Is there anything being planned that incentivizes not shooting on sight?

[Furtherado 100]

pst, I never said they were ancient.

 

It`s still not the same thing, you agree to play a game where there`s a chance you`ll get shot, because people have guns and can shoot you the second you press the "play" button. It`s not the same thing to tear up a painting someone used 10 hours to paint because they were creating something and didn`t agree to any kind of risk that some crazy mofo would come in and tear up their painting. If shooting someone in DayZ is a douchey thing to do is up to you to decide, but you know what you`re getting into.

[Martmital 436]

Does surviving zombies on broken gear, lousy food and contaminated water sound like the environment where you need to rescue someone through a hail of bullets? Who, if so, would be the shooters? The other survivors doing the only logical thing they can think of, getting rid of the only people with which you share an enemy? Or maybe you would need rescuing from a pack of AK-47 equipped zombies with a trained eye...

 

I have a hard time seeing why, in a zombie situation, I should be more concerned with being killed by a fellow human than being eaten by a turned one.

 

2 cents.

 

The game isn't about 'surviving' zombies, they are there simply as a marketable backdrop.  A gimmick.  A selling point.  Zombies in most films are not the threat, it's usually other humans that provide that.  So who is gonna be shooting, the guys wanting my stuff.  the guys that can move like me, think like me and ultimately are the major threat.  Computer AI will never match a human player.  That is what gives DayZ the thrill.

 

Wanna be a hero, do something worthy of the name.  No hero worth his salt goes round claiming to be a hero, he gets labelled it by those around him.

[Nicko2580 398]

It will never be possible to play a 'hero' unless they tie characters to a server.

 

Bandits need to be locked in, so you can track them, hunt them down, administer justice (not necessarily involving execution). If they can simply jump off into the ether of the server list, never to be seen again, anyone playing 'hero' is on a hiding to nothing.

 

I really don't think DayZ can ever be anything but a PvP tactical combat game unless your character is trapped in a single server to face the consequences of its actions - and by 'actions', I'm talking about the more menial survivalist actions and player player-interaction, as well as the combat, robbery and killing: none of it has consequences if you can jump into a different server. 

I wouldn't have a problem with this, as long as I could have multiple characters on separate servers (that never interacted of course). I would hate to be locked in to one character. It's kinda frustrating as it is, only being able to have one regular and one hardcore character. 

I don't want my characters to be able to mix though. I don't want to be able to log on to a server, drop a heap of shit, and come back with another character to get it. I just want to be able to have multiple characters if each of them is going to be locked into the server I start it on.

[rapier17 48]

Wanna be a hero, do something worthy of the name.  No hero worth his salt goes round claiming to be a hero, he gets labelled it by those around him.

I'd never claim to be a hero, just a kind-hearted soul who likes to help out.

 

Just got KoS'd by some fellow as I climbed over a fence out in some village. Nevermind, it happens.

Edited February 17, 2014 by rapier17

[Ovomaltine 30]

Why should they make not killing people an incentive ?

 

because its unrealistic to kill on sight. it just doesnt happen. most humans try to help each other out in a crisis. ofc there are bandits.

but you just dont run around and kill everyone you see because that would mean that you have lost all faith in humanity. which wouldnt be true.

 

ofc in computer games you play a role. in bf4 or cod the role is pretty much predefined as soldier of one faction.

so its totally clear that u kill the other guys for your score, and for "victory" of the game mode. you dont go asking if they are friendly on a bf4

server. and if u do you will get shot 99% of the time :D and the other 1% find it funny and may play along... but well

in open world games where the roles are not predefined you choose your role. and the thing is. you can switch from being the nicest guy on earth

to being a mass murderer in 1 second, because u know its just a game. this is extremely volatile and can lead to some big "WTF" moments.

which may be funny but in the end remove a TENSION in the game which makes the game so awesome.

 

i mean when u walk unarmed/or gun holstered towards a group of 4 armed guys to get to know whats up with them... you are excited. if u then get killed while 500m away from them ...

the excitement is gone in no time. and it has not really been intense for a long time.

i mean even in real life crisis regions bandits/rebels dont shoot on sight on civilians or clearly underpowered people. they take them as prisoner or abuse them as a working force

or want to recruit them. but most humans dont KILL FOR FUN, because it always has consequences to the murderer itself. and i am not talking about legal consequeces ofc they dont

exist in a martial law setting. there is always communication first, except in a dedicated war of course.

