Movement controls detrimental to gameplay in 0.47 patch

[gibonez 3633]

I'd like to imagine that the remaining survivors aren't as incapable as you play them out to be. If anything, the only ones left WILL be the more able bodied and fit individuals. Course that partially depends on the amount of time since the apocalypse. 

 

Yes because in a world devoid of food and proper nutrition people are more able bodied and fit right ?

 

 

Then you also remember the lack of tactical or military training these people would not posses how would they even know how or why someone would enter in that stance ?

[solodude23 649]

Yes because in a world devoid of food and proper nutrition people are more able bodied and fit right ?

That's where you're diving into a completely separate issue. This game has a health and energy system - one which will be further developed in the future. Hell, at this point you can sprint from Svetlo to Kamenka so we can agree there's some work to be done. I just don't think it make sense to assume that every character has poor nutrition when that's not necessarily true.

 

Then you also remember the lack of tactical or military training these people would not posses how would they even know how or why someone would enter in that stance ?

I'm not advocating for a crouch sprint, I actually prefer it in 0.46, but I wouldn't mind if it went either way and I don't think it's the most difficult thing to do either. And knowing when and why should be handled by the player, not assumed by the game.

Edited July 8, 2014 by solodude23

[chompster 171]

Yea and arma 3 characters are also either special forces soldiers or regular soldiers who have not only the physical stamina and strength to move in such positions but to hold them for long periods of time.

 

Your retail working survivor would not have a clue on how to even move in such a manner much less be in shape enough to move that way for a long time.

 

I honestly wish there was no toggle weapon raising in the game we should have to press and hold space bar to raise and shoot our weapons.

which is exactly why I said for short stretches, not kilometers. And you really don't need military training to crouch run, I do it all the time when playing paintball to move from cover to cover. Its really a very basic and instinctive thing many people do.

And by that logic we shouldnt be able to take apart or assemble/swap things on m4s, AKs and other weapons as most people never got the training to let alone ever seen or held one before.

[Etherious 907]

If they wanted to work upon more realistic movement, they should start with the horrible jumping and falling system we currently have...

True enough, except there won't ever be jumping. xD

[kichilron 8550]

 

 

You really need to calm down more before posting. Otherwise you will earn yourself a timeout again.

[Ninja_Meh 115]

interesting to see that although some people feel this thread is a pointless crying session about better new controls, that we have a proper response from Viktor highlighting that what most of us saw as big issues with the changes were indeed infact bugs which were unintended as well as some which were.

 

still i think the ability to walk/jog when crouched is not an ability only viable to military trained persons, that is catergorically not true, I am neither well trained or particularly fit, but i can sprint for quite a long period of time (and if someone shot at me but missed i can tell you i would sprint for as long as was needed until i felt safe my life was not in someones crosshairs). it feels a very whimsical argument to say that people would not be able to have a gun shouldered and move at the jog pace we had in 0.46 as a toggled feature. and yet we can still go to that pace anyway, with a counter intuitive idea of using the sprint buttons (whether we remap the controls or not) it is also totally viable that a person can sidestep at the jogging pace as well without the need to mark it down as needing a sprint command to be issued to do that, and in essence this also means our guys will NEVER be able to strafe at pace which is just not reflective of any kind of sane reality.

 

 

I still personally feel the better way to balance the idea of movement as regards to gunplay is to have a lot more things affecting your ability to hold a steady aim and differing periods of time of affected aim depending on how much time you have sprinted etc.

 

 

all in all im just pleased that (most) people have given good feedback and points about the new changes and that the devs are observing our points of view because clearly some of the movement issues are buggy now where some people presumed they were intended.

 

i look forward to seeing how the movement pans out in the future and will enjoy having discussions where relative compromises can be agreed upon regarding it.

[Grimey Rick 3417]

After playing on Experimental for the past week or so and then going back to Stable, I can honestly say that the new changes feel really bad. There's no reason someone should be forced to walk with their rifle in a ready position. This makes breeching buildings really difficult, to the point of giving the players defending a massive advantage.

I don't mind the slower crouching speed, I feel that's fair. However, the reduced ability to breech is almost game-breaking. The game is already slow and clunky enough without making it more so.

[gibonez 3633]

After playing on Experimental for the past week or so and then going back to Stable, I can honestly say that the new changes feel really bad. There's no reason someone should be forced to walk with their rifle in a ready position. This makes breeching buildings really difficult, to the point of giving the players defending a massive advantage.

 

 

Hmmmm it should difficult and the defending players should have a massive advantage.

[Ninja_Meh 115]

Hmmmm it should difficult and the defending players should have a massive advantage.

when you couple the fact that;

 

A ) they have the advantage, of being inside the building with multiple cover and vantage point gains

B ) they will at a later date have the added advantage of being able to barricade entry to said buildings

 

it seems fair to say that implementing slow movement when aiming unless using another command to go to jogged pace just gives needless disadvantage to the players outside of said building/s

Edited July 8, 2014 by Ninja_Meh

[Grimey Rick 3417]

Hmmmm it should difficult and the defending players should have a massive advantage.

Assuming Hardcore, it's already extremely difficult to breech against a capable player. Moving at half the normal breech speed is going to make breeching twice as hard, putting it up into the near impossible range against a decent group.

I'm all for a challenge, but considering it from a defender's point of view, it's already extremely easy to defend a doorway with an automatic weapon. Making it even easier by taking away the opponent's ability to capitalize on a positioning error I make because their speed has been nerfed is going to detract from my play experience.

Edited July 8, 2014 by Grimey Rick

[gibonez 3633]

Assuming Hardcore, it's already extremely difficult to breech against a capable player. Moving at half the normal breech speed is going to make breeching twice as hard, putting it up into the near impossible range against a decent group.

