Removing M107/AS50 in favor of increased sniper damage?

[Dark Terror 11]

Looked around the forums for a bit and didnt really notice much of what I am about to suggest in any large part atleast...

Thaughts on the current place of sniper rifles in DayZ have led to many arguments around the use and nature of the M107 and AS50 anti material rifles. A recent thaught of mine was that the reason why I personally did not like them being in the game was far from their killing capacity but rather from the fact that there was no disadvantage too using them. This being the case i argued towards the idea of removing the possibility of carrying a backpack or such when using one of fore mentioned rifles.

However after thinking on it and using other rifles in the past few days eg: the m24 and DMR in particular, I came to the conclusion that these rifles in most cases did not lead to a 1 hit kill shot but rather in some cases led to the player just "running it off" literally. This I find to be disturbing because in my mind (correct me if I am wrong here) but being hit by one of these rifles in the chest should kill/mortally wound an individual...

Anyways, as a result of these cases (atleast 3/5 times)... I came to the conclusion that if the more common snipers were damage "boosted" so that anything above the wasteline etc... would result in a kill shot there would not really be much of a need for these anti-material rifles.

Now I know that many people who read this are going to argue against the reasons I have stated above and insist that they (anti material rifles) are needed in order to disable cars and other vehicles etc....

For them I would agree, however if the damage of the "average" sniper were increased there could be a potential for the engine etc... to be disabled.

Whereas in the current state, 1 AS50 shot to the body of a vehicle in the right conditions results in the entire destruction of that vehicle.

What does the rest of the community think about the idea of removing the M107/AS50 on grounds that the rest of the snipers are "boosted" in damage?

[reuben5150 83]

Our server has the AS50 removed and the m107 is pretty rare, result ? Much better game experience, IMO, both should be removed from dayz, they belong in ARMA.

[Khoysta 17]

Realistic bullet damage should take preference than balancing the game. There are many threads/people who want to keep the AS50 and many to remove it. Also how would increasing the damage of all sniper rifles to that of AS50 solve the problem of the AS rather than pseudo AS50's?

[Dark Terror 11]

Also how would increasing the damage of all sniper rifles to that of AS50 solve the problem of the AS rather than pseudo AS50's?

Sorry if I was not clear enough.. Sometimes I tend to ramble too much. haha.

I wasnt meaning increasing their damage to that of the AS50's at all, rather I was suggesting increasing their damage high enough to result in a "1 hit kill" against players. Whilst at the same time doing much* lower damage against vehicle, so much so that only multiple shots to the engine etc would disable the vehicle.

And even then, would not completely destroy the vehicle like you would using the AS50 currently, I have many a time 1 shot Urals anywhere in the vacinity of the hood and blown up the vehicle :/ not as much fun if you ask me of tactically taking out the driver/wheels etc...

[Dark Terror 11]

Regarding vehicles and anti-material rifles, although in reality their purpose is just that... In this game however i find there is no tactics required in order to take out a vehicle. Instead having the AS50 with Nato rounds means that without even thinking of cover etc, jsut shoot the front of it "once" and within seconds i have just dusted an entire squad and the vehicle...

[NoyZ (DayZ) 66]

Take out the AS50s and M107s AND leave all else as is. If you are going to perch up out of harms way, sitting on your ass waiting, you need to head shot to get a kill or rely on the nubness of the victum to allow you another shot. If you can't then you don't deserve the title of sniper. One shot one kill, am I right? If they always get away from you then it may be time to examine your skills and become a knuckle draggin ground pounder where the real skill is.

It is MUCH more satisfying beating someone on even ground. I don't want snipers removed from the game anymore than I don't want banditry removed from the game but it needs to made much harder than it currently is.

As a matter of fact, the DMR and M24 and all other sniper rifles should create A LOT more (at least twice the) aggro that doesn't disappear when they log out. When they log back in, max aggro is right back. You want to sit up out of harms way hoping to get easy kills, then stay the fuck up or shoot your way out.

[enforcer1975 1111]

They don't need an increase of damage, the character hitpoints should go down to the natural vanilla values. It has been tripled for whatever reason while they nerfed weapon damage on the other side.

[WelshWizard 8]

There are disadvantages to the 50 cal. rifles: the Audible range (450m) and size of the weapons which exposes a sniper's position to an astute survivor.

To the people who want them removed: get over it and play better. If you' being frequently hit by 50 cals.

