Hey...I see you....put your hands up.....

[Etherimp 1323]

Still haven't answered my question, have you shot people who haven't shot you and have ran away?  We already established you don't hold up people just to help them, you hold up people who are fully geared also just for the interaction so stop saying you do it just to help people.

 

 

You seem to have some serious problems with reading comprehension, and you like to twist peoples points around..

 

To answer your question: Yes, I have shot and killed many people without even interacting with them. For the following reasons:

 

a. Combat loggers

b. Server hoppers. (Witness people spawning into barracks/jails)

c. Coast Campers.. IE - People sitting in Elektro/Kamyshovo/etc shooting fresh spawns.

 

 

To answer your other question: No, I've never shot someone for running away from me when I held them up, because nobody has been stupid enough to try to run away. I did however shoot a guy who I TRIED to hold up, because he combat logged after I started talking to him. He ran off into a wooded area, I followed him, and he logged out (sat down and started doing the log out animations)... So I shot him in the head for being a combat logger.

 

As far as shooting people who run away who DO NOT pose a threat: I already addressed that. 

 

If I come across a "survivor", and I hold them up, and they refuse to cooperate, I make a judgment call on a case to case basis whether I feel they warrant shooting or not. If they refuse to cooperate, that is a sign that they are not friendly. This is where self-preservation comes in.

[Etherimp 1323]

The irony is I never said I haven't interacted with people have I?  I actually said I have talked to people, the difference between us is I don't shoot them if they run away and I don't tell them to drop there weapon.  I'm willing to treat someone decent and not like a hostage and hope that earns trust that telling someone to drop there weapon doesn't earn.

 

 

All you've done since you've started posting in this thread is name-call and make accusations and assumptions about my character as a person.

 

You've called me a bandit, a bully, a thug, and on many occasions insinuated that I am a liar and attempted to call me out on backtracking/double-talk that is simply a case of your own ignorance/misunderstanding.

 

You're new here. You have about 48 posts, and probably 20% of those have been in this thread. I tried to explain how things were in the Mod to you, but you call that being on a "high horse". You obviously have a lot to learn about the game and rather than making a bunch of accusations and assumptions, you should sit back, lurk more, and try to understand why more experienced players (like Lone Regulator and myself) tend to do things in a way which you do not currently understand. Instead of making statements, why not try asking questions about our reasoning?

 

Maybe if you came at it from a position of inquiry rather than condemnation, then you would better understand the kinds of circumstances we're talking about, because currently it's quite apparent that you have no idea what the fuck you're talking about, and you're out of your element.

 

[escobert 112]

The irony is I never said I haven't interacted with people have I?  I actually said I have talked to people, the difference between us is I don't shoot them if they run away and I don't tell them to drop there weapon.  I'm willing to treat someone decent and not like a hostage and hope that earns trust that telling someone to drop there weapon doesn't earn.

Exactly, I've had plenty interactions with fellow fully geared people where no "Drop your weapon" or "I'm friendly" were ever spoken. we saw each other, both waved then exchanged foods and water, he showed me the fountain and we were off in our own directions. I made sure to not go in the same direction as him to not seem as a threat. we both met, survived, prospered and went on playing happily.

[Etherimp 1323]

Exactly, I've had plenty interactions with fellow fully geared people where no "Drop your weapon" or "I'm friendly" were ever spoken. we saw each other, both waved then exchanged foods and water, he showed me the fountain and we were off in our own directions. I made sure to not go in the same direction as him to not seem as a threat. we both met, survived, prospered and went on playing happily.

 

 

I've had plenty of those kinds of interactions as well.. It's totally circumstantial. While I sometimes travel with a group of other players, I am often and usually a lone wolf. I played a lot of the mod and I know my way around the map. I know how to approach most high-traffic and dangerous areas without being spotted and in such a way that I am able to scout them thoroughly before entering.. In these areas, it's very common to run into highly geared players. MOST of these players are extremely dangerous and NOT friendly.. BUT, I do not want to shoot them on sight unless I have confirmation that they are indeed, up to no good. IE - Server hopping, combat logging, shooting others on sight, torturing fresh spawns, etc.

