About BattleEye and evil intentions

[patmaster 11]

Since the other thread was locked for imho no good reason I have to open this one to address BEdev-Sables post. It sucks that i have to open a thread for this but the other one was locked without a proper discussion - at least imho.

 

I hope you understand I don't mean to spam, I just have these few things that I think people should think about. I also want to apologize for the first post - i was kinda pissed at the time so I hope you can read this post without any hard feelings.

 

So here's the post I'd like to address:

 

 

Here we go again. :) Let me just state the following facts for you:

 

1.) The BE EULA is NOT new or updated. It's been the same for years. If you only discover it now it just shows that you are ignorant and never read it when you were asked to do so when joining a BE-enabled server for the first time.

2.) BE is not a rootkit. It never was and never will be. If you don't know what a rootkit is please look it up first instead of believing these lies.

3.) AV false positives usually happen because BE files are protected (hence AVs can't properly analyze them), not because BE is doing shady stuff.

 

If you want to go on believing these shady individuals with their obvious agendas claming that BE is evil, then please do so. I already posted statements on the BE website in the past and right now I don't feel like doing so again just because some internet clowns call "rootkit" for no reason whatsoever. That only gives them the attention they are craving for. At some point there will be an announcement about our new plans though, so stay tuned.

 

1) That may be, but just because people don't usually read it doesn't make it right to claim the rights todo whatever you want on my pc. It is actually against the law (at least it was about 2 years ago when EAs Origin hit the market with a shitstorm and an expert analysed their EULA) where I live to make suprising demands or disadvantage people in EULAs because the law recognizes that most people don't read them. I'd call an anticheat software scanning my entire PC and claiming the right to send whatever it finds "home" pretty suprising. It doesn't matter that this is common practice (which I'm very unsure if it really is since VAC claims to have stopped this kind of behaviour after a massive outrage).

 

2) Forget the semantics. Whatever it is or isn't - there is no question that it's potentially violating peoples privacy or at least claiming the right todo so. Why claim the right todo so if you have no intention of doing it ?

 

From the EULA:

"-BattlelEye may scan the entire memory and any game-relates and system-related files and folders on harddisk and report results to the connected game server for the sole pupose of detecting cheats."

 

In a post on battleeye.com you address this:

 

"Our EULA clearly states that as well. However, it's true that BE can, from time to time, upload executable code (mainly .dll and .exe files) that has been flagged by certain hack-identifying scans to the BE master server for further analysis."

 

Then why not make the EULA more specific and say that you only upload executables and not documents, pictures or whatever. The less grey area a EULA has the better it is from a customer perpective and since you have no evil intentions why not be abundantly clear about this ?

 

I'm aware that the next paragraph in the EULA states that no passwords and documents are uploaded but clarifying that you only upload executables is a lot more trustworthy than saying we upload all kinds of stuff and then providing 2 exceptions that you aren't uploading - wouldn't you agree ?

You also state that no private data are uploaded but never clarify what private means. I'm a devloper. If I have an executable of my new programm lying around and ou find it - is it private ? Or will it be uploaded because it's for some reason suspicios ?

 

 

3) I didn't even know that some AVs were having false positives with BE currently so I'm not going to address that.

 

 

I'd also like to say that I never wanted to suggest that BE has evil intentions. Unfortunately you don't need to have evil intentions to become the source of evil. If someone breaks into your servers and exploits the auto-update function of BE to exceute malicous code it won't have been your intentions that have lead to many peoples serious concerns but it will still be a terrible situation.

 

[claws4life 99]

The solution is veeeeeeeeery simple. Don't play the fucking game. Personally I'm happy they finally are going to deal with the hackers in a much better way :)

Edited November 14, 2014 by Claws4life

[patmaster 11]

The solution is veeeeeeeeery simple. Don't play the fucking game. Personally I'm happy they finally are going to deal with the hackers in a much better way :)

 

That's exactly what I'm doing...uninstalled it yesterday.

I just wish this wouldn't be necessary and a simple change in the EULA is all I'm really asking for.

[anddos 37]

well there doing something right, ive had a quick look on 3 sites that sell dayz sa hacks and the hack status is detected or recoding, not that i use hacks, i just wanted to see the impact of this new battleye detection against hacks that are for sale, so i can see that the devteam are making progress against hackers

Edited November 14, 2014 by Anddos

[blacklabel79 949]

i wish People whould put that much effort into reading into the EULA of any cloudservice they use and share their private(parts) on ....

