<<<< [How to] Improve random player killing. >>>>

[Zeeb (DayZ) 75]

A list that might actually improve random killing!


I guess I start with saying that KoS is a way people play just to feel safe or to kill boredom, we have several options that could improve it alot, now Im not saying everything or even anything from this list should be implemented, but I do think things like these could be the difference between great gameplay and broken gameplay.

My options for improvements are these:


1) Players should be afraid of dying.
2) All players must regret random kills.
3) Make players communicate more.
4) Force players to team up with fellow survivors.
5) Killing a bandit must be beneficial.
6) Ability to distinguish a bandit from a normal survivor.
7) Benefit from hero'ing.
8) Status which can not be easily undone.

9) True apocalypse loot settings.
10) End game possibilities.

A rough list indeed, more will come over time.



Let us now discuss the above mentioned options;

1#
As someone already stated, making your character able to learn and improve skills during his/her lifetime would make people less likely to risk a death, maybe add stamina and crafting recipes learnt from "failure until success", all skills learned and physical/mental improvements are reset upon death.

(When you run around you should increase stamina, when you craft something and fail you should learn from your mistakes, making it easier/faster the next time you craft)


2#
I know most people will flame the idea of having survivor camps with NPC's, but as an MMO this could be of great value since I did really enjoy Epoch.
What about a secure settlement where there are npc's which can trade or give "quests" in form of maybe turning in animal meat or other items for currency?
Maybe bottlecaps, which in turn can be traded for items.
Also keeping the trade between items, then you actually have to give something away that you might need later to get that extra ammo you need?

When a bandit tries to get close to the survivor camp the "guards" should KoS, but it should be possible to kill the guards, so bandits can get inside the settlement.
Maybe have patrols inside aswell so bandits cant just overrun it in a matter of minutes?
Add high walls so bandits cant kill players from the outside with a sniper, but something inside the walls, like ladders, so players inside can shoot on bandits outside but risk their lives since theyre exposed.

(Having a benefiting survivor camp which only allow players inside that has a humanity of 0+ should make people less likely to random kill)


3#
The need of communication is valuable, having a safe trade function could prevent some random killing, due to the possibility to trade with eachother, maybe then people will establish communication with eachother and then not be forced to kill one another for gear they possibly might need.
Since DayZ now has destroyable gear/loot, this could be a great deal of improvement to the removal of random killing.

(If I met someone ingame that has great stuff, but I want to have that stuff without risking my own/destroying his gear, a trade function between the two of us would help the situation)


4#
What makes people team up?
Players team up with others because they feel they could benefit from a group, what can you benefit from inside a group?
What if there were actually military/bandit settlements with NPC's that KoS, which could give you some pretty decent loot?
What if it would not be possible to get inside alone but with only a group of armed players?
Being a bandit trying to enter a bandit settlement should not matter, you would be as dead as anybody else, people should not benefit for being a bandit.

(Military/Bandit settlements with tons of aggressive guards. This could force players into teaming up to raid the place for above average gear)


5#
Killing a bandit should give a reward, not the other way around, KoS'ing a bandit should be beneficial.
Bounty hunting should be added, players should be able to put a bounty on anyone's head, bandits should not be able to place a bounty and in turn get a bounty automatically. How about bandits drops a finger, ear or head in the vicinity upon death that can be turned in to an NPC for a currency, humanity or item reward?

(If you kill a bandit you should simply be rewarded for your deeds)


6#
When we get thirsty we get a message like "I feel thirsty.".
What if when we stood close to a positive humanity player we get a message like "This person might be trustable."
And being beside a bandit maybe gives a message like "This person does not seem to be mentally stable.", this could remove alot of random killing.

(Status messages when near another player to show you their humanity)


7#
A hero is a hero and should be treated as such.
How about lower prices at NPC trading?
Maybe add 15k blood instead of 12k, also increasing runspeed for a hero and stamina if implemented, longer survival capabilites such as the need to eat, drink or regain energy?

