Its Sad that the mods with potenital have 0 population

[Wazza 274]

Because modding is a huge part of ARMA 2 and always has been. User created content is what keeps the games going, whereas modding in DayZ has served no purpose other than the bastardise it and divide the community. Like I said - it's literally impossible to find a populated vanilla DayZ mod server at this point.

What is user created content if its not modding?

[Mos1ey 6301]

What is user created content if its not modding?

 

I'm not differentiating between user created content and modding. My point was that just because it's good for one game does not mean it's good for another, as has clearly been the case.

[angrygargamel 12]

the problem is all these kids are only out for kill-on-sight...

lately on epidemic as it was a PVE server only...

there were about 5-6 players on... at max

they whined like "is this really no pvp?" or "what should i do then when i cant shoot people?"

 

after they changed the server to pvp... its filled with players to the max... all the kos kids and every fucking hillbillie is on the server now... with only one goal... kill other players...

 

you guys havent got the real way to play this game... you missed the sense...

[Hetstaine 10852]

Sure, but I don't think the fact that DayZ is a mod for ARMA 2 is relevant at all.

 

Because humans are drawn to the path of least resistance. The fact that everyone plays in easy mode servers makes it impossible to find active vanilla servers, the mod was infinitely better before private hive servers became available.

 

 

 It is a weird thing this path to less resistance deal that i have seen thrown about a lot especially in some other topics.

 

 Take il2 for example. Mil sim still but aviation and more niche than fps..more hardcore as well when you get to a full locked in cockpit no outside view, full engine management..essentially 1st person mode. The game is modded six ways from sunday and ten odd years old, but you never find empty locked in pit servers v full 3dp servers..why is that ? It is the same with FPS games..all seeing eye view gives you all of the advantages, but hardly any choose it and the 3dp servers are nowhere near as enjoyable regards a tight core community and skill set.

 

 I can always step straight into a full server of 1st and even have a ton of options on which map, theatre, planeset etc i want because there is so many to choose from. Whereas with DayZ ... although so many seem to want 1st there is sweet fannie adams of them ...with over 4000 servers. Does it say something about the payer base and what games they have come from or ..? The dev group needs to bite the bullet one way or another with this thing and then move on happy with their choice.

 

 Sorry for dragging off topic too much there but it just got me wondering.

[matiman 166]

IMHO, Modding is a great tool to experiment things.

This allow young and motivated games studio to easily try to implement the basic mechanics of a gameplay and game design without too heavy development as if there were building a game from scratch.

 

The mods can also allow to get feedback from players to see what is working or not (both regarding gameplay or technicals aspects). "Re-Modding" (using an existing mod and customize it) is also a very positive experience, as it allow the original mod developper to see what the community would like to see added to the mod, whatever it goes on the same direction or not).

 

But if you want to go forward like DayZ team is trying to do with SA, and then use all this experiences to create a real game, then keep the modding open to public could be a pain in the ass.

First this allow huge security breach, and then of course it divide the community across all the mods that will be done in the future.

But it still remain to have a interresting feedback when seeing how the community improve the game.

 

So this is a difficult decision to take:

- Do not allow modding:

   * Will make hacking much more difficult (and I thing many will agree that hacking is a big issue currently)

   * Keep the community unite under the same game

   * Community will be much more difficult to satisfy, so the game needs to have a very high quality level, and devs team needs to take players feedback in consideration to be able to improve the game or community may be bored after a while

 

- Do allow modding:

   * We will face same hacking issues than currently

   * Dividing players across many sub-mods

   * More easy to handle relation with community as we will be able to customize the mods to make it match with our dirtiest dreams

 

Personnaly, I would prefer that the SA will be restricted to modding. But this will make me a more exigent player, thats why I'm ready to wait for the SA, if more time is required for the game to be finalize properly.

[Feral (DayZ) 622]

mods are subject to market forces, survival of the fittest.

 

player choice doesn't lie, if a mod fails it probably isn't that good or is broken

[Hetstaine 10852]

Totally, if it is a shit mod aint nothing gonna save it..*cough* warz* cough* #cashedupandlaughing* ;)

[Mos1ey 6301]

mods are subject to market forces, survival of the fittest.

 

player choice doesn't lie, if a mod fails it probably isn't that good or is broken

 

By the same logic Justin Bieber is better than your favourite musician because he sells more records.

 

People voted for Hitler and buy Coldplay records. You can't trust people.

[Feral (DayZ) 622]

By the same logic Justin Bieber is better than your favourite musician because he sells more records.

 

People voted for Hitler and buy Coldplay records. You can't trust people.

you can when it comes to what they want.