 

In these scenarios, I will attempt to position myself in a way which allows me to hold them up with minimal danger to myself, but which puts them in a position they cannot easily escape from. I will announce my presence, like, "Hello, friendly player here.. Are you friendly?", from there, I base my next statements/questions on how they respond or if they respond at all. Usually it will go something along these lines..

"Yeah, I see you in X position. Please put away your gun and go to Y position so we can talk."

If, from here, they do not put away or drop their weapon, and if they sound like sketchy people, then I will prepare for combat. 

This is not the kind of holdup that happens on the coast. We're talking about approaching people who have assault rifles and decked out in full military gear inside or around military bases. If you get held up at a military base, and I let  you keep your weapon drawn, then I am just asking to get myself killed. No smart player would do that, no matter how friendly.

[escobert 112]

I agree with you that you do really have to judge a person on their movement/voice if they don't start shooting immediately. I think the other guys and my biggest problem was that you are forcing people to interact and then possibly killing them for maybe being shy or scared and not doing as you order. Just sort of comes off as a power trip sounding thing. I understand not everyone in the game is nice, and i don't expect them to be. It would ruin the core feel of the game if you could just trust everyone.

 

Oh and if they give me a reason to want my character to survive, by all means I'll go along with your robbery. But at this point in the game really all I'm losing is an hour or two of looting since I gave up on bothering with military gear a while ago.

Edited March 4, 2014 by escobert

[Gerandar 212]

I'll never let anyone rob me in this game, I'd rather be a fresh-spawn then give you your jollies.

[StoutAle 69]

Ok fair enough, I might try telling them to not just point it at me from now on, I've not been on the receiving end that much so I'll give this a try next time I run into an armed player and see what happens

The one time we met some guys they did say don't point it at them instead of disarm and I actually did feel like complying more

I just put my weapon away as manners really

 

I watched your video and the first one you asked the guy to put his weapon away and he not only didn't but his friend drew his weapon and raised it trying to sight you in.  Shooting him before he shot you/at you is your choice but I can't blame you for it.  I wouldn't have shot till they shot at me but that's just what makes me feel better about things and again I don't blame you for shooting in that case.

 

You only asked one guy to drop there weapon and it was a sniper, which I thought a bit odd sense you clearly had the advantage being closer range and him in the prone facing away from you, but even so he put it on his back and still didn't drop it and you didn't shoot him.

 

Even the guy that ran up to you with a guy pointed at you (you in the bush with a magnum out) you didn't shoot him. 

 

I don't understand stalking the guy with no clothes on, why didn't you just leave him be?  After three guys with weapons followed and bugged me like that I'd swing at them too eventually, what do I have to lose?  He clearly wanted to be left alone and IMO you were harassing him following him 3 armed people to one naked guy.  I didn't understand that one at all.

 

Bottom line is the only problem I have had with the hold ups is when someone says drop your weapon or they will shoot you or if they shoot someone who simply runs away.  You really haven't done any so I clearly wasn't talking about you or people like you.  The person (Etherimp) that said they shoot runners and demand others drop there weapon completely, I don't understand them and they are no more then bandit thugs looking to be able to justify shooting someone.

 

In the in most states the basis for a "clean kill" (understand this is the BASIS, I don't need a law class from anyone on castle laws and various other reasons, this is the start of figuring out a good or bad kill nothing more) is Ability.. does that person have the ability to kill you? Opportunity.. does that person have the opportunity to kill you?Jeopardy.. are you in jeopardy?  Someone running away from you doesn't fulfill these three things so I leave them be.  This is a game clearly not real life but it's still a pretty good code to follow IMO.

 

If someone holds you up, and you try to get away from the situation (especially when they told you to unarm) and they shoot you in the back they are the hostile in that case I'll never believe other wise.  If someone tries to unarm you it's time to start worrying about there intentions also, if they can't simply have you put your weapon on your back and feel safe or have you point away from them and feel safe then they really must feel inferior in there tactical skills and should stop holding people up in the first place.  You made it work in basically every one of them clips on the video, others can also.  There is a right and wrong way to interact with someone, starting off with I have a gun drop yours and do as I say or I'll shoot you isn't the best way IMO.

[StoutAle 69]

I don't drop my gun because I know I am friendly and will only use it if someone else is hostile. I do not know that about the other person.. They could be hostile or they could be friendly. If they drop their gun, they're friendly.. If they don't, they're hostile. 