I'm all for a challenge, but considering it from a defender's point of view, it's already extremely easy to defend a doorway with an automatic weapon. Making it even easier by taking away the opponent's ability to capitalize on a positioning error I make because their speed has been nerfed is going to detract from my play experience.

 

That's how it works in real life.

 

Trying to breach an area when people know you are coming is suicide. Thats when it requires people to get creative.

[trev186 389]

Assuming Hardcore, it's already extremely difficult to breech against a capable player. Moving at half the normal breech speed is going to make breeching twice as hard, putting it up into the near impossible range against a decent group.

I'm all for a challenge, but considering it from a defender's point of view, it's already extremely easy to defend a doorway with an automatic weapon. Making it even easier by taking away the opponent's ability to capitalize on a positioning error I make because their speed has been nerfed is going to detract from my play experience.

I agree I think most would despise the fact that campers have all the advantages...camping is considered in most FPS games to be a pussy tactic. Giving campers such a huge advantage would just be lame. Unless you make it like BF4 where 90% of the strcutres can be blown to bits by explosives....and give us tons of explosives...

[Ninja_Meh 115]

I agree I think most would despise the fact that campers have all the advantages...camping is considered in most FPS games to be a pussy tactic. Giving campers such a huge advantage would just be lame. Unless you make it like BF4 where 90% of the strcutres can be blown to bits by explosives....and give us tons of explosives...

this is a big point, the changes as they are, do not affect the camping guys, because they don't tend to move a lot anyway, if only to run to a new spot to camp because someone clocked them and compromised their position. its as if though that a lot of people are claiming there is huge run and gun tactics used in every fire fight because of the older controls, which in my experience was never the case. it also seems as though people are arguing you could previously move at an "unrealistic" pace with your weapon readied and that also you were wholey accurate at the same time, which is also not true. if you are in ADS view and side stepping while walk speed, you get a slight movement of the gun, and if you move to a jogged speed, the accuracy of your aim is pretty gimped until you stop. this all makes sense, forcing slow movement when you havent even gone to your most precise aiming view just feels like a badly thought out move, IMO

[trev186 389]

Yea and arma 3 characters are also either special forces soldiers or regular soldiers who have not only the physical stamina and strength to move in such positions but to hold them for long periods of time.

 

Your retail working survivor would not have a clue on how to even move in such a manner much less be in shape enough to move that way for a long time.

 

I honestly wish there was no toggle weapon raising in the game we should have to press and hold space bar to raise and shoot our weapons.

Yet we can fly helicopters???

I guarantee you I could crouch sprint if being shot at....but flying a helo no freaking way...

You I think humans who have sruvived this long would acclamate to basic millitary tactics quickly such as weapon care and how to run with a weapon in their hands...it isn't rocket science.....sure it takes training but we aren't talking about advanced spec ops stuff here...

Also survivors have more of a motivation then most who join the millitary to learn these skills

[gibonez 3633]

Yet we can fly helicopters???

I guarantee you I could crouch sprint if being shot at....but flying a helo no freaking way...

You I think humans who have sruvived this long would acclamate to basic millitary tactics quickly such as weapon care and how to run with a weapon in their hands...it isn't rocket science.....sure it takes training but we aren't talking about advanced spec ops stuff here...

Also survivors have more of a motivation then most who join the millitary to learn these skills

 

Their comments not mine.

 

All the more reason to not include helicopters is what I say.

[trev186 389]

Their comments not mine.

 

All the more reason to not include helicopters is what I say.

Finally something we can agree on..

That will be the hill I die on. I either can move like someone in Arma3 and helos are in the game or there should be no helos and I move like a fat kid.

[gibonez 3633]

Finally something we can agree on..

That will be the hill I die on. I either can move like someone in Arma3 and helos are in the game or there should be no helos and I move like a fat kid.

 

I will say one thing though although not perfect the movement in arma 3 is far more realistic. It does not have the unreal tournament strafe movement that stand alone has.

[trev186 389]

I will say one thing though although not perfect the movement in arma 3 is far more realistic. It does not have the unreal tournament strafe movement that stand alone has.

Also cool with that...I hate it when people do the spam strafe back and forth and they look like a robot....

[gibonez 3633]

Wrong thread

Edited July 8, 2014 by gibonez

[Hikurac 115]

Semi-realistic because why in the hell would you be moving fast while aiming? Especially with how guns work in in DayZ (as of right now) it will cause you to still have your normal aim as if not moving. Of course, this is because of the whole 0 dispersion with the AKM that I like this idea (I see lots of AKMs which is why I said this). More balanced because it means no more fools jogging fast with a gun out spraying (albeit maybe tweak it to be just a "tad faster").

 

Read above.

I see your point, however I don't think removing options from the player is a great way of "fixing issues". A player should definitely be able to run while aiming down sights, however there should be a massive amount of sway.

Edited July 8, 2014 by Hikurac

[solodude23 649]

That's how it works in real life.

 

Trying to breach an area when people know you are coming is suicide. Thats when it requires people to get creative.

But in "real life" aiming down your sights doesn't automatically force you to move at a dangerously slow pace.  Walk aiming should always be an option using the walk key, but it should NOT be the default action when aiming down sights in a fast paced or room clearing situation. "Real life" has nothing to do with the fact that you think that ADS should default you to an extremely slow pace. A defensive position is not advantageous because you know the enemy has to walk in slowly, it's because you have a defensive position.

Edited July 8, 2014 by solodude23

[darthbane67 92]

So far I haven't even noticed these detrimental changes so my vote is no. No one likes change especially those that brush against it to hard on the way out. Seriously they have just changed how you don't sprint/move fast forward right off the bat will raising a weapon and that's a problem?!?! i don't get you people sometimes.

Edited July 9, 2014 by KaserinSmarte67