 

 

concerning an incentive of not KOS'ing:

 

i actually think of some kind of psychological consequences to your char, nothing that hurts too much but still does change some behaviour.

like the heartbeat thing, or a more evil face expression. also maybe if u kos like 20 guys you get some kind of flashbacks, i dont mean

stuff that would prevent you from moving normally and doing stuff normally but like a transparent overlay in the sky which depicts an execution for like 3 seconds or something.

just something that distracts your attention as a player, not technically as the character.

 

and also i do like the concept of making zombies more powerful and having to work together to be able to fight them.

by

- increasing their numbers

- make them act as groups

- make them ambush players

- make them a little more resistant

- make them infect u very early

- convert infected players to zombies after they die

- make infection be undetected for a longer time -> possibility of spreading the infection when working with other people (getting in contact with blood etc, sharing a canteen, bottle of water etc...)

 

back to the psychological consequences. some people wanted some kind of marker for bandits or murderers. i dont think there should be an artificial red dot above their head or sth.

but maybe when u are near (1-10m) a guy who murdered like 5-10 people minimum, then with a certain probability (40% per 30 seconds for example, increasing with higher kill count) you get nervous, you get a heartbeat, you feel uncomfortable (status messages).

so you dont see if someone is a murderer upright, but there is a chance you might feel that there is something strange about a person. ofc if u do that with 5 kills minimum, and that guy lives for like 30 hours already, and had to defend himself 5 times then this adds another positive mechanism. because you can ofc think of that... and ask that guy "why he is making you nervous"... and then he might tell you nothing or he might tell u that he has hard times getting over 5 people he had to kill because they attacked him.

AND THEN u can believe him... and TRUST him ... but maybe he is lying and he killed 5 guys in the last 5 minutes and is just about to kill you.

 

i think this way it would reflect the worlds circumstances in a more realistic way.

 

what do you think of it, just consider being the curious guy in my last 7 line paragraph. wouldnt it be a good simulation of real life trust?

 

so in the end. when you get close to somebody and you instantly "feel nervous", see evil facial expression, then you should be more careful and maybe evade the contact.

and when u get close to somebody and after some minutes you "feel uncomfortable", you should also be careful and maybe ask what the guys/girls story is.

 

i mean thats what 80% of normal people would do to strangers ... "ask them what their story is"

 

because if this game gets released in a status where these things arent taken care of... then it will be a 100% deathmatch game VERY fast.

it will just be a team/squad/clan deathmatch on a big map, with some lonely freshmeats dying in between and zombies running around and posing NO threat to armed survivors.

 

 

EDIT: and dont get me wrong, i dont want KOS banned or out of the game. NOT AT ALL! i just dont want it to be the easiest method to make your life as a survivor.

Edited February 17, 2014 by Ovomaltine

[Martmital 436]

 

so in the end. when you get close to somebody and you instantly "feel nervous", see evil facial expression, then you should be more careful and maybe evade the contact.

and when u get close to somebody and after some minutes you "feel uncomfortable", you should also be careful and maybe ask what the guys/girls story is.

 

I feel nervous and uncomfortable around others already, even more so if I'm within distant to see their face  I don't need my character to tell me. 

[Ovomaltine 30]

I feel nervous and uncomfortable around others already, even more so if I'm within distant to see their face  I don't need my character to tell me. 

 

yes i know. but thats you and not your character. your character can give u very very very small hints if u should be even more uncomfortable than u are already :D

[Martmital 436]

yes i know. but thats you and not your character. your character can give u very very very small hints if u should be even more uncomfortable than u are already :D

 

Why does he need to give me hints?  I feel it already.

 

Pardon my asking, but are you the kind of guy that tries talking to people on buses or at the urinals?

[Ovomaltine 30]

Why does he need to give me hints?  I feel it already.

 

Pardon my asking, but are you the kind of guy that tries talking to people on buses or at the urinals?

 

 

because u only feel that u have been shot when the screen flickers, or the sound comes out of the loudspeakers

and u only feel that you are not longer hungry because the "hungry" status has disappeared.

and u only know that u are low on blood because ur screen turns grey/white

and u only know that u are stuffed because its telling you that u are stuffed

and u only know that there are 60 rounds in a magazine because there is 60/60 standing as text on it.

 

 

edit: and it wouldnt need to give you hints if "random troll" kos'ing wouldnt be able to ruin the atmosphere of a game that can be much more exciting with just some LITTLE adjustments

 

me for example i am not feeling uncomfortable around other players in general, because its a video game for me... i try to communicate with everyone i meet, military looking guys, strange looking guys. and 50% of the time it turns out they are nice. but i want to be able to get a hint if my character should feel uncomfortable around somebody who has like a kill count of 50.