 

I don't like bieber but he appeals to his target audience, millions of teenage girls.

 

hitler was a nut but the downtrodden german masses hung on his every word and followed him into hell.

 

coldplay cleverly exploit their formula for rousing anthemic tunes and hone a sound that appeals to half the planet.

 

 

my point is there is a market for everything and if it finds its target audience and delivers whatever it is that audience craves it will succeed.

 

The mods mentioned have failed on all counts spectacularly.

 

I don't mean to disparage the creative individuals behind them, I salute their efforts, however for whatever reasons the mods they made failed to appeal to the target market and have died as a result.

Edited August 23, 2013 by (MUC) Feral

[FrostDMG 398]

I don't understand this argument that there are "too many mods/servers" are you having problems joining games? I really doubt it

[Mos1ey 6301]

I don't understand this argument that there are "too many mods/servers" are you having problems joining games? I really doubt it

 

Yup, it's impossible to find a populated vanilla DayZ server these days because the masses flock to easy mode servers and the rest are left with 'play there or don't play at all' as their ultimatum.

 

Before private hives and mods of the mod it was difficult to get a place in a lot of 30-40 player main hive servers. Everyone played vanilla DayZ and no one complained about it.

Edited August 23, 2013 by mZLY

[10bag 22]

modding in DayZ has served no purpose other than the bastardise it and divide the community. Like I said - it's literally impossible to find a populated vanilla DayZ mod server at this point.

 

Wow. Great attitude there. Mods of DayZ have served many purposes, some being:

1) Fewer hackers. Whitelisted servers saved DayZ, no doubt about it.

2) More content. As fantastic as Chernarus is (it's the star of DayZ imo) people will eventually grow bored of it. Lingor, Namalsk, Taviana, Varkgard, Podagorsk, Sahrani, etc have given people a lot more to play with.

3) More features. X different mods going in X different directions has given devs and players a chance to experiment. I can only see this being positive for the official mod and the standalone. If a mod goes in a shitty direction, official DayZ can learn from it. If a mod goes in a good/uncharted/interesting direction, official DayZ can learn from it. 

 

Your Hitler/Coldplay comment is nonsense too. I don't even know where to begin with that.

Edited August 23, 2013 by -HB-10BAG

[Wazza 274]

If the majority wanted vanilla servers why are they empty? I agree a lot of the mods/maps have failed but does that mean they should "have a go"? Sure a lesson is learnt from their failures about things people want and don't want. Apologies by th way I'm now trying to type on my phone.

[Mos1ey 6301]

Wow. Great attitude there. Mods of DayZ have served many purposes, some being:

1) Fewer hackers. Whitelisted servers saved DayZ, no doubt about it.

2) More content. As fantastic as Chernarus is (it's the star of DayZ imo) people will eventually grow bored of it. Lingor, Namalsk, Taviana, Varkgard, Podagorsk, Sahrani, etc have given people a lot more to play with.

3) More features. X different mods going in X different directions has given devs and players a chance to experiment. I can only see this being positive for the official mod and the standalone. If a mod goes in a shitty direction, official DayZ can learn from it. If a mod goes in a good/uncharted/interesting direction, official DayZ can learn from it. 

 

Your Hitler/Coldplay comment is nonsense too. I don't even know where to begin with that.

 

1) Whitelisting has absolutely nothing to do with modding. Also, one of the main objectives of the standalone is to crack down on cheating, eliminating the need for whitelists anyway.

2) Meh, Chernarus is the only good DayZ map in my opinion. The others seem half finished and inauthentic.

3) We have a suggestions sub-forum here and the standalone is hopefully going to half enough new content on release to keep people happy for a while. I don't really think we need mods for that. :S

 

It's actually a quote from Peep Show, but I think it proves my point nicely. The general public have poor tastes and make bad decisions, lol. The opinion of the majority should be taken with a grain of salt and actually thought through instead of taken as fact.

 

If the majority wanted vanilla servers why are they empty? I agree a lot of the mods/maps have failed but does that mean they should "have a go"? Sure a lesson is learnt from their failures about things people want and don't want. Apologies by th way I'm now trying to type on my phone.

 

Because the 'saw YouTuber X play DayZ and bought ARMA 2' crowd flocked to the the easy mode servers, admin tend to go with it as it draws more players and the rest of us are kind of stuck with it.

 

This just brings me back to my point of humans being drawn to the easiest path point.

 

There comes a point where you have to differentiate between what the majority want and what is actually good for the game.

Edited August 23, 2013 by mZLY

[Siberian (DayZ) 527]

I can't say I'm a big fan of any of the mods to be honest. They all seem much less polished than the official mod and all they've done is divide the community.