 

There's only 1 thing you have to trust if I am holding you up, and that's that I will shoot and hit you if you don't drop it... So you might as well.

 

 

You seem to have some serious problems with reading comprehension, and you like to twist peoples points around..

 

To answer your question: Yes, I have shot and killed many people without even interacting with them. For the following reasons:

 

a. Combat loggers

b. Server hoppers. (Witness people spawning into barracks/jails)

c. Coast Campers.. IE - People sitting in Elektro/Kamyshovo/etc shooting fresh spawns.

 

 

To answer your other question: No, I've never shot someone for running away from me when I held them up, because nobody has been stupid enough to try to run away. I did however shoot a guy who I TRIED to hold up, because he combat logged after I started talking to him. He ran off into a wooded area, I followed him, and he logged out (sat down and started doing the log out animations)... So I shot him in the head for being a combat logger.

 

As far as shooting people who run away who DO NOT pose a threat: I already addressed that. 

 

 

You act like I twist what you said, but honestly if you look back at my very first post on this thread you'll see I said I understand your position.  We just disagree on being held up.  your last post doesn't jive with your earlier post.  You have sense backed off considerably on what you do when you hold someone up.  As you can see you clearly said if they don't drop there weapon you will shoot them and you will hit them.  This is a far cry from what Lone Ranger does so don't lump yourself in with him.  You hold people up, he interacts with people in a manner where he's still safe but doesn't tell them to drop there weapon or they will be killed.  I called you a bandit because your tactics are banditry like, I changed it to thug or bully because you didn't like bandit and pointed out the dictionary definition of it.  Now your defensive but if you read back at our debate you will see how drastically your "if you don't drop your weapon I'll shoot you and I will hit you" has morphed into "Yeah, I see you in X position. Please put away your gun and go to Y position so we can talk.".  I'm sorry if I misjudged you, but it's only because of what you said. 

[real meatshield 424]

Or maybe they were trying to have a player interaction with you, where they may have given  you food/water/guns/ammo/medical supplies..

 

..Or maybe they would have tested your blood for you, and if you weren't O-, sent you on your way with a bag of rice for your troubles..

 

....Or maybe they just wanted to be sure you were unarmed before they lowered their weapons and started talking to you.

 

But instead, you got scurred of losing a collection of pixels on a screen which represents some virtual avatar, so you ran away, defeating the purpose of the "game".

 

Congrats... You're a part of the problem.

Rinse the sand out of your vagina before you decide to post again plz.

[thelonewarrior 886]

Ok yeah sometimes the heat of the moment things happen so fast

The sniper guy i meant to say put the weapon away but accidently said drop it

I just wanted to get past but didn't want him to turn and shoot me in surprise

Anyway I'm done here, I've learnt a few things I might try in the future to try and better my play style and I'll see how they turn out

[Etherimp 1323]

You act like I twist what you said, but honestly if you look back at my very first post on this thread you'll see I said I understand your position.  We just disagree on being held up.  your last post doesn't jive with your earlier post.  You have sense backed off considerably on what you do when you hold someone up.  As you can see you clearly said if they don't drop there weapon you will shoot them and you will hit them.  This is a far cry from what Lone Ranger does so don't lump yourself in with him.  You hold people up, he interacts with people in a manner where he's still safe but doesn't tell them to drop there weapon or they will be killed.  I called you a bandit because your tactics are banditry like, I changed it to thug or bully because you didn't like bandit and pointed out the dictionary definition of it.  Now your defensive but if you read back at our debate you will see how drastically your "if you don't drop your weapon I'll shoot you and I will hit you" has morphed into "Yeah, I see you in X position. Please put away your gun and go to Y position so we can talk.".  I'm sorry if I misjudged you, but it's only because of what you said. 

 

 

You're telling me who and what I am and what I do and how I conduct myself. As I explained above, these are not holdups down in elektro or along the coast.. They are usually in high value military spawns such as NWAF, Veresnik, Zelenogorsk, or Kamenka.. Sometimes NEAF. Holding someone who's in full military gear up and asking them to drop their weapon is not "bandit like", nor is it thuggish.. I still stand behind my statement that I will shoot someone if they fail to comply with my demands in these situations. If someone is fully military geared and I get the drop on them, if they don't drop their weapon they are likely not friendly. The misunderstanding here is that it seems SOME people have been ASSUMING that I am holding up people along the coast who are not nearly as geared as I am... Which simply isn't the case. 