Edited February 17, 2014 by Ovomaltine

[Wheunis 228]

maybe when u are near (1-10m) a guy who murdered like 5-10 people minimum, then with a certain probability (40% per 30 seconds for example, increasing with higher kill count) you get nervous, you get a heartbeat, you feel uncomfortable (status messages).

 

 

I respect your level aproach to all this, but...

 

Uhm... KoS...

I think you missed the point...

 

You are referring to bandits.

People who rob you, torture you, betray you, etc.

 

KoS on the other hand...

I am one of those.

The shortest killshot I have made in the last 2 weeks, was around 300m.

 

Your sanity/psycho/mental/whatever system has lost all value.

 

Make me wear an armband? What good is that when NOBODY but me ever sees it?

etc etc etc.

 

 

I play a cold-blooded murderer in this game.

He does not care what you think, or how your day is.

He doesn't feel the need to gain your trust before he kills you.

He will KILL YOU as SOON as he can SEE YOU.

 

 

Oh, you might be thinking what if i run into someone's face while doing this or that...

Well, see above: He will KILL YOU as SOON as he can SEE YOU.

I do not chickenplay my way out of it.

I kill.

Or i die trying.

Edited February 17, 2014 by Wheunis

[Ovomaltine 30]

I respect your level aproach to all this, but...

 

Uhm... KoS...

I think you missed the point...

 

You are referring to bandits.

People who rob you, torture you, betray you, etc.

 

KoS on the other hand...

I am one of those.

The shortest killshot I have made in the last 2 weeks, was around 300m.

 

Your sanity/psycho/mental/whatever system has lost all value.

 

Make me wear an armband? What good is that when NOBODY but me ever sees it?

etc etc etc.

 

 

I play a cold-blooded murderer in this game.

He does not care what you think, or how your day is.

He doesn't feel the need to gain your trust before he kills you.

He will KILL YOU as SOON as he can SEE YOU.

 

 

Oh, you might be thinking what if i run into someone's face while doing this or that...

Well, see above: He will KILL YOU as SOON as he can SEE YOU.

I do not chickenplay my way out of it.

I kill.

Or i die trying.

 

 

i dont want to stop your playstyle...

 

and it seems you didnt read all of my text.

if u intend to kill everything on sight, lets say you lay low and snipe your way through eternity.

then u get very subtle and different degrees of psychic trauma after certain amounts of murders/kills.

this means you start to halluzinate (ingame kill sequences appear with big alpha transparency in the sky/clouds)

and make your burden visible like that to you. it wont keep you from continuing killing as a direct consequence.

but it may lower your ability to stay focused 100% of the time.

lets say this happens every 20-60 minutes with a probability shift towards 20 minutes the more kills you have.

 

i wouldnt go as far as to let someone get "insane". but there should be psychologic consequences for killing people

RANDOMLY (can only be measured by number so far) as this would be the case in real life too, which kind of simulates

"morality" & "remorse/guilty conscience"

[Wheunis 228]

you start to halluzinate (ingame kill sequences appear with big alpha transparency in the sky/clouds)

 

 

You mean a highlight reel?

Hell yeah! Can we have this ASAP pls?

[DeatHTaX 1217]

 

edit: and it wouldnt need to give you hints if "random troll" kos'ing wouldnt be able to ruin the atmosphere of a game that can be much more exciting with just some LITTLE adjustments

 

 

This will never go away. It will always be present. Some of you people are just going to have to stop finding a way around it and come to terms with this fact.

 

Not saying I condone it, but seriously, when has a game ever been able to stop someone trolling like that? When that happens to me it doesn't ruin the "atmosphere" of the game. I simply shrug it off and continue playing the way I play.

 

what really ruins the atmosphere is hacking. 

[HazZarD87 166]

i dont want to stop your playstyle...

 

and it seems you didnt read all of my text.

if u intend to kill everything on sight, lets say you lay low and snipe your way through eternity.

then u get very subtle and different degrees of psychic trauma after certain amounts of murders/kills.

this means you start to halluzinate (ingame kill sequences appear with big alpha transparency in the sky/clouds)

and make your burden visible like that to you. it wont keep you from continuing killing as a direct consequence.

but it may lower your ability to stay focused 100% of the time.

lets say this happens every 20-60 minutes with a probability shift towards 20 minutes the more kills you have.