, taking them out of the mod will not help you. You just be killed by the m24 / DMR.

[NoyZ (DayZ) 66]

There are disadvantages to the 50 cal. rifles: the Audible range (450m) and size of the weapons which exposes a sniper's position to an astute survivor.

To the people who want them removed: get over it and play better. If you' being frequently hit by 50 cals.

, taking them out of the mod will not help you. You just be killed by the m24 / DMR.

That's pretty ironic you would say that. There is a better argment for the snipers to get better and NOT need a 1 shot body kill. How about you become better shot while you're up in a cowardly location absolutely having to have suprise? Audible range is useless as they are usually on top of something. As soon as their timer runs down they just log in and out and the zeds are gone. Not even close to enough balancing. They should only get 1 shot every 5 seconds for starters. Everyone within 2k meters gets to hear you and recognize that sound. Sniper missed? Tough shit. Hang your head in shame and sit on your ass waiting for the next victim that was too far away to hear you and didn't get warned over side channel as to your location from your missed victim. Sit on your ass for hours then and see how fun it is to snipe. :lol:

Any server that has AS50s or M107s should just give them to everyone on the starting loadout. If you are against this then it looks EXACTLY like you must have a big advatage to win encounters like all the nubs who raged the L85 thermal got taken out. Look at the new maps and server admins taking them out. Many feel this same way. YOU get over it

Some players aren't happy if they don't have something better than the next guy. Then they wonder why they get called noobs and bambits™. :rolleyes:

[Sutinen 635]

There's a few bad things about these fiddy cal rifles, but the worst one is that if it hits your toe, you're dead. I highly doubt that would happen in real life.

[jayman9696 14]

There's a few bad things about these fiddy cal rifles, but the worst one is that if it hits your toe, you're dead. I highly doubt that would happen in real life.

Your entire foot would be gone and you would bleed out to death in seconds.

[Clumzy (DayZ) 377]

They should only get 1 shot every 5 seconds for starters.

No artificial balancing, please. You want to make sniping more difficult? Add wind. You want to make it more even? Decrease the hitpoints, so that not everyone can take 40 makarov bullets, and then a guy with an AK can peg a guy with a DMR, if he's accurate on his first shot. Weapons are already 'balanced' in real life, why not try to emulate it?

[gloopsgf 35]

Who gives a shit? Stop crying and play the game.

If you are looking for a game without sniper rifles, try my little pony.

Snipers like this exist in real life, why can't they exist in the game?

Don't you think the military would ur their best gear to protect themselves, and get rid of these things?

How about let the game be a game, and let everyone play it.

I have died to douche bags that killed me after I gave then blood transfusions. I have had my Huey shot down from the sky with an as50.

Yes I get pisses, then I realize that it is a game, and let whoever shot me down enjoy it.

[beastoverlord 574]

The reason of why people hate the AS50 and M107 is that they are both 1 hit rifles. Making all snipers 1 hit would just anger people more, not make them happy. Go home spawn-killing-noob-sniper, go home.

EDIT: I don't give 2 shits about either rifle being 'anti-material.' I can take out a car wheels with my makarov, I don't need fancy stuff to do it.

Edited February 4, 2013 by BeastOverlord

[xx_fr0st-w0lf_xx 53]

Wait does op want to increase damage to sniper rifles? cause yea they are the most under powered guns right now. :/

[kaiga12 22]

Tier 1 snipers should be a Lee Enfield (Or Mosin Nagant or whatever they go with as a hunting rifle) with a scope attachment that you have to find on your own and the civilian model bolt action Barret .50 cal which comes with it's own scope and can hold 5 rounds and is extremely rare.

Throw in the windage and environmental challenges that have to be overcome to hit targets at range with ANY gun and you'll have balance.

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

Throw in the windage and environmental challenges that have to be overcome to hit targets at range with ANY gun and you'll have balance.

THIS. x10

I don't think all the folks who believe shooting to be so easy have ever tried it.

Too much "Hollywood education" methinks.

On a side note. In my opinion, players shouldn't be any harder to kill than Zeds are.

Everyone has WAY too much health. It's ridiculous.

[B00tsy (DayZ) 19]

On a side note. In my opinion, players shouldn't be any harder to kill than Zeds are.

Everyone has WAY too much health. It's ridiculous.

