The game needs a bandit system/rewards for being either good or bad

[alleycat 135]

 

No, no reputations. Sorry, but this isn't just any mmo. To the guy who said the medical system is "complicated" : Get a brain. Stop being stupid. It's about as hard and "complicated" as lighting a match IRL.

 

DayZ didn't have a reputation system, and it never will. Sure, we have the skinns in the mod, but that's already too much and a large amount of people didn't want them anyways. The game shouldn't and won't judge its players. Stop asking for it. If you wan't a game with "the good vs the bad", THIS IS NOT IT. THIS IS DAYZ. THIS IS YOUR STORY.I'm serious, go play another game. DayZ will never have a "good"/"bad" scheme, hence it will never have rewards for being either. There will be complex (health) mechanics that require much time and dedication to successfuly apply.

 

BUT THERE WON'T EVER BE A "GOOD/BAD" SYSTEM

 

 

Deal with it.

Weparo

Are you even able to comprehend posts that you read?

 

 

 

I don't know what the words "hard" and "tangible" mean in this context, but it starts to sound a bit like you're suggesting punishing the wicked and rewarding the just, which is not what this game is about.

 

Incentives should emerge from the design of the game, not be tacked on. The "skins" were tacked on. It's ridiculous that I should be forced to wear certain clothes because of my behavior. These are the sorts of features we should try to avoid and look rather for ways to build features of the game that offer players an opportunity to behave in certain ways over time in order to reap long-term benefits.

 

For example, giving players the ability to "report" on the activities of other survivors would make being a hero really attractive. People would start to learn your name, recognize you, etc. and you would become a kind of savior among survivors, but do so through natural means - actions which beget word-of-mouth accolades, not some special hat you wear that identifies you as a "good guy."

 

 

Shooting players on sight while rocket advertises this as "your story" with interactions and players healing others and sharing is just as tacked on. The game does not model any of the real world inhibitions people might have for shooting on sight. While excessively rewarding shooting on sight.

 

And you guys drop that "bandit skin"? I never mentioned bandit textures. What can work is havign some sort of info you can see when you get very close to a player. Like his name, and other things that indicate he is one that shoots on sight all the time.

 

I am not advocating punishing banditry. I am advocating NOT punishing carebearing.

 

I want to see rocket stream himself play without people knowing who he is.

 

 

 

 

Incorrect. The consequence of engaging in violent action immediately upon seeing another player is that you, yourself are now exposed to violence. A player who constantly attacks other players violently is far more likely to die a violent death themselves than one who surrounds himself with friends and avoids contact with strangers.

No. 40 players across the map means you will probably never encounter more than one guy in visible range unless it is dead center in the largest towns. And all it takes is one shot from a rifle. And this whole people observing then considering their actions is a fantasy that never happens. Hesitate to kill and you will get killed. Of course that wont happen if you meet an unarmed player.

 

So you attacking someone then being "exposed" to someone else attacking you is very very very unprobable.

 

 

As I pointed out before, the most important and desirable thing in this game is collecting gear. And there is 0% not not kill on sight.

 

 

 

 

The entire drama of the game is based on the fact that both of these decision are equally possible and can be rewarding in their own ways. Some people choose to be good because a. it's uncommon and they feel special and b. it's just fun to help people. Others choose to be evil because fuck it why not.

There is no drama. Anyone who chose to be good will turn bad after losing all his shit because he let that guy live that came close.

I am betting that you will never try to be good after walking 8km north to the airfield. Take the risk? Not shoot? Then lose all your high end stuff to it.

 

 

Playing carebear being an equally good choice as shooting on sight is an esoteric theory that does not exist in the actual game. And no, helping unarmed players does not count. I want to see you approach a well armed player far north.

Edited December 20, 2013 by alleycat

[Weedz 1105]

And you guys drop that "bandit skin"? I never mentioned bandit textures. What can work is havign some sort of info you can see when you get very close to a player. Like his name, and other things that indicate he is one that shoots on sight all the time.

So instead of what was a stupid idea in the mod you want a stupider idea for the standalone? Edited December 20, 2013 by Weedz

[ZedsDeadBaby 2287]

Shooting players on sight while rocket advertises this as "your story" with interactions and players healing others and sharing is just as tacked on. 

