possible solution to 3PP imbalance?

[Sidewinder24 103]

Being obnoxious and elitist doesn't help either.

If being obnoxious and elitist means supporting your arguments with facts and calling out those who refuse to listen then yes, I'm exactly that.

[Zeet. 101]

The solution is to play on servers with 3PP off, or GTFO to CoD or BF whatever kiddies are playing these days.

[DarkwaveDomina 1099]

I'd love servers with the option of having crosshairs turned off, just like I did in the mod. As always though I am going to say make it a server option, add more choice instead of taking choice away.

[dgeesio 1034]

look it doesn't matter about 3rd person most who whine about it are the very campers that get spotted .

 

i normally play 3rd person , but 1st does there bother me ill play any but... prefer 3rd.

 

anyways....same ol argument break out other forums i was on about how superior 1st is and no exploits :rolleyes:

 

so server is then changed to first low and behold i go on after saying it doesn't bother me and kill about 30 people in first person ! its just as easy to kill in first as third no real massive advantages as many make out. as already posted most who whine about it are campers on roofs or other buildings who may get spotted.

 

there are lots more important stuff to fix than something which isn't really that bad.

[wild_man 4442]

possible solution for 3PP imbalance is give 3PP guys testosterone injection direct into testicles ;)

 

this have effect of make them remember they are man who don't need no assist system for make game easy and take away fear of head bob and panic attack coming from see dayz through eyes of character  :thumbsup: :D

Edited January 14, 2014 by KoS

[AmirDayz 54]

The solution is to play on servers with 3PP off, or GTFO to CoD or BF whatever kiddies are playing these days.

Alternatively you can just be obnoxious on message boards, seems like it's working out well enough for you.

Edited January 14, 2014 by AmirDayz

[Sidewinder24 103]

You are a special kind of retard....

Stay classy. KoS' comment was obviously tongue-in-cheek even if it did have an underlying truth and meaning to it. Quit acting like a child and insulting people. Thanks.

[boneboys 7988]

You are a special kind of retard....

Don't do that.

[burkino_026@yahoo.com 14]

most of you are off-topic already. to those who still are on topic... No, it's not a full solution to everybody, but removing crosshair for weapons could be a quick and easy limitation that would help against those who exploit 3rd person view.

 

You'd still be able to see people behind walls and beyond corners, but it would make it tedious to use your weapon immediately after, unless you're skilled at controls and movement, in which case it wouldnt really matter 3PP or 1PP because you'd know how to move around anyway.

I'm a realism purist and I will use 1PP in engagement not to feel a real man, but to immerse and to better interact with the environment, but I do feel limited in 1PP only when not in engagement. My self-awareness drops considerebly. Dayz is 50-50 with engagement and hiking so, half of the game experience would be derped and would make me want to server hop to a 3PP ON one when hiking, just to feel self-aware. Not a big issue for me, i adapt easily, but I do aknowledge the discomfort of people in a 1PP only environment.

 

I am not discussing 3PP vs 1PP, anyway. I was just suggesting the removal of crosshairs from 3PP when using a firearm. It's ok for me if you fire a gun in 3PP, but it should then be a case of total inaccuracy, as in panic-firing. But accurate fire should be limited to using weapon sights properly.

[gibonez 3633]

That doesn't fix the most important thing with tpv.

 

You would still be able to peek around corners.

[fnal 206]

Gears of war is a single player, arcade shooter...it also has regenerating health when you stand behind cover, and enables you to peek fire from the same cover with almost perfect accuracy and minimal exposure - do you want that in DayZ as well? I think I'd kill myself if forced to play a pvp game like that; two players facing each other behind two walls, both endlessly waiting for the other to make a move so that they can do a perfectly aimed peekshot. Guaranteed stalemate (unless one of them is an idiot).

 

As for 3PP ranged pvp games? World of Tanks springs to mind as the only one played at any serious level, because it has a huge part of its coding dedicated to dealing with visibility round corners and spotting enemies.

 

Oh and FOV is the same in 1PP and 3PP, just shifted back a few metres, it's still the same angle shown on your screen, the FOV argument just shows up people that don't know what they're talking about.

 

EDIT: lol I just found out Gears does have multiplayer...and it looks absolutely terrible. MP added as an attempt to extend the longevity of the game so that people don't take it to the 2nd hand store once they finish the main story I guess

 

You missed some key things in my post that I should have specified more.  I was saying FOV is useless because that is an argument some use against 3rd person, saying you can adjust your FOV in 1st person and everything will be fine, which in reality, it doesn't.  As far as the difference in FOV between 1st and 3rd, it isn't much, but it's the fact that I can see my character's entire body enables me more freedom or movement and visibility.  Otherwise I am stuck with holding alt and having to look around, very clunky and awkward if you don't have the latest and greatest trackIR (still not very natural). 