 

i wouldnt go as far as to let someone get "insane". but there should be psychologic consequences for killing people

RANDOMLY (can only be measured by number so far) as this would be the case in real life too, which kind of simulates

"morality" & "remorse/guilty conscience"

Someone took a psychology starter course and thinks he can dictate the way the game should portray the human psyche? Wrong! Plenty of ruthless sociopaths out there never developed any conscience or remorse, no empathy or pity. If people choose to play like that in the game then so be it. There should be no negative or positive effects from gameplay other than what you gain for yourself.. or stand to lose..

 

If someone chooses to sit on a roof or treeline all day looking for skulls to ventilate then he can and he will. No amount of "stop KOS!!" threads or carebear tears is ever going to do anything about that.

[Caboose187 (DayZ) 3036]

 

If someone chooses to sit on a roof or treeline all day looking for skulls to ventilate then he can and he will. No amount of "stop KOS!!" threads or carebear tears is ever going to do anything about that.

Exactly.  I personally will just wait them out while eating my cans of beans and spaghetti while they slowly die of starvation and sickness from the weather and then go and take all the gear off of their lame ass corpse

[Ovomaltine 30]

Someone took a psychology starter course and thinks he can dictate the way the game should portray the human psyche? Wrong! Plenty of ruthless sociopaths out there never developed any conscience or remorse, no empathy or pity. If people choose to play like that in the game then so be it. There should be no negative or positive effects from gameplay other than what you gain for yourself.. or stand to lose..

 

If someone chooses to sit on a roof or treeline all day looking for skulls to ventilate then he can and he will. No amount of "stop KOS!!" threads or carebear tears is ever going to do anything about that.

 

i dont have any TEARS about KOS and AS I SAID, if u read my texts i dont say STOP KOS... my gosh

 

but would you say the percentage of those sociopaths is over or under 50% of all people?... so make it realistic

as like surely over 80% of all human beings would have problems with killing for no reason

 

it is just unrealistic that speaking of now like close to 50% of all players are those sociopaths...

Edited February 17, 2014 by Ovomaltine

[HazZarD87 166]

i dont have any TEARS about KOS and AS I SAID, if u read my texts i dont say STOP KOS... my gosh

 

but would you say the percentage of those sociopaths is over or under 50% of all people?... so make it realistic

as like surely over 80% of all human beings would have problems with killing for no reason

Wanting to add a mechanic to discourage it makes it just the same. If you had followed the mod and rocket's comments you know that is never going to happen anyway. Making this thread mute

[Ovomaltine 30]

Wanting to add a mechanic to discourage it makes it just the same. If you had followed the mod and rocket's comments you know that is never going to happen anyway. Making this thread mute

 

 

there is a mechanic to discourage someone from running around an airfield carelessly. its people who KOS.

there is a mechanic to discourage someone from not eating or not drinking. its dying of starvation.

there is a mechanic to discourage someone from shooting a gun when he is exhausted. its called aim penalty.

there is a mechanic to discourage someone from eating rotten fruit. its disease.

why shouldnt there be psychological consequence for actions in an open world simulation when there are physical consequences.

Edited February 17, 2014 by Ovomaltine

[irl-calibre 744]

there is a mechanic to discourage someone from running around an airfield carelessly. its people who KOS.

there is a mechanic to discourage someone from not eating or not drinking. its dying of starvation.

there is a mechanic to discourage someone from shooting a gun when he is exhausted. its called aim penalty.

there is a mechanic to discourage someone from eating rotten fruit. its disease.

why shouldnt there be psychological consequence for actions in an open world simulation when there are physical consequences.

 

cause  who or what  is the arbiter to decide that a penalty should be incurred? are you saying no kills are ever justified? who decides if it was justified or not? all the humanity systems that have been tired over the years HAVE FAILED.  In this game you are being hunted by A.I. = zombies &  I = Human Antagonists . All the tears in China are not going to stop you facing adversaries in this game.  your story ends when you die for what ever reason, you maybe weep a wee tear & then you respawn and get another go.  there are no happy endings in the zombie apocalypse. In a way it's like real life, NO ONE IS GETTING OUT ALIVE.

[Martmital 436]

i dont have any TEARS about KOS and AS I SAID, if u read my texts i dont say STOP KOS... my gosh

 

but would you say the percentage of those sociopaths is over or under 50% of all people?... so make it realistic

as like surely over 80% of all human beings would have problems with killing for no reason

 

it is just unrealistic that speaking of now like close to 50% of all players are those sociopaths...

