western equipment should still be available. We're not dealing with a completely incapable armed forces who have no idea how to modernize; we're dealing with one that was (mostly) stuck in the past before but through a large civil conflict began a large modernization process where they would've started getting Western weapons and gear, in addition to modernizing and improving their Eastern gear.

[Tiger205 48]

There's no reason there shouldn't be either NATO or Warsaw Pact weapons available be it it older or newer variants. Same as there should also be leftover WWII equipment like uniforms, helmets and weapons obviously because realism has no say here.

[Sirwarriant12 94]

I was under the impression the devs wanted to cut down on omnipotent snipers. Now they are introducing a permenantly silenced, pinpoint accurate, and full automatic one? Talk about S.T.A.L.K.E.R. fan wank.

AS Val would be much more appropriate if you want to go down that road.

Except its effective range is only about 300m with alot of bullet drop due to the subsonic round, full auto fire was put pretty much as a last resort, as the gun loses alot of it's accuracy and can damage the internals if done too much. If the devs implement it correctly it will not be an all purpose wins in every situation kind of gun at all. Most people will still prefer one of the AK variants for all around and things like the dragunov or other designated long range rifles added down the road for sniping.

[Cap'n (DayZ) 1827]

As well as the past CDF army we saw in ArmA 2 - the bulk of their guns should be basic surplus Eastern equipment, like AKMs and AK74s, as gibonez said, however they should retain/expand upon their large modularity just as Katana67 and Dale Gribble say.

 

In the end we need a good mix of gear; old Soviet equipment can be the bulk but new Eastern equipment should still be available. Western equipment should still be available. We're not dealing with a completely incapable armed forces who have no idea how to modernize; we're dealing with one that was (mostly) stuck in the past before but through a large civil conflict began a large modernization process where they would've started getting Western weapons and gear, in addition to modernizing and improving their Eastern gear.

 

And that's where we draw similarities to the UAF, because it's the same deal. They've pretty much replaced TTSKO across the board with Multicam and new indigenous designs. Why not do the same for the CDF and make their uniforms more western?

[Chaingunfighter 917]

And that's where we draw similarities to the UAF, because it's the same deal. They've pretty much replaced TTSKO across the board with Multicam and new indigenous designs. Why not do the same for the CDF and make their uniforms more western?

Oh, I agree, and I'm sure that'll happen at some point. I mean, Chris did say at one point that they're planning on making kits for several of the ArmA 2 factions available in addition to a large variety of gear from all over the place, so I don't find it hard to believe it'll happen at some point.

 

It probably just hasn't happened yet because of priorities - we have three military uniforms already - TTsKO, Gorka, and technically OREL (in this case used by tactical police, but still a uniform nonethless. You could also count the M65 as "military gear.") There's also four different military issue vests and a bunch of other gear that goes alongside them. Having a good set of gear that matches up to real life is important in the end, but for all intents and purposes right now anything that gets added would just be seen as more military gear and thus it isn't really important now.

 

It's something for the future, though. And I'd say the near future at this point, considering the SVD-M and especially the VSS (a modernized Eastern rifle) are coming it'd be nice to have modern kits to go alongside them.

[Sike (DayZ) 8]

Except its effective range is only about 300m with alot of bullet drop due to the subsonic round, full auto fire was put pretty much as a last resort, as the gun loses alot of it's accuracy and can damage the internals if done too much. If the devs implement it correctly it will not be an all purpose wins in every situation kind of gun at all. Most people will still prefer one of the AK variants for all around and things like the dragunov or other designated long range rifles added down the road for sniping.

Actually the VSS round can penetrate a steel plate a 500m. So ontop of being able to participate at what is currently max range sniping it can also make armor obsolete. Also there is the feature that makes the VSS compactable and able to be fitted in a suitcase. Do I see high capacity vest compatability in the future? Maybe.

 

I honestly can't see this gun not becoming OP as fuck.

Edited April 3, 2015 by Sike

[trev186 389]

Actually the VSS round can penetrate a steel plate a 500m. So ontop of being able to participate at what is currently max range sniping it can also make armor obsolete. Also there is the feature that makes the VSS compactable and able to be fitted in a suitcase. Do I see high capacity vest compatability in the future? Maybe.

I honestly can't see this gun not becoming OP as fuck.

Give it a break most players in dayz are killed within 100 meters and most guns will kill u in one or two shots when de sync isn't an issue at that range...

The pso scope does not have a ton of zoom on it either so they will have to stand still for u to nail em at 500 meters

Edited April 3, 2015 by trev186

[-Gews- 7443]

Actually the VSS round can penetrate a steel plate a 500m. So ontop of being able to participate at what is currently max range sniping it can also make armor obsolete. Also there is the feature that makes the VSS compactable and able to be fitted in a suitcase. Do I see high capacity vest compatability in the future? Maybe.

 

I honestly can't see this gun not becoming OP as fuck.