 

No, it's definitely not. Perhaps you don't understand what I mean by "tacked on." I mean features which exist that break immersion by artificially rewarding or punishing certain behavior. For example, if giving blood to a dying survivor made a plane fly over and drop supplies for you as a reward, that's "tacked on" and artificial. Likewise, if AI NPCs show up and arrest killers and throw them in jail for murder, that's "tacked on."

 

Me shooting your ugly face off because I feel like it is not tacked on. That's a direct consequence of playing a game which has guns and other people in it.

 

No. 40 players across the map means you will probably never encounter more than one guy in visible range unless it is dead center in the largest towns.

 

I don't understand what that's even supposed to mean? I encounter dozens of players every time I play. I usually go prone in the grass and watch them pass by. I don't understand what you're trying to say here? It makes no sense.

 

And this whole people observing then considering their actions is a fantasy that never happens. Hesitate to kill and you will get killed.

 

Yeah, no. That's really not true. w/ binoculars and other long-range optics, it's really easy to observe players from a distance and see what they're doing without becoming directly involved. I witnessed dozens and dozens of murders at the NWAF during the mod days, and often while remaining completely unnoticed. You can take point above a town in a deer stand or sniper tower and watch for hours players come and go and they will never know you're there. Just don't make a target out of yourself and you won't get noticed.

 

Provided the activity is rewarded (i.e., you're able to gain information about other players) and equipment is added to the game to support this activity (like binoculars, optics and cameras) then it would happen all the time.

 

So you attacking someone then being "exposed" to someone else attacking you is very very very unprobable.

 

Okay? I don't understand how that's relevant to my idea.

 

As I pointed out before, the most important and desirable thing in this game is collecting gear. 

 

And as I pointed out before, that's an opinion you're free to hold but is by no means a fact. Collecting gear is important in the first few hours of the game, but it ceases to be a priority after that. For me the most important and desirable thing in the game is trusted friends and after that the second most important thing is interesting stories.

 

What can work is havign some sort of info you can see when you get very close to a player. Like his name, and other things that indicate he is one that shoots on sight all the time.

 

Right. Which is exactly what my idea would allow. As more survivors witness someone being a murderer, word and information spreads about them and then when you see them, you recognize them as the killer you heard about. Did you read my post? Probably not.

 

There is no drama. Anyone who chose to be good will turn bad after losing all his shit because he let that guy live that came close.

 

That is very obviously and demonstrably not true based on the fact that there are several very large clans in operation that have a policy against banditry and murder that have existed since the early days of the mod. They never gave up being good, because for them that's what makes the game fun and interesting, and "losing shit" is meaningless. There's always more "shit" to get. Your obsession with gear is not shared by most players.

 

I am betting that you will never try to be good after walking 8km north to the airfield. Take the risk? Not shoot? Then lose all your high end stuff to it.

 

I am betting you don't know what you're talking about. I survived for 45 days during the mod and never once attacked anyone. I had 5 player killers which were all in self defense. I had over 1600 zombies killed and had easily traversed the map 10 times (over 120km traveled). I had a dozen vehicles including two motorcycles and 4 different "base camps" around the map with 3-4 tents in each holding reserve ammunition, food and weapons.

 

I achieved this by cooperating with friends, playing smart, moving quietly and not going in guns-blazing all the time expecting to win every firefight I got into. It was really fun, and I'm more proud of how long I survived than I am of how much "shit" I had. I had too much shit. We all did. We had shit coming out of our ears. It was not important. What was important was the experiences we had traveling together and surviving.

 

If that's how you want to play the game, you can. Nobody's stopping you but yourself.

Edited December 20, 2013 by ZedsDeadBaby

[ratiasu@hotmail.co.jp 122]

There should be no such features. This is an anti-game, remember?

There should be no rewards/penalties except for logical ones, like zombies aggroing on gunshots (and not with pinpoint accuracy either). If a player wants to shoot on sight, it should be possible. Adding what you just said would make intrigues and group-infiltration impossible. The game should simply promote co-opping by logical and natural means, like for example making it really hard to get a car going on your own, build a base on your own, etc..

[WarAndRuin 19]

Defiantly not!

[alleycat 135]

No, it's definitely not. Perhaps you don't understand what I mean by "tacked on." I mean features which exist that break immersion by artificially rewarding or punishing certain behavior. For example, if giving blood to a dying survivor made a plane fly over and drop supplies for you as a reward, that's "tacked on" and artificial. Likewise, if AI NPCs show up and arrest killers and throw them in jail for murder, that's "tacked on."

 

Me shooting your ugly face off because I feel like it is not tacked on. That's a direct consequence of playing a game which has guns and other people in it.