 

And whether Gears is an arcade shooter has nothing to do with the 3PP argument, all of the problems about DayZ exist in Gears but you don't hear any flak about it in the Gears community.  Also not sure how your opinion about Gears has any merit on this conversation including why you think mulitplayer added to a game is a bad thing.  I'm very very confused. 

[subliminal_city 27]

Alternatively you can just be obnoxious on message boards, seems like it's working out well enough for you.

 

In comparison to quite a few others, he/she is far from being obnoxious.

[Loafy 46]

ugh.

 

Some people play on first person. some people play third. I have just recently switched to full time first person. Either play on a first person server or play third person.

[libertine 351]

The reticule doesn't quite line up with the actual aim of the weapon, at least some of the time, in my experience. My problem is the ambushing and observing from complete concealment which is why the "forth wall" idea sounds great along with more precise head movement control.

[Sidewinder24 103]

ugh.

 

Some people play on first person. some people play third. I have just recently switched to full time first person. Either play on a first person server or play third person.

 

As it is now, why not both? Gear up easily on a 3PP server then come over to 1PP server and murder everyone. Crosshair or no, does that seem balanced to you?

[DarkwaveDomina 1099]

As it is now, why not both? Gear up easily on a 3PP server then come over to 1PP server and murder everyone. Crosshair or no, does that seem balanced to you?

 

I keep hearing about how 3PP is cheating because it lets you see over obstacles, surely that makes gearing up on 3PP servers less safe since every player on it has this easy-mode cheat exploit at their disposal.

[Sidewinder24 103]

I keep hearing about how 3PP is cheating because it lets you see over obstacles, surely that makes gearing up on 3PP servers less safe since every player on it has this easy-mode cheat exploit at their disposal.

 

If played correctly, even another person who is using 3PP won't be able to see you but you can them. That's why it is a false argument to say "well everyone can use it so it is balanced."

[DarkwaveDomina 1099]

If played correctly, even another person who is using 3PP won't be able to see you but you can them. That's why it is a false argument to say "well everyone can use it so it is balanced."

 

But you're always at the same risk of someone using this against you, if they spot you first. That's just how it rolls. To say it's not balanced even though everyone can use it is a bit like saying everyone should spawn with a Mosin and high-powered scope because someone might get the drop on you while you're running about with your fire axe, and you'd never say something like that right?

 

I'd like to note that I have grown accustomed to using first-person now, and play on first-person servers now they have returned to DayZ, but I think third-person is balanced just fine when everyone has the option of using it. I just never would have used it on 3PP:On servers because it's needlessly gimping yourself.

Edited January 15, 2014 by Ulfhedjinn

[Sidewinder24 103]

But you're always at the same risk of someone using this against you, if they spot you first. That's just how it rolls. To say it's not balanced even though everyone can use it is a bit like saying everyone should spawn with a Mosin and high-powered scope because someone might get the drop on you while you're running about with your fire axe, and you'd never say something like that right?

 

I'd like to note that I have grown accustomed to using first-person now, and play on first-person servers now they have returned to DayZ, but I think third-person is balanced just fine when everyone has the option of using it. I just never would have used it on 3PP:On servers because it's needlessly gimping yourself.

 

For anyone that enjoys using 3PP but refuses to cheat with it by looking over walls will be at a disadvantage. Like I said you are hugely minimizing your risk by gearing up on a 3PP server and then you can just  join a 1PP server to wreak havoc on those that are taking infinitely more risk getting the same gear as you.

[DarkwaveDomina 1099]

For anyone that enjoys using 3PP but refuses to cheat with it by looking over walls will be at a disadvantage. Like I said you are hugely minimizing your risk by gearing up on a 3PP server and then you can just  join a 1PP server to wreak havoc on those that are taking infinitely more risk getting the same gear as you.

 

You might be making the decision not to "cheat" but the option is still there. You might make the decision to use an M4 instead of a Mosin with LRS, that doesn't mean someone with a Mosin and LRS is cheating if you both engage each other at high range and he hits you in one shot.

 

I completely support a server option that uses 3PP with some kind of fog of war, but to call it "cheating" because you choose not to use it really is, with all due respect, bordering on childish. If I felt the same way you do about this issue I would simply play on a 3PP:Off server until some form of fog of war or other measure is introduced as a server option*.