 

1/16" mild steel with SP-6, so can the Mosin, easily. Or SKS. The VSS can't penetrate a hard plate either. One more thing: actual armor penetration does not exist in DayZ.

[Sike (DayZ) 8]

Give it a break most players in dayz are killed within 100 meters and most guns will kill u in one or two shots when de sync isn't an issue at that range...

The pso scope does not have a ton of zoom on it either so they will have to stand still for u to nail em at 500 meters

"most players" are scavengers going building to building getting hacked to pieces with axes and peppered with shotguns. That is because getting a scope, a rifle, the ammo and finding the right target is alot harder than running amok through a town and jumping at everything that moves. That has nothing to do with what we are talking about though.

 

Nobody needs to stand still when you have 10-20 rounds of fully supressed and highly accurized lead at your disposal. For as long as you have ammo and as long as your target remains in your line of sight the fight is going to be completely one sided. Hell your target will be lucky just to find out what is going to put cover between him and you.

 

Not to mention your standard 100m fight is still going to be ruled by a VSS in full auto as long as he isn't completely outnumbered.

Edited April 3, 2015 by Sike

[raynor009 204]

I loved using this gun on DayZ Namalsk. I was soo excited when they announced it. I just really hope that it won't be just another crashsite only gun...

[agouti 105]

Actually the VSS round can penetrate a steel plate a 500m. So ontop of being able to participate at what is currently max range sniping it can also make armor obsolete. Also there is the feature that makes the VSS compactable and able to be fitted in a suitcase. Do I see high capacity vest compatability in the future? Maybe.

 

I honestly can't see this gun not becoming OP as fuck.

 

How good are you at lobbing bullets? If you think you can aim a man high at 500 yards, be my guess.

 

 

In other news, massive rush of CoD players to otherwise non mainstream games where the only notion of balance that exists is controlled by only the laws of physics has been noted. Run for your lives! Higher rof means lower damage and all guns now have reticles when fired from the hip except scoped guns, because apparently you're entirely aware of where your bullet goes even without aiming, unless you put a scope on your rifle.

 

Or we could just throw balance to the wind and try to model things according to what's real instead of trying to achieve an artificial balance where no gun is better than any other.

 

 

The VSS shines as a counter-sniper rifle. It has a very specific purpose. Unless you're purposefully hunting snipers, try something else! The immense drop means you better have your range finder out and hope your target isn't moving, like, you know, a sniper.

 

So the devs finally create the rock to the scissors that is the mosin, and you're not happy? It's still a rock to the AK's paper.

[Sike (DayZ) 8]

1/16" mild steel with SP-6, so can the Mosin, easily. Or SKS. The VSS can't penetrate a hard plate either. One more thing: actual armor penetration does not exist in DayZ.

I'm sorry I had no idea you were Russian special forces. Like hell it can't penetrate a hard plate. With standard issue hardened steel or tungsten it can make swiss cheese of hardened 1/5" steel at 100m. Of course this could be carefully planted Russian propaganda to strike fear into their enemies but I doubt it. Also there is no armor penetration in DayZ? I guess I'll start wearing my motorcycle helmet to defeat snipers now.

 

So the devs finally create the rock to the scissors that is the mosin, and you're not happy? It's still a rock to the AK's paper.

How is the AK the paper that cover's the VSS' rock?

Edited April 3, 2015 by Sike

[-Gews- 7443]

I'm sorry I had no idea you were Russian special forces. Like hell it can't penetrate a hard plate. With standard issue hardened steel or tungsten it can make swiss cheese of hardened 1/5" steel at 100m. Of course this could be carefully planted Russian propaganda to strike fear into their enemies but I doubt it. Also there is no armor penetration in DayZ? I guess I'll start wearing my motorcycle helmet to defeat snipers now.

 

[Sike (DayZ) 8]

-snip-

 

I think your post count is high enough to warrant an award.. You don't need to continue raising it with stupid garbage.

Edited April 3, 2015 by Sike

[Chaingunfighter 917]

I think your post count is high enough to warrant an award.. You don't need to continue raising it with stupid garbage.

Well, his unprecedented knowledge of firearms, among other things, has certainly gotten him places around here. He's got the Skype of the Standalone's lead artist; Chris Torchia, and he's undoubtedly had some effect on development because of it.

[Sike (DayZ) 8]

Well, his unprecedented knowledge of firearms, among other things, has certainly gotten him places around here. He's got the Skype of the Standalone's lead artist; Chris Torchia, and he's undoubtedly had some effect on development because of it.

I really hope skype wih a standalone artist isn't a paid position.

[Tiger205 48]

Also there is no armor penetration in DayZ? I guess I'll start wearing my motorcycle helmet to defeat snipers now.

 

Because there isn't? Ballistic vests don't exist in DayZ yet because none of them have any armour configured. Learn your shit before spouting nonsense.