 

 

I don't understand what that's even supposed to mean? I encounter dozens of players every time I play. I usually go prone in the grass and watch them pass by. I don't understand what you're trying to say here? It makes no sense.

 

 

Yeah, no. That's really not true. w/ binoculars and other long-range optics, it's really easy to observe players from a distance and see what they're doing without becoming directly involved. I witnessed dozens and dozens of murders at the NWAF during the mod days, and often while remaining completely unnoticed. You can take point above a town in a deer stand or sniper tower and watch for hours players come and go and they will never know you're there. Just don't make a target out of yourself and you won't get noticed.

 

Provided the activity is rewarded (i.e., you're able to gain information about other players) and equipment is added to the game to support this activity (like binoculars, optics and cameras) then it would happen all the time.

 

 

Okay? I don't understand how that's relevant to my idea.

 

 

And as I pointed out before, that's an opinion you're free to hold but is by no means a fact. Collecting gear is important in the first few hours of the game, but it ceases to be a priority after that. For me the most important and desirable thing in the game is trusted friends and after that the second most important thing is interesting stories.

 

 

Right. Which is exactly what my idea would allow. As more survivors witness someone being a murderer, word and information spreads about them and then when you see them, you recognize them as the killer you heard about. Did you read my post? Probably not.

 

 

That is very obviously and demonstrably not true based on the fact that there are several very large clans in operation that have a policy against banditry and murder that have existed since the early days of the mod. They never gave up being good, because for them that's what makes the game fun and interesting, and "losing shit" is meaningless. There's always more "shit" to get. Your obsession with gear is not shared by most players.

 

 

I am betting you don't know what you're talking about. I survived for 45 days during the mod and never once attacked anyone. I had 5 player killers which were all in self defense. I had over 1600 zombies killed and had easily traversed the map 10 times (over 120km traveled). I had a dozen vehicles including two motorcycles and 4 different "base camps" around the map with 3-4 tents in each holding reserve ammunition, food and weapons.

 

I achieved this by cooperating with friends, playing smart, moving quietly and not going in guns-blazing all the time expecting to win every firefight I got into. It was really fun, and I'm more proud of how long I survived than I am of how much "shit" I had. I had too much shit. We all did. We had shit coming out of our ears. It was not important. What was important was the experiences we had traveling together and surviving.

 

If that's how you want to play the game, you can. Nobody's stopping you but yourself.

Record yourself on fraps 10 different times approaching an armed player you dont know on the NW airfield

 

 

 

Provided the activity is rewarded (i.e., you're able to gain information about other players) and equipment is added to the game to support this activity (like binoculars, optics and cameras) then it would happen all the time.

 

 

Okay? I don't understand how that's relevant to my idea.

Statistically very improbable to bump into another player if it is not the 2 larger towns or NW airfield.

 

 

 

 

Yeah, no. That's really not true. w/ binoculars and other long-range optics, it's really easy to observe players from a distance and see what they're doing without becoming directly involved. I witnessed dozens and dozens of murders at the NWAF during the mod days, and often while remaining completely unnoticed. You can take point above a town in a deer stand or sniper tower and watch for hours players come and go and they will never know you're there. Just don't make a target out of yourself and you won't get noticed.

 

Provided the activity is rewarded (i.e., you're able to gain information about other players) and equipment is added to the game to support this activity (like binoculars, optics and cameras) then it would happen all the time.

Because you farmed all possible guns by server hopping and collected them in clan storages.Obviously gear is boring when you found it all

Edited December 20, 2013 by alleycat

[Advent1 126]

From what I have noticed, KoSing has severe drawbacks as of now. If you kill someone, ALL their gear gets the "ruined" condition. If someone wanted my shiny ACOG sight and killed me for it, it would be ruined and they would not be able to see through it due to the shattered glass.

It also seems there is a "bandit" skin per say in the game. EVERY SINGLE encounter I've had with people wearing the Pay Day clown masks have shot on sight or tried to bind people.

[benvats 0]

Hmm i like the idea of reputation/humanity.

I have no problem with KOS but at the moment there are no consequences for 'bad behaviour'

If people want to bandit fair enough but there should be some kinda incentive for being a 'hero' type or at least for being humane!

In the mod there was a hero skin to work towards. Whilst i dont like the idea of skins, perhaps a levelled incentive such as unique ballistic body armour levels 1-5 say, which u can only obtain by having gained good karma by doing good deeds, (similar to fallout 3) you could have say a heavily armed soldier survivor Npc camp where these could be collected?