 

If someone attempts to run away from you while you're holding them up at NWAF, the odds are they are attempting to flank you, or they are getting friends to move in on you. You simply cannot risk it in those situations. Obviously, I would not shoot a fresh spawn who had no gear if he ran away from me.. There have been many times where I've had something like this happen:

 

-Walk near a fresh spawn/low geared player

-Spoke out, "Hey man! I'm friendly over here.."

-They run away..

-I say, "Guess they didn't want this bag of rice and FNX.... oh wells.. Next guy."

[Irish. 4886]

My favorite so far reaction is this:

 

Aggressor -

"Hey, drop your weapons and surrender or we will shoot."

 

Captive-

"No, you drop your weapons and surrender. Or else Ill kick you from my server." <-- bluffing

 

Aggressor -

Drops weapon and puts hands in the air.

 

#priceless

[Etherimp 1323]

Rinse the sand out of your vagina before you decide to post again plz.

 

 

K, Mister KOS.. Shove it up your ass. :)

[StoutAle 69]

You're telling me who and what I am and what I do and how I conduct myself. As I explained above, these are not holdups down in elektro or along the coast.. They are usually in high value military spawns such as NWAF, Veresnik, Zelenogorsk, or Kamenka.. Sometimes NEAF. Holding someone who's in full military gear up and asking them to drop their weapon is not "bandit like", nor is it thuggish.. I still stand behind my statement that I will shoot someone if they fail to comply with my demands in these situations. If someone is fully military geared and I get the drop on them, if they don't drop their weapon they are likely not friendly. The misunderstanding here is that it seems SOME people have been ASSUMING that I am holding up people along the coast who are not nearly as geared as I am... Which simply isn't the case. 

 

If someone attempts to run away from you while you're holding them up at NWAF, the odds are they are attempting to flank you, or they are getting friends to move in on you. You simply cannot risk it in those situations. Obviously, I would not shoot a fresh spawn who had no gear if he ran away from me.. There have been many times where I've had something like this happen:

 

-Walk near a fresh spawn/low geared player

-Spoke out, "Hey man! I'm friendly over here.."

-They run away..

-I say, "Guess they didn't want this bag of rice and FNX.... oh wells.. Next guy."

 

 

No, again I never told you how to act or what to do, I simply don't agree with what you do.  The ironic part of that statement if YOU have no problem telling people what to do in game.  People don't assume anything, you said you hold people up to help them (remember I asked about this) you clearly don't need to stop people and hold them up if they are geared as well as you are.  So I asked you about this and you said you hold the well geared ones up for the interaction of it.  I haven't assumed a thing, I asked you to explain and made my decisions based on what you said.  The problem is you have changed from billy bad ass "drop your gun or I'll shoot you" to much more calm "I judge things as they happen" guy.  Again even when I said I'm sorry if I miss judged you but it's only based on what YOU wrote here you get pissy with me.  Seems your avatar is correct, I should have ignored you when I first saw that, that's my fault.

[Slyguy65 499]

1.Stop and see if they're friendly or not.

6.Use reverse psychology and mind tricks to turn them against eachother if my capturers are more than 1 person.

7.Encourage him to shoot me. (I am no one's entertainment)

teamspeak and private chats make psychology worthless.

[Etherimp 1323]

No, again I never told you how to act or what to do, I simply don't agree with what you do.  The ironic part of that statement if YOU have no problem telling people what to do in game.  People don't assume anything, you said you hold people up to help them (remember I asked about this) you clearly don't need to stop people and hold them up if they are geared as well as you are.  So I asked you about this and you said you hold the well geared ones up for the interaction of it.  I haven't assumed a thing, I asked you to explain and made my decisions based on what you said.  The problem is you have changed from billy bad ass "drop your gun or I'll shoot you" to much more calm "I judge things as they happen" guy.  Again even when I said I'm sorry if I miss judged you but it's only based on what YOU wrote here you get pissy with me.  Seems your avatar is correct, I should have ignored you when I first saw that, that's my fault.

