Karma System for the Standalone

[DeepSpaceBass 2]

Commendations can be given to players for charity, leadership, or teaching.

Shame can be given for banditry and griefing.

Both of these statistics are only visable to the player recieveing them and acts as a luck multiplier. Players who do bad things generally will have more of the worst happen to them. Examples

• The vehicle someone with negative karma occupies will tend to take more critical damage than someone with good karma
  
• Limbs are more likely to break when the player is injured
  
• Negative karma players are given priority in zombie agro.
  

Now, thats not to say that players with positive karma will have it much better. One player with +100 karma won't have it any better than someone with 0 (neutral) karma. Still encouraging players to play how they want, but if they choose the bandits path, they have to be extra warry.

[GOD™ 2795]

[terrvik 2409]

Don't bring religious mumbo jumbo into the game. :)

I'm going to drink a cup of coffee and then edit in a proper reply. If i remember.

[UmBe 125]

Please, People with bad Karma should spawn as ants or Rats and guys with Super High Karma should Not spawn at all, because they escaped The Cycle of endless life.

Or am I mixing something up Here?

[o-richardson@live.co.uk 34]

Karma system? Its a zombie apocalypse. Im fairly sure everyone would be creating bad mojo at some points.

Just stick to stick and stones... OAH AND AS50'S!

[mzltv 2281]

Not to mention there could be legal ramifications from Bethesda, as the term 'karma' in respect of humanity levels is a blatent steal from the Fallout series.

[gesundheitk 420]

Am I the only one who likes the idea?

Karma is actually a somewhat nicer replacement for the Humanity System we have now. Besides, the implementation of blood being on a person's hands, and little signs of banditry should be supported with notes of zombies aggro-ing near them often, legs breaking easier, etc.. I don't view Karma as being a religious thing, but more-or-less an ingame system with the name of "karma". What is so bad about it?

[Snilex 40]

Not to mention there could be legal ramifications from Bethesda, as the term 'karma' in respect of humanity levels is a blatent steal from the Fallout series.

Wouldn't that mean that Budists can sue Bethesda for stealing the word karma from them? But no, you can't take the word Karma and copyright it in any way. That's like if I'd take the word God and copyright it for my own use. Can't be done.

[mzltv 2281]

Yeah, I don't exactly know how it works in regards to features.. Kinda why I used the word 'could', but now I know :thumbsup:

Regardless, it still could look reletively unproffesional if you stole a term for an identical feature, without acknowledging/requesting permissions or whatever..

[Cone Drone 12]

I feel that the playing field should be totally level, any artificial bonus/penalty system would push players toward a certain play style. I think the only bonus for being a hero should be people knowing you are good guy and considering that in their interaction with you.

[Bribase 251]

It doesn't look like DayZ development is going to go anywhere near this kind of mechanic. Arbitrarily disavantaging players for what could be considered immoral behaviour really doesn't work with the sandbox nature of the game. It doesn't happen IRL and doesn't need to be part of development.

If there is to be some kind of karma/humanity system in SA it should be geared towards the idea of giving up subtle clues about the characteristics of other players and letting you react in whatever way you see fit. "Karma" should be dictated by other players' treatment towards you; If you are a heavily armed badass with no apparent wounds but bloody hands, a gillie and a powerful assault rifle skulking around the coast, players will feel the need to KOS. If you're a survivor type with camping supplies attached to your backpack and a versatile but not overly powerful weapon in your hands they might treat you differently if they find you hunting in the wilderness. It's about letting the player decide how to react, not the game.

[solidice 24]

To be honest; I don't like the humanity system itself. Why? Because people can see what you are from miles away. I don't like to be recognised as a bandit or hero. Because BOTH will be killed on sight. Regular people are not killed that fast. And yes I know it is possible to find casual clothing and mask yourself as normal pete, but I only find those clothes VERY rarely.

There should be no visible (or invisible) consequences of you being a Hero or a Dick.

EXCEPT for other people's distrust in every single person they encounter.

besides, I do not believe in KARMA and I am very displeased when someone is trying to shove it down my throat (same for anything religious or anti-religion)

[HashSlingingSlasher192 29]

Am I the only one who likes the idea?

Karma is actually a somewhat nicer replacement for the Humanity System we have now. Besides, the implementation of blood being on a person's hands, and little signs of banditry should be supported with notes of zombies aggro-ing near them often, legs breaking easier, etc.. I don't view Karma as being a religious thing, but more-or-less an ingame system with the name of "karma". What is so bad about it?

its a zombie apocalypse at some point your gonna kill somebody its not a very subtle way to stop unnecessary banditry its just not fair. what if I kill guys in self defense and i get karma?

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

And yes I know it is possible to find casual clothing and mask yourself as normal pete, but I only find those clothes VERY rarely.

Really? :huh:

Every time I go from camo to casual duds, I'm back in my hero skin.

On the subject of "karma". I don't think there should be any artificial means to judge somebodies character (eg bandit/hero).

Mechanics to treat players differently based on their prior behaviour is just an extension of that. I also don't think it's suitable for DayZ.

There's no reason critical damage, broken bones and zombie aggro should EVER relate to your "karma" or "humanity".

It would just be an abusive, forceful game mechanic, which doesn't belong in this game and thankfully (going by my judgement of the devs' attitude) will never happen.

[badluckburt 974]

Karma is not a good idea, it doesn't work in real life and it wouldn't work in DayZ. Plus bad luck is already in the game with all the bugs of the Arma engine :) so I'd say that makes a pretty good substitute.

