Where do we go if GSPs are not dealing with abuse?

[xalienax 621]

 

the problem is the GSP's are not motivated to do anything. The guys that rent the servers are the GSP's living, why would they deprive themselves of income just to keep a gamer in Liverpool happy.

 

Again it comes down to BIS, they need to be actively involved in this, they have delegated running of servers to the community they have delegated anti hack to battle eye and they don't seem to care about the fact that it don't work.

 

they need to have someone who is monitioring the reports and the actions of the GSP's, if the GSP's don't act against the bad admins they lose the right to rent out DayZ servers.

 

This would end the GSP's indifference overnight and dealing with bad admins would suddenly become a major priority.

 

Basicly this.

 

No 100% automated anti-cheat will work. people can abuse exploits/glitches/etc that wont necessarily be detctable by an autmoated peice of code. NOTHING is more effective then active responsible adins with the correct tools to respond to situations in REAL TIME, not a month later when BE does a ban wave.

 

That said, if rocket and BIS are intent on thier global hive structure rather then singular servers, they have to accept some degree of resonsibility for moderation of the game servers and abuse cases. There needs to be a dedicated team to handle abuse reports and investigate them. with that said, there needs to be a ticket-style reporting system and the burden of evidence should be on the accuser. (basicly dont bother unless you have video/screens/etc)

[daringd 88]

if rocket and BIS are intent on thier global hive structure rather then singular servers, they have to accept some degree of resonsibility for moderation of the game servers and abuse cases. There needs to be a dedicated team to handle abuse reports and investigate them. with that said, there needs to be a ticket-style reporting system and the burden of evidence should be on the accuser. (basicly dont bother unless you have video/screens/etc)

 

THIS is exacty what I am trying to get at, I accept all the arguments that the system is basically flawed from the start by making those who stand to profit the ones who police and penalise the badmins, and in turn stand to lose out themselves, but it doesn't change the fact that this problem IS a big problem and needs a solution, or needs the community to lean on BI for that solution, or at least an aknowledgement that a solution is needed.  The fact the game is in Alpha makes this problem even more serious, how can you effectively test a game for balance and mechanics when there is a portion of the players swinging that balance by breaking the rules.

 

I feel like right now I'm effectively preaching to the choir, as nearly everyone who has responded here sees the problem, we may all have different opinions on how severe it is or what can or should be done about it, but we all see it.  I find it very revealing that no one in a position to do anything about it has said anything.

 

I love the game, and that is precisely why I feel so strongly about this.

 

I'm sad that this thread will slowly die away, the mods here will, at some point have to close it down, because there is only so many times we can re-word or go over the same ground, and I fully understand that, but it means that once again this subject will be swept away out of sight, and the community will trundle on and allow yet another giant blow to the integrity of the game to go unanswered for.

Edited June 15, 2014 by daringd

[Caboose187 (DayZ) 3036]

>snip

It'd at least be nice to hear an opinion from a moderator on what they think about this.

Edited June 15, 2014 by Caboose187

[daringd 88]

I can't see what the quote is! nooooooo

 

 

It'd at least be nice to hear an opinion from a moderator on what they think about this.

 

my quote just says "snip>"  which I don't remember saying...  I don't often use the word "snip" at all.

Edited June 15, 2014 by daringd

[Caboose187 (DayZ) 3036]

I can't see what the quote is! nooooooo

 

 

 

 

my quote just says "snip>"  which I don't remember saying...  I don't often use the word "snip" at all.

I did that from my phone, it took up too much page on mobile :p

[daringd 88]

Well, I still need to know what the quote was, the suspense is crushing me!

[OrLoK 16188]

Like I said no one gives two fucks about that issue, not dayZ team and certainly not the server providers. 

 

Hello there

 

Really? I think you will find you are very wrong there. Dont make assumptions when you dont have the facts.

 

It'd at least be nice to hear an opinion from a moderator on what they think about this.