By having several levels of armour would give u something to continue to work towards. It would have to be unlootable by anyone 'unworthy' and you would loose it once obtained if you took up banditry. If u die u would have to head to hero camp to be reissued a new one.

Just an idea.

Your thoughts?

[Noctiluxx 48]

I like the reputation idea.

 

When you see me on the street.. do you know my reputation? Name? Intentions? No.. you don't

 

So why, in a fight for survival would we ever expect to have such pre-introduction knowledge?  To make it easier for you?   The game isn't about easy, its about doing what you need to survive.  Use what you can to make it out of the situation, don't rely on "hes wearing a green hat, so he's a good guy" because I'll glady wear a green hat and shoot you in the face if thats what I need to survive in the game.

[ZedsDeadBaby 2287]

Record yourself on fraps 10 different times approaching an armed player you dont know on the NW airfield

 

Why would I "approach" them? I observe from a distance while remaining unnoticed. Are you reading anything I'm actually saying?

 

 

 

Statistically very improbable to bump into another player if it is not the 2 larger towns or NW airfield.

 

No, it's definitely not. Just throwing the word "statistically" into a sentence doesn't help; especially when it's obvious you have no idea of the actual numbers involved.

 

Yes, the map is very big; but, there are points of congregation as well as highly traveled "corridors" between hot spots. People traveling from the coast towards the NWAF will pass through areas like Pavlovo, Zelonogorsk, Drozhino, Sosnovka and Myshinko. It's really common to meet people in these areas, as well as on the roads or in the woods between them. Likewise with the eastern corridor between Solnichniy and Berezino. Very heavily trafficked and quite common to encounter players.

 

Even relatively obscure towns like Mogilevka or Dolina see action precisely because lots of people think they're "safe" going there.

 

If you honestly think it's "statistically improbable" to encounter players, then I question how much you've played the game (or, again, you're playing on servers with fewer than 12 people probably).

[ZedsDeadBaby 2287]

When you see me on the street.. do you know my reputation? Name? Intentions? No.. you don't

 

If my friend saw you rob a liquor store last week and he describes you to me then, yes, I will know your reputation when I see you on the street. You're not perfectly anonymous as long as you can be observed.

[desryachri 95]

NO let this be organic! you can NEVER deal with bandits or stop KOS. there are many kind and nice players out there.

[Clumzy (DayZ) 377]

Every time I see another player I try to approach them. I've met a bunch of people in the few days of playing SA, and I've only been killed, like, 3 times by other players. I've been killed by other people as much as I've been killed by bugs and glitches, so I don't really believe that KOS is an immediate problem in the SA. It was the same in the mod, I got killed by players, but it wasn't like an epidemic or anything. I ran a charity out of the church in Elektro for months, and the majority of players either got their loot and left or actually helped me out in running the church. There was a trading post for a few weeks on the same server. So it seems to me like gear is not the only motivator in the game, and people tend to blow KOS'ing in DayZ a bit out of proportion.

[Noctiluxx 48]

If my friend saw you rob a liquor store last week and he describes you to me then, yes, I will know your reputation when I see you on the street. You're not perfectly anonymous as long as you can be observed.

YOu're not wrong.. however, your friends discription may be a bit off from reality, and it was a week ago.. so your memory of it might be slightly different as well. so how do you know for sure it was me? either way, its not vaild to say the white guy with the hat is bad, shoot him always, never trust. or even worse, have a physical label on me because i did something i needed to survive.

[Paradoxfoxx 5]

@ alleycat - you seem to be making a lot of assumptions based off of bad experiences...   Playing the game show's it's own rewards and punishments naturally which is exactly how it should remain.

if i go around killing every player i see without question, i fully expect to have the same treatment shown towards me..  

 

if i see other players with guns looting a town.. i don't just run up to them with my weapon drawn expecting them to play nice..   i'll observe them and see what they do..  only once i know enough about them and what kinda people they are would i ever dare approach them..  gathering intel before making decisions is a hugely important thing..

 

if you get killed in a stupid fashion don't blame the game..  it's doing what is designed to do.. and that is allowing you to make your own mistakes.. so just learn from your bad experiences and play a little more smart.

[boltec 0]

I agree. There should be some handicap and bonuses for heroes and bandits aswell.