(Being a hero should be fun and rewarding, simple)


8#
This one is a simple one, simply leave your humanity locked on to the character, even after death, then people will clearly have seconds thought about random killing if they miss out on a feature like quest obtaining, trading or bounty hunting.

(Humanity should be dangerous, improving it should benefit you alot, decreasing it should make you want to cry)

 

9#
I speak atleast for myself when I say that I think the high loot and ammo count is ruining the game, why?
Because when I first tried DayZ Standalone nearly noone had a gun, this was actually when I realized that with only melee weapons people tend to team up alot more since zombies were alot more dangerous and murdering another player was not a certain victory when you only wielded for example an axe.
Guns should be highly uncommon since most guns were looted the first weeks of the apocalypse, ammo should be really really rare, for example, lets say I play for 6 hours, then I should find 30 stanag rounds at max, that is what I think is a decent setting.

Sure people will say that the game will be no fun if they wont find ammo and they cant play 6 hours a day because of work or other activities, but lets face it, we are not playing Battlefield 4, we are playing DayZ which is a SURVIVAL game, if you do not like the concept then this is not your type of game.
Firearms should be very rare, and ammo should be close to impossible to find, that is what I think could be the key factor to save this game.
Having close to no ammo makes you prioritize when you use it, it is simply how it works, I wouldnt shoot random players if I had only 10 rounds, maybe I would need them to get out of a tricky situation involving zombies or even other bandits, I would save the ammo for more important usage, same goes with medical supplies and food.

(Less guns, ammo and other valuables would make people less likely to waste it, on release people teamed up alot because of the lack of firearms and medical supplies, now everyone can handle themselves against both zombies and players, this might be the actual solution)


10#
The most common reason to random kill is because of boredom, when people gathered all the gear they can, maximizing their inventory, there is only one thing left to do, murder players.
What if DayZ had things you could do only with the best gear?
Maybe certain places could only be raided with military gear because of the danger level, or maybe quests obtained from NPC based on gear?

(You should be able to do something with your character even after you've gained the best things, like raiding places with extremely high danger level, or obtain quests based on your gear)


________________________________________________

The list is nowhere near completed and I will work on it as soon as I get other options poppin up inside my workshop,
please feel free to leave constructive criticism and suggestions.

Do keep in mind that I am a bandit.





__________
/zeeb

Edited January 17, 2014 by Zeeb

[Mallow88 110]

If I see you in game, you're dead.

[Zeeb (DayZ) 75]

[Vitols 3]

I like some of your ideas, but it's obvious that someone's a big bandit hater...

[gibonez 3633]

Heres how you end player killing

 

you dont It will always happen get used to it.

[Zeeb (DayZ) 75]

@Vitols:
Do not get me wrong, I think bandits are essential to the game and it's core gameplay, but "too much of the sweets makes it taste bitter.",
also we all know this is the biggest problem DayZ is currently facing.

@gibonez:
That is why I made this list in the first place, because there is obviously ways to counter it. :)

Edited December 22, 2013 by Zeeb

[Mallow88 110]

Haha you earned my beans for that picture-response

[Shizukage (DayZ) 17]

I agree on a lot of your points, Bandits need to be a part of the game, but currently there are far too many of them. If we keep going in this direction without any changes, DayZ won't be a zombie-survival game, it will be a Free for all deathmatch with zombies as a nuisance.

 

If I wanted to play Deathmatch I'd play Counter Strike or Battlefield.

Edited December 22, 2013 by Shizukage

[R3D B4RON 21]

But, But then what will my axe be good for? I really hate chopping wood.

If you want to avoid KOS go play on a Canadian server. Apparently there dayz is a trash collection simulator where people team up to increase land value in Chenarus.

Whatever you do avoid Russian servers, pretty sure there is a zombie apocalypse going on there IRL and they tend to be a bloodthirsty bunch.

American servers seem to be more eclectic, we have both the sociopaths and those wanting to experience a post apocalyptic running simulator. Variety is the spice of life after all.

[Wo3dy 111]

But, But then what will my axe be good for? I really hate chopping wood.

