SKS : can't hit over 200m

[Irish. 4886]

Those odds are exactly why I have never even picked one up. 

[SerasVictoria (DayZ) 13]

Edit: wait a couple minutes, these are incorrect... fixing...

Here:

Odds of hitting target "1" (headshot)

50% = 75 meters

38% = 100 meters

25% = 125 meters

13% = 175 meters

Odds of hitting target "2" (torso)

50% = 150 meters

38% = 260 meters

25% = 320 meters

13% = 450 meters

The numbers aren't exact because I rounded them off earlier.

 

38% = 260 meters

 

well that's quite what i said in my first post , when i said hitting 2-3 times over 10 shots

 

edit : anyway Gews thank you for those information not going to pick up an SKS any time soon ^^

Edited March 10, 2014 by SerasVictoria

[-Gews- 7443]

38% = 260 meters

 

well that's quite what i said in my first post , when i said hitting 2-3 times over 10 shots

 

Those were incorrect, they are fixed now. It's more like 1-in-3 odds at 200 meters.

[Mullraugh 1151]

There's a certain 'necessary' element to the difficulty of hitting targets at range.  In games like COD and BF, there's an assumption that your character is a trained killer.. emphasis on "trained".

 

In this game you're a survivor, no background story, no military affiliation, no reason for being able to hit a target >200m. Let me be clear, with anything other than a fine-tuned hunting rifle and a naturally steady hand, hitting a target more than 200 meters away is VERY difficult.  I think we've all bought into the notion that because we have a steady hand with a mouse we should able to hit anything with a rifle in a game, hence the frustration with the OP

 

I think there will be will be fine-tuning of exactly how this all gets implemented at final-release, but I propose that 90-95% of the people in this forum couldn't hit a deer at 300 meters IRL with an SKS or M4. Since this game is not a PVP war-simulator, I don't think the developers will lose sleep over this particular dose of realism.

 

Agreed. There was a post called "why are people calling magazines clips" or something dumb like that. He basically ranted about magazines not being clips and how people should stop pretending to be soldiers by calling them clips instead of mags... Unfortunately the thread was locked by the time I read it, or I'd say pretty much the same thing as you when it comes to the fact that we're survivors, not military personnel. If we call mags "clips", it's out of pure inexperience with firearms and military lingo.

[SerasVictoria (DayZ) 13]

well 25% at 225m is even closer to what i saw ingame , so i'm still thinking SKS is shitty for my playstyle 

[HazZarD87 166]

Agreed. There was a post called "why are people calling magazines clips" or something dumb like that. He basically ranted about magazines not being clips and how people should stop pretending to be soldiers by calling them clips instead of mags... Unfortunately the thread was locked by the time I read it, or I'd say pretty much the same thing as you when it comes to the fact that we're survivors, not military personnel. If we call mags "clips", it's out of pure inexperience with firearms and military lingo.

Who says we are. You're character's story is your own. How well you can shoot should be determined by the player's skill and not ingame randomness. In the mod there where still plenty of crap shots. Hell I even had a harder time hitting stuff there than I had IRL.. a mouse sucks for aiming compared to using your whole body tbh.

[-Gews- 7443]

well 25% at 225m is even closer to what i saw ingame , so i'm still thinking SKS is shitty for my playstyle 

 

On target 2 Mosin is about 88% at 200m, SKS 32% at 200m.

[Valadain 270]

Agreed. There was a post called "why are people calling magazines clips" or something dumb like that. He basically ranted about magazines not being clips and how people should stop pretending to be soldiers by calling them clips instead of mags... Unfortunately the thread was locked by the time I read it, or I'd say pretty much the same thing as you when it comes to the fact that we're survivors, not military personnel. If we call mags "clips", it's out of pure inexperience with firearms and military lingo.

 

Military training has almost nothing to do with whether a person can shoot or not.

[SerasVictoria (DayZ) 13]

On target 2 Mosin is about 88% at 200m, SKS 32% at 200m.