 

 

Because avatars are serious business.. It's a joke.

 

Why does it have to be one or the other? Sometimes I hold up fresh spawns and give them stuff.. Sometimes I hold up someone who's moderately geared.. sometimes I hold up someone at NWAF.. How I treat them depends upon how they respond/react and where I meet them and what they're wearing/holding.. Obviously if the guy is wearing mostly civilian clothing and a taloon backpack, with a mosin on his back as he's running around, he's not much of a threat to me unless he pulls his gun, so I'm more than likely just going to say hi and treat him as a fellow survivor until he proves otherwise.. If someone is running around NWAF in full military gear, I will treat them more suspiciously.

 

As far as "why hold up geared players?"... because if you're running around NWAF and I'm running around NWAF, I'd rather make sure you're not going to kill me.. Perhaps I have that Magpul buttstock you're looking for and you have found a Long Range scope that I am looking for.. Maybe you were recently injured and need assistance.. Maybe you were recently in a battle.. Maybe you ran out of food and need a few cans to hold you over. 

Just because people are geared doesn't mean they do not need help or that they would not like to trade items/information. 

 

I haven't told anyone what to do in game.. where did I do that? 

 

I also never pretended to be a "billy badass".. And I never retracted my "Stop or I will shoot you" statement. You have just assumed that is the whole of my persona and that there's no spectrum. You jumped into the conversation and immediately accused me of being a bandit when you only saw one little slice of my playstyle and extracted from that based on very little information.

[Martmital 436]

seriously, Etherimp and StoutAle, go get a fucking room...

[Paule2934 7]

I feel compelled to give my opinion here, which probably nobody cares about due to my low # of posts.  I haven't been posting on forums long but have been playing since the mod, whatever that is worth.  I understand and for the most part agree with both of the two main posters' play styles and think it comes down to personal preference and what makes you feel safe.  The one thing that I will say I don't like is the "put your gun on the ground" approach.  While I understand the logic completely for the person saying it, I do not think it is the best way to promote a friendly and death-free encounter for both parties.  If someone tells me to put my gun on the ground, the first thing I am thinking is that they either want to steal it or make me completely helpless so they can fuck with me.  Since my gun is usually the piece of loot that I care about the most, I am more likely to take my chances in an unnecessary gun battle or flee rather than putting it on the ground.  Of course I also do not agree with merely telling someone "don't point your gun at me."  It does not take very long to shift your aim and get off a quick shot, so I would not be satisfied that the person was safe just because they aim at the ground or off into the woods. In my opinion, telling the person to put their gun on their back seems like a very reasonable middle ground.  It is basically saying to them, "I am not here to take your shit or make you completely helpless, I just want to be satisfied that you can't immediately cause me harm."  When people have done this to me, I have felt at ease because they did not kill me outright and they had the respect and empathy to realize that laying my hard earned weapon down on the deck would cause me significant distress and might make me do something rash that one of us would end up regretting.  All this being said, I don't think it is any of my business to say that doing it one way or the other is "wrong," and labels like "bandit" are overused and tired.  We are all just lost souls in an endless wasteland, but some of us are more courteous and respectful than others.  If someone wants to be a control freak and have the other person do exactly what they say at the expense of their new acquantance/victim's feeling of relative comfort/safety, then that is their prerogative and who am I to tell them to do it any differently?

[Etherimp 1323]

seriously, Etherimp and StoutAle, go get a fucking room...

 

 

I would, but Stout would just try to run away when I asked him to put away his man cannon. :(

Edited March 4, 2014 by Etherimp

[StoutAle 69]

Because avatars are serious business.. It's a joke.

 

Why does it have to be one or the other? Sometimes I hold up fresh spawns and give them stuff.. Sometimes I hold up someone who's moderately geared.. sometimes I hold up someone at NWAF.. How I treat them depends upon how they respond/react and where I meet them and what they're wearing/holding.. Obviously if the guy is wearing mostly civilian clothing and a taloon backpack, with a mosin on his back as he's running around, he's not much of a threat to me unless he pulls his gun, so I'm more than likely just going to say hi and treat him as a fellow survivor until he proves otherwise.. If someone is running around NWAF in full military gear, I will treat them more suspiciously.