This is an issue and it is a known one. Remember the dev team can't tackle everything all the time. But it is something that's actively being addressed.

 

Also, dont expect and instant reply from server providers. They may be in different timezones and/or you might have caught them at an unmanned or super busy time. I;m not excusing them, its just that things can "happen". Its best not to spam them especially as updating a ticket sometimes gets you allocated to the bottom of the "to do" list.

 

If I get a response in 24 hours then i'm happy. Anything in less time is a Brucey Bonus IMHO.

 

If you see repeat offenders then use the usual report methods. 1 email is all that is needed per issue. If you see repeat offenders you can pass on their details to us and we can then push it further up the ladder.

 

Just bear in mind, sometimes things take time. Or an action has been taken  on a server but you may not be privy to that action.

 

We cant do anything about server hosts lack of contact/replies/updates etc.

 

Rgds

 

LoK

[General Zod 1118]

Hello there

 

Really? I think you will find you are very wrong there. Dont make assumptions when you dont have the facts.

 

I don't make assumptions, there were several topics on this subject, and today long long time after this issue was first brought the server list is full of rule breaking servers. Also In those previous topic developers answered in the same way each time. 

Report the server there is nothing we can / will do.

And the fact that so many months later the issue still exist means you either did nothing or not enough. And how do you expect people to trust to if you can't even make people obey your rules ? 

[daringd 88]

Well we are getting somewhere, maybe.

 

I Grant you that some GSPs may be in odd time zones or have things on, and I understand that different companies will operate different policies on dealing with abuse, but it would be good to know if there are guidelines set out to the GSPs by BI, for instance: is there a standard timeframe for dealing with reports?  Are there standardised punishments for breaking rules?

 

If Fragnet can get it right 100% of the time, then there is no excuse  for the other GSPs, I think that, like in many other sectors, BI should have set out minimum service standard guidelines to the GSPs, maybe they did?  But there is no consistency across them.  At least if we were aware of the standard we should expect, we can begin taking them to task when they do not fulfil those requirements.

 

I understand that everything can not be fixed in one foul swoop, but this is a fundamental thing to get right, if this isn't working, then the game is essentially broken and open to exploit, and the more it happens, the more people get away with it, the less seriously people will take it, and most likely the more people will begin doing it too.

 

Just simple fixes to begin with, like cleaning up all the server names that break the rules, that isn't even something that is hard to do, if the GSPs are responsible for upholding the requirements, then BI should be holding them to that promise.

 

I'm sorry to state something so harshly, but it's not hard for a GSP to run automated programs that check their server names and automatically generate warning emails or reset the names if they break the rules, this is the first step, and seems blindingly obvious to me, but I'm in no position to get anything done, and that is the frustrating part.

[OrLoK 16188]

Hello there

 

Ill see if I can get you some more info on this. But what I can tell you  (as I stated before) this is a known issue and as with all issues, what might seem an "easy fix" often is not.

 

@ zod You stated that the dayz team did not give "2 fucks" about the issue. This is completely false, no matter what you might think. I've seen some work towards solving this issue. Hardly something that would have happened if there "were no fucks given".

 

I dont care if you are critical of a decision or direction but to make false assumptions is wrong and somewhat offensive.

 

Rgds

 

LoK

[General Zod 1118]

Well if since than you took some action than all the better for it. But that than my statement wasn't far from truth. 

[OrLoK 16188]

Well if since than you took some action than all the better for it. But that than my statement wasn't far from truth. 

 

Well, it was wrong. thats fairly far from the truth to me.

 

If you said something along the lines that it seemed as if little was happening, in this regard then I may have understood your point of view, but would then have informed you that many servers have been shut down/warned due to abuse with the assistance of the Dayz team.

 

This I have seen.

 

Just saying the Dayz Team doesnt give "2 fucks" is just wrong. Nowt truthful there.

 

Rgds

 

LoK

[daringd 88]

Just a quick update.