 

yeah not even with bipod/compensator lol

 

btw do u know the B95 MOA? my fav weapon <3

[-Gews- 7443]

yeah not even with bipod/compensator lol

 

btw do u know the B95 MOA? my fav weapon <3

 

13.75

[xRann 126]

OT:

Gews, you need to be consulted on firearms and ballistics for this game time now...this nonsense has started to make my brain hurt.

[finnpalm 312]

Agreed. There was a post called "why are people calling magazines clips" or something dumb like that. He basically ranted about magazines not being clips and how people should stop pretending to be soldiers by calling them clips instead of mags... Unfortunately the thread was locked by the time I read it, or I'd say pretty much the same thing as you when it comes to the fact that we're survivors, not military personnel. If we call mags "clips", it's out of pure inexperience with firearms and military lingo.

 

Or it's lost in translation. In Swedish a clip is called "magasin". You can see how that can easily get confusing for a Swede. ;)

 

Military training has almost nothing to do with whether a person can shoot or not.

 

Well, military training includes, among other things, learning how to move with a weapon, how to catch the recoil with your body, how to breathe, and so on and so forth. Irl military training has everything to do with if you can shoot or not. In-game some of that knowledge can be translated into helping you become a good shot as well, since the game is built on the Real Virtuality engine, which is made to be realistic in how gunplay works. If you're ignorant of that fact however, you'll still be bad. :)

[Estyles 14]

SKS is not supposed to be a long range weapon nor particularly accurate.

 

 

 

 

1 meter diameter circle at 200m.

 

 

 

Right now the accuracy is messed up.

 

MP M4A1 = 6.9 MOA

Mosin = 8.6 MOA

SKS = 17.2 MOA

M4A1 = 40.6 MOA

 

 

 

I don't care if they exaggerate the dispersion a bit (that's big-picture vs detail-oriented realism). But the exaggeration should be consistent for all weapons.

 

 

What about Mosin with compensator?

[xRann 126]

Well, military training includes, among other things, learning how to move with a weapon, how to catch the recoil with your body, how to breathe, and so on and so forth. Irl military training has everything to do with if you can shoot or not. In-game some of that knowledge can be translated into helping you become a good shot as well, since the game is built on the Real Virtuality engine, which is made to be realistic in how gunplay works. If you're ignorant of that fact however, you'll still be bad. :)

...you'd be surprised how wrong "Irl military training has everything to do with if you can shoot or not." is, at least the units I've seen. Granted, I'm an outsider looking in as a medic but, still...I could shoot before I enlisted. Training hasn't taught me anything I didn't know already, just reenforced shooter preference as foremost importance.

[rickenbacker 190]

 

What do you think about it's accuracy?

 

I think that no game should ever use the "cone of fire" to simulate human error. But that's just me :). 

 

1m spread at 200m? I think most shotguns IRL would have less spread than that... 

Edited March 10, 2014 by Rickenbacker

[Karakoz 141]

I trained with different guns on a helmet at 200m in prone position, and indeed the SKS is almost unable to hit the target. The Mosin and M4 are very accurate however and won't miss a target at 200m. That's why I don't use the SKS. And it's a loud weapon moreover.

Edited March 10, 2014 by Karakoz

[Valadain 270]

...you'd be surprised how wrong "Irl military training has everything to do with if you can shoot or not." is, at least the units I've seen. Granted, I'm an outsider looking in as a medic but, still...I could shoot before I enlisted. Training hasn't taught me anything I didn't know already, just reenforced shooter preference as foremost importance.

 

Yes, some people are just natural shots. Some learn hunting. Some learn at the range. Some learn by having parents that make them learn to shoot. Some shoot competitively. I've seen first time shooters pick up the gun and shoot extremely well. I've seen first time shooters pick up the gun and shoot terribly. I've seen long-time shooters that still have trouble keeping it on the paper. Not everyone is a fumbling noob with a gun that isn't or wasn't in the military. Some people in the military never get any kind of decent marksmen training.