 

As far as "why hold up geared players?"... because if you're running around NWAF and I'm running around NWAF, I'd rather make sure you're not going to kill me.. Perhaps I have that Magpul buttstock you're looking for and you have found a Long Range scope that I am looking for.. Maybe you were recently injured and need assistance.. Maybe you were recently in a battle.. Maybe you ran out of food and need a few cans to hold you over. 

Just because people are geared doesn't mean they do not need help or that they would not like to trade items/information. 

 

I haven't told anyone what to do in game.. where did I do that? 

 

I also never pretended to be a "billy badass".. And I never retracted my "Stop or I will shoot you" statement. You have just assumed that is the whole of my persona and that there's no spectrum. You jumped into the conversation and immediately accused me of being a bandit when you only saw one little slice of my playstyle and extracted from that based on very little inform

There's only 1 thing you have to trust if I am holding you up, and that's that I will shoot and hit you if you don't drop it... So you might as well.

 

That's what you said.. that's pretty billy badass isn't it?  So you don't miss? The game doesn't ever glitch in your world?  See you don't even really realize how this debate went the direction it has because you don't realize how you have come off and what you have said.  You have sense changed quite a bit but you can't hold what I said when you were being mister one shot one kill hold up bandit against me now that you have changed your tune.  I said twice and I'll say it again if I misjudged you I am sorry, but it's only because what you posted.

[Etherimp 1323]

There's only 1 thing you have to trust if I am holding you up, and that's that I will shoot and hit you if you don't drop it... So you might as well.

 

That's what you said.. that's pretty billy badass isn't it?  So you don't miss? The game doesn't ever glitch in your world?  See you don't even really realize how this debate went the direction it has because you don't realize how you have come off and what you have said.  You have sense changed quite a bit but you can't hold what I said when you were being mister one shot one kill hold up bandit against me now that you have changed your tune.  I said twice and I'll say it again if I misjudged you I am sorry, but it's only because what you posted.

 

 

Some people may bluff when they attempt to hold you up...some people may not be in a very good position. I have been playing the game long enough to know where to put myself in order to block off retreat or prevent them from escaping without great risk for themselves..

 

For example, I may trail them through a treeline, and wait for them to cross halfway through an open field.. Or maybe I'll wait for them to enter a building with only one exit..Just a few examples.

 

In terms of missing.. Sure, everyone misses, because the weapons in the game are incredibly unreliable. That said, I played competitive CS for 7 years at a rather high level. It's rather unlikely that you're going to survive if I put my crosshairs on you with the intent to kill. That's not being a braggart.. It's just being honest.

[Paule2934 7]

 

That said, I played competitive CS for 7 years at a rather high level. It's rather unlikely that you're going to survive if I put my crosshairs on you with the intent to kill. That's not being a braggart.. It's just being honest.

 

I am sure that if people knew how badass you were, they would take it into consideration.  In my experience the vast majority of people in this game can't hit a moving target to save their lives, so thats why I would run if someone told me to set my weapon on the ground versus asking me to put it on my back.  However, if they announced to me that they were a highly accomplished CS player of 7 years, I might think differently?  Sure, it would make you sound like a douchebag if you announced that every time, but it just might save a life or two!   

Edited March 4, 2014 by Paule2934

[River Lizard 47]

I appreciate everyone's input...good discussion on all sides, but I'm still running!!!  :lol:   Blast away if that makes ya feel good.....and I'll die knowing that I scared you enough to shoot.....so we can call it even!

[Etherimp 1323]

 

 

 

I am sure that if people knew how badass you were, they would take it into consideration.  In my experience the vast majority of people in this game can't hit a moving target to save their lives, so thats why I would run if someone told me to set my weapon on the ground versus asking me to put it on my back.  However, if they announced to me that they were a highly accomplished CS player of 7 years, I might think differently?  Sure, it would make you sound like a douchebag if you announced that every time, but it just might save a life or two!   

 

 

 

For the record, I am perfectly happy if people stow their weapon on their back as opposed to putting it down.

[Duenan 226]

The key to survival when approached by a robber is

 

F4

 

Detroit side step

 

Axe to the face