If you want to avoid KOS go play on a Canadian server. Apparently there dayz is a trash collection simulator where people team up to increase land value in Chenarus.

Whatever you do avoid Russian servers, pretty sure there is a zombie apocalypse going on there IRL and they tend to be a bloodthirsty bunch.

American servers seem to be more eclectic, we have both the sociopaths and those wanting to experience a post apocalyptic running simulator. Variety is the spice of life after all.

what about the EU servers? haha

[doctorbadsign 645]

I agree with the idea of making the character rather than gear more valuable. The disappointment I receive upon dying is directly proportional to the quality of my gear rather than the amount of time I have spent playing. This wouldn't and shouldn't stop KOS, but people would probably be more cautious and avoid killing on sight in situations that may risk their character. The things that make your character valuable need to be things that do no give you a huge advantage over other players.

 

Having to team up to raid certain places would also be cool. A huge horde at each military spawn point would be cool, so that the chances of you coming out alive or unharmed when going alone are less than 50/50. This could be cool because you'd have to team up and possibly make uneasy truces with people... And how knows what kind of shit would go down once you get out safely? You'd likely get people who want to kill you straight away after doing this, but hey you've just looted a military base so the chances are you're on level ground gear wise.

 

Interaction should definitely be encouraged, but I don't think it should always be positive. As I say making uneasy truces and bargains would add a whole other level to interaction in the game.

[R3D B4RON 21]

EU servers are the same as American servers, just don't bring your beans from American servers. The exchange rate is awful.

[Sutinen 635]

Run or defend yourself is my experience. A bloodthirsty guy with an FNX is gonna be frustrated and not chase you after you start sprinting unarmed through the woods. I have never gotten hit by an FNX even though I got shot at twice (both fired their magazines empty).

Edited December 22, 2013 by Sutinen

[phL (DayZ) 63]

my thoughts...

 

- keep it 100% sandbox, no skills, no artificial installments -> remove bandit/hero skins

 

- make gameplay really hard: no easy losing zeds, rare items/ammo, always struggle to survive, firing a rifle should be heard miles away (depending on terrain...) attracting lots of zeds.

 

- your only goal must be to stay alive at all cost. and that should be not as easy as it is now. beeing save and geared up should not be a normal thing in dayz...

 

- real permadeath (no hoarding, no easy sk if kamenka spawn...), f.e. join only once a day^^

 

- benefits from interaction (risk vs. reward), things that are easier together (f.e. one distracts zeds, other loots)

 

- stealth is the way of the survivor

 

- maybe make "casual" and "hardcore" difficulty to get rid of 3rdp and other stuff without loosing sales

 

- pvp (and kos) is part of the game, just make it harder

[Zeeb (DayZ) 75]

@phL:
100% sandbox is not fun after awhile, I'm not saying we should remove the core gameplay, just improve it so people actually can have endgame fun while it still is both difficult and dangerous, none of my options removes bandits, they just make it less likely to encounter a deuchebag.

[Merle_Dixon 6]

One way to kill kiddies with BF4 and CoD hard on..stop playing DayZ ..this is my experience so far...i try to alpha test and see bugs and all fine and dandy till someone will wanna play cod on me and fire his gun for the shits and giggles..i am so sick of this crap really REALLY! they must do one simple thing...New spawn amnesty...1 to 2 hours invulnerability for new player so he can gather the crap he needs and get off the coast...this yes its uber but would stop the average hard on jocker saying"uhuhu duhuhu i gotz a uberz snipah rifle...now uhuh i smartz and i haz ballz i killz newz spawn lolollololol"

this really pisses the living bejeesus outta me..i try to do alpha test not to play cod.....

[Zeeb (DayZ) 75]

@Merle_DIxon:
While that is one way, the above mentioned options of mine still provides a realistic experience.
But thanks for your input.

[glowfow@hotmail.com 55]

100% sandbox is not fun after awhile

 

I beg to differ, it just needs a broad selection of options to partake in and the possibilities could be endless. It's just too bad that quite a few people tend to have the creative capabilities of a rock.