[ig-rage 78]

There's a certain 'necessary' element to the difficulty of hitting targets at range.  In games like COD and BF, there's an assumption that your character is a trained killer.. emphasis on "trained".

 

In this game you're a survivor, no background story, no military affiliation, no reason for being able to hit a target >200m. Let me be clear, with anything other than a fine-tuned hunting rifle and a naturally steady hand, hitting a target more than 200 meters away is VERY difficult.  I think we've all bought into the notion that because we have a steady hand with a mouse we should able to hit anything with a rifle in a game, hence the frustration with the OP

 

I think there will be will be fine-tuning of exactly how this all gets implemented at final-release, but I propose that 90-95% of the people in this forum couldn't hit a deer at 300 meters IRL with an SKS or M4. Since this game is not a PVP war-simulator, I don't think the developers will lose sleep over this particular dose of realism.

 

what if my characters back story includes him being ex special operations?

[rickenbacker 190]

Or it's lost in translation. In Swedish a clip is called "magasin". You can see how that can easily get confusing for a Swede. ;)

 

 

Weeeelll, no. Sorry, I'm a bit anal retentive, but a magazine is a magazine (or "magasin" in Swedish). A clip is called "laddram" in Swedish. Not that they're used much, but the old submachine gun ammo used to come in clips of 36 (six rows of six), which were then pushed into the 36-round magazine.

[hugin_q3 8]

First off we need to know the difference between a bolt rifle and a auto rifle.
They are not comparable in any ways ;)

Mosin = Bolt Rifle
SKS = Auto Rifle

And the SKS have an shorter barrel who is a main key also for bullet ballistics. So in all that, I think the dispersion between the rifles are correct.

But other vice I have not studied the numbers for the guns, so what the devs are up to I don't know.

[SerasVictoria (DayZ) 13]

First off we need to know the difference between a bolt rifle and a auto rifle.

They are not comparable in any ways ;)

Mosin = Bolt Rifle

SKS = Auto Rifle

And the SKS have an shorter barrel who is a main key also for bullet ballistics. So in all that, I think the dispersion between the rifles are correct.

But other vice I have not studied the numbers for the guns, so what the devs are up to I don't know.

 

don't get me wrong , there are differences, the problem is that not being able to hit an human sized target more than 25% of time (which is totally random because your scope is right on it, just the bullet going randomly at left or right ) at 200m is unrealistic 

Edited March 10, 2014 by SerasVictoria

[LigerRider 82]

I had an SKS, snuck up on some bandits robbing my friend, was about 30m behind em. Aimed at center mass, all my shots hit in random places where I was not aiming...

[Karakoz 141]

I don't see why this is unrealistic considering the recoil. Soldiers mostly do "area firing" if I can call it like that, i.e. they don't aim precisely. They get out from their positions a few seconds, open fire on the target, and go back to their cover, so accuracy isn't as important as fire power. The M16 was built as a rifle, much more precise than the AK47 that was built like a machinegun, yet the AK74 was still a very good assault gun.

 

Also accuracy is reduced dramatically when you run. If you "snuck up on some bandits" you probably didn't wait long enough before opening fire.

Edited March 10, 2014 by Karakoz

[amiasfree 262]

How in Gods fuck are you hitting anything while shooting prone?.  Everytime Ive ever fucking tried to shoot while prone my bullets hit an invisible wall on this fucking game.  Is there a trick I dont know?

Ha, just experienced this after getting my first mosin/scope/bipod, was trying to test it out on a zed on the NE airbase and wasted so many rounds, even when firing from an elevation while prone. 

[Rick1633 136]

Negative, that is obviously Detroit. ;)

I wish.  Because that would mean I could buy an AK for 50 bucks in Detroit.   I heard thats what a functioning AK cost in Somalia.