 

I have been in communication with one of the GSPs and talking about minimum standards, what are they'?  who enforces them? etc, etc.

 

To make a long story short they gave me a contact at BI to direct my questions to, that I could get first hand answers. (seems smart)

 

I have just sent the message and I'll await a reply.

[agentneo 337]

I also wondered why BI provide no Official servers. This will be more important as time goes on and it becomes hard to find a fair server like in the mod's. I would love to see (like in experimental) a few servers for each region, perhaps 40 or 50 total servers, all official, on stable and provided by BI. this would mean no badmins on those servers and a guaranteed un-modded and vanilla server with no F'ing around.
As I see the server prices are very, very expensive and seeing as those people are paying  to keep the game online, I wonder why BI provides 0 official servers to support the players who paid for the game. If no one rented a server at nearly $100 a month as described above, how would anyone play Day Z?

[kakysas666 191]

It's like when people complain to the Government about their bureaucracy or corrupt politicians and expect the government will fix things. Some people are just too naive. I really hoped more for this generation of people. But they are as naive as older generation. There is NO INCENTIVE for them to be on your side. They get the money anyway, so why bother? The Government use taxes, the GSP use voluntary paid rent, but the end result is similar.

[daringd 88]

It's like when people complain to the Government about their bureaucracy or corrupt politicians and expect the government will fix things. Some people are just too naive. I really hoped more for this generation of people. But they are as naive as older generation. There is NO INCENTIVE for them to be on your side. They get the money anyway, so why bother? The Government use taxes, the GSP use voluntary paid rent, but the end result is similar.

 

While you MAY have a point, saying and/or doing nothing about it also changes nothing, at least talking about it in an open forum creates noise and emboldens people to take some kind of action.  It also lets people see the general feeling, if there is a consensus, if people disagree or are on the fence, it also allows people to work together to generate ideas and solutions.

 

There is an incentive for the GSPs to be on our side, because the feedback I have had directly from some of the GSPs indicates that there is a possibility of BI pulling DayZ from them, however slight, and if they do that, then the GSP in question would lose more than just a few clients, they would lose all of them that use their services for DayZ.  The facts are that up until now we simply are not privy to the agreements between BI and the GSPs, we don't know what is happening behind the scenes, and until we do we have to understand that without the facts, we have really nothing to make these kind of judgements on.

 

I'm not defending anyone here, I'm just trying to be scientific about this, if you recognise the problem, then either add something constructive and helpful or keep your angry opinions to yourself until you have something less circumstantial and incredulous to base them on.

 

I started this thread and I won't have it put in jeopardy of being closed because it attracts reactionary and baseless accusations.

Edited June 17, 2014 by daringd

[OrLoK 16188]

Hello there

 

Let's not go down the conspiracy route.

 

Yes, every company needs income to stay afloat but there's no "scheme" to rip the pennies out of ones wallet.

 

Quite often there have been decisions made I too didnt understand, but after talking about the reasoning behind an action with the devs or being pointed to salient info on the topic one may have missed one understands the viewpoint quite clearly.

 

Servers are not my area of expertise so I can only give generalised information or the little snippets of knowledge I have picked up along the way.

 

Its great and indeed welcomed that folk flag up their concerns/ideas etc etc as long as they are made in a sensible way.

 

Lastly, as to BI run servers, who knows what will happen? Buts AFAIK there were none for OFP/Arma/DAYZ mod so I tend to think that will still be the way on the games release. I could well be wrong.

 

Also DAYZ servers AFAIK are very resource intensive ATM hence the high cost, one would expect the costs to lower as the game becomes more "optimised".

 

I would imagine the prices of rthe servers is set by the GSPs rather than BI, so perhaps talk to them about it.

 

It may well be a smart move for one company to undercut the standard costs. And if a price war starts you may see a large decline in costs.

 

Again, thats conjecture.

 

But BI are not an evil megacorp out to steal your souls.

 

Rgds

 

LoK