 

I hope the standalone isn't opened up to modding. :/

 

wow..

 

completly disagree 10000%..

 

its only because of modding and new maps, that i still even play Dayz.

 

vanilla dayz and Cherna, are simply WAYYYYYYYY to played out and boring now.

 

new maps and new ideas on dayz are what keep it fresh and keep people playing without fresh thinking the game (SA) would die off quickly).

[SalamanderAnder (DayZ) 1747]

- Posting excellence - 

 

 

I refuse to give you any more beans, but keep putting up the good fight. I think you're hitting the nail right on the fucking head here.

 

Prior to the numerous mods that were released, vanilla DayZ was far more interesting and populated. The problem is that the game can't progress any further with mods. The features that simply must be implemented, the ones that need to work properly - they have to be designed and programmed at a source code level.

 

I think it would be nice to see the dev team offer some kind of route to "official mod" status, for certain developers. It would be nice to see 3rd party content that could be screened and incorporated into the official game. Like Namalsk, for example. I really like that map, and I'd like to see it in the Standalone. Kind of how the mod team was implementing community made assets recently. I do like map - and even some gameplay - diversity, but I don't like that servers can just "give out" loot, vehicles, weapons, ect. It's a shortcut. Might as well just make a "custom server" on L4D that gives you infinite ammo and godmode. It would be fucking easy and boring - a.k.a not a game. You might as well play monopoly and just print off money for everyone so nobody loses. It's just ridiculous.

 

So really I think the question here is how do we get a middle ground? How can we allow community made assets (which can be extremely refreshing and can extend the lifetime of a game) without sacrificing the gameplay that actually defines DayZ as it's own game. Basically, we need to be able to mod DayZ without breaking it's fundamental rules.

Edited August 23, 2013 by SalamanderAnder

[Bludy 324]

Modding didn't ruin ARMA 2, that's the difference.

 

modding saved arma2

[Inception. 9443]

Chernarus will always be the supreme map. In my opinion.

[xalienax 621]

Sure, but I don't think the fact that DayZ is a mod for ARMA 2 is relevant at all.

 

Because humans are drawn to the path of least resistance. The fact that everyone plays in easy mode servers makes it impossible to find active vanilla servers, the mod was infinitely better before private hive servers became available.

I would agree, but I would also argue it was better before infection, before spawn gear changes, and before the many zombie tweaks.

What  makes it "better" or "worse" is highly subjective. and that's something I think we can all agree to

[Sutinen 635]

I hate them because I have bad internet (bad download speeds) and can't be bothered to find a good server that isn't whitelisted. I just want to jump in and play DayZ, not waste half a day installing new shit. And everyone else seems to like Taviana or whatever map Frankie is playing right now. Those damn yellow text thumbnails...

I also think they're missing out on the original DayZ, where survival was more important than killing people. Of course survival and killing people have much in common, but the new mods have buffed up military spawns, which means you can go get a full auto rifle before you get your first can of beans..

Edited August 24, 2013 by Sutinen

[plexico 386]

Because modding is a huge part of ARMA 2 and always has been. User created content is what keeps the games going, whereas modding in DayZ has served no purpose other than the bastardise it and divide the community. Like I said - it's literally impossible to find a populated vanilla DayZ mod server at this point.

You were saying?

Edited August 24, 2013 by Plexico

[Cap'n (DayZ) 1827]

I hope someone ports the Standalone map to ArmA 3. Lets petition to have the Standalone map in ArmA 3 on official release. I might make a poll.

[Dekkymane 145]

Breaking point was really good when it actually still had players. Overwatch is a copy and paste of it, dayzero is lame, origins is meh and all the other mods are just boring. The only real dayz, is vanilla dayz.

[mars1 18]

_{So is a mod of the mod a success because it plays well and interests a player no matter the player population, or is success determined by filling the server ?}

 

_{The private hives saved the dayz mod ?  I think so as the main connected hive presented its own challenges with the barracks hopping, combat ghosting no tent saving quirks taking 2nd to the hacking concerns.  Now there are simply too many versions and options for the hackers to possibly keep up :}}

 

_{The mod that got me back into dayz after months off was epochs crafting and in game base building , and I suspect the arma sales that seem to stay in the steam top 10 are being driven by both the mods and the 2 mod installers that make them easy to install.  If you think finding a vanilla dayz server is tough try looking for an arma2 server.}

_{I welcome all the ideas people keep coming up with and I thank the gaming gods for the diversity that keeps dayz alive.}

[harley001 315]

Seeing as we have sub mods of sub mods...  I think this is getting out of hand.