[joe_mcentire 2074]

well i head an idea once...

Why not introduce a model referring to the psychic apparatus defined in Sigmund Freud's structural model of the psyche.

Super-Ego <--> Hero

Ego <--> Survivor

Id <--> Bandit

So roughly we can leave the existing system in terms of termini. Id, Ego and Super-Ego are based on "humane" interaction of the player with environment and other players.

influencing effects are (it would lead to either pos. or neg. effects, according to the proper definiton, so don't pin me down on this right now):

- pacifistic attitude

How important is the constant "use" of a weapon to you? Do you prefer a dialog to a drawn weapon? How do you interpret dayz - killing or purely surviving?

pacifistic attitude is affected due to:

e.g.

based on shots fired

amount of time weapons are (un)holsterd

amount of "hits" on other characters in relation to "life-time"

- respect for wildlife

Is your tolerance only concerning ppl or dou you also respect wildlife? Do you know most (serial) killers started with torturing and/or furthermore killing animals (no and i don't mean hunters for that matter)? Again: killing or purely surviving?

respect for wildlife is affected due to:

e.g.

animal gets killed and meat is (not) utilized within x sec/min

overkills/ improper ways in killing (e.g. by grenades)

non-lootable animals are killed

- altruism/ generosity

Stands for itself: Are you a hero or a villain? Are you European/US or Aussie/Kiwi :P?

altruism/generosity is affected due to:

e.g.

using bandages, blood bags or whatever on others

amount of times giving consumables/ammo/weapons etc. to one by not receiving anything in return (or within a given time)

duty to rescue

coup de grâce

- social intelligence

Are you a loner, living withdrawn, avoiding the remains of societ or do you team up and try to keep what's left of actually being a human?

social intelligence is affected due to:

e.g. amount of times...

...using voip directly to nearby players

...beeing nearby players

...of successful bartering with others

Of course this is just a rough developed idea. But it would be somehow possible to introduce something like this and most of all: loners would also have the chance to remain on a somewhat reasonable humanity level.

EDIT: to be edited to develop this further..

Edited March 12, 2013 by joe_mcentire

[DeepSpaceBass 2]

What the hell are you guys on about? Karma isn't a religious thing.

It was a game mechanic in the fallout games for christs sake! Its just luck based on your actions. It doesn't give anyone an artificial advantage. If you're taking the same precautions someone normally would like not firing an einfeld in the middle of elektro or some crap you'll be fine, but if you do something stupid the situation will be worse than it normally would be for you.

If there is to be some kind of karma/humanity system in SA it should be geared towards the idea of giving up subtle clues about the characteristics of other players and letting you react in whatever way you see fit. "Karma" should be dictated by other players' treatment towards you; If you are a heavily armed badass with no apparent wounds but bloody hands, a gillie and a powerful assault rifle skulking around the coast, players will feel the need to KOS. If you're a survivor type with camping supplies attached to your backpack and a versatile but not overly powerful weapon in your hands they might treat you differently if they find you hunting in the wilderness. It's about letting the player decide how to react, not the game.

I like it and its not exploitable. So what you're saying is if you have aquired good gear and have a lot of murder you have worse luck?

Yeah, I don't exactly know how it works in regards to features.. Kinda why I used the word 'could', but now I know :thumbsup:

Regardless, it still could look reletively unproffesional if you stole a term for an identical feature, without acknowledging/requesting permissions or whatever..

Rulesets don't work like that. There are plenty of games that use D&D rulesets in their game that don't pay anything to Wizards of the Coast.

Edited March 12, 2013 by DeepSpaceBass

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

I having trouble deciding whether you're a joker or a joke.

[DeepSpaceBass 2]

I having trouble deciding whether you're a joker or a joke.

So because you don't like my opinion you're going to make inflammatory posts? Real mature.

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

What the hell are you guys on about? Karma isn't a religious thing.

I having trouble deciding whether you're a joker or a joke.

You could at least google it. Edited March 12, 2013 by Chabowski

[Shiki Nanaya 9]

What the hell are you guys on about? Karma isn't a religious thing.

Joking aside it actually came from India. Originally it was only known as the concept "cause and effect" and then was added on into Buddhism. I think it was in hindu as well but not 100% sure on that one myself and if anyone does know feel free to add.

Edited March 12, 2013 by Shiki Nanaya

[DeepSpaceBass 2]

You could at least google it.

Yeah and that link says its a concept found in multiple distinct relgions. Just because the basis of something is religious doesn't make it innately religous. Common law arose from religion.

[Food 309]

Seriously, it is best the way it is. Rewards for helping, and no penalties for being a bandit. You shouldn't be punished for a playstyle (or rewarded), but at least it does something. I'd rather have nothing telling me how to play, and I WILL NOT play a game with penalties for banditry, although rewards for being a hero I can accept. (Btw currently I'm a hero with 11k humanity from about a week of playing)

[Shiki Nanaya 9]

Yeah and that link says its a concept found in multiple distinct relgions. Just because the basis of something is religious doesn't make it innately religous. Common law arose from religion.

....so if it was 'found' in religion. How did it not come from religion?

That's like saying 'god' was found in multiple distinct religions but that doesn't innately make him/here/it religious.

[DeepSpaceBass 2]

....so if it was 'found' in religion. How did it not come from religion?

That's like saying 'god' was found in multiple distinct religions but that doesn't innately make him/here/it religious.

Because god isn't a sociological concept, hes a diety.