[Arth (DayZ) 1]

I dream about making "camps". Something like stations in Metro universe. Trading between them, gathering food, medicaments, looting ammo and weapon for defend. Raiding opposite camps. Making alliances. Building bases. This will be really immersive. You can choose, work with others or die alone. Devs have to reward us when we coop with other players or force us to coop. I have no idea how, but we need this. First step should be to alarm us againts bandits. Maybe stronger heart beat when we are in line of bandit sight? Maybe little light aura over player when he is friendly? Devs you are talented, we need your help!


PS. I'm not playing DayZ SA yet. I'm watching a lot of streams and I'm going to make Xmas gift for myself this weekend :D

[chris90 54]

no thank yo

[Perrywinkle 6]

I always thought that the penalty would come from the environment... If you KOS someone in a city, better be able to deal with every zombie in earshot that your shots attract (or get out really quick). DayZ just needs more metagame. Something that only multiple people banded together could accomplish that a solo player could not (Repairing vehicles, self-sustaining camp, etc.). 

 

Having some stat or bandit identifying feature is something that was taken out so early in the mod because it couldn't be properly implemented. People who kill in self-defense are tagged as "bad" just as quickly as those that instigate. Every encounter has to be an unknown or the game loses its luster.

 

Giving you a killmail is pretty lame too. That character will never know who killed them, they are dead. You may even team up with that person some other time, who knows. It also prevents QQing on this forum about "Big Bad Bandit Clan X". 

[Dyckman 26]

I sorta liked the the Hero Bandit skins. Problem was, it was simply easy to become a Bandit, and rather time consuming to become a Hero.

 

I'd like a refined polished humanity system again, but maybe for the future. I think becoming both should be equally has hard, not just one run in elektro and boom you're a bandit.

[Danolf 1]

Hard to hide from KoSer with name tag and hard to hide and rob someone too . people see your name when you type chat so just type 1 thing then talk

[Ducard 11]

Are we trying to add more reasons in the game to shoot on sight? didn't you play DayZ origins and saw how that shit turned the game into Bandits vs Heroes? DayZ has a main idea which is survive, you scavenge, kill zombies, and even kill people if they impose any sort of danger to survive but the idea of shooting people because a bandit skin is so cool is extremely childish and doesn't fit the game.

 

One of the best features in the standalone is customizable character appearance, if your skin changes just because you shot an x amount of people doesn't fit into the game and will kill this idea. If you want to shoot people on sight because you think it's fun to be a bandit that's fine but dont expect any extra rewards\special skins for doing that.

[gatman_88 0]

omg alleycat, this game is soooo not for you...you are complaining that what this game needs is reputation??? then go play CoD and until you've reached the highest prestige rank or so...because in a situation like in DayZ, there are no reputations...you don't think I "just killed 10 guys and died afterwards" and say "but I will be remembered" because you will never live again...

 

you give yourself the options:

1. Scavenge through buildings

2. Take it off player corpses

...and prefer option 2? sure, if that person is already dead, then yes...but you are forgetting an important issue which is considering risking your life, which sadly will be less considered once there are persistent tents and you care even less if you die because you have collected loot for the time you magically come back from the dead...

 

Imo your arguments are saying that you wanna get rid of the permadeath aspect, because permadeath means you have to start from scratch...

Benefits of keeping players alive can be friendships or partnerships for looting the Airfield together because its way more difficult to do it alone, and you still need other alive survivors for collecting and transfusing blood...

 

And the death notification by whom you got shot from is also soo unrealistic, because a dead body doesn't say "killed by IF**KEDYOURMOMMA"...the only thing that could increase your reputation is by witnesses, and even then its temporary, like "there is a sniper up that hill killing everybody in Elektro"...if you're so desperate to leave your mark, then leave a note on the dead bodies and spread your reputation that way, that would even be realistic in real life...

 

you're obviously some kind of a big shot from an older mod of a mod of a mod of the mod that is dayz, who built up his reputation and his lvl100 banditskin bla bla...you might as well go to World of Warcraft with your reputation sh*t where the NPCs fear you everywhere...that should satisfy your hunger for attention.

Edited December 21, 2013 by gatman_88

[touffe 3]

 First step should be to alarm us againts bandits. Maybe stronger heart beat when we are in line of bandit sight? Maybe little light aura over player when he is friendly?

 

Edited December 21, 2013 by touffe

[Zogvarn 118]

Just say no to a "Hero/Bandit" reward system and save a kitten.