[Zeeb (DayZ) 75]

@JoostVoordeel:
"I beg to differ, it just needs a broad selection of options to partake in and the possibilities could be endless."

That is what my topic is all about, please read all of the options and you'll see it, thank you for your input.

Edited December 22, 2013 by Zeeb

[Merle_Dixon 6]

Zeeb I agree well when it is supposedly to "team " up and have a nice "survival "experience we have instead vets of the Afghan/Iraq wars  BF4 and CoD coming people here on this game  and they think its a another warfare..with this mentality human race would extinct...problem is this rock mentality that is in the air now.....i havent had this problem in State of Decay which was giving surival driver was number one and the co existance with other survivors and how to look after them was top priority..here is Spawn,find Kool weapons,find naked guy who runs to save his ass from dehydration,aim,fire,rinse repeat and laughing like a moron for the "manly "unpunished griefing deed he just did.....

sorry but this is the raw,brutal truth

Edited December 22, 2013 by Merle_Dixon

[Zeeb (DayZ) 75]

@Merle_Dixon:
That is why my options does not allow such random warfare acts which CoD players possess, this will prevent them from just going about and killing everyone, this will force them to make a well thought out decision.

Edited December 22, 2013 by Zeeb

[Merle_Dixon 6]

Yes i know but how you impose/enforce stuff... i hope Dean can watch this because i am so sick Dayz now currently and thanks to this reason thinking to leave it for now and take back when it is fully ready cause i am really tired..since dayz one  i started here i had that problem,didnt had time to test various equipment for functionality and testing purposes thanks to some gun totting moron....

[Harba 3]

I think its too early to say how the game is going to develop, at the moment zombies are the same as they were in the mod, a nuisance. Maybe once their numbers increase and they make them harder to kill people will team up to get to that precious loot inside towns.

Edited December 22, 2013 by Harba

[Zeeb (DayZ) 75]

Please keep in mind this is mere options, the DayZ developers could bend these however they want, these are just simple starting points.

[Sooden 301]

my ideas to balance Survivors and bandits

 

and i know its ALPHA, and some of these ideas may be in the pipeline

 

- Teaming up for social benefits (kinda relates to #4)

Some sort of social health system may help reduce Solo KOS'ers. The need for human contact or the effects of being alone for so long. Not sure what the effects would be, that could take some real research. But maybe coupled with learning skills from books and teaching from other players, and the lack of ability to relate to the above if your a loner killing psychopath (not a dig at players, but that's what you would be). The social aspects of working with others or soloing should be worked into the game system if they are going to simulate survival.

 

- Wanted Posters  (kinda relates to #5)

maybe if a killing is witnessed and the witness survives (like skyrims bounty system), they could make a poster or note. Then people could read this note and it auto tags the killer for anyone that sees the killer, and the only way for the killer to lose tagging is to change their kit considerably. So either they have to kill all near players or swap out kit they probably don't want to change.

You may think this will make more KOSing but also give a benefit of people running away after their group is attack, rather than just staying for revenge. I think this would be a fair system to help balance out survivors and bandits, also make use of pens and paper.

 

- To easy to kill

Ammo and guns are to easy to find (M4) so there is no value to them, i do think its planed to balance amount of items across servers, but its not happened yet. There is nothing to use guns on apart from people atm, when there are animals, maybe ammo will have a grater value. what if you only had like 15 shots and needed them for hunting, then you may not wanna hunt people cus you need fresh meat or other resources from animals.

from what i have seen, lots of player have hundreds of shots, and that works out as a lot of ammo, very unrealistic atm, but i guess that will be sorted in time. The upside of all this ammo for now is the testing of KOS and weapon. Until they have tested weapons systems thoroughly i think the ammo and guns will stay high. And if, 'when', ammo is reduced, i think a lot of the random KOS'ers will go back to their deathmatch games and more people wanting a survival simulator will play. This game needs to define its self as one of the other, sure some will not like that, but then maybe its not the game for them, they got into the game via the ArmA2 MOD and their mind set was its just a MOD for a deathmatch game, DayZ should not be like that.