Yeah that would be cool if it were a quick deathmatch with no hard work of getting good gear for your character. With a setup where you work for days if not weeks to stay alive and getting better gear then you need at least a chance to survive an attack if you can quickly get away from the firefight. But you should not be so damage resistant as with being shot by a makarov, takes like 3 clips to kill someone with that bee bee gun.

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

It doesn't matter how long it takes you to get your gear. That's not relevant to the point I was making.

It's way too easy to take a half-dozen rounds to the chest and just walk away.

If you want to survive an attack, work harder at not getting shot. :lol:

EDIT:

Player's powers of observation provide them with their chances to survive attacks.

Giving everybody uber healths defeats the purpose of the unforgiving survival challenge.

Edited February 4, 2013 by Chabowski

[frosti 2165]

So I concluded that people are mad at m107 and as50 cause:

1. They outclass assaoult rifles on mid and close range (400 meters).

2. People can log out from game and reset zombies that they lured with them.

3. They can shot down heli and cars in one or few shots.

4. They are used to own bambies and bambits in Cherno and Electro from hills.

My suggestion how to deal with it without removing m107 and as50:

ad1) Make it so you have to set them up before you can start shooting and make it take 5-10 seconds. If you don't set them up and start shoot, make it'll have big recoil.

ad2) This can be solved with 30 seconds log out timer or make it so that game remembers how many zombies you have aggroed on you and respawn those zombies few seconds after you done logging to the game. So if player log out, zombies despawn, if he log back in zombies spawn again. If player aggroed with m107 or as50 all zombies from city in range on 500meters (50 zombies lol?) then they will respawn aggroed at him even if he log out and will go after him untill zombies will be killed or outrunned.

ad3) nerfing damage done to vechicles maybe?

ad4) Bambies can get their gear from other cities then Cherno and Electro. No problem here.

Edited February 4, 2013 by Frosti

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

My thoughts on the suggestions above.

1. Making it so the anti-materiel rifles require a rest or bipod to be accurate would be an authentic, well balanced solution IMO.

2. Apparently zeds spawn entirely differently in SA, so we'll just have to wait and see how log-aggro is handled in future.

3. Destroying vehicles is what anti-materiel rifles are supposed to do. Nerfing damage would be a bad move.

4. Anyone can get killed at any time. Bambi will have to learn to fend for himself.

[B00tsy (DayZ) 19]

Just remove them, it's not a simple survivor weapon, but a high class military rifle. Saves the devs a lot of time nerving them and balancing them while they should not be in the game in the first place.

Remove scoped weapons

Remove helicopters and specially gunships and any vehicle with mounted guns.

Remove NVG's

Remove grenade launchers and maybe grenades too

Introduce the skill factor to surviving. Get up close and personal if you want to kill someone and risk your own life doing it.

[gloopsgf 35]

What wrong with an as50. Stop crying, and play the game

[NoyZ (DayZ) 66]

What wrong with an as50. Stop crying, and play the game

Heres one that needs his one toe shot kill and, apparently, can't be asked to read a short thread.

The ones arguing against this are prolly terrible shots. :rolleyes: The ones with real sniping skill could get it done with a DMR and not whine about the removal/balancing of an OP gun. I have done my fair share of sniping so I'm speaking from XP.

Most of the ones not wanting them out of the game realize they need more balancing. It is funny how children and what seems to be young adults don't realize is that there are more and more servers and maps that have gotten rid of them FOR A REASON. They need more balancing and that is the only way for the ones who are objective (not the idiots saying 'hur dur stop crying' like an 11 year old) to get anything done about it ATM. The community spoke out on the L85 and it got shit canned, thank God. If the community were given the chance to speak on this, the majority would say get them gone while the bigger chunk of them would prolly say re-balance them.

They/I are not for getting rid of snipers. They are necessary to the game just like bandits. RL balancing has shit to do with in-game balancing.

Sad part is there are always going to be the 'entitled' feeling children that must have better gear than the next guy to have fun. To those I say go to a PAY-TO-WIN game and let mommy buy your skill.

Edited February 4, 2013 by NoyZ

[TheBambiAvenger 146]

The only problem I find with this suggestion is many hero's (such as myself) rely on the "knockout" factor to safely "restrain" people we feel might be hostile yet we don't want to kill. Making every sniper a one-hit kill would not only make them much more OP than the other weapon classes (AR's, LMG's, etc.) and would also increase the banditry in the game, of which there is way too much as of now.