 

The state you live in has alot more evil intentions whenn it comes to intrusive Software than YOU want to know and THAT IS A REAL PROBLEM.

Edited November 14, 2014 by {Core}BlackLabel

[kakysas666 191]

I will believe devs are making progress against hacking when I see countless people getting banned once I join a full server. Now it is hard to distinguish people use hacks or is it just poor server performance and I am just standing still instead of laying down in some other location.

[Ziaka 4]

Dear BESable,
 

1. BE gives persistent access to remote computers

2. BE can view any file on disk and upload it to the internet

3. BE can open the memory of any running process

4. BE can download and execute code remotely

5. BE can hook applications and inject code into them

6. BE can protect processes preventing transparency into what it is doing

7. BE protects itself to prevent it being reverse engineered to give transparency into what it is doing

8. BEdaisy.sys is a kernel driver

9. BE's architecture functions the same way as a botnet command & control system

 

But please, do me the courtesy of providing a technical answer explaining how despite all of this "BE is not a rootkit". BE's functionality makes it a rootkit by the textbook definition of the word.

Edited November 14, 2014 by Ziaka

[Ziaka 4]

I have no idea why intelligent discussion regarding a matter that affects everyone is being shut down on this forum.

If BE is a legitimate company that employs proper secure practices they should have no problem answering any concerns with their software.

People are shrugging this off as if it doesn't matter but what they don't seem to realise is BE has the same power over their machine as someone sitting at their keyboard logged in as an administrator. The potential for abuse here is catastrophic.

Edited November 14, 2014 by Ziaka

[blacklabel79 949]

 The potential for abuse here is catastrophic.

 

 

Most Points you stated are either false or exegerated. In any case, i have no Problem with BE whatsoever. If you cant stomach the heaps of (miss)Information just avoid any Software from BE. Simple as that.

 

again, id HOPE People whould put that much thought into the exploit of private data by gouverments/industry...

 

...but hey

 

lets complain about BE....damm users...

 

 

If BE is a legitimate company that employs proper secure practices they should have no problem answering any concerns with their software.

 

 

 

There are several well worded answers from BE regarding the issue. And they are 100 times more honest than anything we hear from gouverments nowadays...enjoi your meaningless rage...

 

 

 

7. BE protects itself to prevent it being reverse engineered to give transparency into what it is doing

 

Expected behaviour for Software designed to combat hacking attempts to the Software it is plugged on to.

 

Since i feel generous today i have googled the discussion that seemed to take place on reddit for your conviniance:

 

http://www.reddit.com/r/dayz/comments/2m5tv6/gabe_newell_on_social_engineering_of_cheating/

Edited November 14, 2014 by {Core}BlackLabel

[r.pitura@live.com.au 12]

 

Dear BESable,

 

1. BE gives persistent access to remote computers

2. BE can view any file on disk and upload it to the internet

3. BE can open the memory of any running process

4. BE can download and execute code remotely

5. BE can hook applications and inject code into them

6. BE can protect processes preventing transparency into what it is doing

7. BE protects itself to prevent it being reverse engineered to give transparency into what it is doing

8. BEdaisy.sys is a kernel driver

9. BE's architecture functions the same way as a botnet command & control system

 

But please, do me the courtesy of providing a technical answer explaining how despite all of this "BE is not a rootkit". BE's functionality makes it a rootkit by the textbook definition of the word.

 

Are you srs dude really tin foil hat is needed for you...

It needs full access to your system for a reason....

Because of the sneaky methods some coders use to hide there hacks..or methods others are just full up front and don't care how long there hack lasts..

And as to being able to log in and control your pc from a remote location dude,you srs need to learn about it because there is nothing in BE that could do it....

[St. Jimmy 1631]

If you're that afraid of BE then you should really shut your internet. Facebook, Twitter, Windows, Anti viruses, Steam, Skype, your web browser, Google, Youtube etc. can also do many things...

[boneboys 7988]

"Since the other thread was locked for imho no good reason I have to open this one to address BEdev-Sables post. It sucks that i have to open a thread for this but the other one was locked without a proper discussion - at least imho."

 

I decide what is a reason.

If I or any of the Moderators lock or remove a Topic do not open another or re-post.