 

*Emphasis on option, I hate the idea of options being taken away instead of added and this is why I post in opposition to people wanting to "fix" 3PP or remove it entirely.

Edited January 15, 2014 by Ulfhedjinn

[Sidewinder24 103]

You might be making the decision not to "cheat" but the option is still there. You might make the decision to use an M4 instead of a Mosin with LRS, that doesn't mean someone with a Mosin and LRS is cheating if you both engage each other at high range and he hits you in one shot.

 

I completely support a server option that uses 3PP with some kind of fog of war, but to call it "cheating" because you choose not to use it really is, with all due respect, bordering on childish. If I felt the same way you do about this issue I would simply play on a 3PP:Off server until some form of fog of war or other measure is introduced as a server option*.

 

*Emphasis on option, I hate the idea of options being taken away instead of added and this is why I post in opposition to people wanting to "fix" 3PP or remove it entirely.

 

So to you as long as everyone has access to something it is balanced as long as they have a choice? More choices the better? So you'd be fine if everyone had access to an in-game map that shows all player's location on the server then? I mean, as long as everyone has it available it is fair and balanced and good, right?

 

Also your M4 or Mosin scenario doesn't really make sense because those are something you have to earn whereas 3PP view exploitation happens at the press of a button.

Edited January 15, 2014 by Sidewinder24

[DarkwaveDomina 1099]

So to you as long as everyone has access to something it is balanced as long as they have a choice? More choices the better? So you'd be fine if everyone had access to an in-game map that shows all player's location on the server then? I mean, as long as everyone has it available it is fair and balanced and good, right?

 

That would, in fact, be balanced and back in the earlier days of the mod there were servers that had maps similar to what you describe. It was a server option that wasn't actually even popular because it wasn't hardcore enough. Which brings me to my next point, I think some of you are confusing balance and realism. 

 

If everyone has equal and fair access to an item or mechanic that is working as intended, that is balanced. Nobody is cheating just because they get the drop on you and use the camera in a way that benefits them. Using that logic seeing someone first is cheating because it gives you an incredible advantage and can make you almost immune to harm should you use that advantage carefully.

 

As for a server option that enables third-person plus some sort of fog of war mechanic if you want, I might even play on it myself despite enjoying first-person servers at the moment, but if you want to take away the current 3PP setup or cry cheating then I'm going to continue calling people out for essentially saying "stop liking what I don't like".

 

 

 

Also your M4 or Mosin scenario doesn't really make sense because those are something you have to earn whereas 3PP view exploitation happens at the press of a button.

 

It doesn't make sense to call the M4 vs. Mosin scenario cheating because the option is available to everybody. If anything though, following your logic, it's less fair than 3PP because 3PP is available to everyone immediately upon spawning and is only really advantageous to the party who gets the drop on the other or uses the terrain better.

Edited January 15, 2014 by Ulfhedjinn

[Sidewinder24 103]

Again, just because you keep saying 3PP is fair doesn't magically make it so. Even if a server was 3PP only. Saying 3PP is balanced because anyone can use it, or it's fair because they have a choice is akin to giving someone the choice between a car or a bicycle in a race down the street.

 

If the race down the street = Survival in Dayz...........how is that a choice again? To be competitive (ie survive the most efficiently) then you are forced to play 3PP. Otherwise you're at the huge disadvantage. That isn't balance, that's poor game design and the opposite of an authentic experience which is something Dayz claims to strive for.

[DarkwaveDomina 1099]

You're not forced to play 3PP though, there are servers locked to first-person now. If all you care about is an authentic experience then join me in playing those.

 

I'll repeat again: Add a fog of war or similar option and I'll support it. More choice is better than removing choice, it's not like we don't have enough servers.

[Sidewinder24 103]

You're not forced to play 3PP though, there are servers locked to first-person now. If all you care about is an authentic experience then join me in playing those.

 

I'll repeat again: Add a fog of war or similar option and I'll support it. More choice is better than removing choice, it's not like we don't have enough servers.

 

You started this whole conversation because of my response to a post talking about choosing one server type over another.  I said why not both. One where you can cheese your way to easier gear by not having to put yourself at as much risk and then coming over to a 1PP server with a huge gear advantage.

 

I guess you still don't understand that my complaints aren't all based on authenticity as outlined with how, even with separate servers, 3PP creates an imbalance. The only way to fix the irrefutable imbalance would be to fix the 3PP ability to see around objects and or have separate hives for 3PP and 1PP servers. Nothing less, nothing more.