 

But your trying to make it tougher for the guys that have this kind of play style, while those that just run round claiming to be hero's have no obstacles in the way of their play style.   

[Ovomaltine 30]

But your trying to make it tougher for the guys that have this kind of play style, while those that just run round claiming to be hero's have no obstacles in the way of their play style.   

 

 

lol? ofc they have people who KOS... and if they dont make this playstyle tougher, then this game will be ruined because in the end everyone just teams up with a clan and its clanwars and KOS everywhere. because there is no reason NOT to kos.

 

in reality, if u were a survivor in a zombie infested region you wouldnt start killing on sight every human you see just for fun.

you only do it because its a game and u dont have to handle the consequences. if u start killing people randomly its just not the NORMAL human behaviour. it isnt. and u just do it because

the game allows it and EVEN REWARDS YOU. by giving u EASY LOOT. for which other players had to take hours.

 

and STILL! i dont want to ban KOS from the game because it BELONGS TO THE GAME. but ... the fact that kosing is ONLY rewarding. ONLY!!!! has to be taken care of by some measure against it.

being the nice guy is not rewarding at the moment ( as it WOULD when there is not as much KOS going on as it is now).

 

at the moment its the question "do i just kos him now and see no penalty for it? - or do i let him kill me and take all my loot" ... its a question which is out of character.

there is no reason to kos or not to kos which are in any way simulating realism. like nightmares, psychotraumata, bad conscience, bad publicity.

 

if u are playing this game in the style of normally running around and not hiding your ass in the woods and waiting for strangers to run by, then at the moment its just a mistake

NOT TO kos. because if u kos then u win it all. if u dont kos u win nothing, but also you may lose everything if the other guy kos'es.

so the game is narrowed down to this very dull question "do i kos him first or do i wait until he koses me"

if killing on sight is not made less attractive (not by artificial means, but by REALISTIC CONSEQUENCES), this game will not live to its full possible potential.

 

 

and claming to be a hero doesnt mean shit... i mean honestly, what point do you want to make?

Edited February 17, 2014 by Ovomaltine

[real meatshield 424]

there is a mechanic to discourage someone from running around an airfield carelessly. its people who KOS.

there is a mechanic to discourage someone from not eating or not drinking. its dying of starvation.

there is a mechanic to discourage someone from shooting a gun when he is exhausted. its called aim penalty.

there is a mechanic to discourage someone from eating rotten fruit. its disease.

why shouldnt there be psychological consequence for actions in an open world simulation when there are physical consequences.

Have you ever murdered someone? Have you ever killed someone at all? How can you be certain that there are consequences to those actions to ANY individual, unless you are that specific individual?

 

There are countless posts here and on reddit, and god knows where else, of people who have tried to play the good guy, get caught in a bad situation, and end up killing someone...for which they later espouse their remorse in much the same way as a courtroom confession. Youtubecan keep you entertained for hours watching these guys and their boohoo show.

 

Then there are those who have no compunction whatsoever to care for their victims in game one way or another since it is, after all, a game. These guys provide much more entertaining, and realistic viewing.

 

The only psychological consequence you should ever feel is that within your own mind. The player's mind, not the toon in game. THAT is the psychological effect which you alone as a player must contend with, if you cannot separate yourself from the fantasy world of Chernarus. 

[Martmital 436]

There's no reason to go round trying to engage in conversation.  No, I don't want a can of sardines, no it's ok, I don't need a canteen, water is plentiful.  No, I'm not gonna tell you where I'm going...  it's the same questions over and over again when you interact with people in game.  Shooting on sight is preferable to having to listen to you whittle on, can't hear ya when your dead.

 

You say you want more player interaction, yet you dismiss clanwars as not desirable...  You have no idea what it is you really want, you just want people to stop shooting you!

[real meatshield 424]

You say you want more player interaction, yet you dismiss clanwars as not desirable...  You have no idea what it is you really want, you just want people to stop shooting you!

 

 

 

This is it, right here. This is the core of these 13 pages of butthurt.

[Gerandar 212]

i dont have any TEARS about KOS and AS I SAID, if u read my texts i dont say STOP KOS... my gosh

 

but would you say the percentage of those sociopaths is over or under 50% of all people?... so make it realistic

as like surely over 80% of all human beings would have problems with killing for no reason

 

it is just unrealistic that speaking of now like close to 50% of all players are those sociopaths...

 

so realisticly how many of us wouldn't have a mental break when an infected person comes spewing blood at us gurrgling like a retarded fish man? 

 

if they ever add going insane to the game many other things other then killing people should break ones mind.